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$$ MUGEN Vs Money....Lets talk $$ (Read 5015 times)

Started by Zazamyon2, October 26, 2017, 03:51:26 am
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$$ MUGEN Vs Money....Lets talk $$
#1  October 26, 2017, 03:51:26 am
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Ok heres a fun one ^^.

The money, the pe$os, the cheddar, the cheese, the guwop, the diniero, the dead prezzies. The stuff we get out of bed for....

There are a bajillion topics covering this differently in the past so I dont want to discuss

"Is selling mugen good or bad or ethically right/wrong."

I want to discuss the other aspects.
The interwebs is not the same place it was when Mugen was a little mugenDOS baby.

There are so many ways for people to make money from their hobbies via a following and the internet now.

Now we have twitch/youtube/live game streaming, patreon, kickstarter, sprite commissions, paypal, donation thingees and more.
We have ad revenue from download links and video ads aswell.

So what are your guys thoughts on the matter of turning a dollar from mugen in the current day and age?





Re: $$ MUGEN Vs Money....Lets talk $$
#2  October 26, 2017, 12:39:30 pm
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Making money from free creations made by other people is not ethical.
You can make money by selling your own mugen work or commissions though, and this is totally correct

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http://paypal.me/XGargoyle  <-- Donations welcome!
Re: $$ MUGEN Vs Money....Lets talk $$
#3  October 29, 2017, 03:49:12 am
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I have no issues supporting a char /stage/creator or a good mugen youtuber.
Re: $$ MUGEN Vs Money....Lets talk $$
#4  October 30, 2017, 02:14:30 am
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I think "contributions" or "donations" are fine.

To me, the grey area is if youre selling mugen games/characters based on existing stuff.

For example, lets say you made a fullgame called capcom vs the hobbit,  and you fully sprited and coded characters from both of those universes totally from scratch and used no existing material from an actual retail game.


Would it be the same as paying for a blanka tattoo on your face or selling a guile oil painting on ebay that you painted yourself legality wise?

Things get a bit sticky at that point i imagine.

 
Last Edit: October 30, 2017, 02:27:57 am by PhantomD
Re: $$ MUGEN Vs Money....Lets talk $$
#5  November 02, 2017, 07:17:12 am
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To me, the grey area is if youre selling mugen games/characters based on existing stuff.

For example, lets say you made a fullgame called capcom vs the hobbit,  and you fully sprited and coded characters from both of those universes totally from scratch and used no existing material from an actual retail game.


Would it be the same as paying for a blanka tattoo on your face or selling a guile oil painting on ebay that you painted yourself legality wise?
Yes and no. Think of it this way: you can sell your services, but you cannot sell the product. It's perfectly legal to pay someone to code something, or draw/sprite something from scratch, because that is work they produced themselves or are licensed to use in derivative works.

When you're selling a game, you're selling a product, and while that product may contain completely original resources, you are still not licensed to use the likenesses of the characters themselves. That's where the hole is: you do not have all the licenses necessary to sell a product, so to do so would be illegal.


But the big takeaway here is the subject of licensing, which while people like KFM have tried to push in the past, I think is long overdue for a proper discussion. I'm not talking about black-and-white be a Nazi or communist with your works, community ethics bullshit. I mean a clear education on what licensing actually means. This is very important, particularly when you go into software development (which, yes, includes the video game industry). There are many times at work I've had to avoid using certain libraries or code because, while the source or DLL is available, does not mean I can put it in a commercial product.

Just because something is open source does not mean you are free to do what you like. There are plenty of projects which are open source on GitHub―hell, Microsoft has its own GitHub account with tons of projects. But that does not mean I can just take their product and sell it. Many people and corporations have gotten into some serious legal trouble over things like this.
Re: $$ MUGEN Vs Money....Lets talk $$
#6  November 02, 2017, 01:18:43 pm
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Thanks Jesuszilla!
very Interesting and informative!

Sooooooo, question then:
With the licensing thingee you mentioned,

If you make something based on an existing licensed game,
or you use sprites and characters from an existing game,
and people pay you donations and commissions, as long as you don't sell the actual "game" itself you are not breaking any laws?

Because i know some people on YouTube are pretty much doing that with capcom vs snk fullgame projects - are capcom chars licensed in a way that we are allowed to generate revenue from them in a round-about way as long as its not actual selling of games using their chars/sprites?


Re: $$ MUGEN Vs Money....Lets talk $$
#7  November 02, 2017, 02:13:55 pm
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You can get paid for coding and sprites but you can't
Just sell a full game since none of us own those IP's
and you cant sell anything with a mugen executable file
Re: $$ MUGEN Vs Money....Lets talk $$
#8  November 03, 2017, 03:08:23 am
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The last part of memos post is because elecbyte specifically forbids people to redistribute mugen, so there was a point of time when not even the people who were making full games were abel to put the mugen executable in there; but with elecbyte's death that is relatively unimportant.

regarding fan art, as adding to what jessuzilla said, not even the people selling fanart are fully legally selling it, but companies generally don't care about labour; only when it specifically hinders their IP is when they go against it, so, fanart that slanders their characters is something they might prosecute, but it depends on the company (most don't mind, so it's easy to find out which ones do); mugen itself has the huge disadvantage of being a game, so to speak, so while most companies immediately should see it as an annoyance, historically speaking only a few ones have taken action against mugen.
Hell , we even got a responses by capcom/snk where the first instance said that mugen was forbidden becuase it infringed on their cpopyrights, but after they received more emails, they looked into the thing deeper and said they were not going to take legal action as long as the games were not getting sold. the ones that specifically went against mugen were some random guys who ended up not making their game at all and the makes of chaos bread/dengeki bunko when they were a poorfag company (before they made melty blood, basically).