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Making character SFFs universally compatible  (Read 31514 times)

Started by Winane, July 04, 2004, 07:39:50 am
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Kula Diamond

Re: Making character SFFs universally compatible
#21  April 27, 2005, 10:20:13 pm
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All of this is giving me a headache. What's that #1/1 thingy?

Fail.

BlackJack

Re: Making character SFFs universally compatible
#22  April 27, 2005, 10:59:37 pm
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#/1 means "palette type".
#/1/1 means "individual palette".

IINM.

Tekkaman Blade

Re: Making character SFFs universally compatible
#23  May 17, 2005, 12:28:07 pm
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Following your procedure, should 0,0 be placed after 9000,2 if it exists? Or should 9000,2 ;which sometimes has it's own palette; be placed at the end, or at least after 0,0?

PS this is great! Went into conversion fever and passed several chars thru the 'mill'. This method is far better than those progs such as the conversor.
Oh and 'updating' my chars sffs seems to have made the character selection to move faster, in addition to ingame fluidity...
Last Edit: May 17, 2005, 12:30:41 pm by blud7

Byakko

Re: Making character SFFs universally compatible
#24  May 17, 2005, 12:36:49 pm
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Quote
If it looks like an alternate portrait or something else that might really ought to have its own palette, compare its palette to the palette of the first sprite in the SFF. If the palettes are incompatible, then move the image (including #/1/1) to the very end of the file.
The important part isn't the number of the sprite but if the palette is shared or not, for optimization sake. If the SFF file (which is the largest in a character) is smaller, you should technically/theorically get it to be loaded fast. Do that for each chars and you might see a small difference.
If I struggled to the end of my determination, to the end of my way of life with my followers, if the result is ruin, then this ruin is inevitable. Grieve. Shed tears. But you cannot regret.

BlackJack

Re: Making character SFFs universally compatible
#25  May 17, 2005, 12:40:45 pm
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blud7 said, May 17, 2005, 12:28:07 pm
Oh and 'updating' my chars sffs seems to have made the character selection to move faster, in addition to ingame fluidity...

Quote
If the SFF file (which is the largest in a character) is smaller, you should technically/theorically get it to be loaded fast. Do that for each chars and you might see a small difference.

:idea: In fact, chars are loaded faster because Mugen doesn't have to browse very long through the SFF to find the portraits (in order to make them appear on the select screen).
Last Edit: May 17, 2005, 12:42:20 pm by Ancient Mariner

Byakko

Re: Making character SFFs universally compatible
#26  May 17, 2005, 01:17:50 pm
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Seriously ? Just for that, it's just browsing to find 1 sprite and forget the rest afterward ? o_O *flies to put the portraits at the beginning of the SFF on all WIPs* *wait... hardly any of my WIPs have their portraits yet*
If I struggled to the end of my determination, to the end of my way of life with my followers, if the result is ruin, then this ruin is inevitable. Grieve. Shed tears. But you cannot regret.

BlackJack

Re: Making character SFFs universally compatible
#27  July 06, 2005, 12:46:11 am
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Byakko said, May 17, 2005, 01:17:50 pm
Seriously ? Just for that, it's just browsing to find 1 sprite and forget the rest afterward ? o_O
To load the select screen, Mugen only browses the SFF of every character to load up the little and big portraits. The SFF is fully loaded only when you're about to use the character (read: during the VS screen).

Quote
*flies to put the portraits at the beginning of the SFF on all WIPs* *wait... hardly any of my WIPs have their portraits yet*
I believe (though I haven't checked) that, in case your character has no portrait, Mugen seeks through the whole file (guess what that means ;) ).
Last Edit: July 06, 2005, 12:49:41 am by BlackJack

Madness

Re: Making character SFFs universally compatible
#28  August 02, 2005, 11:55:55 pm
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someone should *really* do a frontend for that kind of stuff.
or maybe a uberl33t batch file.

Nobun

Re: Making character SFFs universally compatible
#29  September 06, 2005, 11:25:38 pm
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It seems to me that you make a simply thing harder than real.

Why 9000,0 if shared and not the first is showed badly?

Simply becouse of the fact that on select screen Mugen cannot find palette information (stored at the end part of block code for individual-palette) and so Mugen use the palette of screenpack.

Why a shared 9000,0 can be showed without problem on select screen if setted as the first image?

