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Hitbox Discussion I guess (Read 39596 times)

Started by TheFclass97, May 23, 2017, 04:43:13 am
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Hitbox Discussion I guess
#1  May 23, 2017, 04:43:13 am
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Thoughts? I decided to ask some people to make their versions of this normal (standing lp) and compare how we do our hitboxes. I was bored...

Note:

- Fixed Midori's to his newest version.
- Added Answers version
Last Edit: May 23, 2017, 05:01:39 am by TheFclass97
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#2  May 23, 2017, 04:58:42 am
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my ver
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#3  May 23, 2017, 05:01:07 am
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Ohh, interesting.... gonna add that to the main post.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#4  May 23, 2017, 05:04:43 am
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wouldnt it make sense to share a clean pic so that people could draw hitboxes over?
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#5  May 23, 2017, 05:07:38 am
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Enjoy???



When's the Melee hitboxes?
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#6  May 23, 2017, 05:10:21 am
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I agree, and I also see what people priorities are. Man everyone does theirs differently, but same at the same time.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#7  May 23, 2017, 05:10:56 am
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Yamori's is the best. 2nd being zanqueef. Original is fine depending on how fast it is. If its really fast you want blue over read otherwise yamori is good. It's important to note that hit boxes are not about matching the sprite, it's the utility of the move itself.

Edit: I was focused on the upper half of which zanqueef is very much off the mark. You want something like fclass midori or yamori for the hurboxes. the hitboxes see my previous response.
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Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#8  May 23, 2017, 05:21:51 am
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it's because they are already content with what they have done, mugen is not a paying job so as long as the charcter works for a creator that's enough; one's persons crouching while running is another person's change it to pots style.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#9  May 23, 2017, 05:28:14 am
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Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#10  May 23, 2017, 05:58:08 am
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it's the utility of the move itself.

and this is why I don't like having the static picture only, I ahve no idea how the hand got there, for all I know, that's  a taunt and the hitbox should be in the finger.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#11  May 23, 2017, 12:54:47 pm
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Here's my shot at it.

Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#12  May 23, 2017, 03:12:41 pm
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I'm at work right now, but I'll be sure to post some other stuff like gifs and maybe other moves if ya'll are interested. I'll also update the posts when I'm off, because this is getting fun and interesting... Cool stuff guys :D
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#13  May 23, 2017, 03:29:13 pm
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Gonna echo what [E] and Kamekaze said; I have no idea how the hand got there, without the rest of the animation or knowing the move's purpose I can't make a proper judgement of the hitboxes. Perhaps the biggest question (original animation notwithstanding): is it an anti-air or not?
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#14  May 23, 2017, 08:57:39 pm
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I'm no character maker but here is my try (note: I don't like the idea of AA-jabs [with the exception of very few characters], so yeah :S):



PS: looking at it again I would probably increase her arm hurtbox downward a bit.
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Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#15  May 23, 2017, 09:23:40 pm
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Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#16  May 23, 2017, 10:17:15 pm
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Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#17  May 23, 2017, 10:46:17 pm
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That's an anti-sexual abuse defense. There's a mouse trap in there.
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Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#18  May 23, 2017, 10:50:24 pm
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Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#19  May 23, 2017, 10:51:11 pm
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Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#20  May 26, 2017, 02:18:09 am
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Wow, such a good hitbox. I'll update the first post later, but let's try something else (this time with animations!)

This is a standing Medium Attack from Uino (by Drowin).

Animation:



Original Hitbox:



Blank Version:



My version:



Hope we get some interesting versions here since well... it's weapons this time.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#21  May 26, 2017, 02:24:31 am
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here u go

do the thing
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#22  May 26, 2017, 02:56:51 am
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This seems right wish I could get my picture on here but I can't figure out how for some reason.
Edit: I've got it now witness the unholy hitbox.
Last Edit: May 26, 2017, 03:06:19 am by Memes never die
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#23  May 26, 2017, 03:08:29 am
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What is this, early Guilty Gear?

Also nice hitbox Yam.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#24  May 26, 2017, 03:59:36 am
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Now that we have animation involved...

Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#25  May 26, 2017, 06:41:15 am
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here we go:

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Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#26  May 26, 2017, 07:05:21 am
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I'm no expert on hitboxes or anything, but here's my take:

Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#27  May 26, 2017, 07:22:48 am
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I love how Fclass' version is pretty much how it would look in The Last Blade and Yamori X's is how it would look in Samurai Shodown

it's because they are already content with what they have done, mugen is not a paying job so as long as the charcter works for a creator that's enough; one's persons crouching while running is another person's change it to pots style.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#28  May 26, 2017, 01:36:54 pm
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Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#29  May 26, 2017, 06:37:01 pm
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Funny, cause I have never played or seen hitboxes of The Last Blade... Also, interesting hitboxes. I noticed more people put smaller ones under the sword more closer to her arm (which I assume covers the "swinging" part of the move).



https://www.flickr.com/photos/96872887@N07/sets/72157650671215997



Also, lol. I remember seeing this on twitter (I think you shared this one actually, not sure). I really like this, and I'll be honest... Some of them are fucking terrifying. xD

Any who, I guess I'll update stuff soon and put the hitboxes together with names... Actually, should I do that guys?
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#30  May 26, 2017, 07:15:01 pm
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Omg those skull girl hitboxes wtf man, what did they use to create
chars, fighter factorys auto clsn???
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#31  May 26, 2017, 07:17:53 pm
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They used way too many boxes too the point the have boxes inside their boxes inside their boxes....it's a hitbox orgy or something.
Edit: I understand that it works for the engine but on a visual standpoint it does seem a bit much but if I guess it works.
Last Edit: May 26, 2017, 07:25:56 pm by Memes never die
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#32  May 26, 2017, 07:24:20 pm
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Omg those skull girl hitboxes wtf man, what did they use to create
chars, fighter factorys auto clsn???

I honestly don't see SG hitboxes as bad as lets say... GG hitboxes or sf2 (but sf2 is a whole differently story, I wouldn't shit on sf2 really unless my name was T.Hawk). Cause is on it's own engine with it's own rules.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#33  May 26, 2017, 07:26:59 pm
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Omg those skull girl hitboxes wtf man, what did they use to create
chars, fighter factorys auto clsn???

I honestly don't see SG hitboxes as bad as lets say... GG hitboxes or sf2 (but sf2 is a whole differently story, I wouldn't shit on sf2 really unless my name was T.Hawk). Cause is on it's own engine with it's own rules.

You really gonna say they aren't as bad as sf2??
Only problem with sf2 was priority but they didnt
Auto clsn the shit like SG lol
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#34  May 26, 2017, 07:38:20 pm
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Yes, I am. It's not even a fair comparison, cause SF2 was the fighting game to shape the genre we know today and no one really had a clear understanding back then. Not to mention they are complete polar opposites of each other. But if you're gonna tell me these:





Are worse than these?





Then Idk...
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#35  May 26, 2017, 07:40:00 pm
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Yes ,I am. It's not even a fair comparison, cause SF2 was the fighting game to shape the genre we know today and no one really had a clear understanding back then. Not to mention they are complete polar opposites of each other. But you're gonna tell me these:





Are worse than these?





Then Idk...


Sf2 might have a couple funky boxes but skull girls is all fucked up,
All the chars all attacks
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#36  May 26, 2017, 07:41:23 pm
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Sure, they might look strange and maybe have a few meh places here and there, but it's by its own rules and at least try to match with their animations and usage.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#37  May 26, 2017, 07:43:33 pm
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Out of curiousity, did you also want us to provide a short explanation of why we chose the hitbox designs that we did? It would help illustrate the thought process behind them I would think.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#38  May 26, 2017, 07:45:18 pm
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if you want to.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#39  May 26, 2017, 08:53:33 pm
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sfs had this thing where the boxes were an important part of the gameplay and they kept onrebalancing them between revisions; so the boxes are what plays better and works the best in the game over years and eyars of testing; note that that could also  hold true for skullgirls, but at first impression they looks like stuff that a clsn generator woudl spit out, or at least an unpaid intern who has not idea what he is doing besides  "cover the sprite".
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#40  May 26, 2017, 09:00:22 pm
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That Guile St.MP hitbox is wrong and is a bug that is in hitbox viewers that don't draw frame perfectly, i.e. all of them due to how Turbo in CPS2 works IIRC. It's actually supposed to look like:

Please use the SRK wiki when looking at ST hitboxes from now on. It is much more accurate and is a solid resource, plus you don't have to cap stuff on your own so it's just easier. IF you want wack ST hitboxes I'd say Dhalsim Yoga Thrust. Most of them are just insane rather than like, complete nonsense.

