Art & Entertainment => Entertainment => Topic started by: Gate on June 16, 2011, 04:33:46 pm
Title: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Gate on June 16, 2011, 04:33:46 pm
Since DC has it's own topic, we should have one for Marvel too. ::)
Well, let's start by telling some books I've been reading, or following by spoilers (Avengers):
Fear Itself
Boring and predictable, but not the worst event Marvel have done (Secret Invasion was way more disappointing).
Avengers & New Avengers
It sucks. Bendis is a great street level writer, but really blows working with teams. He simply can't find a voice for most of the characters (especially Hawkeye) and seems to use the same characters over and over (The Hood and Osborn for example)
Secret Avengers
Great start but turned really stale when it turned into Steve Rogers and his Amazing Friends. Turned good again when Nick Spencer took off as a writer and gave some more importance for the other characters in the team. Can't wait for the Warren Ellis issues.
Avengers Academy
The best title in the shelves. Most of the students are brand new, but they had a great portion of development. Some of the teachers I've never liked before like Tigra and Speedball are also well characterized. Also, Mettle is boss.
Thunderbolts
Besides the lead character that is terrible (Bendis' Luke Cage), is a solid title when they aren't battling faceless enemies and creatures like trolls and ghosts. Maybe will be better when Songbird takes over the team in the Fear Itself tie-in.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Alhambra on June 16, 2011, 05:38:15 pm
You know I am very tired of crossovers and major events like Fear Itself and Flashpoint so, yeah, I haven't even tried to read any of the latest ones. In general I've grown to dislike how many cameo's and guest appearances are in the books lately.
I agree with you that Avengers Academy is the best Avengers title out there. Invincible Iron-Man, Amazing Spider-Man, X-23, Uncanny X-Force, and, I've heard, the current run of Ultimate Spider-Man are all good. At least they are the books I try to catch up on. Spider-Girl was pretty damn decent as well, except for the twitter thing which was annoying, shame no one bought it.
Bendis is great for character central stories and all but he lacks the skill needed for team books.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Gate on June 16, 2011, 05:55:34 pm
Tried to read Invincible Iron Man when Justine Hammer appeared as a villain because I really liked her in Thunderbolts, but dropped two issues later cause the story wasn't going nowhere. Has Fraction fixed the pacing of the book?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on June 16, 2011, 05:57:31 pm
amazing spidey just started to get good. I'm with you on the big events alhambra, both companies just cant stop, after fear itself in marvel, we have schism which is going to break up the X-men. Uncanny X-force is really good, ultimate X is another good one as well. ultimate Spidey is ok, I'm more looking forward to the new spidey they have coming soon.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Person Man on June 16, 2011, 07:33:07 pm
I'm more of a 'wait for the trades' sort of guy, so I don't have much to say about stuff that's going on right now. I am looking forward reading Deadpool: Fear Itself whenever that gets collected because I know it's being written by Christopher Hastings.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Alhambra on June 16, 2011, 07:52:09 pm
Not really, TBH. I stopped reading it after the whole Doc Ock thing around issue 500. Just before the fear itself stuff. If you weren't enjoying the pacing post "Stark Dissassembeled" then you probably wouldn't like it now. Again though, I'm like 6 issues behind on the book and I'd be lying if I said Larroca's art wasn't a huge factor in me picking it up to begin with. Still enjoyable, and better than most out there.
Ultimate X has been strangely enjoyable. I like the new Angel they have and the whole mutants are illegal angle. I skipped Ultimatum but X has been fun to follow.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Basara Dandy on June 16, 2011, 08:24:34 pm
After Civil War (or better during and after Captain America Reborn), Marvel goes to hell... really the last sagas sucks so hard, but lately I started to read The Thanos Imperative, I just read Ignition (like the chapter #0) so I hope this get me back the love I got for Marvel in the past :-\
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bastard Mami on June 17, 2011, 05:12:28 am
I was reading the exiles and stopped after tehy changed writers.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on June 17, 2011, 05:53:52 am
which series [e]? I read the original one, then volume 2 was kinda bleh and then I picked it up when they started over (with the black panther,scarlet witch,polaris, beast and blink) then it got cancelled and I cried :'(
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: ShadowArm on June 17, 2011, 06:12:40 pm
i want to see the new Ghost rider chick that will replace Johnny and Dan
maybe this is a new rebirth since only Johnny and Dan are the last Living ghost riders on Earth Thanks to Zadkiel
and now god itself is protecting them
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Riptide on June 20, 2011, 01:42:45 am
So nows not the time to start reading x-men books?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on June 20, 2011, 02:01:18 am
now's probably the best time since everything is about to shift, I just wish everywhere I went there werent so many cyclops bashers. Its like the cool thing to hate cyclops now.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: -Red- on June 20, 2011, 08:11:42 am
The only comic I really read was Ultimate Hulk VS Wolverine (Or is it backwards? Meh) and I liked it. I also read the first 2 issues of Fear Itself and have the rest ready to be read and...
*Reads thread*
...OH! I guess this isnt the best start for a comic reading hobbie then :(
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Gate on June 20, 2011, 02:10:45 pm
The only comic I really read was Ultimate Hulk VS Wolverine (Or is it backwards? Meh) and I liked it. I also read the first 2 issues of Fear Itself and have the rest ready to be read and...
*Reads thread*
...OH! I guess this isnt the best start for a comic reading hobbie then :(
There's no thig as bad time to star reading comics, since that are a lot of older comics that you can enjoy while the situation is dire.
I'd reccommend:
Simonson's Thor Roy Thomas' Avengers Busiek's Avengers Busiek's Thunderbolts Nicieza's Thunderbolts Ellis' Thunderbolts Ellis' NextWave Fraction and Brubaker's Immortal Iron Fist Annihillation and Annihillation Conquest
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: psychoripper on June 20, 2011, 11:27:13 pm
In terms of marvel, i liked the civil war series, and on an older note i enjoyed the infinity gaunlet story
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Loona on September 12, 2011, 07:41:39 pm
Isn't the main Marvel universe numbered 616 in its multiverse setting?
I wonder because I just came across this in the Jess Nevins annotations pages for League of Extraordinary Gentlemen: Century 1969 (http://jessnevins.com/annotations/1969annotations.html): "Traditionally 666 has been described as the number of the beast and has been used as such in novels and films like The Omen. But the majority of the early uses of the Number of the Beast were 616, not 666" (commenting on a line in page 37 panel 3)
When was the 616 number first mentioned and by whom?...
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Gate on September 12, 2011, 08:35:19 pm
Isn't the main Marvel universe numbered 616 in its multiverse setting?
I wonder because I just came across this in the Jess Nevins annotations pages for League of Extraordinary Gentlemen: Century 1969 (http://jessnevins.com/annotations/1969annotations.html): "Traditionally 666 has been described as the number of the beast and has been used as such in novels and films like The Omen. But the majority of the early uses of the Number of the Beast were 616, not 666" (commenting on a line in page 37 panel 3)
When was the 616 number first mentioned and by whom?...
Alan Moore when writing Captain Britain or Excalibur stories, I think
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Loona on September 13, 2011, 11:54:37 am
Isn't the main Marvel universe numbered 616 in its multiverse setting?
I wonder because I just came across this in the Jess Nevins annotations pages for League of Extraordinary Gentlemen: Century 1969 (http://jessnevins.com/annotations/1969annotations.html): "Traditionally 666 has been described as the number of the beast and has been used as such in novels and films like The Omen. But the majority of the early uses of the Number of the Beast were 616, not 666" (commenting on a line in page 37 panel 3)
When was the 616 number first mentioned and by whom?...
Alan Moore when writing Captain Britain or Excalibur stories, I think
I'd practically forgotten Moore had worked with Marvel (his DC work is more famous), but this sounds remarkably sneaky and appropriate for him ;D
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on September 13, 2011, 01:55:17 pm
It was also, supposedly part of the address for the Marvel UK offices.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on September 13, 2011, 06:09:04 pm
which series [e]? I read the original one, then volume 2 was kinda bleh and then I picked it up when they started over (with the black panther,scarlet witch,polaris, beast and blink) then it got cancelled and I cried :'(
lol late reply, anyway: I got annoyer on it when they:
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
started killing off all the starter characters, try to explain how the multiverse travelnig works and add multiple supermen as the main characters, all those arcs sucked and the writers did change during that time.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Loona on September 13, 2011, 06:30:10 pm
I'd practically forgotten Moore had worked with Marvel (his DC work is more famous), but this sounds remarkably sneaky and appropriate for him ;D
I seriously doubt he's trying to reference Marvel, it's just the same biblical reference. Moore doesn't want anything to do with Marvel.
I meant him assigning the Number of the Beast to Marvel when working there, if that was the case - 616 isn't actually referenced anywhere I can think of in LoEG.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Mgbenz on September 22, 2011, 07:12:56 pm
First Colossus gets Juggied and now it seems they're going to break up his relationship with Kitty.
Fear Itself is fucking retarded.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Alhambra on September 22, 2011, 07:38:03 pm
Wait. WHAT! First, I though Colossunaut was in the Schism Arc. I've been keeping my distance from both Schism and Fear Itself but that is the most retarded thing I've heard all day.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Mgbenz on September 22, 2011, 07:40:08 pm
Yeah it's from the Schism arc.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Basara Dandy on September 22, 2011, 07:44:11 pm
Yeah, some of my friends told me about that: "don't read Fear Itself, it starts so well, but later it goes to the hell... so boring"
And because of UMVC3 finally I read it: I got the Rocket Raccoon 4-issue miniseries (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rocket_Raccoon_%28limited_series%29) and The Incredible Hulk #271 from the 80s (in CBR format, of course)... and it's pretty cool as character and it has awesome stories. And the miniseries was drawn by Mike "Hellboy" Mignola, what a big surprise :D
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Alhambra on September 22, 2011, 08:40:22 pm
Question. Is/Did Black Goliath dead/die? Again I mean. Or whoever is Black Goliath now. Because I just saw this:
And I face palmed. I swear I just cannot enjoy Marvel Events anymore.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Basara Dandy on September 22, 2011, 09:22:53 pm
It died by the Thor clone in Civil War. I think that image comes from one of the multiple tie-ins from Civil War, since it still appeared Maria Bitch Hill as the main leader of S.H.I.E.L.D. in that time
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Alhambra on September 23, 2011, 02:43:56 am
"It"?
I know he was killed from Ragnorok or whoever his name was during Civil War. The image is a preview from next weeks issue of Avengers. I don't think its a flashback because of the Nazi Robot thing. Maria Hill is currently working for Shield again in some capacity.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on September 23, 2011, 03:40:17 am
I know he was killed from Ragnorok or whoever his name was during Civil War. The image is a preview from next weeks issue of Avengers. I don't think its a flashback because of the Nazi Robot thing. Maria Hill is currently working for Shield again in some capacity.
It looks like a flashback: note the woman who gets a sample of his arm hair; she's probably use it to become the new Goliath.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Alhambra on September 23, 2011, 06:43:52 am
Well that'd be neat I guess.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Basara Dandy on February 20, 2012, 02:47:36 pm
As it says in the article, the "spirit of vengeance" is not with Ghost Rider's creator :-\ http://www.examiner.com/science-fiction-in-new-york/marvel-sues-down-on-his-luck-ghost-rider-creator-for-17k
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on February 20, 2012, 02:52:25 pm
Quesada addressed the controversy by basically saying "oh the fee wasn't OUR fault. (http://blastr.com/2012/02/marvel-jumps-on-ghost-rid.php)
He also said that Friedrich hasn't reached out to the group that helps comic book creators in financial need (that Quesada sits on the board of). The implication being that Friedrich doesn't NEED any help so it's OK for him to pay the ridiculous fee.
:noo:
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on February 21, 2012, 04:28:42 pm
Your link is 404ing mate.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Basara Dandy on February 22, 2012, 02:59:23 pm
I smell a possible boycott in the air by fans to the next Ghost Rider movie because of this (also... Nicholas Cage again :omg:)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on February 22, 2012, 03:03:38 pm
Isn't the GR movie in the same bag as Spider-Man and X-Men, owned by Sony or Fox and not Marvel ? (not sure) Won't do much to Marvel for fans to boycott it, but they can always boycott it for the sole reason that it's Sony or Fox :P
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on February 22, 2012, 03:07:05 pm
You are completely right.
And thats what im doing. They have the nerve to restart ghost rider like that to begin with.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: ShadowArm on February 23, 2012, 09:06:03 pm
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 11, 2012, 03:09:09 pm
ALL OF MY HATE
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 11, 2012, 03:30:51 pm
Everyone has life bars and Arcade seems to be godlike. If arcade had gotten actual powers he would be murdering x-men left and right, this is a vr simulation.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 11, 2012, 03:41:35 pm
If arcade had gotten actual powers he would be murdering x-men left and right, this is a vr simulation.
Wishful thinking, probably. If this was a good writer, someone whose last name wasn't literally "Hopeless"...
NO, MY RAGE SHALL NOT SUBSIDE I WON'T BE ABLE TO FORGET THIS HATRED EVEN IF I DIE AND GET REBORN A MILLION TIMES OVER
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 11, 2012, 03:43:39 pm
He even admits to have taken the idea from a kid's book he read. If arcade could move mountains like he is doing there, what exacly would he be doing killing kids instead of the x-men? And why would they have lifebars?
also, the black guy was the first kill.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on December 11, 2012, 05:53:14 pm
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 14, 2012, 06:20:55 pm
After Slott's fantastic spider-man run a new spider-man is said to start with 700, as the book takes an yet unnamed replacement for peter. The covers all show a spiderman with claws, that calls himself "superior" , the claws has made people theorize that the new spider-man would be Miguel Ohara. Spoilers have shown that seem to hint to it being another person, in what would be considered a giant twist
The story in 698 ( which everyone thought would be a red herring consisted of
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
The imprisioned and sick Doc Ock managing to exchange minds with Peter, letting Peter inside his dying body.
This lead to Peter using Ock powers to summon the sinister Six and attempting to take back his body in 699
The spoilers are that apparently Peter fails, and dies inside Dock Ock body, while making Ock promise that he will try to be a good person. Dock arrogantly clams he will do better than that, he will be a superior spider-man and make spider-man be considered the greatest hero ever.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 14, 2012, 06:25:25 pm
Dumb. Stupid.
Stupid dumb stupid.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: PBRTODD101 on December 14, 2012, 06:52:33 pm
That is just outright bad...damn Marvel, it's like you haven't gotten enough people to be Spider-Man so you come up with the stupidest crap to make it happen. I really, really, really hope this doesn't last. Having Peter but not Peter as Spider-Man completely ruins the character.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 14, 2012, 09:08:58 pm
ARENA talk
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
(http://i.imgur.com/nPkoe.jpg)
ONLY ONE SURVIVES WHO IS IT GONNA BE ?!
I think about a third of those kids are new too! ryker, bloodstone, nara, anachronism, apex, red raven and kid briton are new if im not mistaken.
its really odd to see kammi without skreet
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 14, 2012, 09:41:40 pm
X-23, because she's Wolverine! With boobs! fuck this shitty comic, I don't care if it is a VR sim (which is not even that likely, Arcade suddenly getting godlike powers and changing motivation shouldn't be taken to mean anything important, just think of Scarlet Witch in Avengers: Disassembled. It's just arbitrary changes to a character in order to serve an idiotic plot).
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on December 14, 2012, 09:45:47 pm
>X-23 >loads of other nobodies >there can be only one GEE I WONDER
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Djoulz on December 14, 2012, 09:54:37 pm
wait hold on a minute: regarding issue 698:
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
they killed Peter's actual mind in the 698 issue? serious? O_O
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 14, 2012, 09:55:55 pm
wait hold on a minute: they killed Peter's actual mind in the 698 issue? serious? O_O
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
700 ( which isnt out yet ) he dies in ock body in 700 ( supposedly) Some others are saying that Peter doesnt actually die, but his personality and Ock got merged when they fuse back .
dan slott message (http://i.imgur.com/PjOH0.png)
Also, checked out the previews for the next arena, everyone still has lifebars floating next to them, it looks dumb as shit. The issues seem to be focused on expanding on backstories for the new characters tho.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 18, 2012, 03:02:59 am
Welp I found a leak of that 700 issue, ask me anything and i will reply with spoilers.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on December 18, 2012, 04:22:42 am
How long do you think that thing that happened with that guy will last? I'm betting to early 2014.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 18, 2012, 11:10:03 am
Its obviously designed to be a arc, and it would be an interesting arc too, but it could have happened while ock was in prison, being an interesting story till then. To base a new book name and try to paint it as if he was there to stay is dumb.
A year sounds fine for a year of stories pertaining to it.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 18, 2012, 03:12:57 pm
To base a new book name and try to paint it as if he was there to stay is dumb.
Reminds me of the Captain America storyline. But that felt earned after a long storyline of Red Skull machinations and Bucky being back. Unless Dan Slott's telling me he had a golden octobot lurking in every issue since Ends of the Earth like the Lich Snail, I don't really buy this as a "culmination of 30 issues" or whatever he said.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 18, 2012, 03:56:32 pm
Welp I found a leak of that 700 issue, ask me anything and i will reply with spoilers.
Why make it unnecessarily complicated? :|
im not going to post links to it, but i guess i can give details?!
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Peter in ock dying body is trying to get back into his own body. Ock in pete body is seen on a date with MJ. Pete in ock body tells carlie he was mindswapped, she tells him that its a lie, he tells her one thing that only she and him could know " Peter parker is spider-man, im peter parker." before she gets wounded and passes out. Ock in pete body gets together everyone in peter parker life in a bunker, including jameson, in the avengers tower. Jameson now trusts him because the man is even a avenger. Pete in ock body shows up with the technology to swap their minds back, there is a fight with ock continuously threatening the hostages. Scorpion tries to attack jameson, Ock punches his jaw off, jameson thanks him for being a hero. Mj kisses ock and tells him that she still loves peter after ock gives her a dressing down about being useless. Pete in ock body throws ock out of the window, both together in an attempt to either swap or kill both of them, during the fall, the pre programmed golden bot ( for neural swap ) tries to swap minds, ock is wearing protection to avoid this, the swap fails, ock creates a web cushion to survive the fall. Pete in ock body is now dying as ock stands over him gloating when a mind meld starts to happen, ock relives most of peter life as if it was him in his stead, in his dying throes, peter and ock start finishing each other sentences as peter makes ock promise he will do what he can to protect his family.
Peter dies in front of him after saying "with great power" and ock finishing with "comes great responsability". Ock starts ranting how he can do better than peter ever could, and that if he is going to be spiderman he is going to be superior.
I also read a sort of after thing, where ock wakes up next day, he is still having vivid flashbacks of peter life, he goes back to one of his labs to prepare a new suit for himself, one that shows him as superior, meanwhile he finds automated security measures he left in place that attack him and starts getting disgusted at his original form and personality.
The stories are very well written, but like i said, they could have left peter locked in ock body and it would have been the same, pretending to kill pete while waving the reset button of the meld in our faces is dumb. Previews already show daredevil and ock fighting.
OH also, tumblr was getting mad at mj and ock dating, since he had the mind swap and its technicaly rape, Slott has already been threatening people that he is going to sue them for callling him names and insulting him on twitter.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 18, 2012, 04:08:16 pm
Scorpion tries to attack jameson, Ock punches his jaw off, jameson thanks him for being a hero. Mj kisses ock and tells him that she still loves peter after ock gives her a dressing down about being useless.
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Who is "Ock" in these situations, Ock in Peter's body or Peter in Ock's body?
OH also, tumblr was getting mad at mj and ock dating, since he had the mind swap and its technicaly rape, Slott has already been threatening people that he is going to sue them for callling him names and insulting him on twitter.
This was a problem before, with Chameleon. It is pretty much rape and pretty icky, and Slott needs to stop overreacting.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 18, 2012, 04:12:27 pm
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
ock in pete body, I should probably say something like Spock The whole part where he is calling mj useless is pretty bad.
Well its going to be worse now, because they are seemingly dating.
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Ock in pete body stll talks like ock and keeps insulting people, Its pretty weird that no one notices.
Also, CARLIE KNOWS. This will likely be a plot point.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Snakebyte on December 18, 2012, 04:13:42 pm
This is awful.
Like I really thought we had gone past the point where Marvel was capable of being this awful.
Can we please throw Slott into a cactus.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 18, 2012, 04:17:13 pm
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Snakebyte on December 18, 2012, 04:18:46 pm
He can do that from the cactus! D:<
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 18, 2012, 04:20:00 pm
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
it goes something like
"peter, you need to be careful, i know you are stressed and.." "And what? you are here to give me a peptalk? you are useless, what are you good for? Giving chatty peptalks?" "P-pete... I only try because.. I love you and .." =ock leans in and kisses her = his shadow has tentacles too.
also i got you the page, dont say i never did something for you!!
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
(http://i.imgur.com/qPhaD.jpg)
Hm. That wasn't as terrible as I imagined it would be.
not that it's good, mind you
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 18, 2012, 08:04:27 pm
Spoiler: nsfw(click to see content)
(http://i48.tinypic.com/ctd02.png)
oh dear
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 18, 2012, 08:26:29 pm
that was done before the issue was even leaked. and its nsfw, tag your posts!
At any rate, you should really read it instead of just raging about it. Slott is a good writer, the only fault with any of this was the attempt to make it seem like a replacement, when its obviously a story arc that will be really interesting.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Snakebyte on December 19, 2012, 03:43:32 am
Quote
Slott is a good writer,
Quote
Slott is a good writer,
Quote
Slott is a good writer,
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
No.
Good writing is not pointless gimmicks that never last and don't develop anything.
He lost his spider sense! This is going to be the new status quo! He learned kung fu!
--Reverted within a year with no lasting impact--
Those aren't stories. Those are gimmicks, and awful, awful, awful writing.
I've read every issue of every ongoing spider-man comic, excluding MC2 and ones based on the TV show. Ultimate aside, I'm done now. This is so much worse than Brand New Day.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on December 19, 2012, 03:57:22 am
Eh, I wasn't reading Spider-Man anyway because Slott wasn't doing anything for me, and this isn't going to last past May 2014 anyway. I actually predicted that this would happen months ago, simply from the report that Superior Spider-Man wouldn't be Peter Parker and that 698-700 would be a Doctor Octopus storyline. Frankly, I thought there'd be a lot more people that did the same.
I'm with Iced: if they had kept Pete alive in Ock's body for the length of the arc and done a comic from his perspective and a comic from Ock's perspective it would have made a better story. I'd probably be really excited. As it is, I can't even muster up a passing interest. Marvel and DC have effectively "big event"-ed me out.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 19, 2012, 04:01:46 am
AVX = Some of the best comics I've seen in a while.
... really? Out of character nonstop pointless fight AvX?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Snakebyte on December 19, 2012, 04:14:14 am
Did you read the end, and the Uncanny X-Men tie-in issues, and just Uncanny X-Men in general leading up to it, and the Consequences aftermath series?
Some of the best character development in mainstream comics, tying up things Gillen has been seeding throughout his run and Bendis has been seeding since House of M.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 19, 2012, 04:20:14 am
I just meant the main book itself, I have heard the tie-ins are good and help somewhat with the characterization in the main book.
but the main book is just godawful, I don't know why I read it after hearing all the bad things about it. Morbid curiosity, I guess.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Snakebyte on December 19, 2012, 04:24:09 am
The beginning, yeah, somewhat. The end, no. Basically when Romita stops drawing it... God I hate his art for this kind of thing. The characterization isn't out of character in the slightest, you just didn't read the development.
Kind of unfair to judge how jarring part of a story is without reading it all.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 19, 2012, 04:35:57 am
Kind of unfair to judge how jarring part of a story is without reading it all.
An event should stand on it's own, and not require the reader to have read multiple books to have crucial things explained.
But I do know what happens in the tie-ins anyway, and I didn't really think they helped much.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Snakebyte on December 19, 2012, 04:39:56 am
Quote
An event should stand on it's own, and not require the reader to have read multiple books to have crucial things explained.
I completely and utterly disagree. Events should be things that build from smaller stories happening in other books over a long period of time, and have their effects felt in books that they would naturally be felt in. Why on earth would anyone read comics in a shared universe if they aren't interested in that kind of interaction?
Go buy a novel or an independently-written series if that's what you're looking for. Marvel and DC comics are fundamentally different, and most of what Bendis has done are the best examples of how those kinds of events should be done. Dark Reign was really, really, really good. Civil War and Secret Invasion, less so. I liked the lead-up to SI, but the ball was massively dropped on the actual event.
Another great example of this kind of thing is all the cosmic books put out by Marvel in the last 5-6 years. Annihilation, Annihilation: Conquest, Nova, Guardians of the Galaxy, War of Kings, Thanos Imperative, etc. Fantastic universe-spanning storytelling that all wrapped up nicely at the end.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 19, 2012, 04:42:25 am
I don't mean build-up stuff, I mean tie-ins to the event itself.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on December 19, 2012, 04:43:37 am
I thought Siege and AvX were pretty terrible, too. If the main book wasn't good then I don't consider the event good, because the main book is what everybody will be reading. For instance, Civil War: The Confession is one of the best comics I've ever read but it doesn't retroactively make Civil War #1-7 any less a pile of out of character decisions, shock deaths, and strawman arguments.
Your mileage varies, of course. I will say that keeping Cyclops alive and letting him and his brotherhood keep a book was a great decision, even if I'm still not interested in reading X-Men.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Snakebyte on December 19, 2012, 04:48:38 am
Quote
I will say that keeping Cyclops alive and letting him and his brotherhood keep a book was a great decision, even if I'm still not interested in reading X-Men.
Did that actually happen? What book will he be in? I'm a month or two behind.
The main book of Siege was great, and Siege: Frontline was amazing. Urich and Volstagg! URICH AND VOLSTAGG! If they made an ongoing Urich/Volstagg ongoing buddy book, I would buy 10 copies.
I think the second half of AVX was written very well, and as long as you have read the build-up, I don't think you need to read the tie-ins to understand it. I'm definitely not alone in this opinion. This is the first I've heard of people disliking it.
Maybe some of the Colossus/Magik stuff was in UXM tie-ins, idk. The UXM stuff is all I would consider essential.
I agree that the Civil War ongoing was shit. The event as a whole had some good points, like the Penance stuff (don't shoot me)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on December 19, 2012, 05:02:07 am
Did that actually happen? What book will he be in? I'm a month or two behind.
His team will once again be the focus of Uncanny X-Men when it relauches in February.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Snakebyte on December 19, 2012, 05:21:30 am
YAY UNCANNY IS RELAUNCHING WOW HOLY SHIT YES YAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAY
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on December 19, 2012, 10:13:36 am
(http://i.imgur.com/1Q1U4.jpg)
Sums up a few of my feelings on #700.
I will say that that while the obvious back doors for him to be Peter again (somehow) can be seen from a mile away if you read the story....it's not hard to see why people raged.
Do I like it? Meh, it just leaves a bad taste in my mouth.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 19, 2012, 02:46:30 pm
This is the first I've heard of people disliking it.
Well, this is the first time I've heard of people liking it! :haw:
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Mgbenz on December 19, 2012, 03:00:34 pm
Snakebyte must probably only be hanging out at CBR where they pretty much like anything Marvel throws at them.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on December 19, 2012, 03:06:02 pm
I read the issue today (ASM 700) and yes I raged big time. I found it totally stupid to just shoehorn otto into pete's origin and basically steal it. And him going through those memories magically making him want to be good now.
It's just fucking stupid as fucking shit. Fuck off Dan slott.
I'm tired of them trying to make everything so god damn dark. Spiderman doesn't need to be dark. I thought that was the reason for scarlet spider
Also AvX was fucking shit. And the CBR boards hated it as well (At least the X-boards) making cyclops as the bad guy when he was totally right and basically bullied into being the bad guy was stupid and backfired on marvel big time. He's by far their most popular X-man now.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 19, 2012, 05:03:39 pm
Good writing is not pointless gimmicks that never last and don't develop anything.
He lost his spider sense! This is going to be the new status quo! He learned kung fu!
--Reverted within a year with no lasting impact--
Those aren't stories. Those are gimmicks, and awful, awful, awful writing.
I've read every issue of every ongoing spider-man comic, excluding MC2 and ones based on the TV show. Ultimate aside, I'm done now. This is so much worse than Brand New Day.
I thought of all those directions as coming from above him. his work on she hulk was phenomenal. I keep what I said! I think Slott is good.
Now, someone i would like to see with free reign would be Peter David. Anything he does turns out into comic book gold.
In AVx the only things I really liked were the gillen books, but that happened in such a way that if you had excised the whole event and just had let gillen books tell the story alone I would have thougth the event had gone alright. With the added "OH NO PHOENIX IS EVIL" hubris, it all seemed very stupid. Shit, give gillen spiderman, give peter david x-men, they would make solid gold. The last time peter david and warren ellis had control of a universe, it turned out great (until the fallout, but lets not speak of that ), so seeing another stint like that would be pretty great.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on December 19, 2012, 09:10:07 pm
BMB is doing a excellent job with All New X-men tbh. A lot of people were skeptical of his writing but he has done a wonderful job thus far. His magneto is excellent. His Cyclops is great. The team at the Jean grey school is great as well. And the 05 ( minus iceman and angel) have been wonderful.
I can't wait for the next few issues. I feel bad for teen Cyke. Everyone seems to hate him for what his adult self did :/
I can't get onboard Superior spiderman at all. I don't care. the premise to me is stupid.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Basara Dandy on December 19, 2012, 11:12:57 pm
And finally Marvel killed one of its main superheroes once for all. I read about Superior Spider-Man but I'm afraid of read the comic book itself because of those rumours of Ock being Spidey and viceversa, and the possibility of Peter dead. And they're true. In 90s, Marvel attempted to kill Peter in Clone Saga (making the rumour that Peter was the clone and Ben the real one), but now it concretes finally after they killed him in Ultimate Spider-Man.
Spidey was one of my favourite superheroes and now he's gone. I feel sad now and probably I'll never read something new about Marvel since now Y_Y
Spoiler: Some pages to cry and rant found on Facebook, enter at your own risk(click to see content)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Mgbenz on December 19, 2012, 11:24:30 pm
When was it that Beast became the most hated X-men? I've seen nothing but praise over his upcoming death.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 19, 2012, 11:26:53 pm
You know, it just occurred to me (and by that I mean I saw someone say this somewhere else) that this "enemy becomes better Spider-Man than Spider-Man" story already happened. 20 years ago.
And there's no way this is gonna be better than Kraven's Last Hunt.
That sounds to me like Kaine as the new Scarlet Spider, or the new Venom o_o
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 19, 2012, 11:31:23 pm
Beast is devolving again, and he is afraid that he is going to lose his mind and/or die. Its part of the subplot of why he has traveled back in time to get the five first x-men, his sickness is making him delusional.
Also, potto is such an autistic little douche that almost every page he has been in so far since tricking peter has been hilarious. This is just a long arc, and you all should really read the book instead of just reading on and off pages and raging at things.
following pages are an example from daredevil last pages this month: http://i.imgur.com/91MKj.jpg http://i.imgur.com/MjVEM.jpg
Also , Kaine book is pretty solid, he has been a great character. Flash as venom, also very solid, the symbiote seems to like him.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 19, 2012, 11:33:30 pm
I meant more like "enemy defeats Spidey and takes over his identity", rather than "darker and edgier Spidey".
Hes not darker and edgier. Otto hasnt changed a bit. he is an arrogant prick with a inferiority complex
Quote
never
Your funeral.
Quote
Is the symbiote just over the whole cannibalism phase that Gargan had to go through?
