The Mugen Fighters Guild - [UPDATE!!! 2.26] SFA2 Rundown Back Alley REMIX

XamΣeta

[UPDATE!!! 2.26] SFA2 Rundown Back Alley REMIX

#1 February 24, 2010, 07:14:17 pm

IG @tanooki_ninja

Edited from NeoGouki's awesome conversion, this stage was a private of mine for some time now. I decided to release it due to a recent discussion in Cybaster's Stage Tool thread on the ups and downs of mugen limitations due to the layer 1 sprite reflection trick.

DOWNLOAD

Possible Updates:
~~- Animations from the light beams~~ DONE!
- Maybe "Water Splashes" through Interaction Code...someday

Please comment ...and Enjoy!

***Below Comments redirected from aforementioned thread***

Loona said, February 22, 2010, 08:56:25 pm

Or it's mirrored toward the screen with shadows toward the background or vice-versa (Gen's SFA2 stage comes to mind).

Tamez said, February 22, 2010, 10:30:45 pm

Gen's SFA2 stage is actually a bad example for general mugen purposes.

You know...it's funny you guys mention that just in time when I recently gave away a private SFA2 Gen Stage edit I did from NeoGouki's featuring that same exact reflection effect.

Loona, if you look for a stage called "Arbol de Wif" or the night version "Noche de Wif" you could clearly see the advantages and disadvantages of creating such an effect in the actual mugen builds.

Tamez, as always, you are spot on about the issues this has with mugen and I'd like to add some pics for visual reference and my own slice of the lemon on such issues.

Keep in consideration that the issues you mentioned are mainly seen with "spread leg zoffset" chars (vs. Series types including Juggernaut, Wolverine, Omega Red, Strider, etc.) or any other series of characters with abnormal standing point parameters, be it if they are huge in size or have a sort of dancing around stance like Elena from SF3 for example.
What I mean by "spread leg zoffset" is that in the character's stance, the feet are far apart from each other (spread) and don't exactly share a similar standing point in the zoffset line
Mainly the issue here is the foreground "tricked" sprite will crop the character sprites with its ugly sharp edge.

Yes, there's also an issue with a character falling and being covered by the front layer ground sprite, and there's also the issue with the front layer ground sprite looking FUGLY when a Flash Super Effect is shown...but that just adds to the mugen limitations list, and we all know mugen is not perfect.

If we can look past those things most SF and KOF series chars should be quite ok playing in this stage if in their stance, their legs are positioned close enough together over the zoffset...and basically, this stage would be a "regular" char compatible stage, because after all it has no Super Jump support which is the style of gameplay Juggernaut and others like him are mainly known for, making this stage a Non-Juggernaut Compatible one. Sorry Tamez, but Juggy can not play his all in here.

It would also be awesome to be able to code splashes on the water through stage interactivity code...just throwing it out there.

"We need other people in order to create the circumstances for the learning that we are here to generate" RIP Adam Yauch aka MCA
www.instagram.com/tanooki_ninja

Last Edit: February 26, 2010, 06:30:30 pm by MaxBeta

Tamez

Re: SFA2 Rundown Back Alley REMIX

#2 February 25, 2010, 03:13:29 am

I work at Elecbyte as a sexy janitor.

Well, the whole discussion was about using reflection and shadows at once.
Yet you have no shadows? $:-\$ The original game had both.

Anyway, one of the things to remember when making a large layerno=1 image is to place it twice. There should be a layerno = 0 sprite behind the layerno =1 sprite.

The reason is because some characters use something that removes layerno = 1 stage items during their super moves. Wonder Woman is one example. I turned on debugbg so you can see, but even with it off you would notice the "smearing" effect that would happen if there was simply no sprite there at all.

Also, you can still see reflection in your own images right under KFM's feet. That kinda kills some of the illusion.

But yeah. Outside of a fullgame, I just don't see it being worth it.

www.elecbyte.com

XamΣeta

Re: SFA2 Rundown Back Alley REMIX

#3 February 25, 2010, 02:26:35 pm

IG @tanooki_ninja

Tamez said, February 25, 2010, 03:13:29 am

Well, the whole discussion was about using reflection and shadows at once.
Yet you have no shadows? $:-\$ The original game had both.

Well yeah, shadows over ground, reflections over water...that can only be done through stage interaction code, and even then I don't think it would be possible in the actual mugen builds, so it's one or the other.

The reason why some reflection pixels show under KFM's feet is because I had to leave some open ground there, otherwise chars are badly cropped when they fall. It still happens, but not as much, and it really is a small space that is almost unnoticeable while playing.

Tamez said, February 25, 2010, 03:13:29 am

Anyway, one of the things to remember when making a large layerno=1 image is to place it twice. There should be a layerno = 0 sprite behind the layerno =1 sprite.

Thanks a lot for the tip, and I will be fixing that soon enough today. But still, I think we've already established that the stage serves no purpose for Super Jump characters and if I recall correctly, Wonder Woman is one of them. Do you recall other characters besides her that have this effect over layerno=1 grounds? I'd like to test some things.