But are there truly grown men in this world?!
Last Edit: May 26, 2017, 09:06:33 pm by Killer Kong
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#41  May 26, 2017, 09:08:55 pm
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Righty. So I guess the guy who did the flickr pics uses a bad hitox viewer? Or at least not updated ones n' shit? hmm.. thanks for noting.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#42  May 27, 2017, 01:39:35 am
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One blue for the body, one blue for the arm, and one red for the sword itself. The crayon-ey red and blue boxes are for the extension of the sword (outside of this particular frame).





Also here's an Kal MvC char version.



Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#43  May 27, 2017, 01:52:33 am
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Seriously
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#44  May 27, 2017, 04:24:30 am
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Weapons are tricky, but since that attack has a lot of horizontal range (and reasonable priority since it's a mid), it has to be highly vulnerable elsewhere. Specifically from aerial and sliding attacks. My 2 cents.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#45  May 27, 2017, 12:27:18 pm
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My attempt at this one.

Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#46  May 31, 2017, 05:09:27 pm
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I'm in the mood for some Guile.

Prior to ST you could do this button while moving forward or backward.
It was +3 on hit/block in Super/ST, +5 (!!!!) in CPS1. Discuss how amazing it is. Probably one of the most hilariously disjointed lights relative to its use and application.

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Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#47  August 17, 2017, 01:58:08 am
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Sorry for the bump... We haven't done this in a while, so lets give ti a shot shall we? OK!!! God, this thread was fun... Anywho, ya'll wanna take a crack at this?

Move in question:



Seems like a normal from Mewtwo...

Original hitbox:



Your template:



Have fun... and try to be serious with this one, I want to see how ya'll will approach this one...

Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#48  August 17, 2017, 02:04:37 am
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Top Tier
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#49  August 17, 2017, 02:21:37 am
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Alright so judging by the animation, the attack could go one of two ways: As a mid range poke or as a sweep. Considering the frame of animation that was provided, I decided to opt for the former, as a hitbox for a sweep version of this move is better suited for the next animation frame. The hitbox I feel best captures the movement of Mewtwo's tail, and since this move clearly isn't being used as an anti-air, I opted to position the tail's hurtbox above the actual tail itself, both to capture the movement of the tail and also to make it punishable from the air. The move looks to have pretty quick startup as well, so the large hurtbox balances this out, while still giving Mewtwo's tail some priority on the tip to fulfill its purpose as a poke.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#50  August 17, 2017, 02:27:49 am
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Continuing ye olde traditions

do the thing
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#51  August 17, 2017, 02:42:33 am
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my take at it :x



Considered it a mid range poke that is not supposed to be an anti-air.
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Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#52  August 17, 2017, 02:49:28 am
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Quick one I did using MS Paint:



I think I fucked up on the tailbox (the blue part).
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#53  August 17, 2017, 03:06:14 am
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Hmm, these are definitely interesting... I'll compile a list of hitboxes for a big comparison. I wonder if anyone else has any ideas of how they would do the hitbox/hurtbox for this move... Regardless, this is fun :3 Thanks for participating, this is kinda cool.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#54  August 17, 2017, 05:18:43 am
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I'd not evne make it hit in that frame but one frame later (maybe two, ahve not frame by frame the animation), i'd use hitboxes close to rigepigeon's (just a bit taller)
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#55  August 17, 2017, 08:03:30 pm
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Gonna give this a shot



This one is a bit trickier since, unlike the ones posted so far, this one is an aerial attack that both has an effect on it and also hits twice.

Original hitbox(es):


Template(s):


Seeing as this was taken from one of my own, I'll be abstaining from this one.
Last Edit: August 17, 2017, 08:52:39 pm by Ricepigeon
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#56  August 17, 2017, 08:24:03 pm
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Note: I used different colors since blue kinda made it hard to see, so in place, i used green for the hurtboxes, and yellow for the hitboxes.

do the thing
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#57  August 17, 2017, 08:28:31 pm
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Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#58  August 17, 2017, 08:53:23 pm
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By request, went and replaced the original hitbox images with ones that didn't blend into the background.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#59  September 18, 2017, 07:41:22 pm
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Gonna take this on a different spin; I'm sure many of you have seen mugen characters with limbs that are... "length-challenged", for lack of a better term. I'm of course referring to attacks like this:



The complete animation:



And your template:

Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#60  September 18, 2017, 09:13:36 pm
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Those eyes are scarier than any of his punches will ever be.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
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Now it has AMAZING priority!
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#62  September 24, 2017, 07:19:54 am
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Outside of joke hitboxes or ones that extend much farther than his fist, I can't really see how you could make the hitbox in a way that doesn't turn this move useless.