They have it over sedated, it says that it hated gargan. Flash should have been with the suit for lesser time than he has been, and the suit should have tried to regain control far more often than it has done, it didnt, because it seems to like Flash and wants to protect him.
The suit has no concept of what a recovering alcoholic is , tho. http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/0/40/2087079-venom_11_cover.jpeg It keeps giving Flash booze whenever he craves it.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 19, 2012, 11:45:37 pm
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 19, 2012, 11:48:09 pm
You are getting infuriated by things you dont even read but only hear slightly about, i dont think your plan is working!!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Basara Dandy on December 19, 2012, 11:51:42 pm
Well, it worked for me about Superior Spider-Man, and I was right sadly >_< I want to read about Scarlet Spider and Venom, even those 2 have a crossover out there, right??
And about Ock and trying to kill Spidey... how many of you read the Clone Saga remake in 2000s (the 6-issue miniseries that rewrite this 90s saga and changes the final)??
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 19, 2012, 11:53:57 pm
Snakebyte must probably only be hanging out at CBR where they pretty much like anything Marvel throws at them.
No, actually I hang out on irc/dc++ with scanners, and pretty much everyone I talked to agreed that was the best comicbook event in a very long time and the ending was phenomenal, and my other friends that read comics loved it also.
BMB is doing a excellent job with All New X-men tbh. A lot of people were skeptical of his writing but he has done a wonderful job thus far. His magneto is excellent. His Cyclops is great. The team at the Jean grey school is great as well. And the 05 ( minus iceman and angel) have been wonderful.
I can't wait for the next few issues. I feel bad for teen Cyke. Everyone seems to hate him for what his adult self did :/
I can't get onboard Superior spiderman at all. I don't care. the premise to me is stupid.
Only read the first ANXM but it seemed great. Bendis is the man, when he's really writing and not just doing 'hi this is filler i am overworked' arcs.
I thought of all those directions as coming from above him. his work on she hulk was phenomenal. I keep what I said! I think Slott is good.
Now, someone i would like to see with free reign would be Peter David. Anything he does turns out into comic book gold.
In AVx the only things I really liked were the gillen books, but that happened in such a way that if you had excised the whole event and just had let gillen books tell the story alone I would have thougth the event had gone alright. With the added "OH NO PHOENIX IS EVIL" hubris, it all seemed very stupid. Shit, give gillen spiderman, give peter david x-men, they would make solid gold. The last time peter david and warren ellis had control of a universe, it turned out great (until the fallout, but lets not speak of that ), so seeing another stint like that would be pretty great.
Slott is the sole Spider-writer and you think there's editorial influence? Yeah it doesn't work that way. His She-Hulk was not great.
What 'Phoenix is evil' hubris? Phoenix isn't evil. If that's what you took away from the book you didn't read it right at all.
What 'Phoenix is evil' hubris? Phoenix isn't evil. If that's what you took away from the book you didn't read it right at all.
The first thing that AvX established about the Phoenix force is that it was a parasitic soul-eater of mass destruction that was going to roast the Earth no matter what sooner or later, no questions asked, regardless of previous storylines. That's why the battle happened at all, and some fans are defending Cyclops' action in it because they reject that premise. If you accept the premise, then Cyclops was officially the bad guy from the beginning, at least as far as what the writers wanted to do.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on December 20, 2012, 12:18:00 am
When was it that Beast became the most hated X-men? I've seen nothing but praise over his upcoming death.
All his bitching and moaning got on people's nerves. I like the 05 beast (the original beast they brought back) though he's become assertive and not whiny at all he's becoming one of my favorites quickly.
The writers ret conned the phoenix into something it wasn't and failed. Fans became enraged and even if the phoenix 5 were meant to be bad guys there was never any evidence to prove they were until the avengers starting poking them with a stick.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 20, 2012, 12:20:25 am
What 'Phoenix is evil' hubris? Phoenix isn't evil. If that's what you took away from the book you didn't read it right at all.
safe to say i disagree about she hulk, but opinions are that, opinions, so I will go into this one instead.
Everyone on that event acted as if the phoenix was evil, wolverine, cap, ironman, they all assumed that the phoenix was going to do bad things, after cyclops and the others were possessed , they kept bullying them even though they themselves had created the situation by SHOOTING the damn thing. And all during that everyone pretended that the past hosts all had gone crazy cuckoo in the head. It was extremely shit, they ignored all of the x-men past with the phoenix going as far as being inside Jean as she faced Onslaught. Suddenly the Phoenix was all powerful as well, changing reality around like if it was nothing. They needed to make cyclops and the others wrong, and had to push it instead of letting the status quo change for a while and have them being unstable develop later. Gillen was the savior of that whole thing, his tie in for the even finale literally saved the event from being shit into being okay.
The event was so ridiculous that they had grimm and luke cage both beat the shit of Namor underwater. I liked the tie in comic that implied that it had been squirrel girl and pixie playing with the puppeter toys during the whole thing, tho.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on December 20, 2012, 12:22:13 am
there was never any evidence to prove they were until the avengers starting poking them with a stick.
You keep saying that. You keep disregarding that the Avengers told the X-Men what was going to happen, and the X-Men repeatedly spit in their face essentially saying they only cared about saving mutantkind, not giving a shit that the phoenix might possibly destroy the planet. Cyclops is a bad guy in AvX. It's just the storyline, it was written like that, that's all. That kind of shit has happened before. Get over it.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on December 20, 2012, 12:31:41 am
It wasn't what was "going to happen" it's what they thought was going to happen. everything was going fine with the phoenix force it was going to hope and it was bringing back mutants. Tony stark shot it with a giant uncertain gun and shattered it into 5 pieces.
the 5 that got it then began to make the world better by fixing a lot of problems. Only until the avengers and the us president decided it was too much power for them. So they began attacking them. They made cyclops into the villain. There was never a clear cut villain until the final 2 issues of the whole crossover. The whole thing was out of character for everyone anyway. And they even went to the god damn moon to get the phoenix instead of having it on earth.
And I am completely over it. If it weren't for this event then cyclops wouldn't be as popular as he is as the whole thing blew up in marvels faces when people realized cyclops was right all along.
Also stop being so confrontational over this. You seem to try to attack me more than just respond to what I was saying.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Snakebyte on December 20, 2012, 12:33:55 am
Slott's She-Hulk is overrated and unbelievable. Cheap gimmicks instead of good writing, the same objections I have to his Spidey work. I preferred both Byrne's and PAD's She-Hulk runs.
That said I was a huge fan of Avengers: The Initiative, but I'll give Gage the credit there.
DKDC said:
The first thing that AvX established about the Phoenix force is that it was a parasitic soul-eater of mass destruction that was going to roast the Earth no matter what sooner or later, no questions asked, regardless of previous storylines.
No, it established that's what the Avengers thought it was. Cyclops didn't. Hence the entire storyline.
Iced said:
Everyone on that event acted as if the phoenix was evil, wolverine, cap, ironman, they all assumed that the phoenix was going to do bad things, after cyclops and the others were possessed , they kept bullying them even though they themselves had created the situation by SHOOTING the damn thing.
Exactly! Why are you complaining about this? That's excellent writing!
The Avengers thought the Phoenix was evil, despite there being no evidence of this. Phoenix isn't evil and was never evil. It came back to earth because it had a connection to mutants from the Earth hosts it had inhabited over the years, and Wanda removed them all. Cyclops knew this, he just went too far to accomplish this goal, and went insane in a wonderfully different and appropriate way from any of the previous hosts. He lost track of what he was fighting for, but he did win.
When you say 'they', you are talking about characters in the story, not the writers. Of course Tony Stark is going to fight against cosmic forces swooping in and fixing everything. Of course people close to Jean are going to resist it after seeing what it did to her.
The moral ambiguity of 'would the phoenix five really have saved the world if they had been left alone to do it' is what drove a good chunk of the story. Because maybe they would have, and maybe, by pissing them off and concentrating the amount of the phoenix force in the remaining ones, the avengers ruined utopia. Maybe Tony Stark really and truly fucked it up by taking some kid's word for what the Phoenix was.
Or maybe it always would have resulted in Colossus making whales with legs and forgetting that they don't do so well outside of water.
EDIT TO DKDC/NEOCIDE: Cyclops was always going to be a villain. It was a long time coming. Read Gillen's UXM run, Schism, etc.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on December 20, 2012, 12:36:00 am
It initially came to fix wanda's fuck up with the "no more mutants" That was the whole reason it was coming.
Also logan escalated things because of his whole grudge with cyclops he came off as the bitter ex girlfriend
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on December 20, 2012, 12:38:42 am
It wasn't what was "going to happen" it's what they thought was going to happen.
No, it's what the writers declared WOULD happen. Did you miss Nova blazing through half the universe to warn them that the Phoenix was going to destroy them ? It was actually written like that. "The Phoenix will revive mutanthood ! -But the Phoenix will destroy all life on Earth ! -Screw you !" This is the only thing Cyclops ever said, and that makes him the new Magneto, because he was written like that. Nothing ever contradicted Nova's announcement. It was canonically true, because it was written like that. You keep saying it wouldn't have happened, but the writers wanted it to be the canonical truth, so yes, it was going to happen. Ergo, Stark & co were right, and Cyclops was wrong. Because it was written like that. Cyclops was written so that he would be the new Magneto. He was written to be the bad guy.
Quote
You seem to try to attack me more than just respond to what I was saying.
You keep bringing the same shit up over and again everyone anyone mentions it.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 20, 2012, 12:39:07 am
But Snake, they had a specialist, Wolverine, wolverine lived in the same mansion with at least two of the hosts, and neither of them blew the fuck up and tried to eat the moon! Even assuming that wolverine suddenly got retarded, you still have all the other x-men that could have talked about it, even cyclops word should have been enough for cap to have accepted it instead of coming at them with a shipload of avengers, everything was rushed and nonsense filled in those actions. Shit even xavier should have stopped everything and gone like "calm down you fuckheads, we been at least through three of those before the last planet blew up."
All the characters become walking stereotypes, the only thing that saves Colossus interpretation is that gillen wrapped up his story with illyanna in an okay manner.
The only thing that could have made this all make sense ( including the weirdass powers) was if they had shot necrom instead of phoenix. Necrom fits all those weird descriptions.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 20, 2012, 12:42:12 am
10 years from now we'll find out this was all the result of Sentryboy Prime punching reality too hard.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Snakebyte on December 20, 2012, 12:45:12 am
Yeah, see, us sane people over here, we ignore the parts written by Jeph Loeb.
We don't know who the hell this Nova was, or if his testimony was legitimate, or if his narration was reliable. Also, Jeph Loeb.
Quote
"The Phoenix will revive mutanthood ! -But the Phoenix will destroy all life on Earth ! -Screw you !"
No, it was 'we don't believe you'. Cyclops was written like that because it was the culmination of years of character development by Gillen.
But Snake, they had a specialist, Wolverine, wolverine lived in the same mansion with at least two of the hosts, and neither of them blew the fuck up and tried to eat the moon! Even assuming that wolverine suddenly got retarded, you still have all the other x-men that could have talked about it, even cyclops word should have been enough for cap to have accepted it instead of coming at them with a shipload of avengers, everything was rushed and nonsense filled in those actions. Shit even xavier should have stopped everything and gone like "calm down you fuckheads, we been at least through three of those before the last planet blew up."
All the characters become walking stereotypes, the only thing that saves Colossus interpretation is that gillen wrapped up his story with illyanna in an okay manner.
The only thing that could have made this all make sense ( including the weirdass powers) was if they had shot necrom instead of phoenix. Necrom fits all those weird descriptions.
Wolverine's defining characteristics are his love for Jean, how broken he was by having to be the one that killed her, and how he tries to preserve the innocence of the random pieces of jailbait, Hope in this instance, who he becomes attached to. He just formed his own school so that children would be protected from war. Now, THE child, is going to pushed into something she isn't ready for that may destroy her.
Yes, Wolverine is going to fight this.
Clusterfucks happen when tempers run hot. Of course it was rushed and ridiculous; Cyclops was fighting for his species, Cap was fighting for the world, the last time they interacted it didn't go well at all and both are the authority figures in their respective spheres, and only people. If wars could be stopped by 'people talking', we wouldn't have wars. After a while it just becomes inevitable. This isn't bad writing, this is reflecting life.
Everything here was in character.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on December 20, 2012, 12:46:31 am
Shit even xavier should have stopped everything and gone like "calm down you fuckheads, we been at least through three of those before the last planet blew up."
If he had, the writers wouldn't have been able to make Cyclops the new bad guy, because he would have actually been right. But they wanted him to be wrong, so they made it so that the Phoenix was officially bad.
That story was shit from the beginning, but in that story, Cyclops was still wrong, and the Phoenix was still bad. The very point was that Cyclops was destined to be the bad guy, since earlier storylines as Snake said.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Snakebyte on December 20, 2012, 12:47:38 am
Shit even xavier should have stopped everything and gone like "calm down you fuckheads, we been at least through three of those before the last planet blew up."
If he had, the writers wouldn't have been able to make Cyclops the new bad guy, because he would have actually been right. But they wanted him to be wrong, so they made it so that the Phoenix was officially bad.
That story was shit from the beginning, but in that story, Cyclops was still wrong, and the Phoenix was still bad.
It's like you didn't even read the book.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on December 20, 2012, 12:50:01 am
It wasn't what was "going to happen" it's what they thought was going to happen.
No, it's what the writers declared WOULD happen. Did you miss Nova blazing through half the universe to warn them that the Phoenix was going to destroy them ? It was actually written like that. "The Phoenix will revive mutanthood ! -But the Phoenix will destroy all life on Earth ! -Screw you !" This is the only thing Cyclops ever said, and that makes him the new Magneto, because he was written like that. Nothing ever contradicted Nova's announcement. It was canonically true, because it was written like that. You keep saying it wouldn't have happened, but the writers wanted it to be the canonical truth, so yes, it was going to happen. Ergo, Stark & co were right, and Cyclops was wrong. Because it was written like that. Cyclops was written so that he would be the new Magneto. He was written to be the bad guy.
Quote
You seem to try to attack me more than just respond to what I was saying.
You keep bringing the same shit up over and again everyone anyone mentions it.
No it wasn't at all. He mentioned the phoenix was coming there was never any real indication that it would destroy the planet other than nova's ASSUMPTION. Every other time it came it didn't destroy the planet. It was even controlled completely by cyclops daughter rachel for years.
Cyclops knew more about the phoenix than any of the others did and none of the X-men were buying the phoenix destroying the planet bullshit because that's all it was, bullshit. he was right. the end of the damn crossover proved it. Hope brought back all the mutants when the phoenix was finally given to her and she let it go. She was meant to have it. that was his whole god damn point.
And I keep bringing it up because it's fact why he went "Dark phoenix" They pushed him into it.
I don't think you get the concept of the story at all. because you totally aren't getting the fact cyclops was right in knowing hope was supposed to have the phoenix and she was meant to be the messiah.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 20, 2012, 12:52:20 am
Every other time it came it didn't destroy the planet.
That's the problem, you keep thinking it's supposed to be in line with the previous stories, that's why you assume that the description of the Phoenix given at the very beginning was a mistake from Cap, Nova and everyone.
It's not in line with the previous stories. It's why it's a retcon. If you throw away all previous knowledge of the phoenix (exactly as the writers did) then that description is the one given by the writers, and it says "phoenix = bad".
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Snakebyte on December 20, 2012, 12:55:28 am
neocide said:
Cyclops knew more about the phoenix than any of the others did and none of the X-men were buying the phoenix destroying the planet bullshit because that's all it was, bullshit. he was right. the end of the damn crossover proved it. Hope brought back all the mutants when the phoenix was finally given to her and she let it go. She was meant to have it. that was his whole god damn point.
This. Cyclops was right.
Quote
Waid wrote that. :P
but regardless, I don't see why one pretty crucial part of the narrative can just be glossed over and ignored. :-\
What? What are you talking about? I'm talking about the stupid AR thing with Nova that barely anyone read. Loeb wrote that. Where did Waid have anything to do with AVX?
Wow, wtf, you're right. Was Waid on DRUGS?!
Quote
That's the problem, you keep thinking it's supposed to be in line with the previous stories, that's why you assume that the description of the Phoenix given at the very beginning was a mistake from Cap, Nova and everyone.
It's not in line with the previous stories. It's why it's a retcon. If you throw away all previous knowledge of the phoenix (exactly as the writers did) then that description is the one given by the writers, and it says "phoenix = bad".
No, it's not a retcon. Every part of the story leads to this being the case. You have no reason to believe it's a retcon.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 20, 2012, 12:57:31 am
Other than the very beginning of it all, the plot hook, Word of God, said the phoenix would do so and so. It's badly written because, yes, Cap and Stark say "it will destroy Earth" out of nowhere without any indication of that. It's badly written because Wolverine should know the Phoenix and should know they are wrong. But this was handwaved, because it's what the author wanted, and that makes it a retcon which says that the phoenix is bad. Up until now, there was no reason to say the phoenix would kill everything. And suddenly, word of god says it will kill everything. That's a retcon.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Snakebyte on December 20, 2012, 01:00:28 am
No, the plot hook was a new Nova crashing to earth and saying the phoenix would do so and so, whom Cap and Stark believe.
Wolverine does think they're wrong, but is fighting to save Hope from Jean's fate.
Where is the handwaving?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 20, 2012, 01:01:47 am
Other than the very beginning of it all, the plot hook, Word of God, said the phoenix would do so and so. It's badly written because, yes, Cap and Stark say "it will destroy Earth" out of nowhere without any indication of that. It's badly written because Wolverine should know the Phoenix and should know they are wrong. But this was handwaved, because it's what the author wanted, and that makes it a retcon which says that the phoenix is bad. Up until now, there was no reason to say the phoenix would kill everything. And suddenly, word of god says it will kill everything. That's a retcon.
the word was unreliable, but it will likely not be adressed. So no its not a retcon. The only thing close to a retcon here is the added powers, reality manipulation on that scale didnt happen with the other phoenixes.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Snakebyte on December 20, 2012, 01:03:54 am
You felt it was scaled up from eating a star?
That honestly didn't even occur to me.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 20, 2012, 01:06:22 am
It ate life, it always ate life. creating matter, shifting reality, infusing powers, changing organic life? Yes it was extremely scaled, they were made into supermen. When phoenix ate a star it was the phoenix, not one of its hosts, and it was using as most of its power as it could. Here it was stupidly powerful in a way that no hosts ( even those that were extremely powerful by themselves) had ever done.
If rachel had ever been that powerful she would be doing more with it than punching galactus in the nose once.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on December 20, 2012, 01:10:53 am
Here are literally the first pages of issue 1 of AvX : -page 1 : alien planet, a kid and his father ; bright light -page 2 and 3 : holy shit single panel of a giant phoenix destroying everything -page 4 and 5 : a few wide panels of the phoenix with its flame covering the horizon of the same planet, presumably with the same results as above. We see the planet turning entirely red (previously mostly blue) in the last panel as the phoenix flies into space, as in, burning red.
The first thing we see of the phoenix in this storyline is destroying a planet. This isn't the perception of a character that probably doesn't know better. It literally shows us the phoenix destroying a planet just because it's in its path.
(also Cap & co didn't blindly listen to Nova, Nova didn't even get to speak to them ; they studied his state and figured Nova actually fought the phoenix before coming to Earth)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Snakebyte on December 20, 2012, 01:14:52 am
It ate life, it always ate life. creating matter, shifting reality, infusing powers, changing organic life? Yes it was extremely scaled, they were made into supermen. When phoenix ate a star it was the phoenix, not one of its hosts, and it was using as most of its power as it could. Here it was stupidly powerful in a way that no hosts ( even those that were extremely powerful by themselves) had ever done.
If rachel had ever been that powerful she would be doing more with it than punching galactus in the nose once.
I thought the entire point of the hosts was to restrain the Phoenix's power, and 'eating a star' wasn't directed or malicious, it just felt like eating a star. Where did you get the idea that that was the limit of its powers? It was just something it did casually, revelling in its power.
As for that other stuff? The Phoenix is 'fire and life incarnate'. It always has been. It's as much about creation as it is about destruction. Creating and changing life seems very, very par for the course to me.
But I freely admit this is my own interpretations.
DKDC: Yes, when you are a cosmic force, you have to be very careful to refrain from killing whatever's in your way. The Phoenix not looking where it was going is different from the Phoenix going on a killing spree, and it's easy to see how NovaSamCancerMan confused the two.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on December 20, 2012, 01:15:36 am
The story is full of inconsistencies. half way through the god damn story the avengers actually take the same god damn idea cyclops and the X-men initially had, and that was to give hope the phoenix. The phoenix wasn't evil it was writing wanda's wrong's when she used her hex magic shit to do "no more mutants"
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on December 20, 2012, 01:17:28 am
By the way, Wolverine didn't tell Cap & co that they were wrong. Issue 1, Wolverine says Jean tried to contain the phoenix, to kill it, to kill herself, and failed. That's the first panel where Wolverine appears in this story.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Snakebyte on December 20, 2012, 01:19:30 am
I don't think I said that he told them that they were wrong, just that he thought that they were wrong. I also never said anything about the first appearance.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on December 20, 2012, 01:21:22 am
He's saying Jean tried to stop the phoenix and had to kill herself. Why would she do that if the phoenix was good or even just "not a threat to all life on Earth".
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on December 20, 2012, 01:21:29 am
jean didn't kill herself to stop the phoenix, thats another blunder. She killed herself because she didn't want her friends to keep fighting to their deaths for her. The phoenix wasn't evil then either. the hellfire club had to manipulate her and she created this "dark phoenix" persona. she was never even called that. it was only the name of the damn arc.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on December 20, 2012, 01:22:31 am
You say blunder I say retcon. If you accept that this description is what the writers want to be the truth and not a mistake, then it was written to make the phoenix be bad.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 20, 2012, 01:24:47 am
if they had been incinerating countries and ressurecting people, I wouldnt have thought anything of it, thats what the phoenix supposedly does, hence life and fire and death.
But they were literally shifting reality around so much that they might as well be the bloody beyonder. Like I said, Go back to its previous hosts, none exhibited anything like that.
The whole event sounds very badly planned, cyclops wants to give the phoenix to hope => =>avengers refuse want to takeher off world => cyclops refuse, they try to take her by force =>avengers try to shoot the phoenix (great plan there, guys , really ) =>cyclops is now phoenix => cyclops save the world => hope runs away => avengers now antto give the phoenix to hope ( its cyclops fucking plan, the thing he still wants at this point ) => avengers bully scott around until he goes mental => arrest cyclops because he was possessed ( ! ) and went out of control, its his fault for... having ironman making him posessed.
It was very shoddy, the only saving grace is gillen.
You had first phoenix , you had jean phoenix, you had rachel phoenix, shit you even had (http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/6/61080/1169414-spider_man025_1__super.jpg) spider phoenix.
The dark phoenix happened once, it was the name of the fake jean that phoenix made to take her power. The same Jean that was controlled by outside forces to get depraed! That no one of the dozens involved recalls this is dumb
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on December 20, 2012, 01:26:07 am
it still wasn't bad from the get go or had "evil" in it until it was pushed. Even in AVX it was the same damn way.
retcon or no.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on December 20, 2012, 01:27:48 am
You guys just keep on fighting against what the authors themselves wrote. They write a bad guy, and you insist that they are wrong because they contradict previous stories, that the bad guy was actually the good guy. They are wrong because their story sucks and is badly written, but in that bad story, the bad guy is the bad guy, not the good guy.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on December 20, 2012, 01:31:40 am
They didn't write a bad guy. They wrote a good guy pushed into a corner and turned. what the hell were you reading?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 20, 2012, 01:32:45 am
I think you're both saying the same thing, just using different terms. :-\
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on December 20, 2012, 01:35:57 am
Quote
To some people, the things he did, the lengths that he went to, and the choices he made, make him villainous. In every case, he did them for the right reasons, as he saw them. It really depends upon whether you think those reasons were right and justified. At the end of the day, as he sort of says to Cap, he got as good an outcome as he could possibly have wanted. All he ever wanted to do was safeguard what remained of his people until the point came when this world-changing event happened, and the mutant race was reborn — and he did it. There were casualties along the way, and that's the tragedy, and that's the burden that he's going to carry going forward. Your viewpoint on Cyclops really depends on where you stand on the choices he made. I think at the very least, if he's not a heroic figure, he's a sympathetic figure, and I wouldn't necessarily even rule out that he's a heroic figure.
this is from the editor from AVX
I've always known that it always depends on your perspective of the story itself not on retcons and whatever else the writer wrote. I just don't believe the stuff on phoenix is true and it was proven in the end anyway.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on December 20, 2012, 01:46:25 am
You could say the same thing about Magneto. That's the biggest thing I don't like in this, he fought Magneto all this time telling him how wrong he was to make those choices, and now he's doing the exact same choices for the exact same reasons.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on December 20, 2012, 01:48:17 am
Hence why they are on the same team right now? and magneto isn't a villain right now either?
and no, he's not anti human he was trying to save his race from extinction not prop them up as the superior race so no it's not the same.
Also HE'S NOTHING LIKE MAGNETO.....HE'S WINNING!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on December 20, 2012, 01:50:53 am
Funny you say that because AvX Consequences has Magneto breaking Cyclops out of prison and the both of them starting their own gang which looks a lot like the old Brotherhood.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Snakebyte on December 20, 2012, 01:54:27 am
Magneto hasn't been a villain for a very long time. He fights for his people.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on December 20, 2012, 01:57:00 am
Funny you say that because AvX Consequences has Magneto breaking Cyclops out of prison and the both of them starting their own gang which looks a lot like the old Brotherhood.
how does it look like the old brotherhood? he opened a school and supports the X-men. He's just not taking shit from the humans anymore. He's not outright attacking them or declaring Humans inferior. And he only broke out after his cellmate was killed while the guards just stood and did jack shit.
He was trying to kill himself before that. he even egged wolverine into doing it. I don't see him as a clear cut hero. But he is in no way a villain at all.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 20, 2012, 02:00:35 am
Typical liberal mutie lover bullshit.
Adam and Eve not Adam and Flashburn!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Snakebyte on December 20, 2012, 02:11:13 am
This is not really on topic anymore but I really really want to punch people every time they refer to Namor as 'the first mutant' in-character, as it's so very very wrong.
En Sabah Nur, Selene, and Sinister, just to name a few, predate him. He was the 'first mutant' from an out-of-universe standpoint only, which should not ever be referenced in the comics!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on December 20, 2012, 02:13:01 am
sinister isn't even a mutant.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 20, 2012, 02:14:14 am
I believe they mean publically, he was the first mutant known to the public since his inclusion in the Invaders.
But then again they will probably change that one day so that wolverine, sabretooth and red hulk were the first invaders to be publically recognized, also they were under the supervision of Sam Alexanderson a brilliant young boy that had all the powers of superman, in fact being recognized by his codename, Blue Superman.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on December 20, 2012, 02:32:17 am
wolverine already started the X-men before Xavier did now. THANKS JEPH LOEB!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 20, 2012, 02:49:09 am
Speaking of Jeph Loeb I got my hands on some spoilers of his upcoming "History of the Marvel Universe" limited series which was just announced today:
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Quote
Wolverine founded the lab that held the demonstration that irradiates the spider that bites Peter Parker
Wolverine drove the truck carrying the radioactive waste that blinded young Matt Murdock
Wolverine told Rick Jones that the gamma bomb testing site was "a cool place to hang out"
Wolverine cried only once in his entire life, when he met a young terminal cancer patient named Alexander Samuels
Wolverine helped develop the super soldier formula and was behind the decision to test it on Steve Rogers
Wolverine once posed as a sea captain named Leonard McKenzie, in order to "sleep with hot mermaids", and fathered Namor
Wolverine secretly messed with the Human Torch's construction, introducing a flaw that made him catch on fire when exposed to oxygen
Wolverine founded the USSR to provoke an American scientist to build his own rocket to "beat the Commies into space" and develop super powers from cosmic rays
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on December 20, 2012, 02:54:59 am
you forgot the ones for ghost rider and the rest of the c listers :p
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Snakebyte on December 20, 2012, 02:56:26 am
Sorry Jmorphman I don't buy it, there's not enough Sam. :(
Unless... Wolverine was Sam all along
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 20, 2012, 03:04:29 am
Speaking of Jeph Loeb I got my hands on some spoilers of his upcoming "History of the Marvel Universe" limited series which was just announced today:
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Quote
Wolverine founded the lab that held the demonstration that irradiates the spider that bites Peter Parker
Wolverine drove the truck carrying the radioactive waste that blinded young Matt Murdock
Wolverine told Rick Jones that the gamma bomb testing site was "a cool place to hang out"
Wolverine cried only once in his entire life, when he met a young terminal cancer patient named Alexander Samuels
Wolverine helped develop the super soldier formula and was behind the decision to test it on Steve Rogers
Wolverine once posed as a sea captain named Leonard McKenzie, in order to "sleep with hot mermaids", and fathered Namor
Wolverine secretly messed with the Human Torch's construction, introducing a flaw that made him catch on fire when exposed to oxygen
Wolverine founded the USSR to provoke an American scientist to build his own rocket to "beat the Commies into space" and develop super powers from cosmic rays
Gayness, unicorns, Xavier heads and black Cyclops.
Who cares about the mainstream series again?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on December 20, 2012, 08:17:42 pm
X-treme X-men is awesome as shit.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 23, 2012, 03:26:22 am
welp
this was an ad on a captain america book.
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
(http://i.imgur.com/OWcCG.jpg)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 23, 2012, 03:39:52 am
JESUS FUCKING CHRIST
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on December 23, 2012, 03:44:36 am
damn that kid is going to HATE Wednesday. Go Marvel editorial!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on December 23, 2012, 03:51:21 am
It's alright, leukemia will just live on as the Unrivaled RJ Ricci.
You're a mean one, Mr. Preach. You really are a heel.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on December 23, 2012, 04:12:53 am
I want to make a superior spiderman joke, but it might just be in bad taste.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 24, 2012, 01:57:33 pm
http://www.bleedingcool.com/2012/12/23/um/ bleeding cool posted that page with the justaposition of the new storyline, slott and others got offended and made the guy remove it. in his twitter slott ordered his fans to block bleeding cool until the offending article was removed
https://twitter.com/DanSlott
I am disappoint, there was no photoshopping involved in this, it was an ad that marvel ran,.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Mgbenz on December 24, 2012, 02:08:04 pm
What a douche.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 24, 2012, 05:39:46 pm
http://www.bleedingcool.com/2012/12/23/um/ bleeding cool posted that page with the justaposition of the new storyline, slott and others got offended and made the guy remove it. in his twitter slott ordered his fans to block bleeding cool until the offending article was removed
:|
that doesn't sound very Christmas-y fie on you Slott
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: RobotMonkeyHead on December 24, 2012, 09:55:47 pm
Dear lord Santa...
Title: The Amazing Spiderman Issue #700
Post by: xXMCGXx on December 28, 2012, 07:09:54 am
soo.... i just read this and i was shocked!! and i can say as a fan of spiderman, in my opinion i didn't like this turn... won (my personal favorite), i would like to know what you guys think... if you haven't read it do it... it's like WTF....
