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Win311 Stage (Read 9424 times)

Started by Renzo F, September 17, 2007, 08:42:11 pm
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Renzo F

Win311 Stage
#1  September 17, 2007, 08:42:11 pm
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I wanted to add more stuff to it, but sadly my vacactions are over, and if I don't release the stage NOW it will never get released. I know how I am with creations.
Enjoy; C+C are welcome.



If someone wants to host it I will be very glad, I have no site.
http://rapidshare.com/files/56385741/win311.7z.html

K.O.D

Re: Win311 Stage
#2  September 17, 2007, 08:48:20 pm
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Last Edit: September 18, 2007, 08:53:36 am by K.O.D

Sheng Long

Re: Win311 Stage
#3  September 17, 2007, 08:50:18 pm
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So, I see that you decided against a low res, version, huh?

EDIT: And I have to agree with the post above me. Some of those foreground windows in front of the characters do seem a bit much, IMHO. Makes it a bit harder to see around, you know?


Well, it's really nice work. Great job. :)

"You must defeat my flaming
dragon punch to stand a chance."

Renzo F

Re: Win311 Stage
#4  September 17, 2007, 08:54:09 pm
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K.O.D.: Go on, spread the love and host it. About the control panel layer, is possible to increase the transparency level, so no prob about it.

Mario, sorry, I really wanted to make it low res too; I already read your post in the project thread but as I said my vacactions are over and I don't have enough time for this stuff.

If it makes you fell better, I feel sad about you :P

Anjel

Re: Win311 Stage
#5  September 17, 2007, 09:05:19 pm
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"No money for hosting, no interest for mugen. No website"
:sugoi:
If you want free hostng (10 GB), try smyr.net

The stage is probably awsome, i wont dl it tho (High res :no:).
My shitty mugen stuff:

MirageAtoli

Re: Win311 Stage
#6  September 17, 2007, 10:11:33 pm
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Mugen Docs in notepad; classy.
Titiln said, December 31, 2007, 10:46:10 pm
i think we should call it an "engine" so we don't look like total idiots because otherwise we'd be arguing about a "game" and that would be somehow "dumber" than arguing about an "engine" on the "internet" for countless hours

Beatrice said, March 01, 2010, 06:55:03 pm
Iced said:
I for one, do not enjoy round corners!  :bigcry:
But they hurt much less when we accidentally hit them!  :S

Renzo F

Re: Win311 Stage
#7  September 17, 2007, 10:18:16 pm
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Curious note about your comment: AIR.TXT was the only textfile I could open in notepad because the other ones (SCTRL.txt, TRIGGER.txt) have a filesize > 64K :P

(and they came in RTF format in Winmugen, which isn't regonized by win311 write)

dr.baldhead

Re: Win311 Stage
#8  September 17, 2007, 10:51:50 pm
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looks cool just downloaded it

ziltama

Re: Win311 Stage
#9  September 18, 2007, 08:20:31 pm
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Neat concept.

For the Paintbrush app, choose the masking color carefully.  I can see through 2 of the color palette choices.

I personally avoid using yscaledelta and yscalestart.  It's hard to get the floor to look just right when jumping and just looks odd.

The parallax is not quite right.  The floor still slides underneath the player slightly.  I don't have a great equation to use for 'width' especially when yscale is also used.  The goal is to have the zoffset line with a delta of 2,2.  The y delta is off due to yscale.  The x delta just needs a little bit more tweaking.  Width can be very tricky to use.  (When I used it for my training stage, I had the second number 3x the size of the first number, used no yscale, delta of 1,2; and set the zoffset directly in the middle of the graphic.  This made the zoffset line have a delta of 2,2.)

Oh, all the y deltas are wrong for the various graphics.  Again, the floor should be 2 and anything directly connected to it.

You could add some shading to the floor and/or wall.

You can try decreasing the brightness/intensity of the windows graphics.  So, when they're made transparent, it doesn't become super bright.

Renzo F

Re: Win311 Stage
#10  September 18, 2007, 09:35:00 pm
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Thanks, I was expecting your feedback.

Quote
For the Paintbrush app, choose the masking color carefully.  I can see through 2 of the color palette choices.
I was aware of the problem, so I decided to put mask=0 in the layer. Does this attribute only works with normal layers?

Quote
I personally avoid using yscaledelta and yscalestart.  It's hard to get the floor to look just right when jumping and just looks odd.

