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Decisions about locking threads (Read 31573 times)

Started by Umezono, February 09, 2014, 06:05:53 am
Decisions about locking threads
#1  February 09, 2014, 06:05:53 am
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Hi, just want to make a small suggestion: are you guys opposed to just cutting/locking away all this drama these guys create rather than dealing with it for 5 pages and wondering why its getting overly heated and personal.

jmorphman made the argument that there is resentment but imho the priority should be on keeping a professional and clean atmosphere here, and this drama stuff obfuscates the intent of the rules threads they occur in. should be kept to feedback to warnings within limits.

they are entitled to the resentment but should not be entitled to derailing threads just to make that resentment known.

thats all i have to say, sorry if i may seem impertinent here.
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Re: Decisions about locking threads
#2  February 09, 2014, 06:27:56 am
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Not at all. It's good to hear different perspectives and your's is a welcome one.

By all means, elaborate as much as you feel you have to.

I will say though that 90% of those 5 pages is mostly other members chiming in and creating a snowball effect. We put our two cents in. Then JZ replies. Then members reply to our replies. Repeat for 5 pages. But that's just me.
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Re: Decisions about locking threads
#3  February 09, 2014, 06:38:00 am
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I kinda think that's a problem
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Re: Decisions about locking threads
#4  February 09, 2014, 06:39:48 am
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Lemme just reiterate what I spitballed with Ume on Skype about. Locking a thread means it'll most likely spill out into other topics or people will just make another topic. Then if they get locked/moderated however it happens, people will cry censorship and are quite likely to not believe you no matter how you explain yourself.
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Re: Decisions about locking threads
#5  February 09, 2014, 03:36:56 pm
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Generally speaking, we don't put a lock on topics purely to stop people talking about them.  As irritating as all the drama and arguing can be, people still have their right to discuss them freely.  It's better to let people get whatever it is they have to say off their chests in the appropriate topic (and for us to take any action we may have to in there) than it is to lock the whole thing away and risk the conflict spilling out into the rest of the boards.
Re: Decisions about locking threads
#6  February 09, 2014, 04:38:31 pm
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okay understood but don't you think there should be limits? For example I don't think threads such as "Suggestion: Remove Person Man from Staff" should be allowed. The grievance would be valid as perhaps a single post in Feedback to warnings under your system, but I think a thread solely devoted to starting a shitfest and calling out a mod is rude and unacceptable. had it been me I prob would've hammered that thread with a lock without a second thought. since when is posting an ad hominem filled thread solely to cause drama a proper airing of grievances? the only way it couldve gone was more personal drama. dont think it should be allowed.
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Re: Decisions about locking threads
#7  February 09, 2014, 04:45:57 pm
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there might be something to umezono observation, maybe a middle term, there is a point in all those threads where its obviously just aad hominen filled attack and we should/could have told them to stop being fucking stupid.

We have three threads filled with jz and walt crying about persecution which they cant define or even explain but keep insisting is there because of reasons and lack of moral integrity of the staff.

It grows to a point where both dont even know what to say anymore and start going on about hiveminds. I have never had to deal with grown men acting like this in any of the other communities I visit.

Walt goes on to claim we would have banned sepp, jz goes on to say we have been abusing our power by keeping kfm ( who deleted the whole forum) banned. We are being too lax.
Re: Decisions about locking threads
#8  February 09, 2014, 04:49:17 pm
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This should be discussed out in the open. There's nothing that really requires it to be private. What's say we split this off and move it to decisions or even its own topic? (don't forget to change all the thread titles!)

I dunno how I feel about locking threads but it might be something worth exploring?
Re: Decisions about locking threads
#9  February 09, 2014, 04:55:15 pm
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Iced pretty much sees it the way I see it, we could save about 5 pages of drama by ascertaining whre the discussion deviates from the opinions and intent of the op to simply attacking eachother. I am ambivalent on the JZ issue but all of these threads involving him have turned into pointless and irrelevant arguments about past actions. Also threads like MC2 are bad period.

And okay lets move it.... if I can figure out how I was kinda slow with this forums UI. Anyone wanna help :P
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Re: Decisions about locking threads
#10  February 09, 2014, 04:56:31 pm
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I'll do it.
Re: Decisions about locking threads
#11  February 09, 2014, 05:12:26 pm
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My two cents:

When facing those vague and baseless accusation threads, don't make them personal. The downfall of recent threads is that someone in the staff questions the opposing poster's integrity (or something similar) fueling their rants of bias or incompetence. And even if it's not our fault we're the ones that look anthagonical.

Don't do this. Don't bring shit from the past. Bad arguments collapse under their own weight. Look at Anti 11.
Re: Decisions about locking threads
#12  February 09, 2014, 05:19:35 pm
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How is there an downfall for these personal accusation threads though... imo they hit rock bottom the moment theyre posted. I agree mods are at fault for taking this stuff too personally. My opinion stands however this stuff (personal attacks on eachother) serves no conducive purpose having its own drama thread.

