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Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic (Read 13132 times)

Started by Rolento, September 01, 2011, 03:22:38 am
Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#1  September 01, 2011, 03:22:38 am
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As you've probably noticed, there are a lot of silly people these days doing a lot of silly things like color separation on pre-existing sprite sets. While you look at all those fancy color keys, you might think that the whole process is very difficult. Truth be told, as long as you aren't trying to paint in a complex pattern it's actually pretty simple; more time consuming than anything. Here's one way to tackle color separation using a layers and the pencil tool:



Starting off the original sprite, make a color key of the current colors used. Make a copy of the lines that share colors of areas you want to separate. In Cammy's case, it's the legs and blue tones of her suit. From here, make a new layer and draw over the parts you want to separate with colors not present in the main sprite, also covering over those extra color key lines. Change the layer properties to something like Screen so that the original sprite shows through, but with altered colors thanks to the layer on top. Flatten the image and you have something with color separation.

[Edit: now that the main message is safely posted, more stuff.]

Same method used above used to do a little separation on Ryu's hair. Headband was separated before by KoopaKoot I believe. Second image was more of an experiment to see if a faux Cps3 finish could be done, but it was deemed too little bang for the buck to continue for the rest of the set.

The reason I suggest to make the color key earlier is that now with this altered version, you have exact knowledge of what colors need to be added to the original palette to support your new separation. From here on out, you can repeat the layer process on the rest of the set and just apply the final palette with separation in place afterward to finalize things. As you can see, not a hard process overall once you lay in the ground work.
Last Edit: September 01, 2011, 03:28:25 am by Rolento
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#2  September 01, 2011, 03:30:28 am
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I've been reading your Focus Attack and Ultra Bar / EX Bar System tutorials and I've got to say this is just another thing I'll be using.

Thanks.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#3  September 05, 2011, 05:46:47 am
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Now to cover some old and new stuff that I never got around to posting for some reason or other.
<- Something for a side project.
<- Redid the older edit to use a palette that makes full use of Gouki's colors.
<- Scratch sprite
<- Have a wip animated version of this somewhere or other...
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#4  September 06, 2011, 03:19:30 am
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I remember teh last one, fuck luck finding it, tho.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#5  September 28, 2011, 05:56:33 pm
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Man!! That's an awesome method, yet simple O.o!! I wish I knew it before T_T!!!
I swear there was something cool here!!
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#6  September 28, 2011, 09:55:33 pm
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Andy: While I do have a Youtube account with some videos, nothing related to spritework. Think you might be mistaking me for Shinra, who does make videos of him working on sprites. At least he is one person who does that sort of thing off the top of my head.

FeLo: Simple is best sometimes, especially when you have to repeat the process a few hundred times over.

Since the topic is revived, here's a fun thing to do: find an older animation you worked on and touch it up.

Hey there Zero, looking a little less stiff there. Still got to touch up that back arm some more, so I guess you're not done just yet. Hah!
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#7  September 29, 2011, 04:35:27 am
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What about the Z logo on one of his shoulders?
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#8  September 29, 2011, 04:50:50 am
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Earlier versions had it, but it would suffer from the classic Sagat/Claw issues when mirrored or I would have to do something silly like have a reverse Z drawn on the other shoulder that was color separated and rig it so that the engine loaded a different palette depending on which side Zero was facing ala Gill. A lot of mess for one letter.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#9  September 29, 2011, 05:34:00 am
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Earlier versions had it, but it would suffer from the classic Sagat/Claw issues when mirrored or I would have to do something silly like have a reverse Z drawn on the other shoulder that was color separated and rig it so that the engine loaded a different palette depending on which side Zero was facing ala Gill. A lot of mess for one letter.
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#10  September 30, 2011, 05:04:24 am
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Nice zero Dude ;)

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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#11  October 01, 2011, 11:25:03 pm
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Yes color sep, the bane of my existence.

Is everyone making zero now?
Spriting is hard.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#12  October 01, 2011, 11:26:59 pm
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Hey, I was making Zero before making Zero was cool! .\/.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#13  October 01, 2011, 11:43:29 pm
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Indeed he was. I hit him with my stick so he'd do it.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#14  October 01, 2011, 11:56:10 pm
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Oh, Jhonny-Young-excellent!.  :)
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#15  October 02, 2011, 09:48:14 am
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After playing mvc3 I wanted to make a better zero! ;D
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#16  October 02, 2011, 04:35:16 pm
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Earlier versions had it, but it would suffer from the classic Sagat/Claw issues when mirrored or I would have to do something silly like have a reverse Z drawn on the other shoulder that was color separated and rig it so that the engine loaded a different palette depending on which side Zero was facing ala Gill. A lot of mess for one letter.