The parallax is not quite right.  The floor still slides underneath the player slightly.  I don't have a great equation to use for 'width' especially when yscale is also used.  The goal is to have the zoffset line with a delta of 2,2.  The y delta is off due to yscale.  The x delta just needs a little bit more tweaking.  Width can be very tricky to use.  (When I used it for my training stage, I had the second number 3x the size of the first number, used no yscale, delta of 1,2; and set the zoffset directly in the middle of the graphic.  This made the zoffset line have a delta of 2,2.)
To be honest, I have a hard time working with parallax. I just messed the values for KFM's stage parallax layer until it looked good enough for me. If you can help me pointing what to change I will be very glad.

Quote
Oh, all the y deltas are wrong for the various graphics.  Again, the floor should be 2 and anything directly connected to it.
I'll check it, but I can't really tell what wrong. Value too high? Too low?

Quote
You can try decreasing the brightness/intensity of the windows graphics.  So, when they're made transparent, it doesn't become super bright.
To avoid the effect, the values I set for Source and Dest in the animation frames sum 256. I can't really say the layers turn too bright. I wanted to avoid that from the beginning because it could spoil the whole concept of have multiple windows fliying around.

ziltama

Re: Win311 Stage
#11  September 18, 2007, 10:15:34 pm
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For this particular stage, the y-delta should be 2 for the floor and back wall.  However, this screws up the floor because of yscale.  I think yscale only works well in a non-super jump environment.  If you jump up high, then the top part of the floor scales too much and looks very weird.  So, I would just leave it out and redo the floor graphic (do the scaling beforehand and save).

As an example, we'll use my parallax stage.  To make the calculations simple, I set the back wall and floor to delta 1,2.  I then set width as x, 3x.  x=width of floor tile.  So, the top of the tile is the original width and moves at the x-delta value of 1.  The bottom of the tile is 3x the original width and moves 3x as fast as the top, so has a x-delta of 3.  I purposely then set the zoffset line directly in the middle of the floor tile.  At this point, the floor tile width is 2x.  So, during movement, the floor tile at the zoffset line would move twice as fast as the top.  So, 2x1 = x-delta of 2 (the magic number).  So, now the delta effectively becomes 2,2 at that zoffset line (this will prevent sliding in hi-res stages using parallax).  Of course, with different tile widths, zoffsett values, and starting deltas, then the calculations become more complex.

I use Michael Jackson to test parallax since his feet are right on the zoffset line and he doesn't turn around when you jump over him.

For xscale (non-tile floor), I have specific formulas to use.  Wouldn't be used here anyways, though.

Mask is automatically set to 1 when transparencies are applied.  Mask=0 would be ignored if trans is used.
Last Edit: September 19, 2007, 08:46:28 am by ziltama

Cybaster

Re: Win311 Stage
#12  September 19, 2007, 08:46:03 am
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My "feedback" is completely lame after Ziltama's one, but "Nice stage" :sugoi:

All I could think about was already addressed, so yeah...

ziltama

Re: Win311 Stage
#13  September 19, 2007, 09:25:49 am
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[For Hi-Res Parallax Using Width Only]

I looked at your original floor tile and settings again.

Let's say if you wanted to keep certain settings (x-delta of 0.8 [so delta 0.8,2] and width 64,256; still assuming NO yscale stuff).  So, the top of the tile would have a x-delta of 0.8 and the bottom would have a x-delta of 3.2.  Directly in the middle of the tile would have a x-delta of 2 (the magic number).

[3.2 is derived from the width ratio of 1:4, so 0.8 * 4 = 3.2]

So, the zoffset line, in this case, still turns out to be the middle of the floor tile.  If the floor tile has part of it covered or travels off the bottom of the screen, the zoffset line still has to be set to where the middle of the floor tile is physically.  So, if you have a huge floor tile and the middle of the tile actually goes offscreen, then there's no way you can set the zoffset line right.

If yscalestart is used, then the calculations become a bit more tricky, but you can still try to set it in the middle of the final scaled result and see if it works.  Then again, if you use yscaledelta, the floor will slide vertically when you jump.  I'm not sure of the exact calculations, but you can use both yscalestart and yscaledelta so that the feet don't slide even during jumping.  I did this when I first started my parallax stage and managed to find the right settings (trial & error).  However, I threw yscale out when I made the stage superjump friendly.  Again, superjump makes it look very ugly and difficult to find the right settings.  Kfm stage works well with yscale since the stage is only slightly bigger than the screen and doesn't move much when jumping.

Other examples:

Example #1:
delta 1.5,2
width 50,100

So, the top of the tile has an x-delta of 1.5 and the bottom has an x-delta of 3.  One third from the top of the tile would have an x-delta of 2, so that's where the zoffset line would be set.

