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Competitive Mugen Project (Read 2299 times)

Started by Carlosman668, October 01, 2019, 03:50:28 am
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Competitive Mugen Project
#1  October 01, 2019, 03:50:28 am
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  I want to start a project of having the perfect competitive version of mugen as much as possible. I would like to get a community started and have feedback of the characters to use and how the game should be played. I would also like to know what stages should be fine or banned. the style of the game is most likely POTS but only have the best authors/editors ( INFINITE, DW, RagingRowen, etc). I'll be using the legacy sp with 30 characters and have the add004 patch with it ( TY Rowen). I'll try my best to make as much balance changes as possible.

Re: Competitive Mugen Project
#2  October 01, 2019, 03:56:09 am
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 Honestly, if you're going to mostly feature a PotS style competition, I would stick to the authors who best emulates PotS' own style as well as PotS' own original works. I feel stuff from the likes Infinite and R@CE are way too lopsided for proper balance. Stuff like that are closer to the original PotS are the closest thing to a balanced PotS roster. Otherwise, at that point, you'd get a Brawl Meta Knight situation where brackets are over-dominated by Infinite Dormammu players just because of how overwhelmingly powerful Infinite's stuff are for PotS standards.
Re: Competitive Mugen Project
#3  October 01, 2019, 03:59:39 am
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Honestly, if you're going to mostly feature a PotS style competition, I would stick to the authors who best emulates PotS' own style as well as PotS' own original works. I feel stuff from the likes Infinite and R@CE are way too lopsided for proper balance. They're the closest thing to a balanced PotS roster. Otherwise, at that point, you'd get a Brawl Meta Knight situation where brackets are over-dominated by Infinite Dormammu players just because of how overwhelmingly powerful Infinite's stuff are for PotS standards.

Thank you for the feedback, so who would you like to have when it comes to authors and stages?
Re: Competitive Mugen Project
#4  October 01, 2019, 04:04:21 am
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 I mean, if it were solely up to me, it'll mostly be characters I enjoy playing, but that wouldn't really appeal to what is popular around these parts and would definitely break the balance you're aiming for since a lot of them are anime fighters. As for what I would recommend in a PotS perspective, something like Jmorphman, KarmaCharmeleon, DeathScythe, Jesuszilla's Felicia, and of course PotS' own original CvS2-inspired works. They have the most consistent style among PotS stuff and they definitely were trying to aim for actual gameplay balance.
Re: Competitive Mugen Project
#5  October 01, 2019, 04:06:03 am
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If you want to stick to Pots-style chars, your best bet for a balance tour are only chars by Pots himself, Jmp, DeathScythe, Jesuszilla and KarmaCharizard. Their works are based on available source data and their coding skills are noteworthy. While I do aware there are many other Pots-copycats, their works or edits tend to be sloppy and none of their works truly stand out so it's better to stay away from them for your purpose.
For more input: http://mugenguild.com/forum/topics/an-explainer-pots-style-187886.0.html
Last Edit: October 01, 2019, 04:09:40 am by Mr. Giang
Re: Competitive Mugen Project
#6  October 01, 2019, 04:11:53 am
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If you want to stick to Pots-style chars, your best bet for a balance tour are only chars by Pots himself, Jmp, DeathScythe, Jesuszilla and KarmaCharizard. Their works are based on available source data and their coding skills are noteworthy. While I do aware there are many other Pots-copycats, their works or edits tend to be sloppy and none of their works truly stand out so it's better to stay away from them for your purpose.
For more input: http://mugenguild.com/forum/topics/an-explainer-pots-style-187886.0.html

makes sense, thank you ( btw Love your characters, keep up the good work)
Re: Competitive Mugen Project
#7  October 01, 2019, 04:28:40 am
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All of infinites and races chars aren't overpowered, they can still get their ass kicked by normal pots chars
Re: Competitive Mugen Project
#8  October 01, 2019, 04:40:55 am
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All of infinites and races chars aren't overpowered, they can still get their ass kicked by normal pots chars

well I see we starting some heat with certain characters I'll make a poll whether to have INFINITE and R@CE characters in!
Re: Competitive Mugen Project
#9  October 01, 2019, 04:43:11 am
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So, would you consider MvC3 level zoning balanced in CvS2? Because that's basically what Infinite's Dormammu would be when lumped with standard PotS characters. Hell, Infinite decided to make Stalker Flare air unblockable for no reasons even though it wasn't even air unblockable in Mahvul of all things.

Edit: And for the record, I'm only using Dormammu as an example, but you can apply similar reasoning with other PotS copycats who don't exactly have internalized balance in mind.
Re: Competitive Mugen Project
#10  October 01, 2019, 04:53:06 am
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So, would you consider MvC3 level zoning balanced in CvS2? Because that's basically what Infinite's Dormammu would be when lumped with standard PotS characters. Hell, Infinite decided to make Stalker Flare air unblockable for no reasons even though it wasn't even air unblockable in Mahvul of all things.

Edit: And for the record, I'm only using Dormammu as an example, but you can apply similar reasoning with other PotS copycats who don't exactly have internalized balance in mind.