Becouse the first shared image of shared sff (differently than other shared images)  stores the last-768 bytes-palette information.

second thing: it is better to put the big portrait with individual palette as the last image (and not as the second one as said before).

Code: 
#
1
2
IMAGENAME.PCX
9000
0
0
0
......
;last image
#
1
1
IMAGENAME.PCX
9000
1
0
0
RETIRED FROM MUGEN WORLD.
All my creations (characters, stages, applications, etc) can be freely destributed and hosted anywhere without any limitation.

Developer of N.O.M.E.N. (Abandoned project).

SlayerGatsu

Re: Making character SFFs universally compatible
#30  September 07, 2005, 07:07:21 am
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I might as well Add, that Dos mugen WILL NEVER have any problems at all in
Reading a "PERFECT" sff file.

FOR an sff file to be "perfect" you MUST follow the numbers, OR ELSE, why would have elecbyte MADE group numbers?

MOREOVER, IF you plan to insert Unshared images in an sff THEY have to be LAST. (possibly AFTER 9000,1 )
and No other Indexed images should be place after them.

why?
well it's easy, the palettes of the sprites set in the "middle" will "crack"
you will see and get messed up images when you try to reopen the sff file (unless you extract with sff2pcx (or something better ^^)

so the First image (as logic says) NEEDS to be 0,0

THE PROBLEM that many of you are concerned about it's constant... SORT out the sff with Mee
(
I will soon try and make a better thing ONLY for
a. extract (pcx and text)
b. SORT (the text blocks)
c. Remount the sff
in a VB script Exe where you drop the sff.
The images of group # 9000 will be set to #,1,2 automatically and you will be "advertised" if any images are placed after that So that you can edit the text. (maybe the prog will also open the text at the right point :o and allow to edit before continuing)

Please Ideas (are already many) but are fully welcome, let's try to get me to make something actually useful  ::)
Thanks Ice, I had complitely forgotten ;)

XGargoyle

Re: Making character SFFs universally compatible
#31  September 07, 2005, 05:40:22 pm
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all my characters are compiled with Sprmaker and follow Elecbyte's guidelines about sprite order (9000,0; 9000,1; 0,0...) and I have never had any issue in DOS, linux or Windows versions.

So, the problem is not the sprite order per se but which tool are you using to create the SFF.

Sprmaker never gives any problem.

MEE don't have these issues, as it's actually a frontend for sprmaker.

MCM stores palette information for unshared pictures in a different way, and that's where problems appear. This problem can persist if you have a SFF created by MCM from scratch but you use other tools later.
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SlayerGatsu

Re: Making character SFFs universally compatible
#32  September 08, 2005, 02:44:24 am
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for a fast thing you can align the pics in mcm, then extract all the coordinates, and by the correct pics you can Re make the sff with sprite maker, So it shall always be perfect
(And what I believe the utility will do.... THUS the picks will be extracted as they are and IF they are corrupted then they are corrupted.....  :()

Btw, Winmugen’s Kfm has the images sorted by number --;
Thanks Ice, I had complitely forgotten ;)

Tekkaman Blade

Re: Making character SFFs universally compatible
#33  September 09, 2005, 04:03:36 pm
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There is one problem with your method of putting all the individual palettes last (except for portrait etc). Thing is, some creators (e.g. Toma) put individual palettes so that the pcx’s after it would carry that palette, up until another individual palette. So what happens in your method is that the first pcx is the right colour, but the rest are spoilt… At least this has been my experience so far.

This would also question XGargoyle's statement that sprite order per se is not important (aside from the obvious)

Messatsu

Probably not worth bumping...
New #34  February 22, 2007, 10:41:30 pm
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Quote
It's also important to note that M.C.M. does not reveal what order the sprites in the SFF are in, nor does it let you specify what order to put them in, so I think it cannot be used to implement the guidelines I've provided here.
While the order is not revealed, MCM's order in which the sprites are added is known.  It'll tack on new sprites on the end of the sff.  I've made an SFF to your specifications and when sprites are out of order, it's still possible to reorder them through sffextract and recompiling the sff.  I used to either leave the portrait off on my master copy or delete the portrait and readd it to finalize it.  Using the change sprite option will place the new sprite in the same position in the sff as the one it is replacing.

Bastard Wolf said, May 12, 2008, 05:02:05 pm

Many people risk their lives everyday by having Mugen.
Last Edit: February 23, 2007, 08:29:53 pm by Messatsu
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