Title: Re: The Amazing Spiderman Issue #700
Post by: Xan on December 28, 2012, 07:14:03 am
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: xXMCGXx on December 28, 2012, 07:25:02 am
i actually didn't want to get into any spoilers.... :P just wating for everyone to be in the same page.... thanks by the way... i didn't see this topic.. :P
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 28, 2012, 07:31:02 am
It's not a big deal. :P
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 29, 2012, 12:53:19 am
(http://i.imgur.com/wAJs3.png)
(http://i.imgur.com/XKxyQ.jpg)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 30, 2012, 09:58:12 pm
https://twitter.com/JimMcCann
FUCK.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on December 30, 2012, 10:04:58 pm
Let's hope PAD gets more support than other comic writers who have fallen ill and received little to no help. :(
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on December 30, 2012, 10:29:05 pm
He cant move or see out of his right side, Fuck, this has ruined my day.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Basara Dandy on December 30, 2012, 11:45:39 pm
My bad, Peter is one of my favourite writers, that's terrible what happened to him, I hope he gets better :( I like his works, but more the ones outside Marvel (Young Justice in DC, SpyBoy in Dark Horse)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: LarsAlexandersson on December 31, 2012, 07:49:54 am
It seems Marvel's gone Crapcom all of the sudden.
VIA Crimson Chin's Quote: It was writer's fault!!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DONATELLO on January 04, 2013, 03:10:29 pm
the death of peter parker was bad in the ultimate universe. This one managed to be worse. i now have only one marvel comics that i buy every month it's xmen by bendis and immonem, but i may not continue if nothing of interest happens.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on January 04, 2013, 03:26:52 pm
Ultimate Spider-Man's death was at least decently built up, crossing over with the meta-series of the time, and he took out all of his enemies at once with him, so they really wrapped up everything to say, we're done, we're moving on now. At least there was an accomplishment, there was closure with it ; now the new USM as Miles Morales is just brought in as something completely new and not directly related unrelated, it's another Spider-Man. Peter's dead and you may not like it, but they wanted to move on, so they put him to sleep and left. The problem with this one here isn't his death in itself, it's how his arch-enemy just blatantly took his place and is now parading as him (the writer seems to think like it's still Peter Parker because it's still him you see, only with a different mindset), so it doesn't feel like closure but rather like a spit in the face of everything Parker has done to let him die like a dog in his worst enemy's body. USM Parker's death was completely different and at least acceptable and believable ; here, everyone can only be butthurt like hell about being shamed like that.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DONATELLO on January 04, 2013, 03:33:08 pm
i agree that bendis is the only writer that managed to give respect to peter these last few years. Dan slott has never understood how to write a good spiderman story, the only one i liked since brand new day was the american son by joe kelly
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Djoulz on January 05, 2013, 01:54:06 am
well, Peter Parker is not really dead now is he? you know they willl pull a Superman on him and bring him back eventually, they can't just kill one of the most beloved & iconic character...plus, his body is still here so it would be an easy fix: friend/heroe discovers Spiderman is in fact Doc Oc; some scientist uses a device to bring back Parker's mind (trapped in limbo in some parallel universe) & swap it; done
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on January 05, 2013, 01:58:47 am
his mind is likely still in the golden octobot.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on January 05, 2013, 02:03:04 am
Yeah, that's pretty much a given. I'm only talking about the intent behind these last few issues.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on January 05, 2013, 02:12:32 am
it looks and feels as if it was an arc that got stretched out to an all out event. The first avenging is pretty well written and interesting but the story would have gone out the same had peter still been in the lock out instead of dead.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on January 05, 2013, 03:31:06 am
What about the ickyness with him dating MJ?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on January 05, 2013, 03:34:19 am
it literally hasnt happened yet. He is getting all antsy about it, but the actual dating her part? Hasnt happened yet. He is already getting careless and talking as Ock , insulting people when talking to him.
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
im sort of expecting her to eventually lead him into the bedroom, tell him to wait while she changes into something more comfortable and then for her to come out wearing spider armor and taking him down. in the 700 issue there is a moment where she opens his shirt suddenly and is surprised to see the spiderman shirt under, I think she thought he was chameleon , so she suspects something is up
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on January 05, 2013, 03:38:07 am
im sort of expecting her to eventually lead him into the bedroom, tell him to wait while she changes into something more comfortable and then for her to come out wearing spider armor and taking him down. in the 700 issue there is a moment where she opens his shirt suddenly and is surprised to see the spiderman shirt under, I think she thought he was chameleon , so she suspects something is up
That would be pretty awesome.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DONATELLO on January 07, 2013, 11:22:55 am
just waiting for someone to release a mugen superior spiderman char
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Erroratu on January 07, 2013, 12:37:10 pm
One thing confuses me in the Avengers Arena.X-23 or whats her name is immortal like Wolverine.Unless they get her like arcade did in Deadpool kills the marvel universe she will keep coming back and kill all the others.Aint that a lil unfair?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: readytofight on January 07, 2013, 02:38:25 pm
life is unfair
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on January 07, 2013, 07:10:38 pm
just waiting for someone to release a mugen superior spiderman char
:wtf:
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: The Fisher King on January 07, 2013, 08:36:45 pm
I read that X-23 Healing factor is even better, she even can recover lost limbs like an arm or something... geez
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Erroratu on January 07, 2013, 09:47:28 pm
yea.It was difficult for Deadpool to kill her off,but managed with the help of Arcade,when she was put in the machine that will kill her with electrical power,and everytime she starts healing,the machine does it again. I think she died at the end or something.
Quote
Not really.
'course, this was when Wolverine's healing factor was still reasonable, but this would still kill him, even today
Well the only Marvel comics i read were Marvel zombies,Deadpool kills the marvel universe and the first issue of Punisher kills marvel universe so i might not know everything. Over here the most famous comics are Bonelli's ones(Dylan Dog,Zagor,Nathan Never etc.) and that manga Akira.Marvel is pretty rare,and theres almost no DC
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on January 07, 2013, 10:24:20 pm
Wolverine, and by extension all healers, were at first reasonable. Wolverine premise was that if something didnt kill him right away, he would heal eventually.
Read eventually and realize he would spend weeks in bed after a bar fight, he needed protein and rest to heal. Remember that in Age of apocalypse that wolverine was minus one hand after cyclops tore it off.
Deadpool was supposed to have an advanced version of that grafted to him artificially, so deadpool was pretty fucking hard to kill, as long as his torso was together he could grow out limbs again. Deadpool whole immortality thing was tongue in cheek, in his origin he fell in love with death while being tortured ( as they grafted the powers ) and now wants to go on dates again, the person that keeps him from dying? Thanos.
Then suddenly wolverine got ultra popular and his healing factor become straight up ridiculous. It went to the point where he ressurected from that same type of killing ( the sentinel blast kind) , at that point someone in editorial went "WAIT UP A FUCKING MINUTE" and they quickly come upw ith a bullshit story about why it had worked then and why it wouldnt work ever again. ( he had been cursed with anti death ghosties!!! )
Posted: January 07, 2013, 10:28:19 pm oh, then loeb happened, and ever since wolverine has been a clusterfuck of dead sons and brothers, and strange speeches where he talks about the death of his son and how much it touched him, even if his son later come back to life (he literally says that , he complains about the pain he felt and how it didnt matter he was after all , not dead )
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Basara Dandy on January 07, 2013, 11:22:49 pm
If you talk about someone "immortal" about healing factor, that would be Deadpool. Wolverine has the healing factor developed, but if the damage is too much to his body, he probably can't go back to life (as Jmorphman shows in "Days to the Future Past", when Wolverine was practically melted because of Sentinel's beam). But until now there's no other death to be enough to kill Logan as in that story...
In the case of Deadpool, his healing factor is too much developed, even more than Logan, but that's the reason why his skin and (especially) brain got severely damaged. Some examples I know: -The Punisher kills Marvel Universe: Deadpool is the only "zombie" that cannot be killed by him, Frank killed hundred of times and even he dismembered him and threw the parts far away... and Wade just rearmed after that once again -Cable & Deadpool: when he got exposed to Façade Virus (all human become blue) experiemented the secondary effects become butter literally (melting), then he fusioned with Cable and then he was threw up after healing Nathan's Technovirus going back to normal
well, Peter Parker is not really dead now is he? you know they willl pull a Superman on him and bring him back eventually, they can't just kill one of the most beloved & iconic character...plus, his body is still here so it would be an easy fix: friend/heroe discovers Spiderman is in fact Doc Oc; some scientist uses a device to bring back Parker's mind (trapped in limbo in some parallel universe) & swap it; done
After seeing the comeback of Steve Rogers, I say this would gonna happens, eventually -_-
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bastard Walt on January 07, 2013, 11:23:59 pm
desarrollated = developed
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on January 07, 2013, 11:35:46 pm
best way to kill wolverine is to drown him. Can't heal lungs full of water! I think wolverine even mentioned spiderman could kill him if he actually tried.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on January 08, 2013, 12:22:17 am
If you talk about someone "immortal" about healing factor, that would be Deadpool. Wolverine has the healing factor developed, but if the damage is too much to his body, he probably can't go back to life (as Jmorphman shows in "Days to the Future Past", when Wolverine was practically melted because of Sentinel's beam). But until now there's no other death to be enough to kill Logan as in that story...
In the Civil War event, in Wolverine's standalone series, there was a point where there was literally nothing but the adamantium left on him, and we saw that he was actually going to land of the dead or whatever it was I don't remember, and was denied entry / pushed away by the ones there or something (don't remember the details either), and was simply coming back each time. He says something like one day he'll be allowed to stay at last, and he will.
best way to kill wolverine is to drown him. Can't heal lungs full of water! I think wolverine even mentioned spiderman could kill him if he actually tried.
But they can get empty afterward, and he'll then be alive again. It's more "locked away attached to a large boulder and dropped at the bottom of the ocean and left there forever" than actually killing for good, it's not so much "dead" as it is "fate worse than death". Like those two immortal villains in JoJo (Cars launched in space who "just stopped thinking after a while" and same with that other guy locked at the bottom of some ocean). You can just say it would be the same if you dropped him into a volcano, technically he just won't ever go out of it to heal, but if he did he would revive.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on January 08, 2013, 01:33:19 am
are you sure they'd empty if he's kept under long enough for them not to be filled with water? I don't know if that would work. Also I remember reading in Greg Pak's Astonishing run Cyclops threatening howlett (the gold clawed wolverine and imo the best version of the character) by blasting an optic blast into his nostril. lol
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on January 08, 2013, 01:37:11 am
Worse case scenario about water filled lungs IMO is, he doesn't revive too soon, he rots, his lungs decompose, and bam, he regenerates and there's no water in them so he lives :P
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on January 08, 2013, 01:39:15 am
that depends if his brain doesn't rot either or it's filled to the point it cuts off his healing factor. That;s a big IF though lol
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on January 08, 2013, 01:49:33 am
Wolverine can be killed by drowning. Jason Aaron (re)established it in his run in a (probably futile) attempt to scale back the ridiculousness of his healing factor and even had Wolverine kill a bunch of guys with the same healing factor that way. Also, they got rid of the stupid 'spiritual battle with death' thing they used to explain away him surviving what amounted to a nuclear explosion so no one would be able to write something so asinine again.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on January 08, 2013, 01:50:36 am
His brain's been turned to charcoal more than once along with the rest of all his flesh and organs, destroying his brain means nothing. There's always his bones under the adamantium.
@Speed, "got rid" ? How ?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on January 08, 2013, 01:55:54 am
I don't think his brain's ever been damaged. his skull has always kept it from being damaged. nothing goes through it. If it has then that is beyond stupid as fuck.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on January 08, 2013, 02:02:16 am
He's survived at least one nuke-like blast (that I know of, and I know very little) and the skull isn't completely sealed off, so there's no reason to think the brain was intact after it. The adamantium does completely wrap around his bones, but with the heat they must have been cremated inside it (and that goes for the brain too either way, any sufficient heat will melt it away). I'd only go with that if they actually said once that "the brain was never damaged, that's why". That's stupid because that's just not possible, but I'd accept it as the reason if they said it.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on January 08, 2013, 02:08:26 am
Okay, so basically, the reason Wolverine survived that is because somewhere around World War I he fought the angel of Death in a duel and won, so he basically couldn't die (COMICS!). I forget exactly what happened but he had to cash that favor in to heal some damage to his soul, so if something like that happens again there's no coming back.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on January 08, 2013, 02:10:55 am
So, has he been thrown in a volcano or in the flames of hell, something that would have melted his brain inside his skull, and come back from that ?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on January 08, 2013, 02:14:58 am
Not since they did that story, so the assumption is he wouldn't make it since his healing factor's been shown as being weaker than it was at that time.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on January 08, 2013, 04:18:32 am
That nuke level blast was from Nitro, right? Wasn't there an explanation that Wolverine was on the same power-enhancing pills that Nitro was using or was that just a desperate attempt at justifying a stupid scene?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Djoulz on January 08, 2013, 04:51:50 am
how much heat does it take to melt adamantium anyway? if regular human scientists could provide the necessary heat to melt and process that kind of tough metal, i'm sure a mutant nuke-like blast should be enough to melt it: then what happens? Wolverine can't put the melted adamantium back as it was, mixed with the melted flesh/bones too...it doesn't make a fucking lot of sense.
but ye Comics, don't look for reasonable explanations!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on January 08, 2013, 06:40:02 am
Adamantium is an alloy, and when you mix the component metals together you only have 8 minutes to shape it and whatever before it stops being malleable, even if you keep it heated high enough to remain a liquid. (Wouldn't that just mean it solidified? Comic book science is confusing)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Malikai on January 08, 2013, 06:46:56 am
Once adamatium hardens it becomes indestructible and cannot be remolded unless through molecular manipulation.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DONATELLO on January 08, 2013, 08:04:52 am
you guys forgot the rules:
"(no filthy muties allowed)"
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Basara Dandy on January 08, 2013, 08:52:35 pm
In the Civil War event, in Wolverine's standalone series, there was a point where there was literally nothing but the adamantium left on him, and we saw that he was actually going to land of the dead or whatever it was I don't remember, and was denied entry / pushed away by the ones there or something (don't remember the details either), and was simply coming back each time. He says something like one day he'll be allowed to stay at last, and he will.
Wow, I didn't know that, always I thought Wolverine never got the chance to ever get there, good to know now. And about that, you remind me a moment where Logan almost died, too. In Fatal Attractions when Magneto ripped all adamantium from his body, he almost didn't survived, it was thanks to Professor X and Jean Grey that he could live again
And that happened after Onslaught saga I guess, when Logan became one of Apocalype's riders and he got back the adamantium to his body
If you can manipulate the molecular structure of stuff, adamantium is no different from any other metal. It isn't mentioned how exactly Wolverine gets the adamantium from Sabretooth's skeleton rebonded to his own, but molecular rearrangement is really the only way it could've happened.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on January 09, 2013, 09:40:39 pm
Now this is a superior Spider-Man. (http://imgur.com/gallery/6hvbn) (http://i.imgur.com/OxFFO.jpg)
Friendly Neighborhood Spider-Man was underrated, and too often ignored. While JMS was busy giving Peter talons and spider-totems and whatever, Peter David was cranking out entertaining Spidey stories that actually used the shit JMS introduced and then promptly forgot about.
and don't forget to buy some of his stuff to help out with his recovery! (http://www.peterdavid.net/2013/01/04/here-is-how-you-can-help-peter/)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on January 09, 2013, 09:53:56 pm
I read Superior spiderman today and I have to admit. I liked it. I see the endgame in this.
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
It's definitely not permanent that Otto is going to stay in peters body, the end of the first issue gives us a little insight with seeing what seems to be peter's psyche still inside, but not in control. (I thought it was iceman at first)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: xXMCGXx on January 10, 2013, 03:38:54 am
he's now getting kicked out of the avengers... i'll give him a year... tops...
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on January 16, 2013, 10:25:20 pm
Brian Wood's doing an X-Men series? (http://www.usatoday.com/story/life/2013/01/14/brian-wood-marvel-comics-x-men-comic-book-series/1830971/) With mohawk Storm? And Sublime is back? Sounds awesome!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Basara Dandy on January 16, 2013, 10:56:28 pm
And Jubilee!! Don't forget Jubilee :D (oh the Jim Lee & Animated Series times)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on January 27, 2013, 12:59:37 am
superior spidermon preview
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
(http://i.imgur.com/5uIhobL.jpg)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on January 27, 2013, 04:15:55 am
No amount of Community references will make this any less stupid! >:[
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Basara Dandy on January 28, 2013, 04:41:28 am
Peter the Friendly Ghost
Now I remember why I stopped to read recentt Marvel stuff :_blank:
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Mgbenz on February 15, 2013, 02:16:46 pm
The New York Times has just announced (http://artsbeat.blogs.nytimes.com/2013/03/21/marvels-age-of-ultron-features-controversial-angel/) that very famous comic book writer Neil Gaiman is returning to Marvel, and that's not even the weird part. The weird part is that he's bringing Angela, a character he created for Todd McFarlane's Spawn over at Image Comics with him... for some reason.
She — and Gaiman — will be part of the final issue of Age of Ultron, which Gaiman will co-write with Brian Michael Bendis and which Angela will somehow guest-star in; then she will appear in Guardians of the Galaxy #5, which Gaiman will also co-write with Bendis.
Honestly, Gaiman's jumped ship to Marvel before, so that's not a particularly big deal. And Gaiman won the rights to Angela after he settled with Todd McFarlane last year, since Gaiman created the character, so that's technically not a surprise either except for why Marvel would even want the character. Here are the big deals:
• How is this going to affect the Sandman prequel Gaiman was supposed to publish with DC this fall?
• Since Marvel got the Marvelman/Miracleman rights back, does this mean Gaiman will get another chance to write the character he so loves?
• How the hell are they going to explain how Angela ends up in the Marvel U.?
• And, most importantly, why even bother? Seriously
Age of Ultron concludes in June, so maybe we'll get a few answers then.
wat
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Basara Dandy on March 21, 2013, 10:55:07 pm
Wait... Gaiman was part of Spawn on Image?? he created Angela and now he wants her on Marvel?? he's making Sandman prequel for DC??
Excuse me, I've to go to the bathroom now, my brain is gonna explode...
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on March 29, 2013, 05:07:51 am
I don't know if any of you are reading Uncanny Avengers, but the current issue has gotten X-fans in a uproar over havok denouncing the word "mutant" shit just got real o_o
the said panel that people are pissed about :
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
(http://i.imgur.com/7QkINQx.jpg)
And rick remender's response to people asking about it
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
(http://i.imgur.com/e9aSOVf.png)
he's basically denying diversity, and claiming it as a bad thing. Like labeling yourself black,gay,asian,indian etc is a bad thing and we all should just be "humans" instead of understanding that diversity is a good thing and equality is what everyone wants. Not everyone being the same.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on April 10, 2013, 07:16:13 am
Yeah, the whole "don't use the m-word", is pretty freaking weird, and sounds really uncomfortable if you change it to any other minority. Which is a big problem for mutants, I think, since their whole deal is to stand in for minorities.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on April 10, 2013, 10:12:22 am
Don't call them niggers, call them Black. Or African-American.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on April 10, 2013, 10:23:58 am
hes captain america house Mugga. Wolverine kept freaking all the normies so they got a more pc Mugga.
Too bad that he was once overlord Mutate at the genosha Island working for the government.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on April 10, 2013, 10:10:17 pm
Don't call them niggers, call them Black. Or African-American.
But "mutant" isn't a pejorative. It never has been. The closest thing to one is "mutie".
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on April 10, 2013, 10:39:19 pm
Apparently they're making a storyline where, to them, it is, like saying that a kid has mental retardation isn't really pejorative, it's a medical condition, but it's still seen pretty badly. I dunno, I'm not shocked. It makes sense since they've always all wanted to be recognized as just regular people only with powers, and every time their mutation was pointed out, things went down the crapper. It seems logical to me that they'd go with something like that.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on April 10, 2013, 10:42:56 pm
I think they just should've retconned in a mutant pejorative or something, as it is now it just seems nonsensical to me.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on April 10, 2013, 10:50:00 pm
I got the message, but the wording was horrible.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on April 10, 2013, 11:11:16 pm
I think they just should've retconned in a mutant pejorative or something, as it is now it just seems nonsensical to me.
Its mutie, also freak. They were used a lot during the morrison runs by the hate preaching people.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on April 10, 2013, 11:12:40 pm
I already mentioned mutie. I just don't feel like it's strong enough.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on April 10, 2013, 11:25:58 pm
I can remember a few.
Mutants used "flatscans" to refer to mutants. There was Mutates that was how genosha soldiers referred to all mutants. Genefreaks. hmmm.. Oh, Once Guido Carosella went on live tv saying that mutant was a non pc term and they preferred to be called GEECEES, genetically challenged. To which Havoc said he was shaming his own kind and should stop being a fuckhead.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on April 10, 2013, 11:28:13 pm
I don't remember, was there ever an explanation behind that? It was a Morrision added, maybe referring to the whole "human race will die out in a few generations" thing he introduced?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on April 10, 2013, 11:33:12 pm
he was talking about mutant though, mutant can be equivalent to black or gay or any race or diversifying name. It's never been primarily used as a hateful word. It was more like "hey it's a mutant" and everyone would be scared. I see where that was coming from, but thinking diversity is not good rubs the wrong way when you're in such a gray area to begin with on said subject.
also no, Jmm. flatscans is older than that it's been around since forever, cortez said it all the time, as well as magneto. Human's don't show up on the cerebro like systems when looking up mutants hence the term flatscan.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on April 10, 2013, 11:35:13 pm
I think its older than that, it was a reference to Mutant scans used by genosha and sentinels. They used the word "Flatscan" when they were checking someone and they had no powers. I think the acolytes also used the term, Im pretty sure quicksilver used it to describe his daughter, luna.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on April 10, 2013, 11:38:31 pm
I could've sworn it was him. It sounded Morrisony! >:[
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on April 11, 2013, 04:13:55 am
That term's strictly Claremont. Fabian Cortez coined it circa X-Men 1.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on April 30, 2013, 06:15:36 pm
Marvel is dropping the ax on X-Factor (http://bloody-disgusting.com/news/3230935/marvel-cancels-x-factor/).
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on April 30, 2013, 07:47:05 pm
son of a bitch .\/.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on May 01, 2013, 04:32:30 am
Let's hear it from the man himself. (http://marvel.com/videos/watch/2723/c2e2_2013_peter_david)
Sidenote: he's looking pretty healthy
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on May 03, 2013, 05:48:11 am
So, I decided to check out Superior Spider Man #9.
Spoiler: WELL(click to see content)
Ock decides he's had enough of Peter so he decides to wipe him completely from his brain. Peter won't go down with out a fight though, so they have a battle in Pete/Ock's head to decide who stays.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on May 03, 2013, 05:54:31 am
i thought it was pretty good, I want to see where they go with it. I keep thinking that this should be an arch instead of a new book, its just dumb to pretend that hes there forever.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on May 03, 2013, 06:06:01 am
TBH, It's only in Superior that I hate this whole thing. In Avenging Spider-Man he's written pretty good.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Uche_of_MFG on May 08, 2013, 03:34:22 am
Besides the face that Marvel NOW is probably going to lose some of its fans in place for new ones, some of these books are awesome! I can't wait for these to appear in libraries near me (that is possible the best way for me to check these books out).
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bastard Wolf on May 16, 2013, 05:15:07 am
i'm just going to leave this here... (https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10151401840587344.1073741858.58690437343&type=1)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on May 16, 2013, 11:22:51 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/ciuzcyT.png) fraction slowly making the marvel universe more of the type of stuff that this is
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on May 17, 2013, 05:23:17 am
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
I thought it was funny
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Edtion on May 22, 2013, 10:21:10 am
The Avengers: Earth's Mightiest Heroes is replaced with Avengers Assemble To my understanding, A:EMH happened but they're not directly connected.
I'm really looking forward to this, it looks like the animated movies, and I so love those (most of them anyway)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on May 22, 2013, 10:50:45 am
the first pilots are up and they are so static that they look like cutouts
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on May 30, 2013, 07:27:39 am
New X-Men book by Brian Wood is fantastic. The cast is awesome,the villain feels interesting, the arc has been setup And the plot is progressing nicely.
I love All New X-men And Uncanny X-men Right now, but the pace is either extremely slow(UXM) or non existent(ANXM) X-men has started with a great pace, and already wood has been using characters powers in a unique way (He had psylocke use her psy powers as a bow, something I kinda wanted to do if I ever made psylocke in mugen). Every character is used pretty great. Kitty feels like Kitty. Storm feels like Storm. While Cyclops is my favorite X-men period,but after him is basically everyone on this cast, the females in X-men have always been more interesting than their male counterparts.
Anyway, pick up X-men. It's going to be good.
I'm tired of every few months some big crossover that shakes up the status quo. We Just got over AvX not too long ago, and Age of Ultron is going on. Although it's almost over, it's pretty bleh.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on June 14, 2013, 11:54:05 am
The ragnarok has restarted, the bulwinter has come and will erase everyone from earth.
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
The Iceman has started the ragnarok and soon him and Thor will do battle for supremacy, as Bobby tries to engulf the world into never ending winterr
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on June 14, 2013, 08:27:34 pm
Let's just pretend that there's actually some idiot around here that doesn't know what any of that is about :impressed:.
Through a series of unfortunate events (yearly comic book ones to be exact), 16 young characters of varying popularity that Marvel don't really know what to do with have been forced to fight to the death. Yadda yadda yadda, Oh no Mettle yadda yadda yadda videogaems yadda yadda yadda why so out of character, everyone yadda yadda yadda
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Chase became the new Darkhawk and killed Nico because mind control but Nico was able to cast the last spell "Help" so here comes Princess Powerful to save the day, I guess
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: SNT on July 01, 2013, 04:29:49 am
I hope Shogo wins.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on July 04, 2013, 09:45:19 pm
urgh
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on July 04, 2013, 09:47:41 pm
I heard joe kelly was writing.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on July 04, 2013, 09:50:12 pm
I mean the voice, it's more irritating than usual.
(I don't mind DP when he's actually funny, but damn is he getting as overblown as Wolverine)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on July 04, 2013, 10:05:22 pm
thats the beauty of options, you get to pick and choose what you want to see him in. And deadpool has been everywhere for a while now. This isn't all that new. Most of marvels cash cows are usually whored out all over the company.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on July 04, 2013, 10:09:17 pm
i think its the same voice he has had since mvc3, if anything he is making it creepier by the end of the sentences, which sounds good .
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on July 04, 2013, 11:35:25 pm
No it's not. Did some searching and it turns out it's Will Friedle who's voicing him. Hence the Batman reference in the vid.
(also North has voiced Pool since Hulk VS)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Edtion on July 06, 2013, 10:55:47 am
His voice is too high-pitched.
Spoiler: I don't like Ultimate Spider-Man anymore(click to see content)
I don't really know what people complain about when they talk about Drake as Spider-Man, aside from maybe thinking about "Drake" instead of "Peter/Spider-Man", since he voice sounds close enough to what I think of when I imagine his voice. But Deadpool? No ways, that voice was purposely picked to express that this Deadpool is suppose to be annoying.
I was kind of on-board with Ultimate Spider-Man under the basis that "okay, it's designed for children so it's not going to be my favorite but it'll be okay", but now I dread to watch any of the episodes and am starting to like The Super Hero Squad Show more. Hell, I like Teen Titans GO! more than Ultimate Spider-Man now and I don't even really like the show. Batman: The Brave and The Bold was designed for children/a younger audience and it was great.
The only reason I'll ever really want to watch any more Ultimate Spider-Man episodes is if I run out of other things to watch (or have watched too many) and I REALLY want to watch Spider-Man animated and don't want to watch any of the older shows (Which were sooooo much better).
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on July 10, 2013, 07:30:21 pm
Miss Peter Parker? Well you'll get him back in a new weekly flashback series instead of a full return. (http://www.bleedingcool.com/2013/07/10/peter-parker-spider-man-to-be-a-weekly-series-in-october-and-all-flashback/)
Because, you know, who want's Parker back when we can have a badly written Spider Ock instead (seriously, just read Avenging if you like him, saves you the trouble).
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on July 11, 2013, 11:59:59 am
he's okay, he's not peter, but he's not MEANT to be peter. That costume I like, only because I liked ben rielly's spiderman suit, and this looks awfully lot like it. peter won't be gone for too long though. 2013 is half over already, I'm sure he'll be back in time for the movie in 2014.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Duos on July 11, 2013, 12:03:28 pm
To me there are two versions of mainstream Deadpool: Funny Deadpool and Annoying Deadpool. Not that either are mutually exclusive, but you can tell when he's meant to make you laugh and when he's meant to get on your nerves. I think Eric Matthews makes a pretty good annoying Deadpool, but I wouldn't want him to be the official voice.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on July 11, 2013, 12:38:50 pm
To me there are two versions of mainstream Deadpool: Funny Deadpool and Annoying Deadpool. Not that either are mutually exclusive, but you can tell when he's meant to make you laugh and when he's meant to get on your nerves. I think Eric Matthews makes a pretty good annoying Deadpool, but I wouldn't want him to be the official voice.
technically you are right and there are two versions ( in the comics ) they are usually called Waypool and deadpool by fans. Originally the character, while funny, was meant as an anti hero, he was creepy, the cartoon at least made a good reference to that, he tries to make jokes but they come across as creepy . Waypool is the meme deadpool, the one that instead of joking about being a porcupine because he has a bunch of spears on him starts saying leeroy jenkins and then calls a lolcopter to get him out of there, Daniel Way was put in charge of deadpool once he become "famous" and the first thing he did was add two narration boxes ( originally there was only one used for deadpool narrating himself ) where one of the narration box is a straight man to deadpool zany yellow boxes. He used the straightman box to explain the jokes, this was a murder on his characterization.
This cartoon used old deadpool, even if its pg and doesnt even touch on the cancer, its the kind of disturbed Deadpool that kept a kidnapped blind woman as his butler.
sorry about the nerd rant
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on August 17, 2013, 05:57:09 pm
So yeah, Ultimate Marvel might come to an end and Miles Morales is heading to the main universe. (http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/JoshWildingNewsAndReviews/news/?a=85480)
Not sure how I'd feel about that if it becomes a permanent thing.....
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on August 17, 2013, 08:12:33 pm
If you mean Miles, it'll be better than Superior Spiderman. In fact it should be good if Miles replaces him - although apparently there's something named "Spider Hero" coming up which is most likely Miles' new name, and not Spiderman.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on August 17, 2013, 08:47:21 pm
I'd like it if they used Miles as a way to bring Peter back instead of outright replacement.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on August 18, 2013, 07:49:37 am
That would be cool, but I'd like Peter's return to be as free from outside interference as possible. He's got to be the one to toss Otto out of his own body or this whole arc is a wash.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on August 18, 2013, 08:41:26 am
So yeah, Ultimate Marvel might come to an end and Miles Morales is heading to the main universe. (http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/JoshWildingNewsAndReviews/news/?a=85480)
The Ultimate universe was slowly rotting before Loeb arrived and killed it. Might as well close it all down.
Well, besides Miles. Ultimate Spidey has been the diamond in the rough after Ultimatum.
That would be cool, but I'd like Peter's return to be as free from outside interference as possible. He's got to be the one to toss Otto out of his own body or this whole arc is a wash.
Otto himself bringing Peter back could work pretty well, I think.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on August 18, 2013, 10:42:42 am
Otto himself bringing Peter back could work pretty well, I think.
As a heroic sacrifice, maybe...
I feel the more heroic the return, the better it is. Like when Cap came back and punched the Red Skull in the face super hard or when Superman got his powers back just in time to stop Lex Luthor's robot walkers. A bad resurrection can leave a character aimless for years, like Jean Grey (speaking of X-Men resurrections, I hope Jason Aaron doesn't drop the ball bringing my favorite one back to life...)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: readytofight on August 19, 2013, 02:03:01 pm
the more i read marvel books, the more i'm disappointed. sigh!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on September 12, 2013, 07:26:59 pm
Marvel Comics Solicitations for December show that Scarlet Spider is ending. (http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=47860)
Now to go back to not caring about the Spider books.
