Things that take away the competative aspect from the game. IE X-men vs. Street Fighter is broken because almost every character has really easy infinites that you can lead in to with minimal effort. In Super Turbo Akuma is broken when played correctly since he can leave characters in infinite block stun never letting the opponent do anything no matter what happens on their joystick. SvC although not as broken as those two has some characters with big unblockable set ups that skilled players are able to bust out with ease, death loops etc. Characters are incredibly unbalanced where some are awesome and others SNK just didn't know what to do with.
mugenxero said, August 18, 2009, 08:04:47 amstuffNow that begs the question... If everyone is broken, isn't that technically balanced?
There are degrees of brokenness. Ivan Ooze is more broken than say XvSF Cyc. In XvSF certain characters have more easy ways to lead into mid screen infinites like wolverine.
Noah Bennet said, August 18, 2009, 08:58:03 amAnd yet... It's hilarous how infinites that rely in Stand-off Install/Maha Tandem aren't banned."Mahas" don't really add infinites to characters who wouldn't have them otherwise I think. But anyway, there's some sort of etiquette rule where you can't use more than one Tandem in a row unless the first Stand Crushed, so I guess the infinites they cause are banned in a sense (or at least soft banned).
Correct, but Mahas lead to some unblockable setups... which lead to your generic combo into a YET another lenghty Tandem/infinite.The Tandem limit is new to me though! I only knew of the extremely obvious Petshop ban.
As much as any tandem, having the Stand do a low attack while you do an overhead (or vice-versa) doesn't require the install. And there are already so many unblockable setups outside of tandems that one can't blame it on them.In fact that's one of the things I love about JoJo, you're given two good mechanics to relieve block pressure (advancing guard and free guard cancels), but the attacker is also given such setups and a lot of mixup potential (KOF-style jumps + craziness) - to me it has just the right amount of brokeness.
mugenxero said, August 18, 2009, 10:03:58 amThere are degrees of brokenness. Ivan Ooze is more broken than say XvSF Cyc. In XvSF certain characters have more easy ways to lead into mid screen infinites like wolverine.Speaking of XMvSF, you know how broken it is? The fucking AI did an infinite against me. And no, I couldn't get out of it, no matter how hard I tried.Who was it? Ken.What was it?SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN SHORYUKEN
Flowchart Ken must be canon.In SF4 yes, but in XvSF the second Shoryuken still hits so you get stuck in a flowchart loop.V
But it isn't as good as his crouch short as that leads into his crouch fierce for 28, 5jab, 5strong, 8roundhouse, \/, (8jab, 8roundhouse)xn for full health.
Any game where you need to use individual directions with a joystick for varied purposes works best with numbers whether it be GG, BB, or some versus games things.
Judging by your avatar you play Blazblue, write out a BnB for Arakune with num commands, then write the same combo out for him with 'qcf etc' commands and you'll quickly see the point of using numbers. 'down left' being 1 ends up being a lot easier over all. As stated, the standard US QCFs and the like work well for certain games and are bulky/near useless for others. heck, even wolverine's basic infinite in XvSF.QCF notation:Dash forward, c.lp, c.lk, c.mp, down back RH.K, up forward Lp, neutral air lk, neutral air mp, Aerial down MK~neutral air FP~neutral air Rhk, (land, up lp, neutral air lk, neutral air mk, neutral air FP, neutral air RhK) repeatvs.Numpad notation:661.lp, 1lk, 1mp, 1Rhk, 9lp, 5lk, 5mp, 2mk~5fp~5Rhk, (\/, 8lp, 5lk, 5mk, 5fp, 5rhk)xnAt least for me the secondary of these is far easier to understand, write, and use. If things you need to write consist of simple things like j.fierce (where aerial direction doesn't matter) c.strong (where 1, 2, and 3 are all acceptable), c.forward (again where 1-3 are acceptable), QCF Fierce that's all good, it just loses more and more efficacy as things become less reliant on vague information *like 1-3 acceptable.* and more reliant on precise directions to alter normals, effect spacing, etc.
It's not an issue of convenience at all, it's an issue of universal readability. It's a forum, you take the time to spell correctly anyways, so why not just use something that can be understood by all? All the Spanish/Japanese/French speakers have to speak english outside of International after all, don't they?
The only time numbers were okay for me in command notation was Tekken. And I would rather stick with QCF type commands.
About cheapness, I just don't like sitting through infinites. Though, I guess the trick is to not get caught in them so easily.
However he's still fun to play even if his speed is illogical(midget + huge sword = fast attacks[WTF]).Another cheap thingy was the 5th level of the GG:Boost-Mode from GGI. If you don't manage to warp to the ending of the stage(you have to warp in all levels that appear before, I guess[I forgot how to warp in the 1st one -.-]) the enemies will gangrape you to the extreme.
