Jesuszilla said, March 03, 2016, 11:06:16 pmLilith's Dark Force wasn't that great anyway if I recall correctly.Speaking of things that weren't that great in source, if you add her pursuit attack, speed it up, because it was absolute trash in source.Well I didn't really like the Pursuit moves either..
Ok, just a quick little update here to give a little info. I ran into a laptop complication, but as quickly as it came, I soon had a solution. So, that being said, I've added throw teching to her and decided i needed to realign her sff, since she wasnt really aligned properly, meaning I also had to update the air file and some positions for helpers and stuff. I also re-ripped the vampire chronicle sounds and voices (with the help of a friend of course) mainly because the pack provided here was missing a few sounds (including the KO voice, strangely).As always, I'm open to your suggestions and ideas, so please feel free to leave em here.
Sorry for multiple posting, but I've finally worked up to a test build, to show the progress, and get your opinions. I've also whipped up a little Combo Challenge text, reminiscent of Expert Mode from Street Fighter EX Plus Alpha. I thought it'd be nice to show some tools to get people familiarized and to show her possibilities. Alright so, please test thoroughly, and tell me what you think. I will leave a changelist below:System Advancements:-Added Tech Hits-New guard sound-Added Guard-Pushing-Throws now single button command-Super-Combo inputs now traditional-Modified Vampire Savior combo system-Light Punches / Kicks now self-cancellable-Added renda bonus (from Vampire Savior)-Intricate Super-Cancel combos (from Street Fighter EX)Lilith Additions:-Connected Soul Flash to char palette-Frame data nabbed from Vampire Savior-C. Stand HP is now Command Normal (moar anti-airs pls)-Implemented JZ's "Blur Frame thru Hitpause" method-Added Lilith's Momentum Dash Slide from Vampire Savior-New large port created by me and Daniel9999999-Added 2nd TauntDownload: Click Here
I did try her out and I got a buncha questions, but before that I must say that she's pretty solid and gamelike, her cancels are pretty much as the game and I love that ammount of dedication into making her perfect, I think more people should try this one instead of certain easy to find Liliths, with that said:-Do you plan on adding her highjump from source? I was thinking it could help her overall fast pace, since it allowed her to move rather quickly.-Do you still need basic movement hitboxes in case you're missing any?-Do you plan on adding extra tougher challenges?-Any extra source buffs you might think of adding? I know you made the Ax kick (S. HK) to act like in Vsav2, but what other buffs do you plan on making or have made?-Do you have any future plans?
Morri said, March 16, 2016, 08:02:34 pmI did try her out and I got a buncha questions, but before that I must say that she's pretty solid and gamelike, her cancels are pretty much as the game and I love that ammount of dedication into making her perfect, I think more people should try this one instead of certain easy to find LilithsThank you very much! I'm glad you appreciate it. Now to answer your questions:- Yes, I was planning on that.- I'm not sure on relying on the source games hitboxes very much, since they're a bit janky..- More challenges, maybe. That is, if I can think of them.- Well I've already given her quite the amount of buffs already (longer range soul flash, anti-airs, hitboxes, etc.) so I feel adding more would be overkill.- Future plans are up to you guys, but in the short term, I still have to add the SFEX Guard-Breaker.
Morri said, March 18, 2016, 09:20:13 pmSay, do you plan keeping air blocking or are you going to go for Vsav's blocking rules?That, I'm not very sure of. I feel like making her normals air-unblockable would be a bit too advantageous.
ヤモリX said, March 19, 2016, 12:11:26 amThat, I'm not very sure of. I feel like making her normals air-unblockable would be a bit too advantageous.well that actually depends on a couple of factors, they will be advantageous depending on the move's physical priorities, if the top of the hitboxes allows little trading then yeah it will have an advantage as an antiair, but you gotta remember that these games also induce resets in these cases, and you won't be able to hit them with any move again until they land or are able to attack, so it's more of an advantage into them. (You'd prefer a reset more than say, getting ground comboed)
Air normals should always be air blockable. That's how it's been in every Capcom game with air block.