Title: Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe: Avengers sequel due in 2015
Post by: S.D. on October 23, 2013, 03:48:58 pm
Title: Re: Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe: Avengers sequel due in 2015
Post by: Djoulz on October 24, 2013, 05:42:50 am
Quote
In the anime, portable capturing devices known as "Disks" were developed to capture evil villains. However, thanks to Loki's machinations, both villains and heroes are sealed up in these Disks and scattered around the world. Amid the chaos, five youths obtained the power to restore these Disks-sealed heroes through a program called "Biocode." These youths received five Disks that Spider-Man, who narrowly escaped being sealed himself, retrieved. Thus, these five can restore Iron Man, Captain America, Thor, Hulk, and Wasp — the Avengers!
it's like an Apple ad spoof: "with iTunes for Marvel, you can now restore your favorite heroes to their original factory settings!"
wtf is going on lol
Title: Re: Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe: Avengers sequel due in 2015
Post by: SNT on October 24, 2013, 07:12:08 am
"with iTunes for Marvel, you can now restore your favorite heroes to their original factory settings!"
Hey, Superior Spiderman could use this.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Segatron on October 25, 2013, 03:04:30 pm
So Loki traps avengers in some disks and now like Bagugon and Digimon few kids will use those disk.... Ridiculos Loki gets to be normal while rest of the universe in disc forms. Now Lets See Spidey the only hero & Loki gets to be only villain surviving and I am wondering when will Otto appear as spidey in the future plus The Story looks Ridiculous almost as the two shows I mentioned.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on November 06, 2013, 02:46:56 am
Shape Shifting Teenage Muslim new Ms Marvel (http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=48940)
Quote
“Captain Marvel represents an ideal that Kamala pines for," Wilson is quoted. "She's strong, beautiful and doesn't have any of the baggage of being Pakistani and 'different.'"
The "Ms. Marvel" team is quoted as expecting the book to receive some negative reaction from multiple sides. "I do expect some negativity," Amanat said in the article. "Not only from people who are anti-Muslim, but people who are Muslim and might want the character portrayed in a particular light."
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Nero D. on November 06, 2013, 02:57:09 am
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
lmd de-comfirmed
coulson definitely (obviously) died but he was brought back, death wound and all
but maybe he's...something more
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on November 06, 2013, 08:53:14 am
Wait why did you post this here and also post in the actual MCU thread? :???: Posted: November 06, 2013, 08:56:35 am
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
also I don't think LMD is totally ruled out, though personally I don't think it's the actual answer as to how Coulson came back
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: [DKG] on November 07, 2013, 06:45:31 am
Been a while since I heard anything about this, actually I forgot this existed
Shape Shifting Teenage Muslim new Ms Marvel (http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=48940)
Quote
“Captain Marvel represents an ideal that Kamala pines for," Wilson is quoted. "She's strong, beautiful and doesn't have any of the baggage of being Pakistani and 'different.'"
The "Ms. Marvel" team is quoted as expecting the book to receive some negative reaction from multiple sides. "I do expect some negativity," Amanat said in the article. "Not only from people who are anti-Muslim, but people who are Muslim and might want the character portrayed in a particular light."
Doing a DC move I see, kinda strange that there haven't been many more muslim heroes or villains yet.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on November 07, 2013, 04:14:49 pm
Doing a DC move I see, kinda strange that there haven't been many more muslim heroes or villains yet.
DC move, as in a legacy character? Marvel's had those before, though obviously not to the degree that DC does, nor is it as fundamentally built into the universe as DC's either.
Until new 52 happened because fuck you DC
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on November 07, 2013, 04:17:18 pm
The introduction of Baz as a Green Lantern in N52DCU turned out decent after a while - although I haven't kept up with DC in several months.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: SNT on November 07, 2013, 09:56:21 pm
Cable and X-Force and Uncanny X-Force are getting consolidated into one book, called X-Force. Four man team is Cable, Psylocke, Fantomex and Marrow.
(http://i.imgur.com/97SN6Lg.jpg)
Sort of worried Spiral's gonna fall off the wagon right after finally coming back.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Mgbenz on November 07, 2013, 10:04:16 pm
So I take it that Colossus is going back to the X-Men and bringing along Domino with him? I really like the two as a pair. They're pretty amusing together.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bastard Walt on November 07, 2013, 10:14:44 pm
Cable's got that MGS4 Solid Eye going on.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Titiln on November 09, 2013, 04:47:46 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/z6zmrGB.png) (https://twitter.com/ConanOBrien/status/398978862542901248) how can you even consider making a joke like that in 2013 where outrage reigns supreme
Title: Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe: Avengers sequel due in 2015
Post by: Djoulz on November 09, 2013, 06:58:39 pm
Marvel Comics is set to launch "All-New Ghost Rider" for All-New Marvel NOW! in 2014, courtesy of writer Felipe Smith and artist Tradd Moore. In addition to writing "All-New Ghost Rider," Smith -- an accomplished artist of Japanese manga -- will also illustrate a variant cover for the first issue, which the publisher has provided exclusively to CBR alongside Moore's standard cover for the first issue.
Our All-New Ghost Rider, as the title suggests, is an absolutely new character: Robbie Reyes. Robbie's an East Los Angeles high school senior with a short fuse and a passion for electronic music and absolutely anything powered by an engine," Smith told CBR News in October. "In comparison to previous Ghost Riders, he's young and inexperienced in life; but his harsh inner city upbringing, overall distrust for most people, and serious contempt for his violent surroundings make him the perfect host for a Spirit of Vengeance."
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: MDI on January 13, 2014, 03:06:13 am
So I just finished reading all 1-24 of Superior Spider Man in one sitting. AHHH. Who else is keeping up with the series, looking forward to 25 and Parker's return?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Prototype God on January 13, 2014, 03:31:25 am
I still like avenging spider man, but superior was really meh too me, and i dropped it a while ago. (especially with the whole Parker ghost thing, felt unnecessary and stupid.) Superior kinda reminds me of a bad fan fic for some reason. Parker's my fav super hero, so definitely waiting for him to come back eventually.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: MDI on January 13, 2014, 03:37:38 am
You know they totally removed the Parker ghost very early on. After that it was just Otto and his legion of Spider-bots and soldiers at his command, along with his personal life trying to go back to college and be in a relationship with that midget girl. I really enjoyed him treating Mary Jane like shit though. "NOT NOW WOMAN!" It really hasn't been bad.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on January 13, 2014, 08:24:09 am
Eh. I dropped it after a while, I'm just gonna wait for Peter to come back. Till then I'm just gonna follow whatever Kaine is doing and wonder why he isn't the Superior Spider Man.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on January 13, 2014, 01:08:56 pm
because he's not even the superior clone?
He's book is over, I think he's going to be in limbo for a while. And as much as I wasn't a fan of Spock, he is pretty awesome. I think he might not be dismissed so quickly after petey comes back.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: SNT on February 03, 2014, 01:46:57 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/ka12dng.jpg)
Apparently this is who will become Mrs Deadpool. http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=50553
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Quote
Shiklah is a new character. What can you tell us about her and what inspired her creation? Is she a vampire in the traditional Marvel Universe understanding of the word?
She's actually not. She's a classic succubus; the monsters that would fly in windows and drain men of their vitality and so forth. We put a couple of twists on her and Reilly Brown did a really wonderful job with a couple of different drawings. I don't want to spoil a surprise, but there is more to her than meets the eye. You'll see a different side to her as the story progresses.
She comes from a long line of monsters. She's monster royalty and she was hidden away for a long time and forgotten about. The reasons for that will be revealed. Dracula wants to marry her to unite the monster underworld and receive her family's fortune and lands. So he's behaving like the classic monarch.
Stop me if you've heard this before. (http://i.imgur.com/9EyPefE.png)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on February 15, 2014, 01:17:18 am
This was rumored for a while but I guess the Fantastic Four's cast is finally confirmed. Eh...it actually seems like it is somewhat final. I'm going to be the first person to not go into detail of why Michael B Jordan as the Human Torch is retarded (don't get me wrong, I think it is but lets not go into detail..) but I will say that Miles Teller as Mr.Fantastic is a terrible idea. The only film I've seen him in was that really shitty teenage party version of the Hangover where they're trying to find some asian kid named Jeff Chang. Don't feel like looking it up. Anyway, this dude has severe acne scars and sounds exactly like Jonah Hill. Not trying to be mean, but his face is really unpleasant to look at in HD and his voice is just painful.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on February 20, 2014, 08:08:51 am
Teller was in The Spectacular Now and that seems to be pretty well regarded and I recall hearing good things about his performance.
... but that's not important because he's too goddamn young, Christ almighty young Reed Richards is such a stupid fucking idea it sucked in the Ultimate universe and it will suck here, and everyone else besides Johnny is too goddamn young this is supposed to be a goddamn family metaphor and if everyone is playing a teenager what's the fucking point. Oh and if you're gonna cast Michael B. Jordan as Johnny (and why wouldn't you he's so good!) don't pussy out and cast a white lady as Sue because god forbid the Fantastic Four be 1/2 black you stupid pricks
Seriously fuck Fox I want Galactus in an MCU movie .\/.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: MDI on February 20, 2014, 08:15:03 am
I would very much like to see an important character that is black in the comics be played by a white actor in a FOX Marvel film. Then when people bitch about that I would gladly be one of the people to come along and ask why THAT is considered racist.
And the sad thing is, Rise of The Silver Surfer was...OK. They at least got his character done pretty damn well. I don't have to mention Galactus. But I do agree that he would be very well fit for the MCU.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on February 20, 2014, 08:16:22 am
Because white people ain't grossly underrepresented in comics and movies.
Like, duh, c'mon.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: MDI on February 20, 2014, 08:22:15 am
Oh jeez
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on February 20, 2014, 08:24:04 am
At least we still have The Incredibles, the best Fantastic Four movie ever made.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bastard Mami on February 20, 2014, 04:59:21 pm
Because white people ain't grossly underrepresented in comics and movies.
Like, duh, c'mon.
but who many people are black percent wise in the usa (where most of the comics and movies happen)?
let's say black are 20% of the population and we have a movie with a group of 5 characters and one of them is black, then we get people copmlaining because it got "one token black character" instead of you know, being statistically accurate.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on February 20, 2014, 05:04:54 pm
Wait, are you actually discussing for less representation and variety of people in media?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: GOH on February 20, 2014, 05:07:58 pm
#lessblacks #hollywood #yeswecan
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Nomechy on February 20, 2014, 05:08:21 pm
Yeah, I don't think that population numbers are the correct way to go when we think about who deserve representation in comics.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bastard Mami on February 21, 2014, 04:35:12 pm
comics wise, I think they don't even reach those so technically we are discussing more representation in comics and thus comics adaptations.teh fantastic 4 from the movies are all white , they should have had one black character going by that, so it's more representation. also one more female, because it's 50/50 there.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bea on February 21, 2014, 07:51:52 pm
And... they cast a twig to play Ben Grimm. First a twig playing Wonder Woman, now a twig playing Ben Grimm. This is just grand.
Also, given that I have a pair of cousins that are blood siblings and don't have the same skin colour in my family, I see no problem whatsoever with having a black Johnny Storm and a white Susan Storm.
But then again, word out there is that Invisible Woman it is Susan "Sue" Smith and not Susan "Sue" Storm (http://entertainment.time.com/2014/02/20/fantastic-four-kate-mara-michael-jordan-cast/), because, you know... we got to make it worse than it already is.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on February 22, 2014, 02:44:20 am
I'm going to assume that's just a typo, but it's wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if that's the way they went with it.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on February 23, 2014, 10:23:27 pm
I remember hearing Jordan's casting was all due to nepotism.
I'm not at all excited for this cast but then again I wasn't really gunning with hype over a movie that was guaranteed to be a screw up anyway.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on February 23, 2014, 11:26:25 pm
Nepotism is for relatives, Jordan's casting is more like Scorsese putting De Niro in all of his films. Until he was replaced by Dicaprio.
But then again, word out there is that Invisible Woman it is Susan "Sue" Smith and not Susan "Sue" Storm (http://entertainment.time.com/2014/02/20/fantastic-four-kate-mara-michael-jordan-cast/), because, you know... we got to make it worse than it already is.
Jesus fucking Christ, do they understand the point of the Fantastic Four at all?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bea on February 23, 2014, 11:32:02 pm
But then again, word out there is that Invisible Woman it is Susan "Sue" Smith and not Susan "Sue" Storm (http://entertainment.time.com/2014/02/20/fantastic-four-kate-mara-michael-jordan-cast/), because, you know... we got to make it worse than it already is.
Jesus fucking Christ, do they understand the point of the Fantastic Four at all?
I'd reckon that they understand the point of the Fantastic Four as much as Zack Snyder understand the point of Superman.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on February 23, 2014, 11:34:48 pm
Well I guess to be slightly fair to Fox (not that they deserve it!), Marvel itself sometimes doesn't understand Fantastic Four; see Ultimate Fantastic Four (well I guess Mike Carey's run was pretty cool, and his Ultimate Thanos was neat, but still, the very foundation was rotten)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on March 08, 2014, 02:42:45 am
Moon Knight's debut was really interesting, though I can't help but feel like this new, quirky persona he has is kind of stealing Fantomex's steez, and the new costume doesn't help.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on March 31, 2014, 07:24:09 pm
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Hey Peter's back. Just in time for his new movie.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bastard Wolf on April 01, 2014, 12:53:24 am
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on April 01, 2014, 12:55:48 am
http://mugenguild.com/forum/msg.1933723 you are missing the rest. go check them.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on April 01, 2014, 02:27:54 am
Yeah, get lamestream Ultron the fuck out of this thread.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on April 18, 2014, 03:00:46 am
So Superior is finally over. There was a huge revelation relating to the 2099 universe that kind of makes it canon, I guess? Osborn pulled a Chameleon and fooled everyone. Whatever.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: [DKG] on April 21, 2014, 01:36:52 pm
So I saw Amazing Spider-man 2 and it was ok...they even did the
Spoiler: I Stress. Spoilers, don't blame me if you click this(click to see content)
Gwen falling from the bridge and Peter teying to web shoot and save her only to kill her, they didnt do the neck snap thing though, I think that would've been to violent for the kiddies. So I guess next movie will have MJ, I hope Shalaine Woodley comes back to play her. Also lol at Rhino only being at the end of the movie.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bastard Walt on April 21, 2014, 04:13:12 pm
There's a thread for movies sir.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on April 28, 2014, 07:53:34 pm
AKA something that will last for a bit while they keep telling us he's gone for good but due to popularity he'll be back.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on April 28, 2014, 07:55:21 pm
Yeah, just like last time when they introduced his blond son or whatever.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bastard Walt on April 28, 2014, 08:59:54 pm
If they do it right, I'd be down with that. That guy has seen too much action. An emotional farewell with reminiscence of all the violence he's been part of would do well as a reason for him to rest.
Somehow the way the article describes it, it feels like a movie I've already seen elsewhere ... but still that fuzzy memory of mine is a pleasant one. I hope they do right by Wolvie's death, an event that we can all remember on a positive light
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bea on April 28, 2014, 09:24:10 pm
If they do it well like it was done on Death of Superman, I am pretty okay with that. We all know he will come back in the future, but a good death story can be fondly remembered years after it happened.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Edtion on May 01, 2014, 01:33:05 am
If they do it well like it was done on Death of Superman, I am pretty okay with that. We all know he will come back in the future, but a good death story can be fondly remembered years after it happened.
Not according to Max Landis (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0PlwDbSYicM)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Just No Point on May 01, 2014, 05:00:28 am
That video was great! And I remember when SuperMan died and I saw the 4 new supermen and I was like "Who are these guys?!" then all of a sudden SuperMan was back.
Somehow back then I thought when Supes was killed he was split into 4 new characters and they were able to merge him back together or something. I don't remember how I came to that conclusion or if I was told that or what.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on May 01, 2014, 05:05:34 am
I agree that Death and Return of Superman is pretty much not very good, but Max Landis is totally wrong, Superman is not a dull character!
... he does say that, right? I saw that video awhile ago but I don't wanna see it again because HE'S WRONG ABOUT SUPERMAN but it was pretty funny
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on May 01, 2014, 05:12:14 am
That video was great! And I remember when SuperMan died and I saw the 4 new supermen and I was like "Who are these guys?!" then all of a sudden SuperMan was back.
Somehow back then I thought when Supes was killed he was split into 4 new characters and they were able to merge him back together or something. I don't remember how I came to that conclusion or if I was told that or what.
Why are you capitalizing 'Man' that way? That's not how Superman's name is supposed to be typed so stop doing that.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Just No Point on May 01, 2014, 05:21:58 am
You're not the boss of me! MMMMMMMMMMMMMMAAAAaaaannnnnnnnnnnn
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: SNT on May 01, 2014, 06:59:06 pm
AKA something that will last for a bit while they keep telling us he's gone for good but due to popularity he'll be back.
Galacta will steal the remains, restore his healing facfor and use the body to create the Planet Sniktbub on which she can comfortably feast for all eternity
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Edtion on May 03, 2014, 09:23:06 am
Somehow back then I thought when Supes was killed he was split into 4 new characters and they were able to merge him back together or something. I don't remember how I came to that conclusion or if I was told that or what.
Probably because Superman was spit into two guys (Superman Red/ Superman Blue) after absorbing too much sun radiation and containing too much power to sustain in one body or something like that; this happened in the early 2000's, unrelated to the previous story of a Superman Red from the silver age.
I agree that Death and Return of Superman is pretty much not very good, but Max Landis is totally wrong, Superman is not a dull character!
... he does say that, right? I saw that video awhile ago but I don't wanna see it again because HE'S WRONG ABOUT SUPERMAN but it was pretty funny
He said there's nothing special about Superman other than that he was the first superhero. His superpowers aren't that interesting anymore and there are so many other characters with his powers and other characters now with a more interesting powers, and also that he's overpowered with his only actual weakness being kryptonite (he didn't mention anything about indirect weaknesses such as magic/mental/sun/etc)
Basically he was saying superman isn't new or unique anymore as a character; he didn't say much if anything about the stories, which would leave his point mute since the only way an old character could combat that is if the character constantly changed into new characters.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Mgbenz on May 03, 2014, 02:59:58 pm
That video was great! And I remember when SuperMan died and I saw the 4 new supermen and I was like "Who are these guys?!" then all of a sudden SuperMan was back.
Somehow back then I thought when Supes was killed he was split into 4 new characters and they were able to merge him back together or something. I don't remember how I came to that conclusion or if I was told that or what.
At least that arc gave us Steel. Probably the only person who deserve the Superman legacy.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: [DKG] on May 08, 2014, 09:57:30 pm
Anyone else read the relaunch of the Ultimate Universe, specifically Miles Morales: Ultimate Spider-Man #1. Coz that last page... wtf...
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on May 08, 2014, 10:04:45 pm
what happened?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on May 08, 2014, 10:07:00 pm
Marvel has already pulled all Fantastic Four art down at their offices and is ordering artists to not draw the team or any of its associated characters on external projects. Plus, the team is not making an appearance on any of the company’s “75th Anniversary” project art, despite being the first Marvel superhero team and the foundation of modern comic book superheroes in general. And, of course, every ‘Fantastic Four’ Marvel comic is now rumored to be facing cancellation.
CBR cannot confirm the exact future of "Fantastic Four" and "Ultimate FF," but has confirmed with multiple industry sources speaking on the condition of anonymity that a hiatus for the property is planned, at least as of recently. Plans can change, something that's potentially more likely now that the situation has been made public. The Fantastic Four characters are said to continue appearing in other Marvel titles, just not in a specifically branded "Fantastic Four" series.
Also X-Men properties are safe because they're too popular.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on June 01, 2014, 07:08:46 am
There are rumors about this rumor that the decision was made by Marvel CEO and noted weirdo and also probably racist Isaac Perlmutter. (http://www.bleedingcool.com/2014/05/31/fantastic-four-skinned-comics-marvel-entertainment-fox/)
Also X-Men properties are safe because they're too popular.
A relative term, they're not doing anymore major crossovers unless the Avengers are involved, and creators are reportedly discouraged from creating any new IP for either FF or X-Men because Fox will gain instant access to it, for free.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: SNT on June 01, 2014, 07:50:07 am
they're not doing anymore major crossovers unless the Avengers are involved
What major Marvel crossovers DON'T involve the Avengers though?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on June 01, 2014, 07:54:59 am
Well, X-Men had stuff like Schism, Spider-Man has had stuff like Spider-Island, and so on and so forth. Now, Spider-Man has an upcoming event, and X-Men only has another Avengers co-event.
Boy I am sick of these fucking event comics.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: SNT on June 01, 2014, 08:10:54 am
Well, it's not really just Axis, there's 3 Months To Die in the pipe as well.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on June 01, 2014, 08:13:25 am
I guess that isn't technically classified as an event, it's more of a major story arc thingy? (I don't think anything has tie-ins to it or the like that the big events have)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: SNT on June 01, 2014, 08:16:57 am
Dude, it's Wolverine, he's in so many teams I heard he just applied for the Justice League. Take him out of the equation and lots of people in-universe are going to notice.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on June 01, 2014, 08:21:48 am
Regardless, I don't think they're designating it an official event along the same level as the others.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on June 02, 2014, 12:50:27 am
Please tell me that's not Nick Fury's head and that they're not moving out a character with like 60-70 years of history for Jackson Fury
LMD, probably. Hopefully.
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
they'll be back in a year or two anyway
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on June 06, 2014, 12:42:02 am
*breaks a chair* DAMNIT MARVEL!
*Walks away from the PC. Takes a breath, shows his wife, echoes his rage. Kisses, walks back to PC*
Ok, so- Logen is gunna die.......Again Jean Grey died...............Again 'White Fury' died............Again
And Ghost Rider is now, basicly the Green Lantern Corps- *Wife looks at DC thread, asks why a marvel character that looks like Pam Grir (http://www.imdb.com/media/rm2505213184/tt0071517) with a robotic arm*
Mavel is out of ideas my love.........Again
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on June 06, 2014, 12:44:21 am
your died list is missing aunt may,nightcrawler,cyclops,Xavier,Magneto,Cap America And probably a bunch more.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Nomechy on June 06, 2014, 12:55:56 am
That image of Powergirl proves what exactly? She's Superman with tits.
No, she's fun with a great sense of humor. Supergirl is Superman with tits (and insecurity). Power Girl is Superman with no complex, which is a good thing, to the point she's almost a deconstruction of Superman.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 15, 2014, 11:49:39 pm
Well said DKDC
Plus, the other characters I posted prove that they can "break out" and be more then a quick gimmick in the right hands.
Heck, most don't even know Zatanna's an offshoot because she's a fleshed out character. Hell, look what JLU did for HawkGirl.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on July 16, 2014, 12:15:31 am
Characterizations aside, all of those characters you listed are female versions of male characters (sans Zatanna).
Not even. I'd rank Power Girl with Harley Quinn (another character who I feel they've kept around because of cosplay/lamestream buzz) as one of the absolute worst DC characters. I'm glad they've pigeonholed her on Earth 2.
Power Girl has had some interesting stories, but I would say that it is more of a testament to that particular team's writing ability, that they can take a bad character and make them interesting. As a concept Power Girl is bad and only popular because of her costume. She was basically Supergirl with an identity crisis and borderline schizophrenia before they made her a self-parody, and then ultimately ditched her and put the former characterizations on a character who deserves them (the original Supergirl).
BTW: Supergirl is infinitely more interesting than Powergirl. Who actually reads World's Finest?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on July 16, 2014, 12:34:38 am
Zatanna is actually a derivative of a Golden Age hero named Zatara. Those were pretty much the worst examples one could pick. :-\
also this kinda happened before! (http://www.bleedingcool.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/07/EarthX_05_Cover.jpg) (http://www.tgfa.org/comics/thor/images/EarthX_SpEd_09.jpg)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 16, 2014, 01:45:09 am
Thor Odinson, God of thunder, royal heir to the throne of Asgard, protector of the realm of earth, has become King Thor RULER of Asgard at long last............ All Hail King Thor, God of thunder! :buttrox:
and now, the best idea they have is to turn him into a woman? You Frigging hacks! >:D
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on July 17, 2014, 05:02:36 am
He's not being turned into a woman; a woman is taking over his superheroic identity. This stuff happens all the time, and it's often great. And the creative team is fantastic, so... clearly hackwork. ::)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 17, 2014, 05:07:14 am
So here's the New Avengers Now. I freely admit I was wrong about being Angela; it's clearly some other new character destined to fall by the wayside.
I don't know why I just have no interest in these things any more. I think it's because there's a clear timetable now. Back in the day when something like Superior or Lady Thor or Captain Falcon happened it felt more like "Man I know this can't last forever but I'd love to see how far it can go!"
Now, I know exactly how far it can go: right up until the next movie. I feel like I've seen the Wizard and there's no going back.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on July 17, 2014, 05:46:55 pm
"Guy's we're challenging the status quo...YEAH!"
Then the sales and reactions hit and the movie comes out and everything goes back to square one.
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
I'm cool with Falcon being the new Cap to be honest
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on July 17, 2014, 06:33:26 pm
So Bucky fakes his death to go into seclusion only to then rejoin the Avengers? K.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 17, 2014, 11:07:07 pm
I'm trying to rage, I really am, I'm digging deep, but after all the $hit they've pulled, I honestly don't care, it's just so "meh" for the sake of being "meh".
Its uninspiring, lazy and wont last long...........Scarlet Witch looks good though.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on July 18, 2014, 01:24:06 am
I don't know why I just have no interest in these things any more. I think it's because there's a clear timetable now. Back in the day when something like Superior or Lady Thor or Captain Falcon happened it felt more like "Man I know this can't last forever but I'd love to see how far it can go!"
I don't know why I just have no interest in these things any more. I think it's because there's a clear timetable now. Back in the day when something like Superior or Lady Thor or Captain Falcon happened it felt more like "Man I know this can't last forever but I'd love to see how far it can go!"
Eh it's always been like that.
But it hasn't though! I can point you to one clear case where "all new, all different" actually meant something! But even beyond that, you think about stuff like Rhodey replacing Tony and Eric Masterson and Ben Reilly and Jean Paul Valley. Those were changes that anybody in their right mind knew weren't going to stick, but it hasn't been until recent times that you could say "This won't last past May".
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on July 18, 2014, 02:05:07 am
I dunno, having a specific time table for them now just doesn't bother me much.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: SNT on July 18, 2014, 02:52:00 am
I'm cool with Captain Falcon too. He shows his moves and doesn't afraid of anything.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Nero D. on July 18, 2014, 03:17:09 am
hmm, sam as cap, thats pretty cool
i actually wish they did more with isaah, but most people probably dont know who he is and would probably go "black cap wah wah"
if they really wanted to change falcon they coulda went back to "snap" wilson and made him a superhero this time around: think about it, a pimp superhero, the possibilities are absolutely endless and self-explanatory
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on July 18, 2014, 05:42:10 am
Isaiah Bradley is all old and has pretty severe dementia, though. There's his son Josiah X and Patriot, though.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on July 18, 2014, 06:10:55 am
‘Steve’s spirit is as willing as ever, but his body is no longer up to the task of being Captain America, so he'll employ his skills as the new Cap’s remote strategic adviser,’’ Brevoort said. ‘‘He'll also tutor Sam in how to throw the shield, a skill that’s deceptively difficult for the new Cap to master.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: SNT on July 18, 2014, 07:51:53 am
Well, it's begun. Old housemate of mine on Facebook is furious with FemThor because it's ruined her yaoi fanfics.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on July 18, 2014, 08:03:36 am
Regular Thor's still around! And now he's missing an arm and has a beard! (http://i.imgur.com/UOjDQzU.jpg)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: SNT on July 18, 2014, 08:09:24 am
Apparently the new Iron Man series is being written by Tom Taylor, dude behind the Injustice comics and fellow Melbournian. Good on you, mate.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 19, 2014, 12:11:51 am
Apparently the new Iron Man series is being written by Tom Taylor, dude behind the Injustice comics and fellow Melbournian. Good on you, mate.
Every time I see his name I get nervous because I think he's Tom Taylor pulling the "not a real person but actually a character from a book, transplanted to the real world" like the character also named Tom Taylor in the great Vertigo book The Unwritten (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Unwritten) is. So, like he's a doubly fictitious character who has crossed over first to the "real world" of comics and now has crossed over again to our world!
(guys I promise I'm not a shill for Vertigo)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Xhominid on July 19, 2014, 06:16:18 am
I thought we all liked the Rulks now that Jeph Loeb isn't writing them and really great writers are using them to do wacky fun shit?
wacky fun $hit........is still $hit-
Spoiler: Idea(click to see content)
It's Betty Banner/Ross again, killed off and brought back for what? the fourth time? Dose anyone even care about the 'oh, she's the only thing that can calm him blah blah blah' Beauty & The Beast shtick? No.
Play up the fact that Bruce Banner becoming the Hulk has destroyed her personal life, career and family. What is it like to see someone you love splashed all over the new, papers, internet, it's like being related to a guy who goes on a shooting rampage, and everyone knows who you are and that you're related, it would be hell. Every time something happens reporters are fallowing her around wanting interviews, her face splashed on "News Networks", random people recognizing her on the street, or worse assaulting her, because a loved one was injured or killed in a Hulk related incident. I mean come on, her father and ex/husband have been trying to kill each other for 50+ years.
The Hulk is first and foremost a Monster.
Kill her off via The Leader, Hulk goes off in a major city, S.H.I.E.L.D brings in Ross because of his experience, but gets in over his head (as always) after Thunderbolt Ross is killed at the hands of the Hulk, on live TV after millions of property damage, half the Avengers wreaked and hundreds dead via falling buildings. She is brought back by The Leader, and turned into this "Red Hulk girl", soon as Hulk is seen again, She is air dropped in and via jump jet, armed to the teeth an let loose, Hulk is instantly taken off guard because it's frigging 'Betty' with red skin and She-Hulk's build, her rage finally let loose all the stress, pain and emotional grief of just being associated with him brought to bare, beating the hell out of him with boiling tears in her eyes.
She-Hulk and Doc Samson show up and do battle with her while a bewildered Hulk looks on, Doc and Jen fight her and assume she's just some twisted clone, then the big reveal, it is in fact Betty, and she's doing this willingly, to "End This Nightmare", unable to defeat all three, she escapes via portal after a quick speech about how no treatment, breathing technique or medication has ever worked for long, and all they'll ever do is prolong the inevitable, before someone else dies, as the portal closes.
The Leader, sitting on a throne-like chair "A successful field test my dear" he says, standing, placing his hand on her tattered shoulder "Shut up" she says, smacking his hand away "I'm not one of those----things you grow like fungus , when I try this again, it'll be while he's still Bruce, he deserves to know and understand why this has to happen be before give I him peace", "Of course Miss Ross" a rumble shakes the floor "What was that, I thought you said this place was secure?" she asks, "Ah, he's arrived", says Leader "Who? what have you done?" she says backing away, balling up her fists "No need for theatrics Miss Ross" the thick, steel automatic door slides out of the way "I saw your scuffle Miss Ross, so I made a few calls, next time you'll have help" -
-Abomination steps out of the shadows.