Anyways, my intention with this stage was to offer the other side of the coin that NeoGouki avoided. Even with its limitations and bugs and all, I'm sure some people might find it useful and enjoyable...so let's not deem it unworthy yet.

"We need other people in order to create the circumstances for the learning that we are here to generate" RIP Adam Yauch aka MCA
www.instagram.com/tanooki_ninja

Tamez

Re: SFA2 Rundown Back Alley REMIX

#4 February 26, 2010, 03:04:51 am

I work at Elecbyte as a sexy janitor.

MaxBeta said, February 25, 2010, 02:26:35 pm

Tamez said, February 25, 2010, 03:13:29 am
The original game had both.
Well yeah, shadows over ground, reflections over water...

Um. No. Play SFA2 again.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0kyPUcnw0I

MaxBeta said, February 25, 2010, 02:26:35 pm

I think we've already established that the stage serves no purpose for Super Jump characters and if I recall correctly, Wonder Woman is one of them. Do you recall other characters besides her that have this effect over layerno = 1 grounds?

I just used WW because when I was testing layerno = 1 stuff for my own work, she was the one I had on hand to test with. I can't recall offhand another person to test with, but that's because I haven't actually "played" mugen for about two months while my computer was messed up.

I know she's not the only one though. Ziltama even made a point of putting hidden things in his stages that only pop up when the remove layerno = 1 effect happens.

www.elecbyte.com

XamΣeta

Re: SFA2 Rundown Back Alley REMIX

#5 February 26, 2010, 03:47:10 pm

IG @tanooki_ninja

Tamez said, February 26, 2010, 03:04:51 am

MaxBeta said, February 25, 2010, 02:26:35 pm
Tamez said, February 25, 2010, 03:13:29 am
The original game had both.
Well yeah, shadows over ground, reflections over water...

Um. No. Play SFA2 again.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0kyPUcnw0I

Yes, you are right...can't argue there. But the shadows in mugen aren't oval-shaped dark blots that cover up most of the immediate proximity grounds below the character's feet, so it's not gonna work.

I guess its either shadows or reflections, but you can't have them both. Again, that's why I made this edit, to offer another option to the mugen gamer.

Tamez said, February 26, 2010, 03:04:51 am

I know she's not the only one though. Ziltama even made a point of putting hidden things in his stages that only pop up when the remove layerno = 1 effect happens.

Great. Info is much appreciated. I went over to Ziltama's website and by scanning over some of his stage screenshots, I've noticed that Reu, Pots and most Loganir, Buyog chars do this as well. So, I basically replicated the floor bottom in another instance with layerno=0 and that problem is now fixed. Thanks again, Tamez.

Currently working on giving the light beams some fade animation...this edited stage will see it's Final Update later today.

"We need other people in order to create the circumstances for the learning that we are here to generate" RIP Adam Yauch aka MCA
www.instagram.com/tanooki_ninja

Last Edit: February 26, 2010, 04:26:16 pm by MaxBeta

XamΣeta

Re: [UPDATE!!! 2.26] SFA2 Rundown Back Alley REMIX

#6 February 26, 2010, 06:32:09 pm

IG @tanooki_ninja

Stage has been UPDATED today! New Light Beam animations.

"We need other people in order to create the circumstances for the learning that we are here to generate" RIP Adam Yauch aka MCA
www.instagram.com/tanooki_ninja

DrZaius

Re: SFA2 Rundown Back Alley REMIX

#7 March 05, 2010, 05:26:23 am

Professional Gorilla
Ook ook!

Sorry if this is a late response but I thought it might help.

MaxBeta said, February 26, 2010, 03:47:10 pm

Tamez said, February 26, 2010, 03:04:51 am
MaxBeta said, February 25, 2010, 02:26:35 pm
Tamez said, February 25, 2010, 03:13:29 am
The original game had both.
Well yeah, shadows over ground, reflections over water...

Um. No. Play SFA2 again.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M0kyPUcnw0I

Yes, you are right...can't argue there. But the shadows in mugen aren't oval-shaped dark blots that cover up most of the immediate proximity grounds below the character's feet, so it's not gonna work.

Couldn't you edit the Shadow values so that they simulate those oval-shaped blots? Bring the yscale close to zero and have the shadow disappear entirely by setting fade.range values (if you don't want the shadow moving around at all when characters jump, that is).

My MUGEN and Minecraft site.
People need to stop using 4Shared, already.

Last Edit: March 05, 2010, 05:30:42 am by DrZaius

Left4Joker

Re: [UPDATE!!! 2.26] SFA2 Rundown Back Alley REMIX

#8 March 06, 2010, 02:29:27 am

Running thru the night

very nice...

amn ,,,its off-topic but... can you tell me what values you use in the resize of the sf3 ryu ??
i really liked ,makes it a bit more like chars from others sf

Console collection: Xbox 360, Wii, PS2, Dreamcast, PSP, Genesis, N64, PSX. ==Next buy: Gameboy Color ==

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