Jesuszilla said, March 20, 2016, 03:15:31 amAir normals should always be air blockable. That's how it's been in every Capcom game with air block.Thats correct, but the debate at hand was over whether I should keep her grounded normals air-unblockable.Morri said, March 20, 2016, 03:10:53 amwell that actually depends on a couple of factors, they will be advantageous depending on the move's physical priorities, if the top of the hitboxes allows little trading then yeah it will have an advantage as an antiair, but you gotta remember that these games also induce resets in these cases, and you won't be able to hit them with any move again until they land or are able to attack, so it's more of an advantage into them. (You'd prefer a reset more than say, getting ground comboed)Hmm.. I guess that'd very much depend on the chars at hand, wouldn't it? What I mainly had in mind was how many other chars out there do have air-blockable normals. Also, let me just ask: what do you think of the current system's way of handling it? (Hittable at all times except when falling, but control is regained after 15 ticks)
Ah, grounded normals? Quite debatable. I personally force them as unblockable in the air like the original games do, though @Vans: would argue against this due to Marvel characters being a thing.But even in the case of Marvel characters, you'd essentially be buffing the character in that system who already probably has a distinct advantage over you, so I say, unblockable!
ヤモリX said, March 20, 2016, 03:31:14 amWhat I mainly had in mind was how many other chars out there do have air-blockable normals.Well, you gotta remember that MUGEN is pretty much a conjunction of characters of many different styles and that pretty much there's gonna be clashing between characters of different series, mainly due to rule differencies... I wouldn't put too mich thought about that if you ask me.ヤモリX said, March 20, 2016, 03:31:14 amAlso, let me just ask: what do you think of the current system's way of handling it? (Hittable at all times except when falling, but control is regained after 15 ticks)I like it, since the moves on Lilith weren't so antiair-ish anyway and makes the basic ground comboing work in the air as well. However I think the hittimes should be the exact same as the ground hittimes, just to avoid infinites or making moves unsafe like that.
For a character who's air mobility isn't as elaborate as other gameplay styles, anti-airing is a pretty important tool to have so yeah, I'd vouch for making them air unblockable.
Alright, so, from what I've gathered here, I'll most likely make them air-unblockable. But with that in mind now, should I make them fall into an unrecoverable but invulnerable state on hit (a la vsav) or stick to the current method?Also a little off-topic statement: I don't want to sound whiny or anything, but I'm a bit puzzled at the fact that quite a few people did download the test build, but I didn't get much of any feedback on that..
Most people are into collecting and don't quite have the knowledge to impart feedback. Ideally, verbal interest would align closer to download count but that's not quite how it goes sadly.
I'm really digging the combo challenge. The combos are just right so that I feel like I can do them, but they still present a major challenge.This might break her, but maybe she could make it so that her EX projectile hits twice? I know it's more so a pressure tool, but most of the time, EX projectiles hit twice, and it would be a nice little bonus to have. Maybe add the choice between a projectile that goes up and down (LP+MP) and a projectile that goes forward and hits twice (MP+HP)?
BrawlTheMan said, March 20, 2016, 07:56:45 pmI'm really digging the combo challenge. The combos are just right so that I feel like I can do them, but they still present a major challenge.Awesome! I'm glad you like it.BrawlTheMan said, March 20, 2016, 07:56:45 pmThis might break her, but maybe she could make it so that her EX projectile hits twice? I know it's more so a pressure tool, but most of the time, EX projectiles hit twice, and it would be a nice little bonus to have. Maybe add the choice between a projectile that goes up and down (LP+MP) and a projectile that goes forward and hits twice (MP+HP)?What about LP+HP? :pIn all seriousness, that's a neat idea, especially since Lilith's' ES projectile hits 3 times in source, but yeah, she already has quite a few tools in her disposal already. It might be a bit much.