Nah, lets just have her F*** the hulk in the open while an eye dude watches.........Classy Marvel
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on July 19, 2014, 06:38:27 am
Anyway, I haven't heard great things about Tom Taylor's work on Earth 2, so I'm a little cautious about him suddenly getting a major Marvel book.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on July 19, 2014, 06:46:51 am
I'm not getting anything from Vertigo, honest! And I'll prove it!:
Ever since Karen Berger left Vertigo has been a shell of its former self and most of the stuff that would have been done at Vertigo is now being done at Image because of Warner Bros's increasingly tyrannical cutbacks to creator rights and royalties! And although apparently it's a bit better in terms of the books being put out than it was two or so years ago it is still a shell of its former self!
It's Betty Banner/Ross again, killed off and brought back for what? the fourth time? Dose anyone even care about the 'oh, she's the only thing that can calm him blah blah blah' Beauty & The Beast shtick? No.
Play up the fact that Bruce Banner becoming the Hulk has destroyed her personal life, career and family. What is it like to see someone you love splashed all over the new, papers, internet, it's like being related to a guy who goes on a shooting rampage, and everyone knows who you are and that you're related, it would be hell. Every time something happens reporters are fallowing her around wanting interviews, her face splashed on "News Networks", random people recognizing her on the street, or worse assaulting her, because a loved one was injured or killed in a Hulk related incident. I mean come on, her father and ex/husband have been trying to kill each other for 50+ years.
The Hulk is first and foremost a Monster.
Kill her off via The Leader, Hulk goes off in a major city, S.H.I.E.L.D brings in Ross because of his experience, but gets in over his head (as always) after Thunderbolt Ross is killed at the hands of the Hulk, on live TV after millions of property damage, half the Avengers wreaked and hundreds dead via falling buildings. She is brought back by The Leader, and turned into this "Red Hulk girl", soon as Hulk is seen again, She is air dropped in and via jump jet, armed to the teeth an let loose, Hulk is instantly taken off guard because it's frigging 'Betty' with red skin and She-Hulk's build, her rage finally let loose all the stress, pain and emotional grief of just being associated with him brought to bare, beating the hell out of him with boiling tears in her eyes.
She-Hulk and Doc Samson show up and do battle with her while a bewildered Hulk looks on, Doc and Jen fight her and assume she's just some twisted clone, then the big reveal, it is in fact Betty, and she's doing this willingly, to "End This Nightmare", unable to defeat all three, she escapes via portal after a quick speech about how no treatment, breathing technique or medication has ever worked for long, and all they'll ever do is prolong the inevitable, before someone else dies, as the portal closes.
The Leader, sitting on a throne-like chair "A successful field test my dear" he says, standing, placing his hand on her tattered shoulder "Shut up" she says, smacking his hand away "I'm not one of those----things you grow like fungus , when I try this again, it'll be while he's still Bruce, he deserves to know and understand why this has to happen be before give I him peace", "Of course Miss Ross" a rumble shakes the floor "What was that, I thought you said this place was secure?" she asks, "Ah, he's arrived", says Leader "Who? what have you done?" she says backing away, balling up her fists "No need for theatrics Miss Ross" the thick, steel automatic door slides out of the way "I saw your scuffle Miss Ross, so I made a few calls, next time you'll have help" -
-Abomination steps out of the shadows.
... that sounds terrible. The same old same old of relentless grim 'n' grittiness and dourness that's sunk DC as of late. :-\
Marvel's been on a real creative renaissance of late, and it's because of its willingness to shake things up, try new things, and to actually try and lighten things up for their line of comics about people in spandex fighting other people in spandex.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 19, 2014, 06:50:28 am
Grim and gritty? Dude that's life man.
Edit: Don't get me wrong, New52 is bull$hit served on a gold plate, but accepting the natural progression to a storyline isn't a bad thing.
And what's this "people in spandex fighting other people in spandex" thing you keep coming back to?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on July 19, 2014, 06:59:36 am
Just trying to keep things in perspective. This isn't Watchmen or anything, this is a fundamentally optimistic and light universe. In real life, Peter Parker would probably die of radiation poisoning and Bruce Banner would be a smouldering pile of ash. Screw real life, this is comics!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on July 19, 2014, 06:59:46 am
Hmm, I just realized that with Iron Man having whatever the hell going on with his faaaace, Thor missing an arm and losing Mjolnir, and Captain Falcon, the only thing left to do is separate Banner and Hulk and then Hickman can get on to whatever he's got planned.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on July 19, 2014, 07:01:22 am
Wrong, this is storytelling, comics are simply another median to convey it.
If one of the very few things your story accomplishes/ is remembered for is a green guy and a red chick F**king because "dur-hur it's funny", you've failed to tell good story.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on July 19, 2014, 07:13:20 am
There is a time and a place for dourness. And it can be used well, even in superhero stuff (the aforementioned Watchmen). But the mainstream Marvel universe is not really the best place for it.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on July 19, 2014, 04:52:47 pm
It's Betty Banner/Ross again, killed off and brought back for what? the fourth time? Dose anyone even care about the 'oh, she's the only thing that can calm him blah blah blah' Beauty & The Beast shtick? No.
Play up the fact that Bruce Banner becoming the Hulk has destroyed her personal life, career and family. What is it like to see someone you love splashed all over the new, papers, internet, it's like being related to a guy who goes on a shooting rampage, and everyone knows who you are and that you're related, it would be hell. Every time something happens reporters are fallowing her around wanting interviews, her face splashed on "News Networks", random people recognizing her on the street, or worse assaulting her, because a loved one was injured or killed in a Hulk related incident. I mean come on, her father and ex/husband have been trying to kill each other for 50+ years.
The Hulk is first and foremost a Monster.
Kill her off via The Leader, Hulk goes off in a major city, S.H.I.E.L.D brings in Ross because of his experience, but gets in over his head (as always) after Thunderbolt Ross is killed at the hands of the Hulk, on live TV after millions of property damage, half the Avengers wreaked and hundreds dead via falling buildings. She is brought back by The Leader, and turned into this "Red Hulk girl", soon as Hulk is seen again, She is air dropped in and via jump jet, armed to the teeth an let loose, Hulk is instantly taken off guard because it's frigging 'Betty' with red skin and She-Hulk's build, her rage finally let loose all the stress, pain and emotional grief of just being associated with him brought to bare, beating the hell out of him with boiling tears in her eyes.
She-Hulk and Doc Samson show up and do battle with her while a bewildered Hulk looks on, Doc and Jen fight her and assume she's just some twisted clone, then the big reveal, it is in fact Betty, and she's doing this willingly, to "End This Nightmare", unable to defeat all three, she escapes via portal after a quick speech about how no treatment, breathing technique or medication has ever worked for long, and all they'll ever do is prolong the inevitable, before someone else dies, as the portal closes.
The Leader, sitting on a throne-like chair "A successful field test my dear" he says, standing, placing his hand on her tattered shoulder "Shut up" she says, smacking his hand away "I'm not one of those----things you grow like fungus , when I try this again, it'll be while he's still Bruce, he deserves to know and understand why this has to happen be before give I him peace", "Of course Miss Ross" a rumble shakes the floor "What was that, I thought you said this place was secure?" she asks, "Ah, he's arrived", says Leader "Who? what have you done?" she says backing away, balling up her fists "No need for theatrics Miss Ross" the thick, steel automatic door slides out of the way "I saw your scuffle Miss Ross, so I made a few calls, next time you'll have help" -
-Abomination steps out of the shadows.
Nah, lets just have her F*** the hulk in the open while an eye dude watches.........Classy Marvel
Mark Millar, that you?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Nomechy on July 19, 2014, 07:11:49 pm
Sky, your complainst about how stuff comics are doing is bad would be a bit easier to take seriously if your own ideas were not total rubbish.
Have any of you read the new Moon knight yet? Shit is great.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 19, 2014, 07:35:01 pm
(whether he can or not come up with better ideas and is or not willing to, doesn't make your scenario any less horrible / Man of Steel-like)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 19, 2014, 08:05:37 pm
Yes, because that actually trying leaves you open to criticism. How about elaborating on why it's so bad.
The fanboy mentality amazes me. People will throw cash away on bad storylines, acknowledge them as bad, then defend them.
Sheep
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on July 19, 2014, 08:11:12 pm
Personnal tragedy of being hounded by the press, "thousands of deads, millions in property damage", getting killed and coming back as the exact same thing just to show him how bad it is (becoming the devil to kill the devil) are all absolutely awful plot points. "You don't like my idea ? Then try and do something better" is also an absolute garbage "wounded ego" defense. You don't NEED to make better to dislike something.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on July 19, 2014, 08:17:02 pm
i dont see those storylines as being half that bad like red hulk was a terrible character writers that come after come and fixed the character suddenly he is fun to have comic book fans are expected to understand continuity and arcs they know that if an arc is not for them and they dont like it a future one might be a bad story doesnt erase a good story and in the end the only things that get to be canon are those that are cool enough that other cool writers keep referencing either to fix or to build upon which is pretty much how you can have so many x-men stories and not have them all be shit because xavier was in love with marvel girl in one of the first issues, that got thrown out because it was a dumb idea.
Betty Ross had been dead in the storyline where Peter David stopped writing hulk after over ten years writing him. It was a strong storyline and they didnt allow Peter to keep doing what he wanted so he left.
In the end of the same storyline it was shown that Thadeus Thunderbolt was saving her alive but infected so he could treat her. Many years later he shows up with a gamma transformation he applied to himself, red hulk, and he eventually uses it to cure his daughter. Which is pretty much what a good writer would do with "Thadeus now can apply gamma transformations to people that make them almost immortal", do it to his daughter.
all the gamma powered people are extremely different( which was part of why red hulk was so shitty of an idea) and this was like two years ago, she had plenty of growing space since.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 19, 2014, 08:20:37 pm
Let the high school dogpile begin!
I never said to do better, because I know by the defensive replies you can't........I asked what ideas you have.
Clearly none, plus, I came up with that in ten minutes, this is what they are paid to come up with, their career man and this is best they can do? Now that's rubbish.
Feel free to defend them anyway.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on July 19, 2014, 08:33:29 pm
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
So the recent issue of Avengers World. Rogers and Natasha have a son in the 'future'.
I found this strange because Black Widow is supposed to be Winter Soldier's girl. :(
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on July 19, 2014, 08:49:23 pm
Could be a Next Avengers homage, could be Avengers 2 spoilers.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on July 19, 2014, 08:56:33 pm
Who are you saying is defending what ? Not liking your suggestion doesn't mean defending anything else. So what the hell are you talking about ?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on July 23, 2014, 10:06:17 am
Nobody needs to come up with their own idea in order to criticize another. Otherwise the entire concept of criticism would not exist. Not everyone's a writer, but everyone can decide whether they think someone is bad or not. So remember when we were talking about how dude Thor and white Cap and I guess non-asshole Iron Man would be back to normal come the next Avengers movie?
Well Tom Brevoort is making $100 bets that they won't revert... before/when the movie comes out. (http://www.bleedingcool.com/2014/07/19/tom-brevoort-makes-100-bets-that-the-new-captain-america-and-thor-wont-revert-to-the-originals-by-the-release-of-avengers-age-of-ultron/) We all know they'll revert eventually. And while that's not exactly the strongest statement one could make that those characters wouldn't revert, it's at least nice to see they're aware of it. I guess? I dunno!
Betty Ross had been dead in the storyline where Peter David stopped writing hulk after over ten years writing him. It was a strong storyline and they didnt allow Peter to keep doing what he wanted so he left.
In the end of the same storyline it was shown that Thadeus Thunderbolt was saving her alive but infected so he could treat her.
Funnily enough, that part was not written by PAD at all, it was the writer who came after him. PAD certainly intended her to be dead for good. (http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/2013/02/02/the-abandoned-an-forsaked-death-is-not-the-end-the-death-of-the-hulks-wife-the-quickest-retcon-in-comic-history/)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 24, 2014, 01:32:31 am
Nobody needs to come up with their own idea in order to criticize another. Otherwise the entire concept of criticism would not exist.
Not true, the entire concept of criticism involves the opinion both for or against a work, he feels it's a bad storyline, that's fine, but he wouldn't feel that way if he didn't have his own train of thought on the matter, he/they/you simply refuse to elaborate on it. So long as there are opinions and differing personality's , there will be criticism, both reasonable and unreasonable.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Just No Point on July 24, 2014, 04:20:05 am
You can have absolutely no idea for how a story should or shouldn't work and still find it good or bad. You don't have to have a "better" idea to criticize stuff.
I make comics/stories and anyone can criticize my works without any justifications because that's how criticism works. Anyone that rebuttes with something along the lines of "can you make better?" Is a bad writer.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on July 24, 2014, 09:19:51 am
Byakko, Iced and I all gave fairly detailed reasons why we didn't like it. Everyone else basically did so as well, just very briefly. And that's really all one needs. Don't need to write a dissertation about it!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Nomechy on July 24, 2014, 05:40:51 pm
I guess I could have broken it down, but I would rather not waste the time since I don't actually get a lot of time on computers right now.
Jmorph explained it best imo.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 25, 2014, 02:58:48 am
You can have absolutely no idea for how a story should or shouldn't work and still find it good or bad. You don't have to have a "better" idea to criticize stuff.
I make comics/stories and anyone can criticize my works without any justifications because that's how criticism works. Anyone that rebuttes with something along the lines of "can you make better?" Is a bad writer.
Sense you put it that way, thank you very much for the complement :buttrox:
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Just No Point on July 25, 2014, 03:07:19 am
??? I don't think I complemented or offended...
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on July 25, 2014, 03:48:59 am
They're giving that name to Totally-Not-Lady Thor.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on July 25, 2014, 03:56:22 am
His name is Thor Odinson. So im guessing they are going with odinson just to make it easier for people.
I have no idea who the girl will be, maybe valkirye?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on July 25, 2014, 03:57:01 am
Thor's going through some very late teenage rebellion and refuses to go by his first name now, it's why he's no longer worthy. Just give him some space and he'll grow out of it.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on July 25, 2014, 03:58:25 am
She has a book, stepping her into thor role would be a downgrade. (http://x.annihil.us/u/prod/marvel/i/mg/a/10/53692c3fc8c7f/portrait_incredible.jpg)
And this is an upgrade? (http://i1-news.softpedia-static.com/images/news-700/Marvel-Announces-Black-Character-as-All-New-Captain-America-Falcon-Takes-Over.jpg)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on July 25, 2014, 04:40:02 am
Becoming Captain America, the literal symbol of America in superhero form is an upgrade, yes.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 25, 2014, 04:44:16 am
Good for him, how is it good for the character? Given they've done it before and it never worked out.
They can't force an idea that isn't going to work, it will hurt sales and once more they'll revert back to Steve. Which cheapens 'The Falcon' character.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on July 25, 2014, 04:46:22 am
It didn't cheapen Bucky when he took over; Steve Rogers can't do it right now, and someone needs to step up. Jim Wilson has more than proved he's able to wear the uniform.
I'm a real sucker for legacy characters or temporary replacements like these, when done well. They reveal so much about each character.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 25, 2014, 04:57:35 am
I'm a real sucker for legacy characters or temporary replacements like these, when done well. They reveal so much about each character.
Can't disagree with you there, however, more people should know about Elijah Bradley.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: trexrell44 on July 25, 2014, 05:13:38 am
Marvel has pretty much lost their minds on this one. It is an obvious attempt to add more diversity to big name characters. Usually woman and characters of color have smaller more insignificant roles. Falcon is the best example in the world, because he is pretty much the last black guy you pick to play on your team of black superheroes or superheroes in general. Adding more woman and more diverse people in the most well known roles is suppose to bring in new readers. At the end of the day it pisses of a bunch of the fans. I'll stick with my New Avengers with my main man Luke Cage(should of gave him the shield) leading a rather impressive group of woman and diverse heroes.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on July 25, 2014, 05:30:44 am
Captain America and Falcon are best buds and have worked together for years, why would it make more sense for Luke Cage to get the shield? :-\
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Nero D. on July 25, 2014, 05:41:10 am
because he's also black, but he's buffer than falcon, i guess, that's about the extent of it
Captain America and Falcon are best buds and have worked together for years
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on July 25, 2014, 05:48:15 am
I think it had more to do with the idea that Luke Cage is "cooler" than Falcon and less about what makes more sense story-wise. Although I am eager to see an kayfabe explanation of why Bucky isn't doing it again.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on July 25, 2014, 05:50:31 am
He's too busy taking over for another old guy from WWII who was kept young through a special serum but now has lost that vitality. He's gonna be shooting aliens in the head.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on July 25, 2014, 05:56:28 am
Oh god, I forgot that everything I know about Nick Fury is a lie even though the crux of the Nick Jr. storyline is that an old Nazi wants Nick Fury and Son's magic blood
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on July 25, 2014, 11:13:51 am
She has a book, stepping her into thor role would be a downgrade.
And this is an upgrade? http://i1-news.softpedia-static.com/images/news-700/Marvel-Announces-Black-Character-as-All-New-Captain-America-Falcon-Takes-Over.jpg
...as part of a storyline where cap aged and has to pick a quick replacement he can direct in battle, his best friend is the most obvious choice considering he has been captain america before.. how would that not be a replacement. He doesnt even have a book to call his own
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 25, 2014, 09:27:05 pm
Their races and relationship have nothing to do with military succession, what's wrong with John Walker? He was groomed for the roll by the military, it takes more then 'friendship is magic' to be Captain America.
Their races and relationship have nothing to do with military succession, what's wrong with John Walker? He was groomed for the roll by the military, it takes more then 'friendship is magic' to be Captain America.
(http://i.imgur.com/u7vxGqV.jpg) You want a disabled captain america that is also a racist and an extremist and tried to commit suicide last time he was made captain america, long before he lost both a leg and an arm?
Over someone that was captain america before and is still directly working with steve rogers and actually fits the story?
Why are you even pretending you know what this is about. If this is your idea of trolling its kindof bad.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 25, 2014, 10:15:07 pm
You want a disabled captain america that is also a racist and an extremist and tried to commit suicide last time he was made captain america, long before he lost both a leg and an arm?
Never heard of a redemption story eh?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Just No Point on July 25, 2014, 10:20:35 pm
C'mon Iced. This is comics! He can easily "he got better"!!!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Nomechy on July 25, 2014, 10:25:10 pm
Lady Thor's design is pretty ace so far.
And since Chris Samnee should get to draw more Thor stuff anyway. (http://33.media.tumblr.com/2af9f6fa4067d26b642715c742634061/tumblr_n92f0utnAU1t1xi2ao1_1280.jpg) TO VICTORY
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 25, 2014, 10:31:39 pm
Yes, I knew about his injuries, not so much about the racism though (really?) Seriously Iced, you wouldn't want to read a story about a guy like that fighting to be more then he is?
With how many BS "dead, alive, dead, alive" plotlines they've thrown out there, you really don't want to read about something meaningful, like a disabled vet inspired to pull himself together and be a frigging hero again? And who gives a damn about his arm and leg, half the marvel universe are missing limbs! There's a great story in here man.
I swear, it's like the zoo animal parable with you guys.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Nomechy on July 25, 2014, 10:37:14 pm
While that's fair enough, nothing really makes it automatically more interesting of a story to tell then Falcon taking up the spot of Cap after Steve loses his power. It's all about how it's gonna be told and that's still yet to see.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on July 25, 2014, 10:39:40 pm
It doesnt really matter, what matters is that the story rememnder is telling uses one of the old captain americas, that one specifically,t he one with the wings that goes "CAW CAW". and theres no reason to keep harping on and on about how it should have been another when the story was built with that .
At this point I think you are just trying to get on jm nerves by playing contrary to whatever he says =P Its coming to a point where you repeat the same post three to four times and get answered three or four times the same.
its no biggie, its falcon assuming a part he played before under direct supervision of Steve( which he didnt have last time). Shit even Cable was Cap America at one point, stop being afraid of the inclusion boogeyman and let shit play out. Walker coming out of the woodwork to replace cap when cap is directly having falcon do it would be odd as fuck.
Mighty avengers cover is out! (http://i.imgur.com/MWEpISx.jpg)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on July 25, 2014, 10:45:10 pm
like a disabled vet inspired to pull himself together and be a frigging hero again?
Flash Thompson / Agent Venom says hi.
THANK YOU
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on July 25, 2014, 10:48:35 pm
I don't really get why you're thanking me, seeing how I'm telling you that your suggestion is already done and to go see elsewhere if there's someone who cares.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on July 25, 2014, 10:51:09 pm
its no biggie, its falcon assuming a part he played before under direct supervision of Steve( which he didnt have last time). Shit even Cable was Cap America at one point, stop being afraid of the inclusion boogeyman and let shit play out. Walker coming out of the woodwork to replace cap when cap is directly having falcon do it would be odd as fuck.
Never happened.
Angela: Asgard's Assassin (http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=54271) was just announced at SDCC.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bastard Walt on July 25, 2014, 10:55:31 pm
Excuse me? Are we getting into the race thing yet again?
Bringing things up? I didnt say anything about bringing things up. I said you seemed to be playing contrarian.
(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_TEoH2Eg8LgA/TIZ1W25zkWI/AAAAAAAADb0/LPi3VTh0Y9I/s1600/mot+08-18-7b.jpg) Walker, who is one of my favorite characters, is doing fine for himself( ultimate cap america is pretty much him with less psychotic breaks) and has his own arc and story in thunderbolts . Who else do you want to bring up as an excuse why falcon shouldnt be cap?
I don't really get why you're thanking me, seeing how I'm telling you that your suggestion is already done
...meaning that you're helping to prove his point :P
Saying a storyline is already being done doesnt prove that a character should be made to repeat the same storyline while the other is going on. Thats like saying that if there is a arc where cyclops becomes magneto then quicksilver should be made to become magneto because the other one proves it can be done.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on July 25, 2014, 11:02:17 pm
I don't really get why you're thanking me, seeing how I'm telling you that your suggestion is already done
...meaning that you're helping to prove his point :P
I'm saying it doesn't NEED to be done specifically in Cap because it already exists somewhere else, and those who want to see that can read Venom instead of MAD at Captain Falcon. Because it really doesn't have anything to do with Cap or Falcon, and it doesn't forbid that other amputee from becoming his own hero under a different name, he doesn't need to become Cap.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 25, 2014, 11:09:27 pm
The term is "Underdog story", of course it's been told more then once, but different characters will react in their own way.
That's like saying you shouldn't want to see 'Warrior', because you've already seen Rocky.
The term is "Underdog story", of course it's been told more then once, but different characters will react in their own way.
That's like saying you shouldn't want to see 'Warrior', because you've already seen Rocky.
It doesn't explain why it HAS to be this amputee guy and it HAS to be the Captain America name. Let Falcon have it, let the amputee guy do something else on his own, and go read Venom.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 25, 2014, 11:19:14 pm
It doesn't explain why it HAS to be this amputee guy and it HAS to be the Captain America name. Let Falcon have it, let the amputee guy do something else on his own, and go read Venom.
When did I say it "has" to be him? He's not the only person I listed.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on July 25, 2014, 11:33:39 pm
So... Let Falcon be Captain America ?? No ???
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 25, 2014, 11:48:11 pm
I've stated my reasons for and against.
Here's another term that fits, 'agree to disagree'.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on July 25, 2014, 11:51:12 pm
Nnnnnno you really haven't. The only thing you said is "what's wrong with [this other guy] ?" and "it takes more than 'friendship is magic' to be Captain America". You also claimed that it would hurt sales, but there was nothing to back it up (I see your "it failed before" and I raise you a "Captain America 2 : the Winter Soldier was a gigantic hit").
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on July 26, 2014, 12:03:46 am
Yeah, uh, John Walker makes absolutely no sense to be the next Cap. It didn't really work out the last time he did that. Ended very poorly.
But he's gotten better since then, more or less; he doesn't really need a redemption story at this point. I think he even has his limbs back now, however...
There's not a snowball's chance in hell that Cap would trust him with the shield again, even though he's more stable now. In fact he's probably the absolute last person Cap would consider giving the shield to. Falcon has worked alongside Cap for nearly 50 years, he's more than earned it. It just makes sense that it would be Falcon. Cap's the authority figure in this decision, and he'd pick Falcon.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 26, 2014, 12:05:05 am
Nnnnnno you really haven't. The only thing you said is "what's wrong with [this other guy] ?" and "it takes more than 'friendship is magic' to be Captain America". You also claimed that it would hurt sales, but there was nothing to back it up (I see your "it failed before" and I raise you a "Captain America 2 : the Winter Soldier was a gigantic hit").
Wrong again, but you're close.
Why would CA2 have to do with choosing a new CA? Or have any effect on the comic for that matter?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on July 26, 2014, 12:07:30 am
It was a hit, people loved it, Falcon gained massive exposure by being Cap's sidekick in it, people buying the comic books definitely saw the movie and are going to be more receptive to him anywhere he goes regardless of what he was just before in the comics. I don't understand why you have such a problem with it. The only thing you're saying is that you THINK it will be bad for Falcon and for the name of Cap, but you have no basis for that (other than "it didn't work last time", but again, Winter Soldier movie throws that out the window). Falcon has a great opening from the movie, it's pretty much the best time for him to do anything, he has a free pass. And no, I'm not wrong, I rechecked your posts on the subject, that is in fact what you said.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 26, 2014, 12:13:03 am
Because I think there are better choices then Falcon to be the next cap, and again, we don't have to agree on it, hell, I think the idea is him "Stepping down" getting "killed" (yet again) or quitting is stupid in an of itself. That and you know it's a temporary gimmick, so what's the point?
But you don't want to hear that do you.
Hell, the whole thing is already a joke........Captain Falcon.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on July 26, 2014, 12:18:05 am
That and you know it's a temporary gimmick, so what's the point?
Then what's the point of anything, and what's the point of putting anyone else as Cap ? Let's never change anything because it's always going to revert back. Remember that free pass Falcon got from the movie ? This is him using it. Tell me who here doesn't want to hear that.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 26, 2014, 12:20:30 am
Here's another term that fits, 'agree to disagree'.
Is it that hard?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on July 26, 2014, 12:23:24 am
Your reasons have all been shot down and you don't want to hear it, yes, I do call that flustered when you're so vocal against Falcon getting the name but can't back it up. Your "let's agree to disagree" is just your way to say "I want you guys to know that I hate it but I don't want to discuss it" without being honest, trying to act like you have good reasons.
If you want to say "that's just my opinion, I don't mind if you're against it", say it, but say it once, just don't try to argue for several pages without putting yourself on the line with a "agree to disagree" magic exit door.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 26, 2014, 12:27:06 am
You again?
It's called tolerance, look into it.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on July 26, 2014, 12:28:46 am
Are you stupid or are you really looking for a fight but being cowardly about it And no, it's not called tolerance.
If you want to say "that's just my opinion, I don't mind if you're against it", say it, but say it once, just don't try to argue for several pages without putting yourself on the line with a "agree to disagree" magic exit door.
(people won't get mad if you have an opinion, but people will call you out on your bullshit that you're probably going to try to backpedal as trolling)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on July 26, 2014, 01:18:09 am
Dude, no one has to like what you like, I don't like the idea or execution of Falcon becoming Cap, get the hell over it.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on July 26, 2014, 01:23:48 am
If you want to say "that's just my opinion, I don't mind if you're against it", say it, but say it once, just don't try to argue for several pages without putting yourself on the line with a "agree to disagree" magic exit door.
(people won't get mad if you have an opinion, but people will call you out on your bullshit that you're probably going to try to backpedal as trolling)
Still acting like it's other people's fault for disagreeing, are you ?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on July 28, 2014, 06:53:52 am
Agents of SHIELD is canon now. (http://comicsalliance.com/marvel-mark-waid-shield-original-sin-annual-cyclops-layman-death-of-wolverine-next-big-thing/) Kinda. Well, they're introducing the agents to 616.
but the big news is that MARK WAID IS WRITING IT, which will probably mean THOSE CHARACTERS WILL FINALLY BE INTERESTING PROBABLY
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on July 28, 2014, 07:24:29 am
Rather have the guy who we've known for a while be the successor to the Captain America legacy than some new character (which is honestly the only thing irritating me about the new Thor).
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: 【ＭＦＧ】gui0007 on July 28, 2014, 09:35:55 pm
Falcom will been a great Cap! I can't wait to see him in action!
Agents of SHIELD is canon now. (http://comicsalliance.com/marvel-mark-waid-shield-original-sin-annual-cyclops-layman-death-of-wolverine-next-big-thing/) Kinda. Well, they're introducing the agents to 616.
but the big news is that MARK WAID IS WRITING IT, which will probably mean THOSE CHARACTERS WILL FINALLY BE INTERESTING PROBABLY
Great! Now we can see the Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D for real in the comics!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on August 07, 2014, 11:56:40 pm
I know right, Catwoman is always going around murdering people willy-nilly.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on August 08, 2014, 12:32:44 am
What a coincidence, I was just thinking "I guess they're trying to split her up from her 'Marvel's Catwoman clone' image by making her take a clear cut side, that of the bad guys".
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on August 08, 2014, 12:33:19 am
She's on a revenge streak after Spider-Man (Doc. Oct) beat the hell out of her and threw her in prison. I don't think it's a mind control thing. I really can't see her being able to recover from this, so this storyline will probably lead to her death (though with comics, you can't rule out some weird twist).
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on August 08, 2014, 03:43:00 am
You say that, but I see Electro killing those men.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on August 08, 2014, 04:43:12 pm
She participates and gives the order, it's the same thing.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on August 08, 2014, 07:43:11 pm
Didn't she also use her bad luck powers to redirect non-Electro lightning (as in from the sky) into a bunch of other prisoners? That would seem to point to it being Black Cat, or someone with the same powerset disguised as her, or something.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on August 09, 2014, 01:21:22 am
It's 'Accessory to Murder' at the very least, and lame at that, BUT, I'm glad there doing something with her, not necessarily this, whatever, I'll see where it goes.
I'm going to miss SSM when it's run is over :-\ didn't realize how much I disliked Parker till he was gone.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: [DKG] on August 21, 2014, 09:26:03 am
so apparently people arent liking this cover http://io9.com/check-out-spider-woman-1-starring-spider-womans-ass-1624535918 dont see what the problem is...
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: presidentdevon on August 21, 2014, 09:30:53 am
so apparently people arent liking this cover http://io9.com/check-out-spider-woman-1-starring-spider-womans-ass-1624535918 dont see what the problem is...
Dayum dat ass. Can't complain about it, that's for sure. Her nose looks weird though.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on August 21, 2014, 09:38:56 am
The cover looks like shit and that posing is abhorrent. Fuck that cover. And people wonder why the comics industry is seen as juvenile!
Quote
You can draw women in a sexual way w/o being exploitative & degrading about it. They can own their sexiness. Don't draw them as fuck-toys.
and the weird thing is, this guy has done that before. (http://studiomadeinpb.files.wordpress.com/2012/12/milo-manara-marvel-covers-teaser1.jpg) I don't know what the fuck was the thought process behind the Spider-Woman cover, but it's not the same one that went into his other work (http://www.superamiches.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/7459188c14b8ce0b04618f786b7d31a7.jpg).
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on August 21, 2014, 04:55:57 pm
Manara cover, Greg Land interior .. this title is a crime against anatomy.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Nero D. on August 21, 2014, 05:41:19 pm
i don't think any kind of fabric works that way, like, even the tightest of fabric will go over the body's creases when in a (admittedly) suggestive pose like that, specially full body, i mean, even goddamn empowered of all people demonstrates that ffs, it's like she's wearing nothing at all in comparison
nonetheless, it's sexy and she's sexy and im a guy so yea
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on August 22, 2014, 01:37:34 am
So, this (https://www.carstickers.com/prodimages/643_fairy_sticker_decal.gif) and this crap (http://www.prosportstickers.com/product_images/p/309_fairy_decal__98058.png) has been on nearly every dumbass collage girl's bumper in my town since 2005, of but a chick in spandex, that's going to far?