I suppose one could cheat a little and go with the "effect" route, having a punch-trail explod/effect for the attack so that it can extend their hitbox beyond where his fist actually is. without making things look too weird. 
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#63  September 24, 2017, 08:46:19 am
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Redo the sprites.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#64  September 24, 2017, 09:02:59 am
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I'd prefer to cheat the system in slightly... different way.

Made in Paint, used green and yellow colors just to not mix up with other hitboxes.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#65  September 24, 2017, 11:26:29 am
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There was a template instead of that joke picture, you could've taken that one.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#66  September 24, 2017, 12:12:44 pm
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Oh, right...
Well, here is the clean version.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#67  September 24, 2017, 05:23:46 pm
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Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#68  August 02, 2018, 04:35:16 am
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Necrobump my niggas

Welcome back to the stage of history! This time, I took a suggestion from a friend to make a hitbox for this move in particular:



And this is the frame you shall work with:



And this is my interpretation:



I'm sure you guys have way better hitboxes than mine, but this is for experimentation to see how you guys view your hitboxes and test some philosophies and have fun with it... So yeah, go ham!
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#69  August 02, 2018, 04:37:31 am
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Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#70  August 02, 2018, 04:44:34 am
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Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#71  August 02, 2018, 04:58:08 am
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Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#72  August 02, 2018, 05:26:52 am
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Okay so this one requires a bit of an explanation behind the thought process and why I had to do multiple submissions. Being familiar with JJBA, this is obviously a multi-hit move, so it would only make sense for the hitboxes to either be all over the place, or generalize the position of the hitboxes. Mulithit moves like this typically have a gap in between where there is no red clsn, as evidenced by A, which is also used for the startup frames of the attack, whilst B and C are the hitboxes that it would transition to as more hits progress, in order to compensate for push velocities. Since this is obviously not an anti-air, the last frame (D) is placed a bit lower and longer on the final hit to give it that final oomph.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#73  August 02, 2018, 07:07:00 am
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Pretty solid technique that I think is a lost art in this day and age
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Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#74  August 02, 2018, 07:15:49 am
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Shouldnt the Blue(hurt box) be in sync with the red(attack)? Say if red is 2x2, so should be the blue? :muttrox:
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#75  August 02, 2018, 10:39:03 am
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That would give the attack no priority.

My take on it:
Last Edit: August 02, 2018, 11:55:49 am by AlexSin
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#76  August 23, 2018, 02:32:39 pm
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Question, are people here actually using good hitbox practices here, or are we being sarcastic with our placement?
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Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#77  August 23, 2018, 04:57:01 pm
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I take it you don't like any of them (which ones are you talking about, by the way?), so how would you make them?
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#78  August 23, 2018, 09:21:33 pm
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I don't have much to add since I've never made a character in mugen b4, but Pikachu guy might be talking about what I've noticed when I was making my mugen characters:

When I make characters using only red hit boxes they always win the match.
When I make characters using only blue hit boxes they always lose.

The solution is I make all my characters to only use red hit boxes. That's why their AI is so strong, even at difficulty level 1.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#79  August 23, 2018, 10:50:26 pm
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But that's also what makes them broken. You should use both red and blue boxes.
Beware the Dark Wolf once more!
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#80  August 23, 2018, 11:49:40 pm
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His post was totally serious, red boxes ftw!!! :goi:
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#81  August 24, 2018, 12:12:39 am
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: <

Well, my intention was serious but eh, what can you do?
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#82  January 14, 2019, 07:06:31 pm
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Time to bump this with something I think is quite interesting. We've talked about weapons before in this thread, but what about something a little bigger?

Reading through Umezono's reviews of the October CotM nominees, specifically the review of Gordeau by OHMSBY, he mentions how some of Gordeau's hitboxes are 'absolutely enormous', and that's a fair point, so what would you do differently?

OHMSBY's version:


UNIST version:


Template:


Animation reference:


You'll notice the hitboxes are active on a later frame in the UNI version, but since that's the original, that's what I decided to use for the template (plus it's easier to see the weapon's range).