I didnt know that their was unblockables with INFINITIES characters lol. Let's see how the votes go!!
Re: Competitive Mugen Project
#11  October 01, 2019, 05:07:09 am
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There's enough Infinite/Race stuff out there you could just make a separate comp for those.
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Re: Competitive Mugen Project
#12  October 01, 2019, 05:54:39 am
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Re: Competitive Mugen Project
#13  October 01, 2019, 08:12:07 am
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I would add characters from the following authors to the rosters, but edited to have CC instead of Max Mode:
Divine Wolf, Cruz, Victorys,

Other authors to consider:
Froz, Chazzanova

the only specific characters I would exclude from the above authors are: Hiryu, Psylocke, Jill, Juggernaut, Wolvverine
Re: Competitive Mugen Project
#14  October 01, 2019, 09:38:07 am
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You could always tweak/nerf Infinte and R@CE's characters if you know how to code.
Falcon Rapper's PotS chars are similar in style to the above.
Re: Competitive Mugen Project
#15  October 01, 2019, 09:47:37 am
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You could always tweak/nerf Infinte and R@CE's characters if you know how to code.
Falcon Rapper's PotS chars are similar in style to the above.

The same can be said to every single characters, be it MvC, KoF or even cheapies so that just simply doesn't make senses.
Re: Competitive Mugen Project
#16  October 01, 2019, 10:00:42 am
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Infinite, Race, Falcon Rapper etc characters simply put are not built the same as traditional pots style characters. they aren't something you can just "tweak" and throw in and expect to have a cohesive "competitive" roster. Beyond frame data and velocities and all that shit, there is just basic design choices that would give them unfair advantages. Like the addition of mvc like chains, random moves like fireballs, and instant cancellable supers off every normal or special. Not to mention the cornucopia of bugs that they have. In fact throwing all these "traditional" characters together themselves won't be cohesive considering PoTS own works had drastic changes in quality later on.

If you wanted a "cohesive" roster what you would need to do is make a fullgame. That means building all these characters from scratch to have a competitively balanced and viable system. If you can't do that. Your best bet is to just use only one set of characters by one author.

Or you can wait a couple years for when Jmorphman's fullgame is finally a thing.

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Re: Competitive Mugen Project
#17  October 01, 2019, 05:35:49 pm
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Infinite, Race, Falcon Rapper etc characters simply put are not built the same as traditional pots style characters. they aren't something you can just "tweak" and throw in and expect to have a cohesive "competitive" roster. Beyond frame data and velocities and all that shit, there is just basic design choices that would give them unfair advantages. Like the addition of mvc like chains, random moves like fireballs, and instant cancellable supers off every normal or special. Not to mention the cornucopia of bugs that they have. In fact throwing all these "traditional" characters together themselves won't be cohesive considering PoTS own works had drastic changes in quality later on.

If you wanted a "cohesive" roster what you would need to do is make a fullgame. That means building all these characters from scratch to have a competitively balanced and viable system. If you can't do that. Your best bet is to just use only one set of characters by one author.

Or you can wait a couple years for when Jmorphman's fullgame is finally a thing.



I respect the idea of building characters from scratch, but that was not my intentions.  My intentions are  is to make a balanced mugen game with tons of balance adjustments to characters and good viability. I want to set a standard for competitive mugen and set off an example.
Re: Competitive Mugen Project
#18  October 01, 2019, 05:39:50 pm
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Infinite, Race, Falcon Rapper etc characters simply put are not built the same as traditional pots style characters. they aren't something you can just "tweak" and throw in and expect to have a cohesive "competitive" roster. Beyond frame data and velocities and all that shit, there is just basic design choices that would give them unfair advantages. Like the addition of mvc like chains, random moves like fireballs, and instant cancellable supers off every normal or special. Not to mention the cornucopia of bugs that they have. In fact throwing all these "traditional" characters together themselves won't be cohesive considering PoTS own works had drastic changes in quality later on.

If you wanted a "cohesive" roster what you would need to do is make a fullgame. That means building all these characters from scratch to have a competitively balanced and viable system. If you can't do that. Your best bet is to just use only one set of characters by one author.

Or you can wait a couple years for when Jmorphman's fullgame is finally a thing.



Or, y'know, you can just use Jmorphman, KarmaChameleon, DeathScythe & Knuckles8864's stuff.
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Go check out Team Sonic Fighters!
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Re: Competitive Mugen Project
#19  October 01, 2019, 05:45:02 pm
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Well, I am working in a fully balanced mugen.

With this mechanics:
6 buttons
Chain combo,
Launcher,
aerial combo
spot dodge
power charge
MVC imput style Hypers,
TAG SYSTEM:
assist,
character change
and delayed hyper combos,


I am using a vast selection of characters and recoding some stuff that needs to be recoded,
I will upload a Nero video one of this days and an update
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Re: Competitive Mugen Project
#20  October 01, 2019, 05:55:39 pm
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Well, I am working in a fully balanced mugen.

With this mechanics:
6 buttons
Chain combo,
Launcher,
aerial combo
spot dodge
power charge
MVC imput style Hypers,
TAG SYSTEM:
assist,
character change
and delayed hyper combos,


I am using a vast selection of characters and recoding some stuff that needs to be recoded,
I will upload a Nero video one of this days and an update


Seems interesting, but why do you have spot dodge in an mvc style game, its technically useless since u can whiff cancel moves. But other than that i hope your project goes well.