Morons
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on August 22, 2014, 01:40:45 am
Did you even read the article?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on August 22, 2014, 02:12:56 am
He doesn't read anything. He doesn't watch anything. He half overhears things and is enraged by them.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Titiln on August 22, 2014, 02:19:52 am
i don't dislike that cover because it's tumblr problematic, i dislike it because it's very poorly drawn especially that fucking michael jackson nose
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on August 22, 2014, 02:29:57 am
That's because Manara is a mid-tier porn artist.
Marvel should hire better smut guys to do their covers.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on August 22, 2014, 02:31:23 am
But they already have Greg Land!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on August 22, 2014, 02:33:34 am
Manara looks like he gave up on that cover, the hands are incredibly well done, the rest looks like a rush job. (http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/0/40/3154089-guardiansofthegalaxy_5_variantmanara.jpg)
far from his normal http://hidekee.tumblr.com/post/74875900030/lordtimeblogposts-milo-manara-marvel-covers
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Edtion on August 22, 2014, 02:36:02 am
Manara looks like he gave up on that cover, the hands are incredibly well done, the rest looks like a rush job. http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/0/40/3154089-guardiansofthegalaxy_5_variantmanara.jpg (http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/0/40/3154089-guardiansofthegalaxy_5_variantmanara.jpg)
far from his normal http://hidekee.tumblr.com/post/74875900030/lordtimeblogposts-milo-manara-marvel-covers
... Yeah, he must have given up on that one, considering those other works of him. Those other covers sport beautiful, sexy women drawn pretty well and empowered by their sexiness, very unlike that Spider Woman one. :| What awesome piece it could have been if he decided to put effort on it...
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on August 22, 2014, 03:10:47 am
No, I'm describing anyone who chooses to take issue with a fully covered woman, because of her pose, or what the artist is known for. It could use a bit more color, but honestly, you're nit-picking.
Mind you, this is the same company that had a 14 year old Kitty Pryde screwing Colossus.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Just No Point on August 22, 2014, 03:14:09 am
Fully covered in red paint?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Snakebyte on August 22, 2014, 03:17:35 am
No, I'm describing anyone who chooses to take issue with a fully covered woman, because of her pose, or what the artist is known for. It could use a bit more color, but honestly, you're nit-picking.
Mind you, this is the same company that had a 14 year old Kitty Pryde screwing Colossus.
...Nope? Kitty Pryde was in university in a comic published before AXM. Check your facts before spewing bullshit. She's legal.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on August 22, 2014, 03:20:38 am
...Nope? Kitty Pryde was in university in a comic published before AXM. Check your facts before spewing bullshit. She's legal.
LOL, I still have the book dude, and it was long before AXM.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on August 22, 2014, 03:22:16 am
What book is that? Kitty didn't sleep with Colossus until Astonishing. Pete Wisdom took her virginity. That's canon.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on August 22, 2014, 03:24:19 am
Boy, it's almost like Sky doesn't know what he's talking about!
She was dating Colossus when she was 13/14 (and he seemed to be in his early 20s), but they weren't fucking. Of course, the age difference was pretty gross there too!
Boy, it's almost like Sky doesn't know what he's talking about!
She was dating Colossus when she was 13/14 (and he seemed to be in his early 20s), but they weren't fucking. Of course, the age difference was pretty gross there too!
You know, he just looked old because comics. The ANADs except Wolverine, Banshee, Sunfire, and maybe Thunderbird were actually pretty young. He was like 18 at the most, probably 17. Everyone in Claremont just spoke like old people except Kitty and I love it so much
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on August 22, 2014, 03:35:25 am
Isn't it a comic book? Don't all their costumes look more like painted skin than fabrics?
Normally you see fabric act even a bit like fabric around creases and cracks like that! Heck even my comics aren't this bad and they have nano armors that can fit over each strand of hair!
This is far worse than most (all?) comics do. I mean if the camera was from behind you'd see orfices!!
At sky's last post- those are not on the same level at ALL!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on August 22, 2014, 03:41:31 am
I don't have a time machine. Why would anyone start talking about 20 year old art right now? Make sense for once, holy shit.
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
I actually like everything but the Black cat one, that one just looks too artificial, too much like a pose (and the anatomy doesn't make much sense either)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on August 22, 2014, 03:43:32 am
I actually like everything but the Black cat one, that one just looks too artificial, too much like a pose (and the anatomy doesn't make much sense either)
I can respect that :beatnik:
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Snakebyte on August 22, 2014, 03:46:20 am
I agree with that. First two are nice. Black Cat's is silly. Neither is close to the level of the SW pic.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Edtion on August 22, 2014, 09:07:05 am
I don't think any one here is a master of anatomy and even if one were, I would think you'd have better things to do with your time than criticize someone's bad drawing. I also believe a master of physics would be doing something better than criticizing someone's bad depiction of a physical material.
If you're going to argue about gender issues of over/sexualising a picture or ague about said argument (like Sky79 did) then say so. If you're going to argue about what's actually important here (that being the image is not good), then say that.
But this is not about the anatomy or physics of the character(s). If you're not 100% accurate in the depiction of an image, then it is inaccurate. That includes lighting/colors/etc = every drawing is inaccurate. Every photo is inaccurate. NO image based of a real object is accurate.
As the artist, he has the right to break the laws of reality in his image, the same as a writer has with the story. Does breaking the laws of reality sometimes make an image look better? YES Did he break it correctly? No (imo)
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
(http://www.previewsworld.com/catalogimages/STK_IMAGES/STK620001-640000/STK629293.jpg) I just like this picture
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on August 22, 2014, 09:22:46 am
The anatomy is important because its badness is very noticeable and detracts from the overall work. The bad anatomy does not add anything to the work besides more of Spider-Woman's ass. No one is demanding hyper realistic Alex Ross artwork of people stiffly posing and not much else. Stuff like Jack Kirby's exaggerated anatomy, suggesting power and poise, or even Todd McFarlane's Spider-Man stuff (with the crazy, often nonsensical poses he drew for Spidey to emphasize his agility and giving his webslinging a real sense of dynamism), that's all very different than shit like this. It's not even worth comparing.
If you're going to argue about gender issues of over/sexualising a picture or ague about said argument (like Sky79 did) then say so. If you're going to argue about what's actually important here (that being the image is not good), then say that.
You can do both. It's not one or the other. And don't go dismissing the terrible depiction of women in comics as "not important". Jesus fuck.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Xhominid on August 22, 2014, 09:37:55 am
You can do both. It's not one or the other. And don't go dismissing the terrible depiction of women in comics as "not important". Jesus fuck.
Not dismissing any of your claims or whatever but I must be extremely ignorant because I read that article...and the main complaint...is the fucking fabric? Are you serious? Why the hell should this be an issue past Tumblr? Is it the pose? Yeah, it's bad when you look past the rest of the artists' work which did the sexy correctly, but one bad dud shouldn't equal "OMG, SPIDER WOMANZ BEING OBJECTIFIED, KILL MARVEL, DIE MARVEL!!!".
Seriously, I've seen more skintight suits that artists liberally act like it's spray painted on the females for the longest, hell, it's a FUCKING TROPE for christ sake!
It's bad enough seeing this terrible shit on Yahoo, I seriously don't want to see this and "It's not realistic at all" crap from a comic book sheesh.
If you are aiming for something about "terrible representation", actually go about the extremely stupid shit like Doctor Light being the fucking Rapist for a long while or something similar making the character into a punchline joke.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on August 22, 2014, 09:43:23 am
I haven't seen one reaction close to "OMG, SPIDER WOMANZ BEING OBJECTIFIED, KILL MARVEL, DIE MARVEL!!!". I'm sure there have been a few, but who gives a shit? Most people are reasonable. People are just very understanably upset that the comic Marvel was touting as their headline in their new push towards female led comics has an erotic pin-up cover.
You act like that men come off as completely squeaky clean somehow...
Why don't you get back to me when there's something comparable to women in refrigerators but for men. Or stuff like that tentacle cover for Heroes For Hire. Or any number of things. But you know, like a systemic issue, and not isolated incidents.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Xhominid on August 22, 2014, 05:32:15 pm
I haven't seen one reaction close to "OMG, SPIDER WOMANZ BEING OBJECTIFIED, KILL MARVEL, DIE MARVEL!!!". I'm sure there have been a few, but who gives a shit? Most people are reasonable. People are just very understandably upset that the comic Marvel was touting as their headline in their new push towards female led comics has an erotic pin-up cover.
So what? As I stated before, it's one simple dud and people are acting like it's the end of the world and all that other shit. There's being blown out of proportion and then there's this.
Quote
Why don't you get back to me when there's something comparable to women in refrigerators but for men. Or stuff like that tentacle cover for Heroes For Hire. Or any number of things. But you know, like a systemic issue, and not isolated incidents.
1. I wanted to delete that since I didn't feel like derailing my own point, but I guess I was too slow.
2. There is a version of Women in Refrigerators for men: Men are the Expendable Gender. Having men be raped and have zero consequence(Or in fact, be BLAMED for it, see Green Arrow and Canary for that) happens compared to the other way around in comics or how about the fact that just like the women, the men usually carry out of this world physiques as well(Seriously, Deadpool looks like a terminal patient, yet still has the abs most would kill for, super regen be damned)
Let's just lock this back to the main issue with the cover though, I don't want to derail the issue.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on August 22, 2014, 05:39:27 pm
I haven't seen one reaction close to "OMG, SPIDER WOMANZ BEING OBJECTIFIED, KILL MARVEL, DIE MARVEL!!!". I'm sure there have been a few, but who gives a shit? Most people are reasonable.
So what? As I stated before, it's one simple dud and people are acting like it's the end of the world and all that other shit. There's being blown out of proportion and then there's this.
People saying "this cover sucks, why is it drawn so badly and what the fuck is with Spider-Woman's ass" is not the same as saying it's the end of the world. No one is threatening to cut off Milo Manara's dick or anything.
2. There is a version of Women in Refrigerators for men: Men are the Expendable Gender. Having men be raped and have zero consequence(Or in fact, be BLAMED for it, see Green Arrow and Canary for that) happens compared to the other way around in comics or how about the fact that just like the women, the men usually carry out of this world physiques as well(Seriously, Deadpool looks like a terminal patient, yet still has the abs most would kill for, super regen be damned)
None of those are systemic, pressing issues (especially not male superhero physiques, that does not in any way compare to the way females are sexualized in comics). Well, the rape one is, but that's not really a male/female issue, it applies to both genders. We have a rape problem in our society, for both genders, and it's really fucked up! And comics have been by and large absolutely horrid at dealing with rape, whether it's male or female. But beyond the purview of this thread, yeah.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Niitris on August 22, 2014, 05:43:24 pm
What, no more pics? :(
Anyway, I'm far from a comic buff, but that's a terrible cover for it's intended market (sexy as it may be). Besides being an easy target for omgSexualization, I don't think most comic fans want to have their official cover art of a female lead be one that shows her body-painted ass 3 feet in the air (unless I'm underestimating how much the crowd may like that). Let fan-artists do that shit.
Also, lmao at her nose; the fuck is that supposed to be?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on August 22, 2014, 05:47:33 pm
you two boobs dont know what fridged means >:C
Quote
2. There is a version of Women in Refrigerators for men: Men are the Expendable Gender. Having men be raped and have zero consequence(Or in fact, be BLAMED for it
Women in refrigerators is about female cast members in stories being sacrificed cheaply to make for inner conflict that motivates the story to forward itself for the male members. It was coined about how dc killed and maimed females left and right to have the heroes be sad about it. It isnt about "unfair things happen to characters"
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on August 22, 2014, 05:48:40 pm
Hey man, it's not just DC, don't be a fanboy >:[
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on August 22, 2014, 05:52:17 pm
the coinage of the term is strictly from dc behaviour , its specifically about Kyle whats his name , the green lantern whose girlfriend was stuffed into a freezer because they didnt want to show the dead body.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on August 22, 2014, 05:53:35 pm
That's where the name came from yeah, but the original list had Marvel examples too! And stuff from other companies as well!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Just No Point on August 22, 2014, 06:37:06 pm
I don't know. I never got that one really. If the lead character is male then it makes sense that most everything is to push the male lead. And there are several more male leads in comics. The issue would be more female leads. They do the same to push their female counterparts. Or should if they don't.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Nomechy on August 22, 2014, 06:58:58 pm
No one is demanding hyper realistic Alex Ross artwork of people stiffly posing and not much else.
Hey now, don't talk shit about Alex Ross. I will fight you.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on August 22, 2014, 07:00:10 pm
52 Catwoman's female companion, Lola, was brutally murdered (http://modern-myths.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/01/2135831-lola.jpg) to motivate her story and I remember that didn't go over so well either, though this probably has more to do with the fact that the character in question was killed just two issues into the series. idk. The 'murder of loved ones' as an origin story in general is considered cliche and cheap these days, especially when they haven't even been developed so that the audience cares about their death.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Nomechy on August 22, 2014, 07:32:33 pm
Heroes needing to be motivated by personal tragedy is such rubbish.
Double-D said it the best.
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
(http://i.imgur.com/9XcjQex.jpg)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on August 22, 2014, 08:35:09 pm
Same here, I always hated the "this time, it's personal" type of story.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on August 22, 2014, 09:26:17 pm
I don't know. I never got that one really. If the lead character is male then it makes sense that most everything is to push the male lead. And there are several more male leads in comics. The issue would be more female leads. They do the same to push their female counterparts. Or should if they don't.
It's about the aggregate, like the Bechdel test; it doesn't tell you much about the specific example, just that it meets the criteria. Like, Alex DeWitt (the eponymous woman in the refrigerator) and Gwen Stacy are both on that list because both characters were killed off to make the hero sad and provide shock value, but Gwen's death is a good story and Alex's is not. Or comparing some more recent examples (that aren't old enough to have made the list), Sue Dibny's rape and murder in Identity Crisis (seriously, fuck that comic) to Sharon Carter's mind and body being violated by Dr. Faustus and Zola in Brubaker's Captain America. The former exists solely as a prop to make everyone feel sad while the latter is given agency and is an actual character in the story whose trauma is important. That and other reasons are why Brubaker's Cap run is fantastic and highly praised and Identity Crisis is a piece of shit (other reasons include: the culprit being Jean Loring and her motive being "I'M CRAZY AND I NEED MY MAN BACK", the Zatanna mindwiping, making Tim Drake an orphan because all that distinctiveness he had from the other Robins really had to go, and Deathstroke fighting off the entire Justice League by himself somehow, among others) and the first sign of DC's slow decline into its present state.
Wait shit all the good ones are Marvel and all the bad ones are DC, fuck >:[
Hey now, don't talk shit about Alex Ross. I will fight you.
I don't mean all his art or anything, but a lot of the time his work can be really stolid and undynamic, those times when the models he's using shine through his art too much and it just feels awkward and stuff.
But it's certainly not all of his stuff, and is mostly restricted to his covers (but then again that's mostly what he does anyway); the most recent thing I saw from him was actually really good, it was the latest cover of Astro City. It looked great.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Nomechy on August 22, 2014, 10:22:11 pm
In other news: While I still really like All-new ghost rider, going from Tradd Moore's art to Damion Scott kinda hurts.
Atleast Tradd still did this awesome cover for it.
The anatomy is important because its badness is very noticeable and detracts from the overall work. The bad anatomy does not add anything to the work besides more of Spider-Woman's ass. No one is demanding hyper realistic Alex Ross artwork of people stiffly posing and not much else. Stuff like Jack Kirby's exaggerated anatomy, suggesting power and poise, or even Todd McFarlane's Spider-Man stuff (with the crazy, often nonsensical poses he drew for Spidey to emphasize his agility and giving his webslinging a real sense of dynamism), that's all very different than shit like this. It's not even worth comparing.
If you're going to argue about gender issues of over/sexualising a picture or ague about said argument (like Sky79 did) then say so. If you're going to argue about what's actually important here (that being the image is not good), then say that.
You can do both. It's not one or the other. And don't go dismissing the terrible depiction of women in comics as "not important". Jesus fuck.
1. Fuck Jesus 2. I said important "here", I didn't say it wasn't important (not that I'm saying it IS important either), I am just saying it is not important here...in the view of complaining about this particular image. I wouldn't care if the picture contained a guy showing his dangley parts, the only thing important here is that the picture isn't good.
Any complaint that this picture is responsible for excessive sexualism of females or whatever is BS; the rational argument being it "possibly" adds to it and/or it's part of the problem, but full guns blazing on this picture and/or the artist is entirely misdirected. If you want to aim that kind of argument properly, it has to go to the artist for not doing it correctly, Marvel for allowing it, and everyone/everything like it that adds fuel to the fire.
2. There is a version of Women in Refrigerators for men: Men are the Expendable Gender. Having men be raped and have zero consequence(Or in fact, be BLAMED for it, see Green Arrow and Canary for that) happens compared to the other way around in comics or how about the fact that just like the women, the men usually carry out of this world physiques as well(Seriously, Deadpool looks like a terminal patient, yet still has the abs most would kill for, super regen be damned)
None of those are systemic, pressing issues (especially not male superhero physiques, that does not in any way compare to the way females are sexualized in comics). Well, the rape one is, but that's not really a male/female issue, it applies to both genders. We have a rape problem in our society, for both genders, and it's really fucked up! And comics have been by and large absolutely horrid at dealing with rape, whether it's male or female. But beyond the purview of this thread, yeah.
I actually have no issues with Male rape. Not a one (mutilation is not a part of it). I glimpsed through Invincible #110 and it did not upset me one bit.
I have something against Male-on Feminine rape and gore/ugly(or lack of any attraction) rape, as well as Male-on-Male/Male-on-Female/Male-on-whatever rape, but Female-on-whatever or Feminine-on-whatever rape? I can't think of a reason I'd have a problem with it. Yeah, I know it's illegal and someone's (probably) a victim here, but right and wrong is a moral viewpoint and my morals dictate whether or not I really care about something and that's not one of them.
edit: well actually my only problems with those occurrences would be now's not a good time (like someone's busy) or the action would infect the victim with something.
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
and no, I don't need anyone to spit their morals at me telling me that I'm bad/sick or whatever for seeing it this way
I also don't care that my view isn't equal for everyone, nothing is ever equal. You say equality for one group and exclude another, then you say equality for all people and exclude non people, then you say equality for all biological life and exclude artificial life; it never ends, nothing is completely equal and I don't see why I should try to clamp my morals to do so either.
:)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Xhominid on August 22, 2014, 11:06:41 pm
People saying "this cover sucks, why is it drawn so badly and what the fuck is with Spider-Woman's ass" is not the same as saying it's the end of the world. No one is threatening to cut off Milo Manara's dick or anything.
The number of news sites that report like this is something that's gonna affect comics like a black eye says differently again.
Quote
None of those are systemic, pressing issues (especially not male superhero physiques, that does not in any way compare to the way females are sexualized in comics). Well, the rape one is, but that's not really a male/female issue, it applies to both genders. We have a rape problem in our society, for both genders, and it's really fucked up! And comics have been by and large absolutely horrid at dealing with rape, whether it's male or female. But beyond the purview of this thread, yeah.
Dude, we already went over this with Elena and Uriel/Gill. It doesn't matter if it's supposed to mean something, I remember hearing that big breasts are supposed to be something of a sign of fertility or another deeper meaning close to nurturing(I remember this being used in the Dragon's Crown fiasco 2 years back), and people ignored it. So if we can do that because it still "sexualizes" the females, shouldn't the males, who pretty much suffer the same issues, suddenly get a slap on the wrist because "females have more problems"? How about we fix the issue on all levels, not act like it doesn't matter please or just torpedo the argument into not being an issue at all.
Back in the day, some 'mommy types' made a stink about how some artists put a bellybutton on her outfit 'They're implying that she's naked, I must make known my objection' it was pathetic and pointless.
You want to make a point? How's this sound kids.......Don't buy the book.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on August 23, 2014, 02:56:12 am
Dazzler is one of your favorite X-Men. I'm holding this against you forever.
2. I said important "here", I didn't say it wasn't important (not that I'm saying it IS important either), I am just saying it is not important here...in the view of complaining about this particular image. I wouldn't care if the picture contained a guy showing his dangley parts, the only thing important here is that the picture isn't good.
It IS important here. That's why there's a discussion. :-\
Any complaint that this picture is responsible for excessive sexualism of females or whatever is BS; the rational argument being it "possibly" adds to it and/or it's part of the problem, but full guns blazing on this picture and/or the artist is entirely misdirected.
Literally no one is saying that. The people on the side of it being excessively sexualized are saying it is a product of and adds to an existing environment.
I also don't care that my view isn't equal for everyone, nothing is ever equal. You say equality for one group and exclude another, then you say equality for all people and exclude non people, then you say equality for all biological life and exclude artificial life; it never ends, nothing is completely equal and I don't see why I should try to clamp my morals to do so either.
I'm so sorry that people who want to be treated the same as everyone else are trampling on your pristine morals, Jesus Christ. You're really putting your morals out on the line here!
Dude, we already went over this with Elena and Uriel/Gill. It doesn't matter if it's supposed to mean something, I remember hearing that big breasts are supposed to be something of a sign of fertility or another deeper meaning close to nurturing(I remember this being used in the Dragon's Crown fiasco 2 years back), and people ignored it. So if we can do that because it still "sexualizes" the females, shouldn't the males, who pretty much suffer the same issues, suddenly get a slap on the wrist because "females have more problems"? How about we fix the issue on all levels, not act like it doesn't matter please or just torpedo the argument into not being an issue at all.
Superman's muscles are not the same thing as Spider-Woman's ass. Not even remotely close. I mean shit, a Superman comic drawn the same way as Milo Manara's other, sexy-but-not-trashy art (the ones shown in this thread besides the Spider-Woman one) would be pretty cool, but it's never gonna happen.
But you're right, we already talked about this with Urien and Elena, and I see no great reason to bother rehashing simple concepts like this.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Xhominid on August 23, 2014, 04:17:59 am
None of that is acting like the world is ending. It's all been pretty damn reasonable?
I'm just generally speaking from all of this. All of the comments I've seen and the editors still act like it's still something terrible in the end and that is what my point is against, it's not, it's ridiculous to act like it is.
Quote
Superman's muscles are not the same thing as Spider-Woman's ass. Not even remotely close. I mean shit, a Superman comic drawn the same way as Milo Manara's other, sexy-but-not-trashy art (the ones shown in this thread besides the Spider-Woman one) would be pretty cool, but it's never gonna happen.
But you're right, we already talked about this with Urien and Elena, and I see no great reason to bother rehashing simple concepts like this.
Considering I literally seen multiple Spiderman pics with him being around the same poses as Spiderwoman, yet gets no flack whatsoever...difference past societal issues, my ass.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on August 23, 2014, 04:22:42 am
It's not at all ridiculous, because to those people and many others (and me), it is terrible. People should be allowed to say they find it terrible without having other people demand they shut up because they don't find it a problem. :-\
Considering I literally seen multiple Spiderman pics with him being around the same poses as Spiderwoman, yet gets no flack whatsoever...difference past societal issues, my ass.
Those Spider-Man pics aren't sexualized. They're not drawn to give anyone a spider-boner. This Spider-Woman cover is drawn by an erotic comic artist. He makes sexy pics, that's his deal. That's what he's known for. That's why he got this job. And that's cool! Drawing sexy pictures is by no means inherently bad, but sometimes you get things like this where it's just too much, like pretty much everything in life. You can go overboard with just about anything. But compared to his other stuff, like that one pic of Black Widow he did? That was great, she was stylish and sexy and felt like she was about to kick some ass. This Spider-Woman cover is her sticking her ass up for some reason, it looks dumb as hell and its overall just a poor drawing from an aesthetic standpoint.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on August 23, 2014, 05:40:56 am
Also, WHAT IS THERE TO MISS? Alison is still an active character in Uncanny X-Men.
Well, she went to "Mojo-World" with (ugh) LongShot, and only popped in and out for awhile. Heck, I liked that she was never afraid to go toe to toe with Rogue either, the parallels between Rogue and Alison's sister are hard to miss. Plus, once she went public about being a mutant, it ruined her singing career. She's a great story.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Xhominid on August 24, 2014, 12:51:08 am
It's not at all ridiculous, because to those people and many others (and me), it is terrible. People should be allowed to say they find it terrible without having other people demand they shut up because they don't find it a problem. :-\
Except having it be as huge as this from what I've heard is a simple variant cover...is a freaking overreaction, especially since unless the stuff INSIDE the comic is pure sex, is not worthy of any of this...
Quote
Those Spider-Man pics aren't sexualized. They're not drawn to give anyone a spider-boner. This Spider-Woman cover is drawn by an erotic comic artist. He makes sexy pics, that's his deal. That's what he's known for. That's why he got this job. And that's cool! Drawing sexy pictures is by no means inherently bad, but sometimes you get things like this where it's just too much, like pretty much everything in life. You can go overboard with just about anything. But compared to his other stuff, like that one pic of Black Widow he did? That was great, she was stylish and sexy and felt like she was about to kick some ass. This Spider-Woman cover is her sticking her ass up for some reason, it looks dumb as hell and its overall just a poor drawing from an aesthetic standpoint.
And that's the problem: With women, it ALWAYS default to sexy and as you demonstrate, what men do is apparently not meant to be. This is the stupid part and why while I never talked about it, I never felt like the Hawkeye Initiative had any ground. There ARE certain themes that only males and females can do AS WELL as how society portrays them all the same. I'm saying it on PURE STANDPOINT, you are saying it from a SOCIETAL STANDPOINT. Logically, Spiderman is as much of an object as Spiderwoman is considering he does the same level of poses(if not moreso considering he started first) than Spiderwoman, yet receives zero flack. Hell, I've seen a comic called Ant that virtually has THE EXACT SAME ISSUE, but since Ant's a guy...no muss.
No one is stopping you from having an opinion...immediately jumping on a comic book company because they dared to have a variant cover be a sexy pose(whether it's stupid or not, who the hell cares?), including having multiple journalists(including someone on TMZ who thankfully got demolished trying by other TMZ people) act like it's a huge deal like Thor Girl(seriously...who really cares? Elseworlds have been doing these concepts forever) is just ridiculous.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bastard Mami on August 24, 2014, 01:01:29 am
Except having it be as huge as this from what I've heard is a simple variant cover...is a freaking overreaction, especially since unless the stuff INSIDE the comic is pure sex, is not worthy of any of this...
dude, it's not that huge, you are talking as if it got the same reaction as doc octopus becoming spiderman, the only thing I ahve seen coming out of this is a few parody and "correction" fanarts.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on August 24, 2014, 01:54:00 am
Yeah, seriously. People are allowed to be upset about this, and the response has been pretty measured. You're really the only person making a federal case about this. :-\
... unless you're implying any kind of sense of outrage is wrong regardless? Cause that's pretty shitty.
And that's the problem: With women, it ALWAYS default to sexy and as you demonstrate, what men do is apparently not meant to be.
No? Whenever someone draws a women it is not suddenly endowed by the spirits of sex to be give people boners. Artists choose to add that, and they don't do it to every character or every panel or every cover. And people aren't talking about the cover being sexy, they're talking about it being overly sexualized, to the point where it's a detriment of the entire work. I keep saying: drawing sexy ladies is not the issue here: (http://38.media.tumblr.com/cd3d6c1cc4f1b9fecc4196be4b8adba6/tumblr_nal87zmLYR1rnbeuro2_500.jpg) this sketch was done by someone displeased with the cover. It keeps the same concept, same basic pose, same everything. And it looks phenomenally better, despite being a quick sketch (in particular the fingers which are super rushed). Spider-Woman looks sexy and powerful here, ready to pounce, something the original just doesn't capture.
Logically, Spiderman is as much of an object as Spiderwoman is considering he does the same level of poses(if not moreso considering he started first) than Spiderwoman, yet receives zero flack. Hell, I've seen a comic called Ant that virtually has THE EXACT SAME ISSUE, but since Ant's a guy...no muss.
That's nonsensical. Spidey doesn't get put in the same poses. Spider-Man doesn't appear on covers sticking his butt in the air with a visible 3 inch butt crack. I would love sexy Spider-Man covers (but like the redrawn sketch above, not like the original), but it ain't happening any time soon.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on August 24, 2014, 02:05:52 am
You're still on this? 3 days man, Jesus!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on August 24, 2014, 02:07:13 am
I thought we had moved on to talking about women in refrigerators and what happened to Dum Dum! (and a possible segue into hating on Identity Crisis, WHICH I AM STILL TOTALLY UP FOR, GUYS)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on August 24, 2014, 02:23:44 am
The entire Fury LMD thing is so full of holes I should be eating it on a sandwich. The Dugan reveal's no different. For those who liked, "Wait, so how does Battle Scars work if that was a LMD the whole time?" comes the sequel "How the fuck did the Skrulls kidnap Dugan and not figure out that this guy was a fake and just reprogram him or something?"
This stuff really brings out the anal-retentive canon nerd in me. I understand if you contradict something from a decade or two in the past, but if your reveal conflicts with something within the last five years then it's a bad reveal.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on August 24, 2014, 02:25:14 am
It was SUPER ADVANCED ALIEN TECHNOLOGY that was never used on the regular LMD's, it makes perfect sense!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on August 24, 2014, 02:28:40 am
Super Advanced Alien Tech that can replicate magic blood to make a Nazi young and also fool A RACE OF ALIEN SHAPESHIFTERS?
GRAAAAAHHHH
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on August 24, 2014, 02:31:52 am
It's just so overly complicated; if they wanted to get rid of Dugan (and BOOOOOOO at that very sentiment) they could have just killed him off now!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Niitris on August 24, 2014, 02:40:10 am
Discussing about women and how much their butt may poke out is an interesting topic, although I don't think most people here share my sentiment.
Carry on.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on August 24, 2014, 02:41:42 am
There's never enough interest in talking about men's asses, though. :(
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Edtion on August 24, 2014, 02:49:36 am
That's because feminine asses are always better than masculine asses.
The only place I want to see a masculine ass is in a moment of humor, like when Brock Samson was getting his prostate searched and then he broke the guy's hand by squeezing hard.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on August 24, 2014, 02:52:08 am
It's just so overly complicated; if they wanted to get rid of Dugan (and BOOOOOOO at that very sentiment) they could have just killed him off now!
That's just the heart of it. This whole thing is needlessly complicated. There's no reason Fury couldn't have also been doing secret alien tech assassin and also fighting Scorpio. There's no reason that Angela couldn't be Odin's daughter and be, say stolen by "someone" and taken to "another universe" and now she's here instead of raised in a secret realm that nobody knew of. There's no reason TONY STARK HAD TO PHYSICALLY MESS WITH THE GAMMA BOMB WHILE DRUNK AND BE RESPONSIBLE FOR THE HULK, over revealing that maybe the army sent him the schematics and he just made some changes for higher damage output.
I'm not a fan of events in general, but this one has really been grinding my gears. I really can't wait for AXIS so I can just see heroes teaming up against bad guys again.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on August 24, 2014, 02:59:04 am
Yeah, the retcons just seem overly destructive instead of constructive; it's a real shame.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bastard Mami on August 24, 2014, 05:01:43 am
maybe spiderwoman got some nice silicon implants on her butt, they kinda look like that.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on September 01, 2014, 01:21:15 am
(http://i.imgur.com/rwyPmCf.jpg)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Edtion on September 01, 2014, 05:26:17 am
I agree, that face WOULD be better.