To clarify I think that feedback to warnings thread is perfect for any sort of mod incompetence discussion, it keeps things tidy. Of course there needs to be some curbstomping of the resulting drama tho. Keepin it ontopic and civil would be nice.
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Last Edit: February 09, 2014, 05:25:28 pm by Umezono
Re: Decisions about locking threads
#13  February 09, 2014, 05:26:47 pm
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So you're basically saying that we should try not to use any of our moderation powers, not to delete, edit and lock things?? Yeah that's exactly it. They're only secondary options, fallbacks.

locking threads make it seem like we're silencing people. if a topic really has no worth in it, let it sink by itself. take the diplomatic way out
Re: Decisions about locking threads
#14  February 09, 2014, 05:34:07 pm
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I also read that and on the silencing/censorship issue I agree completely, if the op is being validly criticized and there is resultant drama its probably best to let that run but I just wanted to know if it would be more prudent to lock threads where the only intent is to cause drama. These threads continue to derail further and are posted in weeks after the fact, extending the grace period for another argument to start. If they are just trying to cause trouble vs. actual people who have actual concerns about rules ie. All the people who were concerned about the jz rule on either side I dont think its fair they are afforded the same protections.
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Re: Decisions about locking threads
#15  February 09, 2014, 05:35:39 pm
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People can't grasp at straws indefinitely. They'll eventually shut up, or become a laughing stock.

They can, however, dig old stuff and blame you for it during considerably long periods of time.
Re: Decisions about locking threads
#16  February 09, 2014, 05:36:24 pm
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My two cents:

When facing those vague and baseless accusation threads, don't make them personal. The downfall of recent threads is that someone in the staff questions the opposing poster's integrity (or something similar) fueling their rants of bias or incompetence. And even if it's not our fault we're the ones that look anthagonical.

Don't do this. Don't bring shit from the past. Bad arguments collapse under their own weight. Look at Anti 11.

Good point and I'll always do my best to keep a neutral stance. However, when someone (Anti-11) makes a statement that claims "C.A.N./Saikoro do not give a shit" I am most likely going to question them as to why they said that, and handle it based off of their response.

So you're basically saying that we should try not to use any of our moderation powers, not to delete, edit and lock things?? Yeah that's exactly it. They're only secondary options, fallbacks.

locking threads make it seem like we're silencing people. if a topic really has no worth in it, let it sink by itself. take the diplomatic way out

I was going to dive a little deeper and quote some previous posts, but what I bolded out bodes with me and I agree with c001357. Locking a topic should be taken case by case and be considered carefully and obviously discussed by us, privately or not. I feel that locking something will suggest to the community that we're forcing a remain silent rule, and that'll spill out onto other threads, as C.A.N. mentioned before. Form what I've been exposed to thus far, the drama builds based off of many factors (replies to replies, people not agreeing with our replies, stances on the given subject and past experiences, etc.) and lingers for a bit as people say their piece, and then it dies down. The Anti-11 thing and JZ's threads were heated for about a day or two and then they died down.

For the most part, I think we have been handling things as best as we can. If people think we should do things differently, well then that is their issue.
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Re: Decisions about locking threads
#17  February 09, 2014, 05:41:15 pm
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  • 「目指すはクールでロックなアイドル!」
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if its an obvious troll then it'll get eaten up by the shit thread or whatever
Re: Decisions about locking threads
#18  February 09, 2014, 05:43:08 pm
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Exactly. I think Anti made that point very clear. :mmhmm:
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Re: Decisions about locking threads
#19  February 09, 2014, 05:45:14 pm
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I am talking about less obvious bullshit like the mc2 stuff that was drama masquerading as feedback, solely meant to argue

The shit threads cool but I feel like it used a bit too sparingly. Just imo not a demand to start shoveling stuff out in a frenzy like I had to do to my fuckin driveway all of last week
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Re: Decisions about locking threads
#20  February 09, 2014, 05:48:11 pm
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I am unfamiliar with the MC2 situation so I can't really comment on that as much as I would like to. For now, I'll leave the situations that have a history to them up to the vets and learn from their replies and handling of the situation.
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Re: Decisions about locking threads
#21  February 09, 2014, 08:19:37 pm
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So you're basically saying that we should try not to use any of our moderation powers, not to delete, edit and lock things?? Yeah that's exactly it. They're only secondary options, fallbacks.

locking threads make it seem like we're silencing people. if a topic really has no worth in it, let it sink by itself. take the diplomatic way out

This.  Most of that stuff just needs to run the course.  However when the drama has died down for a day or two and someone comes along and bumps the thread, that would be a good time for a warning to everyone to let it die.
Re: Decisions about locking threads
#22  February 10, 2014, 12:07:11 am
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I still dislike the notion of allowing threads solely meant for people to argue over personal shit
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Re: Decisions about locking threads
#23  February 10, 2014, 12:37:19 am
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You're right. However, no matter how you go about trying to lock threads, ban or warn people regardless of how much control we try to put over everyone, someone will complain about something, or come off the wrong way according to someone else's perspective, and start drama. Trying to avoid drama and whatnot is impossible. Doing our best to curb it is really the only way to go, and even with that, there's only so much we can do.
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I'd like to report two robots on the MFG forums: One is EXShadow. The other is Saikoro.
There should be a Saikoro plugin for Photoshop.