Have fun if you want to attempt it (let's get at least a couple of serious ones, hah).
3DS FC: 0516 - 7483 - 3564
Oh, I want a diagram. I fucking love diagrams.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#83  January 14, 2019, 07:16:23 pm
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basically if it was in my game

do the thing
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#84  January 14, 2019, 07:24:39 pm
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Here's my horrible attempt at hitboxes.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#85  January 14, 2019, 07:46:36 pm
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Not exactly who or how this character plays. But there'd be a massive delay on recovery to make up for the massive hitbox advantage.
The first hit box frame would last 1 tic. The end hit box would be determined in game and edited down to probably 2 tics, maaaaybe 3.
I should have extending his blue boxes to match where his arm first travels in the 1 tic attack frame, but that'd be worked out after a few tests.
Spoiler: LARGE GIF INSIDE (click to see content)


----
Yamori X, why would you be able to hit all that open blue above the ax?
vVv Wheat Stage Released vVv
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#86  January 14, 2019, 07:54:41 pm
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Eh...

Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#87  January 14, 2019, 08:29:17 pm
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idk about that blue box on the staff... seems awkward cuz if an attack hits that blue box on the staff, damage will be dealt to the fighter.
Beware the Dark Wolf once more!
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#88  January 14, 2019, 08:37:12 pm
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That's how weapon attack CLSNs usually go for.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#89  January 14, 2019, 10:26:17 pm
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ya, so they cant just throw out unpunishable hits. kof provides the best example of this.

in a game like bbctag i feel like theres enough tech that it doesnt make gordy that bad on his own, but then again, gordeau/ruby is a popular team precisely cause their scythes control so much space with minimal risk
youtube
●▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬♥๑۩۩๑♥▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬●
Put this on the profile of people who are known/wanted terrorists
that were involved in the September 11th attacks in 2001
●▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬♥๑۩۩๑♥▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬●
- courtesy of Iced
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#90  January 14, 2019, 10:45:09 pm
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Last Edit: January 14, 2019, 10:49:36 pm by nick.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#91  January 14, 2019, 10:49:46 pm
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youtube
●▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬♥๑۩۩๑♥▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬●
Put this on the profile of people who are known/wanted terrorists
that were involved in the September 11th attacks in 2001
●▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬♥๑۩۩๑♥▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬▬●
- courtesy of Iced
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#92  January 14, 2019, 11:06:46 pm
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Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#93  January 15, 2019, 08:10:45 pm
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As I've said many times before, even weapon based fighting games know that weapons are to be treated as an extension of the body. Yet there will always be someone who expects realism in a genre where the laws of gravity are horribly warped and regular people throwing fireballs are the norm.

it's because they are already content with what they have done, mugen is not a paying job so as long as the charcter works for a creator that's enough; one's persons crouching while running is another person's change it to pots style.
Last Edit: January 15, 2019, 08:14:53 pm by Alpaca-San
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#94  January 16, 2019, 01:17:05 am
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So at what point do we consider large disjoint hitboxes to go from carefully crafted character design to bad design?
If the character is designed to control space with large disjoints, couldn't that be considered as part of their kit for zoning purposes?

Last I remember Gordy's large disjoints were considered part of his character identity.
Last Edit: January 16, 2019, 01:21:56 am by vgma2
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#95  January 16, 2019, 01:25:07 am
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 I normally just go with "roughly half the hitbox needs a hurtbox" route because a lot of fighters I play do this with weapon based attacks and it's what I use as a basis for some of my own creations whenever they use melee weapon based attacks. Excessively safe zoning is pretty broken, which is why why gigantic hitboxes that cannot be traded against are usually frowned upon. They should still beat out non-reversal based unarmed strikes anyway because they still have more hitbox than them, but something like a Shoryuken that is meant to beat out other attacks should still be able to hit through them as well.
Re: Hitbox Discussion I guess
#96  January 16, 2019, 01:48:36 am
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Wow cool. Wasn't expecting this many replies.

If an attack is going to be long-ranged but slow and punishable, you'd want it to have pretty decent priority during its active frames so it doesn't get beaten out by a jab or a quick poke, and then extend the hurtboxes out for a few of the recovery frames that follow so it can be punished if blocked.

I forgot to mention this, but the above is Gordeau's 5C (standing heavy) in Under-Night, which is active from frames 29-34, though the attack's hitboxes shrink a little vertically on frame 32. His hurtboxes are not static leading up to frame 29, as the further into the attack he gets, the more his hurtboxes extend outwards. For 12 frames, he looks like this:
3DS FC: 0516 - 7483 - 3564
Oh, I want a diagram. I fucking love diagrams.