Is the Genesis/DAZ3D model, or someone elses?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on September 01, 2014, 03:41:08 pm
Having a nose is an upgrade, no doubt.
What program?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bastard Walt on September 01, 2014, 04:03:29 pm
more importantly, what exactly is that image trying to prove?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on September 01, 2014, 04:04:34 pm
Ass and face position are broken. The model is actually a human-like position. Of course, artists aren't expected to be always anatomically perfect, but there's a limit and the cover feels really weird and inhuman.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on September 01, 2014, 04:08:35 pm
WE'RE STILL TALKING ABOUT THIS
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bastard Walt on September 01, 2014, 05:54:57 pm
I'm sorry for my ignorance here, but ... The 3D model and the art look exactly the same, minus one leg position.
The only thing I see "wrong" on that is the horribly drawn face and the sexualization everybody is outraging about, but other than that, it really doesn't look "impossible"
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on September 01, 2014, 06:00:25 pm
Its not impossible. Some people were trying to "prove" it was
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on September 01, 2014, 07:23:26 pm
Wow, now that's quite an exaggeration on the legs there. The head looks about right though (that or she has a giraffe neck).
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Niitris on September 01, 2014, 07:27:26 pm
lol
That's not even taking into account that the head is a bit too far from the center of her upper body, without her neck being adjusted. Picked a good time to get back into 3dcg.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bea on September 01, 2014, 07:38:36 pm
The pose is not exactly impossible, but I am yet to find fabric that is THAT skin tight. She'd have to be wearing body paint instead of fabric for it to cling so tight to her bum. ;P
And the biggest problem there is that Milo Manara is clearly capable of much better than that. :(
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bastard Mami on September 02, 2014, 12:03:40 am
this is actually foreshading; in 2-5 years time we will learn that spiderwoman is actually a cyborg and manara will laugh at you all.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on September 02, 2014, 12:52:32 am
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on September 05, 2014, 06:41:02 am
So, uh, Marvel's doing those Miracleman reprints, right (I know, not actually Marvel Universe, shush), and will eventually produce new/old content that was never drawn/some combination thereof, or something? to finish off Neil Gaiman's run. In the meantime, however, there will be an annual with a new story from the X-Statix team of Peter Milligan and Mike Allred, as well as a never-drawn script by Grant Morrison (!) (http://comicsalliance.com/new-miracleman-stories-coming-from-morrison-quesada-milligan-and-allred/) that dates back to the 80s, when it was rejected by Alan Moore at the time (INSERT MOORE/MORRISON FEUD BULLSHIT THEORIES HERE). This is a bit of a surprise, since Morrison seemed to have a somewhat frosty relationship with Marvel, but he acceded to having his script drawn and published after Joe Quesada found said script reached out to him; Morrison agreed, but only if Quesada drew it (!!!), and he did, and here we are! Pretty wacky!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Nomechy on September 05, 2014, 07:01:26 pm
Didn't Morrison kinda get pissed with Marvel after they retconned stuff from New X-men?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on September 05, 2014, 08:19:14 pm
I think he's generally getting tired of Big 2 work completely. Although let's be honest, you don't cut Magneto's head off and expect that to not be changed at the first opportunity.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on September 05, 2014, 08:57:51 pm
I think the reversals of stuff from his run was one of the reasons, but I don't think Magneto was one of them. For one thing, he had Magneto joke about always coming back (his secondary mutation!) and provided an easy out to his Planet X behavior (was taking Kick, Kick controls your brain, etc.) Of course Marvel completely ignored that escape hatch when they ham-handedly revived Magneto...
But Marvel pretty much reversed or ignored everything Morrison set up, save for Scott and Emma running the school, I guess (and also the idea that it is in fact supposed to be a school, and not a mansion a bunch of older teenagers and adults live in while they talk about their feelings). They immediately ran away from the idea of a mutant subculture and mutants becoming underground and cool and having their culture coopted by humans with House of M (because the whole persecuted minority allegory makes a ton of sense when there's only 198 mutant left). They dialed everything back to the same holding pattern the franchise had been in since Claremont, without really adjusting all that much to events like House of M. I think Morrison would be rightly upset to have the giant kick in the boot he gave to the franchise slowly retconned away in favor of more of the same of what came before him.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Edtion on September 23, 2014, 09:59:44 pm
Spider-Woman's Big Ass is a Big Deal! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CB6TiRJNI-Q)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on September 23, 2014, 10:07:57 pm
STOP
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on September 23, 2014, 10:14:25 pm
I'm so glad you resurrected a topic that has long since been moved on from for the sole purpose of posting a nearly one month old YouTube video, and nothing else.
Just A+ posting all around
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Edtion on September 23, 2014, 10:17:40 pm
I'm so glad you resurrected a topic that has long since been moved on from for the sole purpose of posting a nearly one month old YouTube video, and nothing else.
Just A+ posting all around
You're welcome :)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on September 23, 2014, 10:25:24 pm
Why don't we all post random, month old stuff? (http://comicsalliance.com/marvel-dc-female-audience-female-characters-female-creators/)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Edtion on September 24, 2014, 12:22:16 am
Why don't we all post random, month old stuff? (http://comicsalliance.com/marvel-dc-female-audience-female-characters-female-creators/)
Nah, I'd probably care of even like it, but there's way too much reading involved with that page -_-
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: 【ＭＦＧ】gui0007 on September 24, 2014, 02:14:03 am
Marvel is declining in comics because of some attitudes. Started cluttering the story of Spider-Man. Then with this crap of "Death of Wolverine" (only I didn't like that?) And want to replace Thor (not because it is a woman, but, IT'S THOR!).
Now this story of "machismo" coming to be discussed (again...). Is it means that the heroines can't sensualize in the covers? Is that oppresses someone? What it has to controversial?
Thus Marvel takes this stupid attitude. (http://www.avclub.com/article/marvel-cancels-milo-manara-covers-after-spider-wom-209593) "Ah, because we want to attract the female audience and sexy covers would offend women ..." GIVE ME A BREAK!!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on September 24, 2014, 02:20:27 am
Marvel isn't declining just because they're doing a PR move you don't like.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on September 24, 2014, 02:23:05 am
the "death of wolverine"you dont like hasnt even happened yet.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on September 24, 2014, 02:25:17 am
Marvel is a business out to make money. If they see something that could affect their bottom line, they're going to stop it. If they see something that can make them more money, they're going to do it. Why do you think they keep restarting their comics? Because #1's sell, this is a proven fact. You want the solution? Find the comics you like, keep reading them.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on September 24, 2014, 02:26:56 am
Wolverine can't not be involved in every major team. I refuse to believe that he will truly die.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on September 24, 2014, 02:30:55 am
He's gonna be dead the same way Batman was dead. Sabretooth will replace him for a while (Superior Wolverine), then X-23 will replace him (WOLVERINE), then he'll come back in a miniseries and his book will relaunch.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Eddie Hunter on September 24, 2014, 02:36:38 am
The main reason why i'm not liking Marvel is the Event after Event with obligatory tie-in's bullshit, seriously they barely ended Original Sin and what's is that next month? Oh it's just MOTHERFUCKING Axis! ughh...FUCKING BULLSHIT!
(SOMEONE SAVE MY MONEY PLEASE! ;-; )
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on September 24, 2014, 02:39:50 am
I'm so glad you resurrected a topic that has long since been moved on from for the sole purpose of posting a nearly one month old YouTube video, and nothing else.
Roger That- Everything Wrong With Captain America: The Winter Soldier. (http://youtu.be/W529m44OT0Y)
Wolverine can't not be involved in every major team. I refuse to believe that he will truly die.
Because he's been a cash-cow for longer them most reading this thread have been alive. He's not going anywhere, thus, the act of creating a storyline claiming to "killing" off their most popular characters has long since become nothing more then a 'writer's crutch'. It's the equivalent to smashing your head against a wall, then being angry about the pain. Vote with your dollars, don't like it? Don't read it, or at the very least, don't pay for it.
Never reward failure
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on September 24, 2014, 02:42:50 am
they are killing him because he's been in too many books with too many different personalities to the point he's become a self righteous hypocrite who has been losing a lot of his fans because they can't make up their mind what they want to do with him.
This is all being done to refresh the character and put him on the shelf for a while, which imo he reallly needs.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Titiln on September 24, 2014, 02:44:21 am
they are killing him because he's been in too many books with too many different personalities to the point he's become a self righteous hypocrite who has been losing a lot of his fans because they can't make up their mind what they want to do with him.
This is all being done to refresh the character and put him on the shelf for a while, which imo he reallly needs.
They are killing him because it will make them money and create buzz. Let's not ascribe a lofty goal to it.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on September 24, 2014, 02:48:18 am
that's part of it, but he's been watered down to the point every issue has a different wolverine. His sales were dropping and wolverine fans were fed up with how he was being done.
Not to mention they want to boost some of Wolverine sidekicks as well.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on September 24, 2014, 02:58:25 am
that's part of it, but he's been watered down to the point every issue has a different wolverine. His sales were dropping and wolverine fans were fed up with how he was being done.
And throwing in another over-used gimmick won't fix that problem.
Not to mention they want to boost some of Wolverine sidekicks as well.
You want to give them a 'boost', you bring in fresh writers with fresh ideas.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on September 24, 2014, 03:03:56 am
Killing him isn't the gimmick part though, it's keeping him on the shelf for what seems to be at least a year to move the rest of the universe forward. Say what you will about DC but when Bruce was gone Dick stepping up as batman was big and I loved the progression of the character.
Wolverine has gotten as far as he's going to go right now or anywhere (Claremont wanted to kill him off decades ago) but if his dying helps progress other characters I'm for it.
I doubt it will have lasting effects, and I don't really like wolverine in general, but I don't think killing him off is a bad idea. If for the sole purpose of keeping him shelved for a while helps him when he returns.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on September 24, 2014, 03:05:56 am
If it means Daken will step up again, great, but keep fucking X-23 in irrelevant titles.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on September 24, 2014, 03:13:30 am
daken is one of the people not getting spotlight, who they have is sorta stupid, Sabretooth,x-23,Mystique,lady deathstrike and someone else.
No daken, no jubilee no kitty The latter two, being his actual sidekicks one of whom he even trained to be a ninja.
X-23 and Sabretooth will get the most impact from this though.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on September 24, 2014, 03:13:47 am
Wolverine has gotten as far as he's going to go right now or anywhere
No, he's gone as far as that particular writer(s) are capable of taking him. If you want to 'downplay' something, you don't draw attention to it by killing it, you downplay it, by downplaying it.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: 【ＭＦＧ】gui0007 on September 24, 2014, 03:15:46 am
the "death of wolverine"you dont like hasnt even happened yet.
Yep, i see Iced. I mean, Wolverine is dead and them some months after he's back. And i really didn't enjoy this (like the Batman R.I.P. arc - part of them).
The main reason why i'm not liking Marvel is the Event after Event with obligatory tie-in's bullshit, seriously they barely ended Original Sin and what's is that next month? Oh it's just MOTHERFUCKING Axis! ughh...FUCKING BULLSHIT!
Marvel isn't declining just because they're doing a PR move you don't like.
Yeah, i know DKDC. But i talk about declining in the stories, the arcs. And about this unecessary controversy.
Sadly some people don't follow the stories and arcs for a long time (like me). As i see, as i know, most of the heroines covers (some heroes covers too) are sexiness and both men and women like that.
But these people be content with this and help Marvel continue taking these attitudes. That is why more and more i miss the Marvel who made unforgettable arcs.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on September 24, 2014, 03:18:16 am
Wolverine has gotten as far as he's going to go right now or anywhere
No, he's gone as far as that particular writer(s) are capable of taking him. If you want to 'downplay' something, you don't draw attention to it by killing it, you downplay it, by downplaying it.
no, the character has gone to the point he's basically pulled a 180. Wolverine is better as support character who doesn't have to be the focus, but once that happened he eventually started to get watered down and his character changes from book to book. It's not really the writer, it's more the direction they take him in in general.
as far as bruce and dick switching, I'm talking about the last time when dick actually thrived in the roll and loved it, not knightfall or the other arc where bruce was forcing it on him.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on September 24, 2014, 03:22:54 am
And want to replace Thor (not because it is a woman, but, IT'S THOR!).
Lots of superheroes go through the "dead/out of commission, replacement arc, return" story; I don't see any reason why it won't work for Thor (and it did already happen! There's Beta Ray Bill of course, and lets not forget ol' Eric Masterson from back in the 90s, RIP Thunderstrike, nobody gave a shit about you). I think this whole retirement, replacement, return arc has a pretty high batting average, and while it will eventually get pretty overused I don't think it's time to retire it just yet.
Now this story of "machismo" coming to be discussed (again...). Is it means that the heroines can't sensualize in the covers? Is that oppresses someone? What it has to controversial?
Thus Marvel takes this stupid attitude. (http://www.avclub.com/article/marvel-cancels-milo-manara-covers-after-spider-wom-209593) "Ah, because we want to attract the female audience and sexy covers would offend women ..." GIVE ME A BREAK!!
People got upset by that cover, yes, and it's not exactly difficult to understand why. Manara is an erotic artist: he draws porn and erotic art for a living. And there's absolutely nothing wrong with that! But Marvel's hiring of him for the covers of their big "lets attract female readers" campaign (which is a market they're very much interested in, given that it's the fastest growing audience in comics right now) is pretty weird and counterproductive, and honestly, I'm not really sure it should be appearing on any of Marvel's comics, except for mature reader's ones, IMO. And it ultimately resulted in this move; people very understandably got upset by that cover, and Marvel is very understandably trying to rectify their mistake because they're trying to sell their comics to those same people.
The main reason why i'm not liking Marvel is the Event after Event with obligatory tie-in's bullshit, seriously they barely ended Original Sin and what's is that next month? Oh it's just MOTHERFUCKING Axis! ughh...FUCKING BULLSHIT!
DC is no better, sadly. I'm really tired of these unending events too.
Sadly some people don't follow the stories and arcs for a long time (like me). As i see, as i know, most of the heroines covers (some heroes covers too) are sexiness and both men and women like that.
No, not really, not at all. Not even remotely. (http://comicsalliance.com/superhero-beefcake-sexy-comics/) There should be more sexy guys, and some more non-sexualized women, because right now it's too often the case that the dudes are all boring and not sexy and the women are always sexed up, variety is the spice of life, after all!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on September 24, 2014, 03:27:25 am
The marvel events keep happening because idiots keep buying them in droves, AVX Original Sin etc they all do very well numbers wise. Until big events don't draw anymore don't expect them to stop anytime soon.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on September 24, 2014, 03:31:35 am
My anger is mostly directed at the audience too! And they keep not reading the books I like and so they get canceled! And they keep buying books that Greg Land draws! >:[
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on September 24, 2014, 03:32:56 am
There are tons of people who don't even follow the ongoing titles who buy the events. Reboots and events are what makes the companies money.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on September 24, 2014, 03:39:14 am
My anger is mostly directed at the audience too! And they keep not reading the books I like and so they get canceled! And they keep buying books that Greg Land draws! >:[
There are tons of people who don't even follow the ongoing titles who buy the events. Reboots and events are what makes the companies money.
Yep yep yep. Just accept it as a necessary evil and don't read them. Trust me, it's life changing. Even the brief exposure to Original Sin I got made me angry.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on September 24, 2014, 03:43:24 am
My anger is mostly directed at the audience too! And they keep not reading the books I like and so they get canceled! And they keep buying books that Greg Land draws! >:[
God I hate greg land, all his copy paste work it's fucking horrible, how does he still have a job. Greg Land is the chuck austen of artists
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on September 24, 2014, 03:45:48 am
Yep yep yep. Just accept it as a necessary evil and don't read them. Trust me, it's life changing. Even the brief exposure to Original Sin I got made me angry.
I don't wanna accept it! Comics should be good! Events should be better! And there should be another Great Lakes Avengers special! >:[
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: 【ＭＦＧ】gui0007 on September 24, 2014, 03:58:25 am
Yep yep yep. Just accept it as a necessary evil and don't read them. Trust me, it's life changing. Even the brief exposure to Original Sin I got made me angry.
I don't wanna accept it! Comics should be good! Events should be better! And there should be another Great Lakes Avengers special! >:[
Yeah, i'm with you Jmorph! Why Marvel doesn't made more elaborated arcs and stories like they does in 70-90 era? (that i have a pleasure to enjoy it with my old brother and my grandpa. Ah, the good times...)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Eddie Hunter on September 24, 2014, 03:58:52 am
At least my favorite Super-Hero/Spy is sexy. http://img4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20140808210010/marvel_dc/images/7/71/Grayson_Vol_1_2_Jimenez_Variant.jpg
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on September 24, 2014, 04:03:21 am
Company wide events will NEVER be good, and I will tell you why right now.
1)They're written by only a select group of writers and they typically focus on the characters THOSE guys are writing, thus every other character has no real reason to be there.
2)They're written with the intention of reaching a set number of goals. Thus the greatest strength of the medium, the ability to tweak a storyline to focus on what works, is completely tossed to the wayside.
3)Because of points 1 and 2 EVERY comic that features ANY character involved in the event has to have their storyline on hold until the event is over and, if they're unlucky enough to be involved in one of the set goals, scrapped entirely.
That's why the only events that really work are the ones contained to a single family, like X-men only, Superman only, etc. A company wide event only works if the writers involved are completely conscious and respectful of things going on in other books.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on September 24, 2014, 04:04:47 am
I dunno I thought Final Crisis worked out pretty well. Mostly.
Yeah, i'm with you Jmorph! Why Marvel doesn't made more elaborated arcs and stories like they does in 70-90 era? (that i have a pleasure to enjoy it with my old brother and my grandpa. Ah, the good times...)
Eh, I think Marvel is doing astonishingly well right now, creatively. Adding more elaborate arcs doesn't always improve the quality, and in a lot of cases might actually be harmful.
At least my favorite Super-Hero/Spy is sexy. http://img4.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20140808210010/marvel_dc/images/7/71/Grayson_Vol_1_2_Jimenez_Variant.jpg
Dick Grayson's ass is powerful enough to warp reality and make everyone draw him sexy. Everyone covets the ass of Grayson, for they too want his sexiness. :)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on September 24, 2014, 04:13:35 am
I dunno I thought Final Crisis worked out pretty well. Mostly.
Morrison's events work because Morrison is writing a story about good guys fighting evil that he has probably had sitting in his wizard mind for 200 wizard years. I mean, look at Multiversity.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Eddie Hunter on September 24, 2014, 04:33:30 am
Just warning DC and Marvel, picking a bunch of shity writers and making them work on a single event will not make the event better written than a event written by just one shity writer. *cof*cof*Future's End*cof*cof*Original Sin*cof*cof*
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on September 24, 2014, 08:05:40 am
I don't think the writers in that were shitty, the story and concept just was, also wasn't original sin just jason Aaron? With tie in's?
And isn't future's end more of a new status quo rather than event? from the looks of it, that's what it is.
Speedpreacher hit the nail on the head with the whole trying to ram more than one branch of marvel into one book, you end up making one group look bad(Civil War,Avx) or ruin a certain mytho from one branch to shoehorn another in. (Avx) The people who buy it are the ones who want to see all these big giant fights that never happen and we just get a bunch of bullshit (age of ultron)
They keep coming back for the same crap (Original Sin) and then we get something else(Axis) that's going to change things again and is going to have the same people shelling out money to have another event 5 months from that.
Marvel makes a lot of money on these events, so they'll keep doing it, unless Axis tanks, I don't see this changing anytime soon.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on September 24, 2014, 08:50:47 am
Marvel's recent events have all been written by their some of their top talent, right? Jason Aaron, Matt Fraction, Jonathan Hickman, etc.; I definitely don't think it's a matter of the writers being shitty, it's just the very nature of events themselves that make them so hard to crack.
unless of course you are a wizard, like Speedpreacher said
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on September 27, 2014, 07:48:47 pm
Alright folks, big, big, BIG news: The family of Jack Kirby has reached a settlement with Marvel Comics, over the ownership of the literal scores of characters and concepts he created and co-created for Marvel. (http://deadline.com/2014/09/jack-kirby-marvel-settlement-lawsuit-supreme-court-hearing-841711/) This deal comes just days before the Supreme Court was scheduled to take the case into conference (to determine whether they would take up the case in court).
While this is great, great news, something that should've come about decades ago, I can't help but feel a little bit bittersweet about this (and not just for the reason that Kirby himself and his beloved wife Roz did not live to see this day): if the Supreme Court decided to hear this case, it could've sent a ripple through the industry and allowed the heirs of the people whose creations have brought these comic book companies so many billions to finally get their deserved share of the profits, and possibly even the chance to regain the rights to the creations themselves.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on September 27, 2014, 10:50:24 pm
That's why it was settled out of court, Can you imagine the backlash from that? Disney would be pissed.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on September 27, 2014, 10:56:51 pm
Oh, that much was obvious, but it got so, so close to being taken to court (really suprised Disney didn't settle earlier) that it actually seemed possible.
Although, if it came out with the Kirby family ended up with the rights, it would've been highly unlikely anything would change from a consumer endpoint; the Kirby family doesn't really want anything to change with how Marvel is using those characters, they just wanted a fair share of the profits. They would have either sold the rights off entirely or leased them out for a fair sum. Which is basically how it happened anyway, only without Kirby being officially recognized as owning the rights, and there not being precedent for the families of other creators to challenge companies for the rights of their characters.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on October 06, 2014, 08:39:46 am
It's official: Fantastic Four is ending. (http://www.bleedingcool.com/2014/10/05/confirmed-fantastic-four-to-be-cancelled-in-2015-with-a-triple-sized-issue-645-as-january-kicks-off-fantastic-fourever/) Doesn't really seem to be sales related (it was in eight place in August on the sales chart), so it's really hard to see it as anything besides a giant fuck you to Fox.
and, I mean, can you blame them?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Uche_of_MFG on October 06, 2014, 04:00:45 pm
Whoever made that decision needs to grow up.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on October 06, 2014, 04:02:03 pm
And you need to shut up but that's not going to happen either.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Person Man on October 06, 2014, 09:19:15 pm
Ryan North, writer of the Adventure Time tie-in comics and the amazing Dinosaur Comics (http://qwantz.com/index.php) will be writing a new ongoing Squirrel Girl solo series (http://comicsalliance.com/ryan-north-erica-henderson-squirrel-girlmarvel/) for Marvel, thereby proving we are in fact living in the best of all possible universes.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on October 06, 2014, 09:23:04 pm
Literally just about to post that! It's so amazing!!!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Person Man on October 06, 2014, 09:29:34 pm
SO amazing. I unironically adore Squirrel Girl, and North is a brilliant writer. I am beyond hyped for this series.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on October 06, 2014, 11:06:25 pm
Fantastic Four has been meh for years, even with Hickman writing it. It's just not interesting anymore. I can definitely see Marvel relaunching it a year or so from now though.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: 【ＭＦＧ】gui0007 on October 07, 2014, 12:45:08 am
I just say thank you for Stan Lee and Jack Kirby for creating one of the most beloved superheroes groups. Fantastic Four always been in my mind.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on October 07, 2014, 02:30:29 am
RIP FF >_< you were mistreated, mismanaged, taken for granted and poorly represented, but loved by your true fans.
The FF movie will need to bomb and bomb hard enough, that they won't dare make another movie. Thus letting the rights return to Marvel. It's 'franchise hardball' and will hurt for a time. But it will be worth it, If not, then we'll have one dismal failure of a movie after another, like the BS Spiderman movies.
Point being people, if Marvel isn't making it, don't see it.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: 【ＭＦＧ】gui0007 on October 07, 2014, 04:29:38 pm
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on October 07, 2014, 05:31:58 pm
It's been rumored before, and while this situation is a bit different, (ASM2 relatively-flopping has sent Sony into a tizzy) I just can't see this happening at all.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on October 07, 2014, 05:35:40 pm
#CivilWarForAvengers3
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on October 07, 2014, 05:36:37 pm
Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on October 07, 2014, 10:29:16 pm
Some MORE rumors about the direction the Spider-Man films might take (http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/JoshWildingNewsAndReviews/news/?a=108839); there seems to be three ideas being worked on. The other two might involve a soft reboot starting with Sinister Six, with a new actor in the role of Spider-Man (and the Sinister Six movie itself being a team-up of Spidey his villains? eeeeeeeeeeeehhhhh); the other involves putting Spider-Man himself on the shelf while Sony tries to spin-off various side-characters, and see what sticks. There doesn't seem to be any indication that there would be a combination of any of these (like, say, reboot of Spider-Man franchise + tie in with the MCU), but hell, here's hoping.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on October 07, 2014, 11:06:40 pm
Gotta love how the comic threads are treated as the gutters of the cinematic universe threads. :)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on October 08, 2014, 12:00:47 am
Sony doesn't know what to do with him, I hope this thing with disney pans out though, as long as it's not for civil war, why do they think people liked that? or even chose sides? It was so one sided. Just as bad as AVX (I hope that never.. ever happens)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on October 08, 2014, 01:52:03 am
Some MORE rumors about the direction the Spider-Man films might take (http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/JoshWildingNewsAndReviews/news/?a=108839); there seems to be three ideas being worked on. The other two might involve a soft reboot starting with Sinister Six, with a new actor in the role of Spider-Man (and the Sinister Six movie itself being a team-up of Spidey his villains? eeeeeeeeeeeehhhhh); the other involves putting Spider-Man himself on the shelf while Sony tries to spin-off various side-characters, and see what sticks. There doesn't seem to be any indication that there would be a combination of any of these (like, say, reboot of Spider-Man franchise + tie in with the MCU), but hell, here's hoping.
That's unfortunate, Andrew Garfield is the second best thing in those movies behind Emma Stone IMO. Why don't they just change the writers (ba-dum-tish) or directors, I wonder?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on October 08, 2014, 02:16:00 am
I really hate his Peter Parker but I dunno if that's more of the writer's fault or just his acting; in either case he's pretty talented but I'd rather someone else took over the role for a new direction, and he and Emma Stone can be in an actually good movie together and radiate intense chemistry and have fun banter and shit.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on October 08, 2014, 04:32:08 am
A few updates on that whole Spider-Man/MCU rumor: EW says, according to "well placed" sources, that Sony is absolutely not interested in sharing Spider-Man with Marvel, and that Sinister Six is still on track. (http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/MarvelFreshman/news/?a=108860) However, it also says that Marvel still might get a hold of the film rights in a few years, if Sinister Six fails; moreover, they wouldn't try and rush out a Spidey reboot movie out but instead use him in supporting roles in other movies (in which case I can't see them keeping anything from the Sony movies, and indeed they might not be able to, legally). Which seems like the best possible outcome!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on October 10, 2014, 08:31:55 pm
Yesterday at New York Comic Con, Marvel Comics announced their next big comics event, a brand new Secret Wars! Set to be written by Jonathan Hickman with art by Esad Ribic, the series will begin in 2015 and last one full year.
The series no doubt is what Hickman’s run on “Avengers” and “New Avengers” has been building up to since launching in 2012 as both series have dealt with parallel worlds to the Marvel Universe, not to mention the current story arc goes by the title “Time Runs Out.” Both of those things seem to play into this new Secret Wars as the promo art shows not only the new female Thor, the Superior Iron Man, and Sam Wilson as Captain America, but Miles Morales the Ultimate Spider-Man, Iron Man 2020, both regular Thor and Captain America, and countless other heroes and villains.
THIS IS INTERESTING. I HAVE NEVER READ THE ORIGINAL SECRET WARS SO I WILL DEFINITELY CHECK THIS OUT. ALSO HICKMAN AND RIBIC.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: 【ＭＦＧ】gui0007 on October 11, 2014, 04:25:04 am
Hmmm, another Secret Wars huh? This is could be interesting. :)
Now another Spidey rumors: Andrew Garfield to be replaced as Spider-Man in Sinister Six spin-off 'soft reboot'. And Venom movie is reportedly dead. (http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/JoshWildingNewsAndReviews/news/?a=108839)
WTF?? O.O
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on October 11, 2014, 04:31:10 am
Now another Spidey rumors: Andrew Garfield to be replaced as Spider-Man in Sinister Six spin-off 'soft reboot'. And Venom movie is reportedly dead. (http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/JoshWildingNewsAndReviews/news/?a=108839)
Some MORE rumors about the direction the Spider-Man films might take (http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/JoshWildingNewsAndReviews/news/?a=108839); there seems to be three ideas being worked on. The other two might involve a soft reboot starting with Sinister Six, with a new actor in the role of Spider-Man (and the Sinister Six movie itself being a team-up of Spidey his villains? eeeeeeeeeeeehhhhh); the other involves putting Spider-Man himself on the shelf while Sony tries to spin-off various side-characters, and see what sticks. There doesn't seem to be any indication that there would be a combination of any of these (like, say, reboot of Spider-Man franchise + tie in with the MCU), but hell, here's hoping.
:P
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on October 11, 2014, 04:36:23 am
It's only cool if it's set in that world. Spider-Gwen in 616 would just be another angst-fest about how she misses home and can never go back.
So that's probably what's going to happen, actually.
EDIT: Oh yeah, I suppose I should toss in. One full year of event - bleh. Prospect of Fantastic Four ending and "NO MORE MUTANTS" - very petty if it's what it's supposed to seem like, but doubtful that they would actually do that shit.
Hmmm, I like the idea, and character (no not because I detest Parker) but why an alternate universe? One miscast spell, 'doomsday portal' or hissy-fit via Scarlet Witch and 'poof', welcome to the mainline Marvel Universe. Hell, how many times have they brought Cable back that way eh? Have fun with it. I can see her having little quirky 'space and time' moments here and there with other heroes-
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Gwen: Wait, Thor was a guy here? Now that's odd. X-23: Ha! next you'll tell me Michael Jackson is still alive in your timeline. Gwen: Who's Michael Jackson?
That, and how will Gwen make a life, in a timeline where she's suppose to be dead? I'm interested.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Uche_of_MFG on October 12, 2014, 11:16:44 pm
More news from New York Comic Con 2014:
Silk is getting her ongoing series as well. (http://www.newsarama.com/22418-nycc-14-spider-verse-panel-silk-gets-ongoing-along-with-spider-gwen.html)
Guardians of the Galaxy and X-Men are teaming up for a major event of cosmic proprotions. (http://www.newsarama.com/22399-nycc-2014-black-vortex.html)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: 【ＭＦＧ】gui0007 on October 13, 2014, 05:06:03 am
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on October 13, 2014, 05:49:48 am
So Jeff Lemire's taking over Hawkeye, huh? (http://www.bleedingcool.com/2014/10/12/marvel-announces-kate-bishop-to-share-the-lead-in-new-hawkeye-by-jeff-lemire-and-ramon-perez/)
That's a lateral move if I've ever seen it. Although the article talks about it being a new thing that Kate and Clint are co-leads, but haven't they been co-leads for a while now?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on October 13, 2014, 11:09:14 pm
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on October 13, 2014, 11:22:14 pm
THEY ARE ACTUALLY RELAUNCHING EVENTS NOW.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on October 13, 2014, 11:32:17 pm
Thats a promo related to Secret Wars.