That's a shame. The Z logo is one of zero's physical identifying traits next to the booblights. Least they're still there though. :3
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#17  October 02, 2011, 11:44:12 pm
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MightyKombat: Maybe I can talk someone into editing it in later once the main sprites are done. Hah.
StormEX: From what I recall, you are aiming towards a VS series based one, whereas I am looking to set up a spriteset that allows options for VS series and more grounded fighters as well.


I blame Eli for this.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#18  October 02, 2011, 11:47:55 pm
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SQUIRRELY
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#19  October 03, 2011, 10:20:09 am
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MightyKombat: Maybe I can talk someone into editing it in later once the main sprites are done. Hah.


I blame Eli for this.

1. It would take something like Gill's doublesided ness. But yeah I see why you left it out. Lot of work. Plus it reminds me how Capcom originally planned to have Dee Jay's trousers read "Mantis" but changed it for that reason.

2. MAKOTO CONFIRMED FOR BRAWL *tomato'd*
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#20  October 05, 2011, 04:08:55 am
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Quite a bit of work for little real gain.


And because it is honestly a pretty cheap and easy edit from above, one true Squirrely.

Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#21  October 05, 2011, 04:15:26 am
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That looks really good like the rest of your sprites. And thanks for your Color Separation guide it's really Useful and easy i'm using it to Color separate Hiryu and it's really helpful.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#22  October 05, 2011, 05:22:09 am
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Nice to hear that someone's found a use for it. I swear I post some of these things for no reason sometimes as so little of it sees any actual usage.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#23  October 05, 2011, 08:05:43 pm
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People wil learn.... some day...
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#24  October 05, 2011, 08:11:15 pm
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Quite a bit of work for little real gain.


And because it is honestly a pretty cheap and easy edit from above, one true Squirrely.

Now that's cool. Possible project one day or just a one-time thing?

Also do you plan on looking at the Arc System Works games sprites, like Guilty Gear and the like next?
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#25  October 06, 2011, 02:40:54 am
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Makoto there was mostly just a quick edit from the last one as both had some similar features to start with. Not familiar with the character enough to consider for a real project. Have considered looking at the various Arc System Works games, but I still have a bit of unfinished business with Capcom and their CPS3 era work first.

Have this strange cat themed fellow bugging me about working on a CPS3 styled character to go along with Goku and Vegeta. Could only think of one character that might be worth it as I had done edits for him in the past for another person's project. I'll just say "Pantera - 10's" and leave it at that.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#26  October 06, 2011, 03:07:28 am
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KAAAAAKOOOOOROOOOOOTT!!!!!!!!
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#27  October 06, 2011, 02:30:47 pm
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Ah yeah. I forgot about CPS3.

What about SNK's AOF trilogy and Fatal Fury series? Just sayin'.
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#28  October 06, 2011, 03:08:32 pm
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I don't think there's much to be said about AOF, artwise. Sprites are large, clunky, and they follow very basic rules of "Add as many colors to make it look like it has more detail", being the brightest shade of every color WHITE in most cases, which sucks IMO. This applies to AOF 1 and 2. Regarding AOF3, one of the few noteworthy things to mention are the insane amount of frames for the animations, but nothing remarkable on the sprite style itself.

For the FF series, I'll let other people comment since I didn't really play any of those games enough to remember.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#29  October 06, 2011, 03:15:19 pm
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I do know they went a more cartoonish route between RB1 and special. Compare RB1 Franco to RBS Franco.
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#30  October 07, 2011, 04:51:35 am
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AOF related sprites never really caught my attention; just didn't quite look right to me. Can't say I played a great deal of Fatal Fury titles either, or at least nowhere near to the amount of time spent on games using styles that I have covered/plan to cover to sprite studies.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#31  October 07, 2011, 09:12:47 am
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On the palette seperation thingy. E has created a program he calls merge layers.

Basically, you set up a palette, apply it to all your images, alter said palette and create another version of all the images. Palette should be the same on both sprites, but one set has say, hair and everything shared the different colour. You then have 2 sets

One normal
One with odd colours

You then run through the odd colours and simply delete the stuff you'd like seperated off, ie returning to original. E's tool will run through all the images and merge them together, so the stuff you deleted is overlaid onto the original sprite. This gives you a seperated block, as well as original stuff showing through.