Example #2: Ceiling objects.
delta 3,2
width 200,50

So, the top of the tile has an x-delta of 3 and the bottom has an x-delta of 0.75.  4/9 from the top of the tile would have an x-delta of 2.  [There's a difference of 2.25 for the x-deltas.  I thought of it as 9 quarters (9 * .25 = 2.25).  So, 4/9 from the top, x-delta would be 2.  3 -> 2.75 -> 2.5 -> 2.25 -> 2.]

Of course, you're not gonna set the zoffset line on the ceiling, but if you wanted to hang an object with the same x-delta as the fighters on the ceiling, this is where you would put it.

Example #3: Floor object not on plane of the fighter.
delta 1,2
width 40,120

So, again, x-delta at the top of the tile is 1, and x-delta at the bottom of the tile is 3.  So, directly in the middle is where the zoffset line should be (where x-delta is 2).

Now, let's say you wanted to put an object on the floor behind the fighters.  Obviously, the object won't be parallax, but you don't want the object to slide as well.

If the object is placed 1/4 from the top of the floor tile, then that object's delta should be 1.5,2.  If the object is placed 3/4 from the top, then the delta should be 2.5,2.  Of course, things get more complicated when you're trying to figure things out for exact pixel lengths.

[Again, this does not apply for xscale, which is for non-tile parallax.]

As an aside, you could try to add shading to the tiles.  For mine, I placed a grayscale transparent gradient over parts of my stage.
Last Edit: September 19, 2007, 09:32:55 am by ziltama

Renzo F

Re: Win311 Stage
#14  September 19, 2007, 08:05:51 pm
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Ok, thanks, I got it. Now I understand how yscale screws all the calculations, so I removed that parameters and I'm only defining width. Now the characters don't slide when the stage scrolls.

I'm fooling around a bit with your idea of shading the floor and wall a bit. Here's the result:

Do you think It looks good enough?

I'll be working a bit more with the stage and I will post the updated ver.

ziltama

Re: Win311 Stage
#15  September 20, 2007, 12:47:29 am
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Yeah, looks much nicer.  I dunno if you noticed, but you're using both reflection and shadow.

BurgerKing

Re: Win311 Stage
#16  September 20, 2007, 01:03:25 am
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Looks really good, One of the best stages i've seen in a long time. Too bad i don't have High Res. Oh well
\"oohwhap\" said:
dont requset my chars tey r prevet

DM

Re: Win311 Stage
#17  September 20, 2007, 01:21:30 am
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LOL Great stage, man! A Win3.11 stage, it's too nostalgic. :sugoi:
You can make a Win95 stage, also. ;P

BTW, this new shading looks much better. :)
Oh, please, make a lo-hes version, if possible. ^_^

Jessy

Re: Win311 Stage
#18  September 20, 2007, 01:36:56 am
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yeah...cool.. ;D

And a D.O.S. stage can be cool too..
and/or...WINDows 1 too..
-I hate haters and S.o.S chars.....
-time to migrate from winmugen...

Renzo F

Re: Win311 Stage
#19  September 20, 2007, 03:47:07 am
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ziltama said, September 20, 2007, 12:47:29 am
Yeah, looks much nicer.  I dunno if you noticed, but you're using both reflection and shadow.
Cybaster pointed that when I was in early stages. I think I'll go for reflection, since the way the shadow works will give me a lot of trouble with the BG layers.

And since at least 3 members are requesting a Low-Res version I'll work on that after I give the final touches to the Hi-Res version.

Renzo F

Re: Win311 Stage
#20  September 20, 2007, 05:08:36 am
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Renzo F

Re: Win311 Stage
#21  September 20, 2007, 06:56:13 am
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ziltama

Re: Win311 Stage
#22  September 20, 2007, 10:05:37 am
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Since paintbrush is not transparent, set the masking to zero.  I can still see through those two palette options.

The icons should probably have the same delta as the back wall.

You can try to have the windows scroll by in a repeating loop (i.e. set velocity, tile, and tilespacing.)

Low-res is just not as nice, obviously.

Super_Sloth

Re: Win311 Stage
#23  October 21, 2007, 06:50:54 am
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maybe someone should make a "blue screen of death" stage :P
Sloths. Unlike monkeys they are not like mankind. They are far greater.

Renzo F

Re: Win311 Stage
#24  October 21, 2007, 08:59:48 am
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Quite possible. There exists a Linux screensaver with all kinds of crash screens for different OSes.
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