In team/tag games a single cheap character can be easily overcome by a cheap team. Take kofxi's duck king, he is top tier but not cheap by himself, but put him in a stun team and he will become as annoying as oswald.
Lyuna Silverleaf said, August 19, 2009, 12:28:59 amNot all of us use that format for moves, jesus, it's like trying to decode hieroglyphics. mugenxero said, August 19, 2009, 06:24:19 amJudging by your avatar you play Blazblue, write out a BnB for Arakune with num commands, then write the same combo out for him with 'qcf etc' commands and you'll quickly see the point of using numbers. 'down left' being 1 ends up being a lot easier over all. As stated, the standard US QCFs and the like work well for certain games and are bulky/near useless for others. heck, even wolverine's basic infinite in XvSF.QCF notation:Dash forward, c.lp, c.lk, c.mp, down back RH.K, up forward Lp, neutral air lk, neutral air mp, Aerial down MK~neutral air FP~neutral air Rhk, (land, up lp, neutral air lk, neutral air mk, neutral air FP, neutral air RhK) repeatvs.Numpad notation:
Wait, people use "neutral" in commands other than Tekken? And even then there is a symbol for Neutral.I'm half convinced he purposely lengthened the "normal way" to prove a point.
I don't use that other method because I like QCF styled commands better. That other method is kinda annoying to me.I gave it a chance.
Jesuszilla said, August 18, 2009, 08:19:57 ammugenxero said, August 18, 2009, 08:04:47 amstuffNow that begs the question... If everyone is broken, isn't that technically balanced?I'd assume whoever hits first wins.
MirageAtoli said, September 10, 2009, 08:05:25 amJesuszilla said, August 18, 2009, 08:19:57 ammugenxero said, August 18, 2009, 08:04:47 amstuffNow that begs the question... If everyone is broken, isn't that technically balanced?I'd assume whoever hits first wins.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qVkkYyRgS4U
Cheapness is a poison in most Japanese games, like i.e. Johann in ROTD. He spams the same attacks in a cycle, first his "'nado spam" (which in this game is an energy slash), then he'll kick you some times, and then, "BIG FINISHA!!!" (that "Dragon Dome-Wave"), which takes HALF OF YOUR LIFE BAR AWAY. Most of the characters in this game will kick your ass if you don't apply heavy team-work, using team combos and DMs to your fullest advantage, but this guy takes the cake.
X-Men: Next DimensionThe time-limits against the robots are fucking cheap. As much as I remember they were like 30-60 seconds and it wasn't possible to win with a time-victory. That means you have to play like a god, which is difficult because the game was poorly programmed.
If he's played by a human. Also the special versions of Sol and Ky with their "always full" special meters.
grapplers from KOF are cheap. I can understand with goro being big and slow and typical grapple trait, but, small guys like ramon, or blue mary .... I hate them. they all actively dash themselves forward and grab with a faster speed than normal, greater priority than normal, greater damage than normal, many of some can attack grounded opponent as well, on the otherhand the projectiles there is not that awesome, they can easily rolled in dash and grab. resulted in a battle of countless rolls instead of real fighting.I prefer capcom's you hit me some, I hit you some, lets see who'll stand at the end.
Ivan Ooze is here, that means bosses are fair game.As such...http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T9HuQswu4-U&feature=relatedhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hjUa_TY1xgc&feature=relatedThe first is the intial part of a 4-video chain. She's as bad, if not worse than he is.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3SNj9_LE9YDedicated to all the people who ask charging for specials to be removed from Mugen chars. 8)
Zako A said, November 27, 2009, 12:41:20 amhttp://guiltygear.honmaru.pl/img/leopaldon.jpgIf he's played by a human. Also the special versions of Sol and Ky with their "always full" special meters. FUCK LEOPALDON!!!Anyway, I say an extremely cheap character would be: TEH WHOLE FUCKING CAST OF MORTAL KOMBAT 2 IN TEH ARCADE! HATE!!!
PotS said, December 29, 2009, 06:11:06 pmhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3SNj9_LE9YDedicated to all the people who ask charging for specials to be removed from Mugen chars. 8)SvC Guile..
Shadow_Darkness said, January 03, 2010, 11:49:53 am"Boss" Order Sol. Man that guy is the soul of cheapness.Indeed. His supermove is the cheapest shit I've ever seen.