It means if you wanna do lots going over the sprites a few times, but batch changing a palette is pretty simple, and you don't need to be so careful that you don't select/delete/draw over bits you weren't meant to because they'll come back from the "under" sprites.

If anyone is really interested in this i'll post some examples of how i do the setup. Dunno if E wants the program out there, don't see why he wouldn't.


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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#32  October 07, 2011, 09:26:18 am
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I understand it fully, is the dl at his site?
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#33  October 07, 2011, 10:16:46 am
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Makoto's tail should be way fluffier.
I'd complain about how the skirt should be shorter and the legs longer but those differences are because of the style, I guess.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#34  October 07, 2011, 01:01:25 pm
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I also just remembered. What about the cross-tonfa things on her arms?
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#35  October 07, 2011, 05:27:25 pm
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makoto' nipples should be bigger.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#36  October 07, 2011, 10:19:03 pm
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Not particularly planning to do much more with Makoto, just a cheap edit off Itachi from the screenshot. If I did more, I'd give her back her original stance for starters.

Cyanide: I am aware of his tool, but personally prefer to work off a single image.

[e]: Not enough space, plus see my site regarding the subject matter.


Can see why Balthazar did not opt to follow all cps3 color usage. Not necessary in all cases. Slowly working on during later hours when I should have been sleeping. Hah.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#37  October 07, 2011, 10:27:08 pm
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Shame. Ah well.

I've grown to love Balthazar's spriting style since I saw his Goku and Vegeta. Any particular bits of his work you're looking at aside from what's mentioned?
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#38  October 07, 2011, 10:32:50 pm
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More looking at cps3 sprites for reference, although I did look at the mockshots that included his take on the character for some initial ideas on color choice.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#39  October 07, 2011, 11:07:48 pm
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What's the verdict so far? From the looks of the starter sprite it looks to be pretty good.
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#40  October 07, 2011, 11:13:08 pm
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Verdict? Think you lost me there. If you're talking about the style in general, I think Balthazar had it right to dumb things down a bit for the sake of animation, especially where it a lot of colors were not really needed. Downplaying the shading on the hair for instance as you go further back and down to make it a bit easier for fluid movement, and while the body may seem detailed it realistically isn't that bad considering the scale of things.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#41  October 07, 2011, 11:23:26 pm
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Yeah I meant the style in general. 

The bit about the hair also makes some palette making easier since you don't have to worry about the bits of hair that shoudl be recoloured to match.

I like some of your custom sprites too and agreed about the CvS-ification attempts by dampir. Can't really say they look that CvS to me.
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#42  October 08, 2011, 04:54:35 am
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As for the style as a whole, I consider it one of the high points of commercial pixel art. You have work that has a lot of detail, allows for very lush palettes, and retains a good deal of fluidity due to its roots in classical animation techniques. The only unfortunate thing I can think of regarding the style is that it saw relatively little usage because of how intensive it is to create on a larger scale. It's beautiful to look at, but there was a lot of manpower that went into making it, restricting how often it could be used.

As for the KOF into CvS edits, my general issue is just how rigid these edits wind up being compared to the source sprites.  The insistence on effectively just changing some shading and scale around to make it work is more of a handicap than anything else.  If they looked at the commercial examples to see just how Capcom's artists transitioned the characters from their initial looks into the CvS style, you'd see more interesting work.

Relating to Untalkative Saiyan, JZ reminded me of some rather nice white tones that existed off a particular Ken palette. Slowly setting up all the colors I need for him.


Added progress from day 3; I really need to start working on sprites at more reasonable hours of the day. Also, for the last time Iced I am not giving him a nipple beam he will have his explosive chest bump at most stop asking for it. .\/.
Last Edit: October 08, 2011, 06:48:42 am by Rolento
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#43  October 08, 2011, 12:38:50 pm
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It does seem like it'll take a while to do.

2. Yeah, I never really saw the appeal in dampir's sprites, it always looked like he took the original sprites, scaled them and messed with the shading. Honestly, they didn't look very different from the original.