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Secret wars is likely going to be about incursions, so this means one of the universes joining the war is a civil war universe where things went some other way. Probably Tony and Spiderman stayed together till the end.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on October 15, 2014, 08:48:37 pm
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: [DKG] on October 15, 2014, 10:51:57 pm
So over in the Ultimate universe, Peter Parker is revealed to be alive, they doing a Jason Todd type thing with him... sigh
And Wolverine is dead now... and what a shitty way he died... the whole issue was pretty meh.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on October 16, 2014, 12:46:21 am
Wolverine died like he lived - in an overexposed, cash-grab comic event. If only it could have had a foil lined edition! They could have called it the special Adamantium-encased issue!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on October 16, 2014, 12:48:39 am
they had to throw in that Logan kissing jean grey cover... I almost threw up.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bastard Walt on October 17, 2014, 07:32:39 pm
So over in the Ultimate universe, Peter Parker is revealed to be alive, they doing a Jason Todd type thing with him... sigh
And Wolverine is dead now... and what a shitty way he died... the whole issue was pretty meh.
You are acting like he will never come back...hell, I can't even give them a YEAR, it'll be like 6 months full of ridiculousness about how everyone misses him and then BAM, he's back and every single comic writer is again writing him like a hypocritical jackass he was before.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bastard Mami on October 18, 2014, 04:55:29 am
isn't he still guesting in some ongoing comics ?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on October 23, 2014, 12:52:06 am
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on October 23, 2014, 12:55:50 am
ewww Old Man Logan
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on October 23, 2014, 01:02:16 am
quiet. Old man logan was a great tragic story with gross incest hulks. If you meant ewww to all the things that happened in it then yes. Ewww. But it was a great story :V
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on October 23, 2014, 01:03:20 am
No, I mean eww it was a shitty try-hard edgy story because Mark Millar licks goats >:[
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: 【ＭＦＧ】gui0007 on October 23, 2014, 01:12:01 am
It was kinda funny that is could really happend. I prefer this than Old Man Logan. :P
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Mgbenz on October 23, 2014, 05:30:51 am
Screw those Squirrel Girl finally her own ongoing!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Uche_of_MFG on October 23, 2014, 08:01:20 am
Why are they bringing back old stories like Old Man Logan and Civil War for?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on October 24, 2014, 02:02:15 am
Because the upcoming year long Secret Wars event is about alternate universes crossing over with each other. It's safe to assume these promo pics are showing some of the universes that will be visited.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on October 24, 2014, 08:59:32 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/xXzt7ru.jpg) Welp.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: 【ＭＦＧ】gui0007 on October 24, 2014, 10:50:26 pm
So, this is the end of the Ultimate Universe for real??
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Mgbenz on October 25, 2014, 12:29:55 am
Should have died after Ultimatum. It had some great characters (Miles, Jackson Fury, Gaylossus, etc.) but I never really liked the Ultimate line. It's a universe where everyone is doused in copious amounts of jerkass.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on October 25, 2014, 02:07:54 am
Yeah, I'd appreciate just getting rid of it. Like Civil War it's got Mark Millar's taint all over it, and Jeph Loeb destoyed all its potential almost immediately after Millar left.
I think it's likely some of it (Miles) will get rolled into 616 in Secret Wars anyway. Maybe even a soft reboot so that they've been there all along.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on October 26, 2014, 09:40:52 pm
(http://a.pomf.se/eagrki.jpg)
Eww this art
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on October 26, 2014, 09:48:52 pm
its the mouths they are drawn like an afterthought, they look awful. Its like muppet mouths.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on October 28, 2014, 12:08:14 am
Saw THAT coming.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: FeLo_Llop on October 28, 2014, 01:51:16 pm
Storm as a Lin Kuei? O_O
I'm a bit out of this but...
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
- Why Wolverine is missing his left hand? Rick Grimes complex? - Where's Cyclops? I hate that guy but...
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on October 28, 2014, 02:48:13 pm
Its age of apocalypse. A world where Xavier was dead and so Xavier took over the world on the seventies. Wolverine lost his hand when he cut out cyclop eye.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on October 28, 2014, 03:47:19 pm
Xavier was dead and so Xavier took over the world on the seventies.
Well heck, how did he manage that? :P
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
it's an alternate universe that resulted from Xavier's son going back in time and trying to assassinate Magneto (in a twisted attempt at helping his father) but accidentally ends up killing Xavier. It was up to Magneto to form the X-Men, but was slower in doing so than Xavier in the original universe and so Apocalypse was able to rise and take over the world.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: FeLo_Llop on October 29, 2014, 09:24:06 am
Thanks, gentlemen!!
What I don't understand is, Wolvie was able to create each cell of his body when Nitro destroyed him(except the skelleton) in Civil War, and he can't create a new hand here...or...that "silver" thing in his forearmis indeed his hand and "bones" melted" above the flesh or whatever. Either way it's creepy O.O !!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Xhominid on October 29, 2014, 09:32:35 am
What I don't understand is, Wolvie was able to create each cell of his body when Nitro destroyed him(except the skelleton) in Civil War, and he can't create a new hand here...or...that "silver" thing in his forearmis indeed his hand and "bones" melted" above the flesh or whatever. Either way it's creepy O.O !!
Because Wolverine is inconsistency incarnate...and written by fanboy writers that overblow Wolverine into a fighting god.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on October 29, 2014, 08:14:01 pm
He was hopped up on MGH right before that, though. It's still pretty bullshit but not as terrible as it would be if he hadn't had his healing factor supercharged, I guess.
But jeez, it's so weird to have even normal Wolverine regularly tank stuff that killed him in that iconic death scene in Days of Future Past (http://i.imgur.com/w30eHrn.jpg)...
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on October 30, 2014, 05:51:07 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/OCCl3Ou.jpg) This is just sadistic, Marvel. :(
also, leagues more importantly, Marvel is now putting in creator credits for Jack Kirby!!!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on October 30, 2014, 10:51:32 pm
"The Maestro was a version of the Hulk from an alternate future timeline, approximately a hundred years into the future, combining Banner's intelligence with the Hulk's more malevolent aspects. After a nuclear war killed almost all of the Earth's superhumans and brought the world to the brink of extinction, the Maestro seized control and became the ruler of Dystopia."
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Lord Kain on November 03, 2014, 09:15:22 pm
X-MEN from year 1992 its coming back again wih new comics;
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: DKDC on November 03, 2014, 09:17:10 pm
You did see all the similar posters that have been popping around lately, right ? It's not a new comic.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on November 03, 2014, 09:17:45 pm
It's one of those event teasers, not an actual series.
And thank God for that.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on November 03, 2014, 09:20:48 pm
^ wtf are you talking about? 92 X-men was the shit, still the highest selling comic to this day. yea those comics weren't very deep but that core group is what got me into X-men and comics in general, Don't hate :V
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Lord Kain on November 03, 2014, 09:43:59 pm
Hmmm guess my mistake, it could simply be a poster and just especulations of there been any new comics, i did noticed people hating on comics during the 90's in other articles, I in my opinion think the contrary, comics were more popular during that time but I guess story wise have gotten much better in recent years?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on November 03, 2014, 09:44:02 pm
^ wtf are you talking about? 92 X-men was the shit, still the highest selling comic to this day. yea those comics weren't very deep but that core group is what got me into X-men and comics in general, Don't hate :V
I like the part where I'm supposed to agree.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Lord Kain on November 03, 2014, 09:49:31 pm
Unfortunately I started liking X-Men because of the animated series, after that i started collecting cards,comics and shit like that to see if those characters had background stories and what not till i got into Marvel a bit deeper, but again thats me, geeks who knew xmen before me and hated the animated series think differently i think
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Ryūku Tsukuyomi on November 03, 2014, 10:00:01 pm
^ wtf are you talking about? 92 X-men was the shit, still the highest selling comic to this day. yea those comics weren't very deep but that core group is what got me into X-men and comics in general, Don't hate :V
I like the part where I'm supposed to agree.
Clever dick. Now get out.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on November 03, 2014, 10:11:53 pm
Anyway, Alonso offered some clarity on these teasers in an interview with CBR a weeks ago.
Quote
Speaking of major Marvel events -- for the last two weeks, folks have certainly been speculating about these event-based teasers that have been rolling out daily, with the latest debuting earlier today on CBR and teasing an end to the Ultimate Universe. The general consensus appears to be that it's tied to the new "Secret Wars" somehow, but what can you say about the teasers at this point?
Alonso: What I can say is that none of these teasers are for "What If?" stories. These stories really happen. And they happen in real-time -- they're not flashbacks. They count.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: 【ＭＦＧ】gui0007 on November 03, 2014, 10:19:24 pm
I grown up reading X-Men and seeing the animated series (which in fact made a huge success in Brazil). And i don't be afraid to say that, after 60-70's Era, the 90's Era really marked my life.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bastard Mami on November 03, 2014, 10:28:27 pm
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on November 03, 2014, 10:43:27 pm
Guys, I know pretty much all of us grew up on the 90's X-Men series, but like, seriously, have you watched it recently? It's fucking awful; don't let nostalgia blind you. The writing is wretched and the animation is somehow worse. :-\
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bastard Walt on November 03, 2014, 10:45:54 pm
The designs and bright colors are iconic. We play Mugen characters everyday based on those designs, it's gotta be worth for something.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on November 03, 2014, 10:50:49 pm
Oh, it's definitely not all bad (dat theme music, some of the voice acting, etc.), but compared to Batman The Animated Series (which aired at the same time), the difference is night and day.
also those designs aren't technically from the animated series :P
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on November 03, 2014, 10:59:04 pm
dont listen to the naysayer.
and CRY FOR THE MOON
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on November 03, 2014, 11:00:58 pm
Can't even use something from the original series, huh?!
this seems like the best time to catch up on what happened Previously, on X-Men:
/me screams in pain, ala Xavier
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Titiln on November 03, 2014, 11:11:14 pm
as a kid i loved the xmen cartoon and i couldn't stand to watch the batman one. i hated the art style and none of the characters were interesting to me. xmen had cool characters like the dude what threw cards, eye lasers man, woman that could steal powers and give me awkward boners and magnetic man. it definitely doesn't stand the test of time but it's what made a lot of people aware of the xmen
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Lord Kain on November 04, 2014, 12:07:15 am
^ That
Also I watched X-Men before I even moved to the United States I had basic English knowledge back then and had no ideoa how their names could be in english, characters were introduced to me as Guepardo, Gambito, Jubilo lol, those were the days!..
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on November 04, 2014, 01:22:06 am
Guys, I know pretty much all of us grew up on the 90's X-Men series, but like, seriously, have you watched it recently? It's fucking awful; don't let nostalgia blind you. The writing is wretched and the animation is somehow worse. :-\
Dude, you are giving it way less credit than it deserves, it's not as awful as you're making it out to be. Yes it wasn't the greatest thing in the world but it was awesome. and I wasn't even talking about the cartoon, I was referring to that time period in X-men in general. As bland as the 90's were The crazy storylines and bright colors is what drew a lot of people to it.
And writing, seriously? it was a kids show, nothing had great writing in kids action shows back then wtf were you expecting something worthy of an emmy?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bastard Walt on November 04, 2014, 01:54:09 am
Just one thing, if I may. The english dub is HORRENDOUS. There's like this grainy, weird dry echo (I really can't describe it any better than that), along with some pretty doubtful over-acting that actually does make everything sound extra silly.
We actually got some super serious actors in the Spanish dub for the most part that really gave everything the proper gravitas. It was a great show, we had nothing like it before XMEN other than the weird Hanna Barbera Super Friends from decades back.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on November 04, 2014, 01:58:26 am
I liked the voice acting; well, most of it... or maybe just some of it. It had a lot of varying degrees of quality; Wolverine's voice is still what I picture whenever I read him, but then you've got voices like Xavier's, which was so whiney (and so prone to YELLING IN PAIN every episode).
Dude, you are giving it way less credit than it deserves, it's not as awful as you're making it out to be. Yes it wasn't the greatest thing in the world but it was awesome. and I wasn't even talking about the cartoon, I was referring to that time period in X-men in general. As bland as the 90's were The crazy storylines and bright colors is what drew a lot of people to it.
I know you weren't talking about the cartoon, but other people were! :P
I also got into X-Men through the cartoon, but it's definitely not a show I would want to watch now, nor show to my nonexistent children. There's much better ways to get into X-Men (whether through the Claremont run of comics, the movies, or even the Wolverine and the X-Men show), and much better superhero cartoons in general.
And writing, seriously? it was a kids show, nothing had great writing in kids action shows back then wtf were you expecting something worthy of an emmy?
I liked the voice acting; well, most of it... or maybe just some of it. It had a lot of varying degrees of quality; Wolverine's voice is still what I picture whenever I read him, but then you've got voices like Xavier's, which was so whiney (and so prone to YELLING IN PAIN every episode).
Dude, you are giving it way less credit than it deserves, it's not as awful as you're making it out to be. Yes it wasn't the greatest thing in the world but it was awesome. and I wasn't even talking about the cartoon, I was referring to that time period in X-men in general. As bland as the 90's were The crazy storylines and bright colors is what drew a lot of people to it.
I know you weren't talking about the cartoon, but other people were! :P
I also got into X-Men through the cartoon, but it's definitely not a show I would want to watch now, nor show to my nonexistent children. There's much better ways to get into X-Men (whether through the Claremont run of comics, the movies, or even the Wolverine and the X-Men show), and much better superhero cartoons in general.
And writing, seriously? it was a kids show, nothing had great writing in kids action shows back then wtf were you expecting something worthy of an emmy?
Batman is batman, it had a way better driving force behind it. But seriously the stories weren't that bad. Nor was the show in general, And NO wolverine and the X-men AND the movies do not do good jobs of representing the X-men's mythos the way the 90's show did. both of those were wolverine centered as fuck and as much as I liked WATXM I didn't like how so many people felt like shells in it (don't even get me started on cyclops in it, bleh) I just put the DVD on an hour ago to see for myself, and it looks fine, it's not the best looking thing in the world by any means, but to outright basically slam it the way you did is just horseshit :p
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on November 04, 2014, 02:31:22 am
I agree they focus on Wolverine too much but I think the movies (the good ones, at least) do a great job of representing what X-Men is all about (I can't speak for Wolverine and the X-Men because I've never seen it, but I've heard nothing but good things about it).
But c'mon, Batman being Batman doesn't change anything. A critically acclaimed, Emmy winning X-Men series was definitely possible back then (and still is), you just need the right people! Get Greg Wiseman on that shit or something, there's no need to settle for a subpar show like 90s X-Men!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on November 04, 2014, 02:35:28 am
what, like this?
Honestly the x-men tas show was leagues ahead most of the stuff at the time, it was way better than the spider-man show the ironman show, the hulk show, or any of the avengers shows.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on November 04, 2014, 02:37:44 am
We will not speak of the anime.
and c'mon, being better than the Marvel shows still isn't a great badge of honor (and actually I would rate Spider-Man above X-Men, not saying it's great or anything, just slightly better). We deserve better shows! >:[
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on November 04, 2014, 02:38:19 am
I agree they focus on Wolverine too much but I think the movies (the good ones, at least) do a great job of representing what X-Men is all about (I can't speak for Wolverine and the X-Men because I've never seen it, but I've heard nothing but good things about it).
But c'mon, Batman being Batman doesn't change anything. A critically acclaimed, Emmy winning X-Men series was definitely possible back then (and still is), you just need the right people! Get Greg Wiseman on that shit or something, there's no need to settle for a subpar show like 90s X-Men!
Yea, but it was still good for what it was, it still told a better phoenix story than the movies did, it still had the best roster assembled and walt you're tripping the voice dubbing was good, minus xavier's AAAAHHUHHH. It had two voice actors from RE's heyday too (Jubes VA does claire's voice, and Jean's did jills) not to mention in all the Vs games those were the voices used.
X-men Evo was a great X-men show if you want a cartoon. And I'm gonna have to disagree to an extent about the good movies representing what the X-men were about, as much as I love first class, it didn't really feel like "fighting and saving a world that fears and hates you" it had that in the final scene in the first movie, and the second tried to do that a little bit with the DOFP storyline, but to it's core it's just been a story about 3 friends.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on November 04, 2014, 02:40:38 am
Honestly the x-men tas show was leagues ahead most of the stuff at the time, it was way better than the spider-man show
For the record, the 90s Spiderman feels very much like the aftermath of how high the bar was set by the XMEN show, and it did a pretty good job at showing who Peter Parker was as a character, and not a goofster in tights 24/7 like those Newspaper Comic strips JMM posted the other day, or the Hannah Barbera show that spawned countless memes.
To me personally, it's all the way up there with Batman TAS in terms of how serious they were to explore the characters. That 90's Spiderman show made me realize how deep down the rabbit hole the Spiderman mythos could go (bear with me, I was a very young teenager). Pairing that with the arcade releases of XMEN COTA and later the MSH games from Capcom, that's when my appetite for Marvel Comics really grew. We didn't really have access to the comics around here, so that was all we had.
Later those same guys that made Spiderman made a Fantastic Four show, and a Hulk cartoon too around that same time, and those were HORRIBLE.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Iced on November 04, 2014, 02:45:55 am
and c'mon, being better than the Marvel shows still isn't a great badge of honor (and actually I would rate Spider-Man above X-Men, not saying it's great or anything, just slightly better). We deserve better shows! >:[
dont mess with perfection, we already had the perfect shows.
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
The nineties hulk had a kickass opening too, even if the show itself was pretty bad.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on November 04, 2014, 02:46:52 am
I've heard that the Hulk show (season one, at least) is the best of the 90s Marvel shows, but I haven't seen it since it aired so I dunno how accurate that is. But Jesus that Fantastic Four cartoon, I can't believe I used to get up at like 6 to watch that and Iron Man. On school days. :(
Yea, but it was still good for what it was, it still told a better phoenix story than the movies did
That's not saying much! The Phoenix story the animated series told was pretty bad too!!! D:
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Niitris on November 04, 2014, 02:49:07 am
I haven't watched the X-Men animated show in about 15 years. I liked it back when I was younger because the characters were cool. But even then, I always felt that there was something "cheap" about the presentation, and apparently this recent discussion gives more validity to that feeling (while describing it in a far more informative way).
Yeah, the design and color direction was easily it's strong point. That kind of stuff tends to stand out among the youth (when one isn't as knowledgeable on the more technical aspects). It could've definitely been better, but I wouldn't call it a bad show considering the target audience.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on November 04, 2014, 02:57:51 am
Guys, I know pretty much all of us grew up on the 90's X-Men series, but like, seriously, have you watched it recently? It's fucking awful; don't let nostalgia blind you. The writing is wretched and the animation is somehow worse. :-\
Dude, you are giving it way less credit than it deserves, it's not as awful as you're making it out to be. Yes it wasn't the greatest thing in the world but it was awesome. and I wasn't even talking about the cartoon, I was referring to that time period in X-men in general. As bland as the 90's were The crazy storylines and bright colors is what drew a lot of people to it.
And writing, seriously? it was a kids show, nothing had great writing in kids action shows back then wtf were you expecting something worthy of an emmy?
I thought you were talking about the Jim Lee comic.
I never liked the Marvel cartoons, even as a kid. The aesthetic always reminded me of Captain Planet where every character has a gargantuan jawline.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on November 04, 2014, 03:09:31 am
I've heard that the Hulk show (season one, at least) is the best of the 90s Marvel shows,
The first season is great and it legitimately has one of the greatest openings (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dyQpEoMFF3w) of any cartoon ever (tells you everything you need to know about the character in a minute! THAT'S how you do a theme song!) The second season, where the animation changes and She-Hulk becomes a main character... not so much.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: 【ＭＦＧ】gui0007 on November 04, 2014, 05:41:50 am
Damn, i watched A LOT Hulk series! :)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on November 04, 2014, 05:39:16 pm
(http://i.imgur.com/EHQAwX6.jpg) Marvel says this is the last teaser.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on November 04, 2014, 05:42:19 pm
reboot :/
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: -Red- on November 04, 2014, 05:51:06 pm
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: -Red- on November 04, 2014, 06:24:58 pm
Pretty sure most of us agree that Batman TAS is pretty much the best superhero animated series from the 90's, even better than Xmen in general although to be fair, it's far easier to develop a story with fewer main characters (Xmen's regular cast is gigantic in comparison).
It's also kinda unfair to rule out an entire series by comparing it to the very best episode of another serie when Batman also had its lows. They're both very different series, one being particularly gritty and serious up to the color palette and straight shapes everywhere, while the other being less serious and more colorful with wild silly comic book designs and upbeat music. I personally like both equally although I got bored of Batman quite often when I was younger due to the lack of punch in the episodes (You enjoy it more when you're older and can appreciate a slow paced story).
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on November 04, 2014, 06:52:57 pm
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on November 04, 2014, 07:31:44 pm
I made an attempt at figuring out the best X-Men episode but I just couldn't, so I went with generic. It's pretty slim pickings!
Maybe it would be better to compare the worst episodes, like the one with the long, meandering origin of Mr. Sinister vs. the episode where Batman is knocked out for most of the running time and the episode instead follows some plucky kids hiding his body in a basement! Or the one about Gambit's family and the Thieves Guild, featuring the absolute worst accents of any kind ever captured on film vs. that one episode where Catwoman is turned into a furry so a mad scientist can give his man-tiger creation children.
Pretty sure most of us agree that Batman TAS is pretty much the best superhero animated series from the 90's, even better than Xmen in general although to be fair, it's far easier to develop a story with fewer main characters (Xmen's regular cast is gigantic in comparison).
Eeeeeeh, I dunno. That's a definite problem with the movies, because there's so little screentime to go around (and it applies to all superhero team movies); TV can develop a huge amount of characters pretty well, and indeed X-Men did flesh out most of its cast, albeit pretty simplistically (I don't want to keep beating the DCAU drum but... the Justice League show was in the same boat and did so much better characterization-wise that it's hard not to compare!). In any case characterization wasn't a huge problem with the show, it was the plots, the animation, the unlikeability of the characters, the voice acting sometimes, the near complete incompetence of the heroes, stuff like that.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Niitris on November 04, 2014, 08:22:56 pm
So I went back and saw an episode for the first time in nearly 2 decades (wow). Don't know where the sequence with Bishop going back in time to stop Professor X from getting killed stands in comparison to other episodes, as if I would know.
Characters are a huge part of any narrative; hell video game character reveals garner way more attention than anything else due to possible novelty I suppose. The other facets to X-Men animated certainly isn't good (some parts are just laughable), but it's how the characters are presented that really gives the animated series it's appeal. When you have more insight on what makes a quality production, theh yeah it can seem underwhelming. With the quality as is, this would get panned if this was revived as a live action series for young adults. But in a show (or anything for that matter) where the standards are lowered due to the age demographic, sometimes good characterization is all you really need.
I also see why Woverine just "broke-out" in comparison to the others (always knew but just wanted to point that out).
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: 【ＭＦＧ】gui0007 on November 05, 2014, 12:44:16 am
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on November 08, 2014, 08:14:09 pm
Well I mean, it is Iron Man. Smug and douchey is kind of part of the package, even without factoring in the additional smug douchiness that a "Superior Spider-Man" type title would imply!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Tyrant Belial on November 08, 2014, 08:24:51 pm
New helmet seems. . . impractical beyond the point of an iron man suit, let's just have my face open to getting hit!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on November 08, 2014, 08:26:49 pm
He's a big fan of Jim Lee's weird sock masks, that only cover the sides of one's head but leaves the face and hair exposed for some reason!
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on November 08, 2014, 08:30:16 pm
so he's not getting a faceplate at all? thats lame, he looks like forge without it.
and why do superheros always go to SF when shit either fucks up(DD) or is about to (X-men)
And the reboot is coming, it'll be all new and ruin 50 years of continuity. There are some things with certain characters I will be glad to be gone though if it does happen.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on November 08, 2014, 08:40:41 pm
Extremis superior, faceplates inferior.
I also am of the opinion that there will not be a reboot, simply because DC does it when they feel their continuity has gotten too convoluted, and Marvel has, for a while now, disregarded or outright ignored their continuity.
The ultimate result of all this will be them reclassifying their multiverse into something less vast and comic-booky into something more streamlined and mass-media friendly.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on November 08, 2014, 08:45:17 pm
I wish that was right, but I just have a feeling their going to wipe it all out.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Roman55 on November 08, 2014, 11:58:46 pm
It'd also be kind of stupid of them to do a full on reboot when they're currently doing things that got their comics attention from people who only would probably care about their film adaptations (like FemThor and Falcon Cap which they made out to be big deals).
While there will be some things done that shake up the continuity for good or ill, it probably won't be a total erasing of history like DC did.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on November 09, 2014, 06:14:29 am
^ you're d@mn right I hate the idea of a female "Thor". But I hate a cheap cop-out even more.
*Cough Cough* Countdown *Cough Cough*
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on November 10, 2014, 08:13:06 pm
SO FORMER WWE SUPERSTAR CM PUNK IS WRITING THOR ANNUAL #1: http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=56972
JASON AARON 2.0?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on November 10, 2014, 08:25:26 pm
Well... if you told literally anyone on Earth that the lead singer of My Chemical Romance would be writing a critically acclaimed, Eisner-winning comic series ten years ago they would've laughed in your face, so who knows?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Speedpreacher on November 10, 2014, 08:35:18 pm
Guess we can expect Thor and THOR to not engage in any ale drinking for that issue.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: 【ＭＦＧ】gui0007 on November 10, 2014, 08:53:33 pm
SO FORMER WWE SUPERSTAR CM PUNK IS WRITING THOR ANNUAL #1: http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page=article&id=56972
JASON AARON 2.0?
Pffff... That's just sucks.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on November 10, 2014, 09:07:57 pm
Why is that, exactly?
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on November 10, 2014, 09:15:35 pm
yea Punk clearly has a passion for comics, I don't think it'll be bad, plus it's an annual so you get a bit more freedom.
But jason aaron, he was good on thor, but I sorta hate him a bit for his X-men run (he pitched schism and wrote it, basically the start of wolverine's hypocritical descent. And his crappy new kids in Wolverine and the X-men)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: 【ＭＦＧ】gui0007 on November 10, 2014, 09:22:04 pm
But jason aaron, he was good on thor, but I sorta hate him a bit for his X-men run (he pitched schism and wrote it, basically the start of wolverine's hypocritical descent. And his crappy new kids in Wolverine and the X-men)
^^ THIS! I'm afraid of this could happen about CM Punk. Plus, i didn't like so much this new Thor.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on November 10, 2014, 09:27:26 pm
there's a lot of writers though, who are good on some books but not others. Not everyone can write team books. I liked Gillen's Uncanny X-men run more than his Iron man run for instance.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Jmorphman on November 10, 2014, 10:39:44 pm
yea Punk clearly has a passion for comics, I don't think it'll be bad, plus it's an annual so you get a bit more freedom.
But jason aaron, he was good on thor, but I sorta hate him a bit for his X-men run (he pitched schism and wrote it, basically the start of wolverine's hypocritical descent. And his crappy new kids in Wolverine and the X-men)
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bea on November 10, 2014, 11:58:00 pm
I am more worried that her midriff is exposed and she has a boob plate, which is pretty terrible when it comes to armour, as all blows are diverted directly to your sternum, usually for disastrous results.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on November 11, 2014, 02:08:53 am
The 'Boob armor' sucks, no doubt. Classic Thor rarely wore armor and even then, the dude can take shotgun blast to the chin and smile, it's unnecessary.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Japanese Jesus on November 11, 2014, 02:53:14 am
Thor should just be naked since his armor is really unneeded.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Nomechy on November 13, 2014, 05:17:02 pm
Ultimate Thor look is pretty sweet.
Mostly for the beard, which im really glad they gave him now that he is all washed out and unworthy.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: [DKG] on November 19, 2014, 09:42:54 am
Read the Marvel/Shingeki crossover now http://www.reddit.com/r/ShingekiNoKyojin/comments/2mhebw/attack_on_avengers_from_brutus_magazine_all_8/
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bastard Mami on November 19, 2014, 05:31:37 pm
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: 【ＭＦＧ】gui0007 on November 28, 2014, 12:05:25 am
Marvel trolling Fox. Marvel BLOWS UP Fantastic Four Reboot Cast In THE PUNISHER #12 (http://www.comicbookmovie.com/fansites/fuffy/news/?a=111604)
Quote
Every news about the new Fantastic Four reboot seems to upset the fans even more, but what does Marvel think about the movie at this point? Well, we might have the answer in the new Punisher issue from last week.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Bastard Walt on November 28, 2014, 04:46:18 pm
Wow, it took a lot of reading to get that joke. There's barely any likeness to the actual actors because of the shoddy artwork.
That's my main gripe with comics these days, they rely so much on colorists making everything look amazing via adding volume through shading, that they're completely disregarding the quality of the line art. Ugh. #Opinion
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: 【ＭＦＧ】gui0007 on November 28, 2014, 04:54:14 pm
That's my main gripe with comics these days, they rely so much on colorists making everything look amazing via adding volume through shading, that they're completely disregarding the quality of the line art. Ugh. #Opinion
Agreed Walt.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on November 28, 2014, 07:06:12 pm
That BS blur effect >_<
Title: Re: Marvel Cinematic Universe: Strange is Benedict Cumberpatch!!
Post by: ShadowArm on December 18, 2014, 06:45:12 pm
I'll take that bet and raise you 1,000,000. The spies are not even at the Xavier school, they are at the JGS.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on December 19, 2014, 01:21:54 am
I call BS, and if one is in the Xmen, It won't be a major character, it'll be some throw away new student.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on December 19, 2014, 02:03:35 am
it was it was two of them actually, the whole reason why spiderman is at the JGS is to find them. No one knows but the readers obviously. On another note, sad that pichelli isn't on All New X-men anymore, that art is so gorgeous.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Sky79 on December 19, 2014, 04:02:55 am
Thanks Dirty :sugoi:
Lord forbid they have actual character development of established characters *cough cough* Marrow *cough cough* F***ing hacks *cough cough*
Nah, lets just play it safe
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on December 19, 2014, 04:04:16 am
marrow was in the last version of X-force, but it got cancelled (again) so yea....
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: ShadowArm on December 19, 2014, 09:53:54 pm
since marvel and Remendo is throwing shit at the fan like if there's no tomorrow, it will be a main character
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on December 19, 2014, 10:20:22 pm
no, it won't that would make no sense, and fit no logic, and what is happening in avengers books doesn't always carry over into X-men books, so the whole hydra agent thing might not even carry over. As I mentioned, they were already revealed during jason aaron's last few issues of wolverine and the X-men.
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: ShadowArm on December 19, 2014, 10:34:46 pm
and something atleast makes sense on marvel nowdays, with the hinted reboot next year, they will probably find away to make another X-men be a Spy and it will be a main character only to sell more
Imagine if Magneto was Sleeper Hydra Agent since he was Totured by the Red Skull?
Or Maybe Magic, Rogue, If don't... maybe Emma, they really want to pull out a Secret Invasion 2.0 before the Secret wars to screw up the entire universe before the reboot on Secret Wars(by there disney would have enough money to buy back X-Men from Fox without problems)
the last thing we need now is that at the end of Secret wars and Convergence, Both Marvel an D Multiverses are Linked up Again, like at the end of JLA/Avengers, since Morrison and john Hickman are communicating with each other and both are close friends
Title: Re: Marvel Universe discussion (no filthy muties allowed)
Post by: Neocide on December 19, 2014, 11:01:29 pm
it won't be Magik, Magneto, or Rogue or emma or any of the top names. The whole secret wars isn't between heroes in the same universe, it's between different universes entirely.
Again the whole Hydra thing was something done in Captain America, and it's been known that things like this may play in one book, but are totally ignored in another. Most of the X-men characters you mentioned are written under bendis, who by all means ignores continuity all the time to write his own stuff. So chances of any of that happening are slim to none.