SvC Guile could combo booms infinitely in the corner, but over all he wasn't even the best character in the game.
mugenxero said, January 03, 2010, 08:45:06 pmSvC Guile could combo booms infinitely in the corner, but over all he wasn't even the best character in the game.Hahaha. I really need to look at some SvC tournament matches and see people breaking it apart.
Haven't seen many tourney vids but here's part of Sonic hurricane showing the former part of my statement. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V6zNG8WUpi0&feature=related#t=4m07s
I don't think there's many SvC tournaments anymore, mostly because the game is widely considered as a pathetic joke of a fighter nowadays, really only fit for casual play.
Though you must admit, it had the most over the top anouncer, even beating out alpha 3 "Here comes a new Challengua!"
From the sound of things, it looks as if there are many ways to break a game. Also, never play a crossover made by SNK.
mugenxero said, January 04, 2010, 05:33:31 amThat be CvS1 right? And Millionaire fighting 2k1 is CvS2?Nah that little pocket thing that everyone loves.
lol no one has ever mentioned Brawl here XD~IC's7 ways on Chaingrabbing~FalcoJablock, Laser Lock~DededeChaingrab and CG Infinite on wall~MetaKnightMetaknightness(Yes I play Brawl as a competitive fighting game, Brawl+ to be exact)
Brawl's fun...but leans more of a casual thing than a fighter IMO.Anyway, one of the cheapst I know of is petshop's combo from JJBA. Trap, ice rape, then more ice rape, trap again, ice rape.
Can be blocked low and takes 3 gauges. Real reason birds only loses to 2 characters or so is: 1 he doesn't need to block low, 2 he can fly out of range for a lot of characters to hit him and play run away/spike games kind of like a small screened Storm, 3 some ZOMG incredible pokes/screen control moves.
ecthelionv2@hotmail.com said, January 13, 2010, 03:36:51 pmBrawl's fun...but leans more of a casual thing than a fighter IMO.Anyway, one of the cheapst I know of is petshop's combo from JJBA. Trap, ice rape, then more ice rape, trap again, ice rape.lol maybe this video will make all the difference?http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZBImJv8HbQinspiration son Brawl+>Melee>Brawl =D
For me, meh. I mostly see move spam and ring out, tis a pattern.so no, not impressed. If I see an epic fight...yeah I'll be impressed.
ecthelionv2@hotmail.com said, January 14, 2010, 04:00:26 pmFor me, meh. I mostly see move spam and ring out, tis a pattern.You do not seem to realize that ring out is the only way to KO in Smash.
Kei_Takaro said, January 14, 2010, 01:47:28 pmlol maybe this video will make all the difference?http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rZBImJv8HbQinspiration son Brawl+>Melee>Brawl =DYou should post a video that actually shows a match instead of one that just shows KOs.
HeadShot said, January 15, 2010, 08:44:31 pmecthelionv2@hotmail.com said, January 14, 2010, 04:00:26 pmFor me, meh. I mostly see move spam and ring out, tis a pattern.You do not seem to realize that ring out is the only way to KO in Smash.Uh no, I've played SSB games and you can KO by just beating the crap outta them.... No ring outs required. They just happen to be the fastest way to KO someone.
In every Super Smash brothers game I played unless it was set to some kind of stamina mode ring out was the only way to score a kill. You're likely trolling, but this post is in case you're mistaken instead. *Bites the hook.*
They just look like they get ringed out coz they involve some animation that sends them out of the ring in a Hillarious manner when you KO them normally...preferably with a baseball bat or hammer.
Azazel in Tekken 6..................................http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XKQ3UlpC030God damn blocks...
Eh, Alice seems more annoying than Azazel <_<;;About brawl, it's a combo video, an epic fight would need an epic ko, yet it would take a milllion tries to do so,btw, that isn't the standard brawl, it's for tournament use with hacked physics plus no one in the right mind would use items for competitive play. The ko's are in form of either gimping and smashing, wherein gimping, is where you knock your opponent out and stop his attempt to recover where smashing is a form of building up percentages where in after being punished enough at a high percent, one smash move will be able to send the opponent to the Blast zone.I also remember the brawl community is developing a Street Fighter Brawl modification in the workshop, go check it out if you want =D
ecthelionv2@hotmail.com said, January 16, 2010, 12:51:13 amThey just look like they get ringed out coz they involve some animation that sends them out of the ring in a Hillarious manner when you KO them normally...preferably with a baseball bat or hammer.In Smash there is no health count by default, you have damage percentage up to 999%, though 100% is usually enough to score a kill. As your damage count gets higher, the knockback you get when you are hit increases, and when you have accumulated enough damage a strong attack will send you flying off the stage. So the flying out of the ring is not an animation to make KOs funny, it's the actual knockback working its magic.