3.  Give Broly a really loud long scream ala Hispanic DBZ chars for mugen when they do those long as heck intros :V
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#44  October 08, 2011, 05:06:04 pm
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Yeah, then I'll do a really stupid "black broly" voice patch for when you do the ENTIRE CHARACTER.
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#45  October 08, 2011, 05:13:06 pm
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And I'll do one where all his voices are him shouing "KAKAROT" or "KAKAROTTO" at repulsive volumes.
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#46  October 08, 2011, 05:55:39 pm
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1. Overly long scream is silly, and I don't think a sombrero would work on Broly.
2. Black Broly voice patch only makes sense if he has an intro stealing Bluestreak's jacket/hoodie/forget what the thing is called.
3. Pretty sure variable Kakarots and Kakarottos can be achieved though just grabbing samples from the other titles he's appeared in. What would be funny is a joke intro that is basically an acapella intro with assorted cameos. Would not require a Black Broly voice for that but rather a few male and and at least 1 female voice to cover things.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#47  October 08, 2011, 06:44:21 pm
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1. Nah, I didn't mean give him a sombrero. When I said "ala Hispanic DBZ chars" it meant "Like" But anyway yeah.

2. I prefer the term anorak. It works doesn't it?

3. Acapella KAkarot choir would be the shit.
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#48  October 08, 2011, 07:07:01 pm
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or with a bluestreak pallet
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#49  October 08, 2011, 07:14:01 pm
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Indeed. Suppose the hoodie would end up as more of a decorative scarf considering the scale.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#50  October 08, 2011, 07:38:10 pm
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It also looks like you're gonna have Broly emulate God Rugal's stance like Flowagirl/NEcromancer's did.
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#51  October 08, 2011, 09:22:50 pm
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As I may have been the person who edited that stance in there, probably a safe bet. Hah. (Reason for the may being that I remember doing some edits for his Broly including a stance, but I'm not sure the final stance is the same one. Too long ago.)
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#52  October 08, 2011, 09:30:32 pm
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Really? Wow, didn't know that.

Are you gonna draw Cooler next? Just asking.
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#53  October 08, 2011, 09:53:09 pm
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Was thinking more into going into animating the Legendary Goku Puncher here.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#54  October 08, 2011, 10:24:20 pm
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Sounds like fun.
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#55  October 09, 2011, 12:34:16 am
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Think I've got the color count down to 36 for base spritework. Should be able to cover a reasonable range of palette ideas I think. (Don't bother on this image though; no index present to edit.)
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#56  October 09, 2011, 03:39:54 am
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Wow man!, this is really nize.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#57  October 09, 2011, 11:37:22 am
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I call 2nd BRoly Movie Hair Colour and Bio-Broly.
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#58  October 10, 2011, 02:49:37 am
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Actually, added version with additional white tone for eyes and teeth now. There we go.
Last Edit: October 10, 2011, 03:01:15 am by Rolento
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#59  October 10, 2011, 03:13:36 am
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Thats right Black Broly in this muhfuckuh! First imma truck trunks and gohan, then imma punt vegeta!!!
Spriting is hard.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#60  October 10, 2011, 03:44:36 am
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Good afternoon, Kakarotto. I have nominated you to be the first of my victims.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#61  October 10, 2011, 10:27:56 am
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Awesome work on Broly!!!!


But last one misses a decent hat, something as:

Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
I swear there was something cool here!!
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#62  October 10, 2011, 03:10:49 pm
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I was very close to adding the hat, but then I realized it would be impossibly to fit well over that haircut anyway. Hah.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#63  October 10, 2011, 03:58:01 pm
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you can fusion his hair style and the hat, because that's the only way i see it working.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#64  October 10, 2011, 04:46:45 pm
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Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#65  October 10, 2011, 04:57:22 pm
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I was very close to adding the hat, but then I realized it would be impossibly to fit well over that haircut anyway. Hah.

You can't copypasta and alter Carl's hat then?

How about a pickelhaube?
There was a sig here. Its gone now (thanks photobucket ya fecks)
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#66  October 10, 2011, 05:59:11 pm
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Its "Bluestreak" not "Da Black Broly." Not that this would be hard to edit.
Spriting is hard.
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#67  October 10, 2011, 11:41:51 pm
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Titiln: Wait, there was a Black Broly? Hah!
I'll just have to look at Carl later, or draw on a tiny bowler hat or something.


Came to conclusion that Broly's undeniably large for widescreen. Reduced his upper body a bit and currently using 80% in engine scaling to bring him down to size.
Last Edit: October 11, 2011, 05:22:05 am by Rolento
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#68  October 11, 2011, 01:45:13 pm
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Well Broly was a big fat bastard in the anime. In most of the games, especially Budokai 3, he TOWERS over everyone present.
There was a sig here. Its gone now (thanks photobucket ya fecks)
Re: Tired Man's Guide to Color Separation / Yet another .\/. random stuff topic
#69  October 11, 2011, 01:48:40 pm
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