The Mugen Fighters Guild

Art & Entertainment => Fighting Games => Topic started by: GTOAkira on March 09, 2018, 12:23:32 am

Title: Super Smash Bros Ultimate
Post by: GTOAkira on March 09, 2018, 12:23:32 am
Super Smash Bros is coming to Nintendo Switch in 2018!

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DXzPRoFUQAAm1QL.jpg)



Characters confirmed so far :
-Inkling
-Link
-Mario
And base on this picture : Samus, Kirby, Donkey Kong, Bowser
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty

Will post the trailer when it gets uploaded to youtube
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: drewski90 on March 09, 2018, 12:26:49 am
i guess they're starting over? the rumors say that it'll have the wii u and 3ds content meaning all the stages exclusively on the wii u and 3ds will be here

but aside from that i'm very excited for this

we finally get to see link in his different attire, mainly the breath of the wild attire
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: DNZRX768 on March 09, 2018, 12:30:50 am
Argh, someone beat me in making the thread about the game.

Anyway, it was at least three years ever since the last entry. Seems to be the right time to announce the game.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on March 09, 2018, 12:37:18 am
I posted this in the Nintendo news thread, but just repeating here since we have an actual thread to discuss it in now.

So since we know BotW Link is in this game, time to speculate.  Would it be worth losing the older Twilight Princess Link for this one?  I feel if it's just a skin, it would not do the character justice, especially as the new outfit's not exactly iconic, you try to lose it ASAP in the game for better gear.  Plus previous Link equipment doesn't carry over to the new Link at all.

I'd rather they make him a new character with a new movepool.  Name him Link, rename the old one we've had thus far to something else (Hero of Time could work, maybe, since BotW is the only time in-game they mention him being canonically called Link?  Though then you have all the manga and other sources that state otherwise, of course).  Then you can really apply BotW's new mechanics into Smash, with the breakable limited time weapons a la Robin in Smash 4 and all the little tricks that tablet can do like blocks of ice and time stopping.

Another issue arises with BotW Link becoming the default one though; what do we do with Ganondorf?  He does not have a human form in BotW.  We've been stuck with TP Link just so Ganon had a matching counter-part, but now what?  I would greatly enjoy a what-if new design for human Ganon like we got with Sheik getting a Twilight Princess design, but that may be asking for too much.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Kirishima on March 09, 2018, 12:39:07 am
Marth is at the center of the logo with what appears to be Toon Link next to him.  Feminine figure next to Bowser and Kirby is either Peach or Zelda.

There was a leak about this that name dropped the Inklings and also claimed Ice Climbers will also be featured.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: drewski90 on March 09, 2018, 12:43:45 am
ganondorf will return in his hyrule warriors attire soon
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Kirishima on March 09, 2018, 12:48:58 am


E3 cant come fast enough.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on March 09, 2018, 12:51:40 am
ganondorf will return in his hyrule warriors attire soon
Ugh, please, I hope not.  That thing was so doofy looking, with that mane.  Reminds me of SFV's Akuma.

The more I look at that silhouette of Samus the more I see Smash 4's Other M (https://www.ssbwiki.com/images/e/e4/Samus_SSB4.png) appearance, rather than Samus Returns (https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/metroid/images/0/08/3DS_MetroidSamusReturns_char_01.png/revision/latest?cb=20170617175630).  Or at least some mash-up of Brawl's Prime interpretation (https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/ssb/images/2/27/Samus_Clear_SSBB.png/revision/latest?cb=20160118005549) and whatever additions they'll have in store for Prime 4.

Oh well.  It would be the quick answer to just use Smash 4's model, I suppose.  Well, I hope they at least lose the ridiculous jet heels for Zero Suit.  I'm not going to hold onto hope for Ridley, when they were so set against him appearing, but at least some touch-ups to make the slim Metroid representation better.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: NamelessOnlinePlayer on March 09, 2018, 12:56:55 am
Glad about a new Smash coming. Hope I can get to buy a Switch this year.
Given that Link is using his BOTW attire, what could be more likely: a port with some character redesigns or a brand-new game? There's no Bandai-Namco or any third-party names in the trademarks, so I'm a bit curious on it.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: drewski90 on March 09, 2018, 12:57:23 am
ganondorf will return in his hyrule warriors attire soon
Ugh, please, I hope not.  That thing was so doofy looking, with that mane.  Reminds me of SFV's Akuma.

The more I look at that silhouette of Samus the more I see Smash 4's Other M (https://www.ssbwiki.com/images/e/e4/Samus_SSB4.png) appearance, rather than Samus Returns (https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/metroid/images/0/08/3DS_MetroidSamusReturns_char_01.png/revision/latest?cb=20170617175630).  Or at least some mash-up of Brawl's Prime interpretation (https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/ssb/images/2/27/Samus_Clear_SSBB.png/revision/latest?cb=20160118005549) and whatever additions they'll have in store for Prime 4.

Oh well.  It would be the quick answer to just use Smash 4's model, I suppose.  Well, I hope they at least lose the ridiculous jet heels for Zero Suit.  I'm not going to hold onto hope for Ridley, when they were so set against him appearing, but at least some touch-ups to make the slim Metroid representation better.

yeah, i'm hoping to see which pokemon will be here and which won't

probably pikachu will be here from the look of the silhouette group
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: RoySquadRocks on March 09, 2018, 01:01:12 am
Pac-Man better be in this installment!!!
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: R565 on March 09, 2018, 01:02:56 am
Pac-Man better be in this installment!!!

My guess it's a complete edition with a few more fighters and other things.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on March 09, 2018, 01:06:59 am
I sincerely doubt you have any need to worry about Pikachu in relevance to ANYthing related to Pokémon.  Presume Charizard will be safe as well, considering its immense popularity as well.  We all assumed Jigglypuff was cut out last game, but it appears legacy matters more than relevance in some cases, as long as it doesn't break the game like Ice Climbers, so I'll just say for Jigglypuff she's going to be fine.  Apparently the one from the original anime has become relevant again in the Sun and Moon one anyways, so there's always that too.

I'm less certain on Greninja.  He had his time in the sun with the X/Y anime series really boosting his popularity, but that's done and done.  And it has no use in the latest games.  I could see Greninja getting the boot for Decidueye.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: drewski90 on March 09, 2018, 01:08:20 am
Pac-Man better be in this installment!!!

My guess it's a complete edition with a few more fighters and other things.

meaning it'll have the biggest stage roster ever
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: R565 on March 09, 2018, 01:29:09 am
Pac-Man better be in this installment!!!

My guess it's a complete edition with a few more fighters and other things.

meaning it'll have the biggest stage roster ever
EXACTLY.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Person Man on March 09, 2018, 01:45:42 am
And the Smash wishlisting begins once again. :P  It's most likely going to be an enhanced edition of the Wii U release, so I wouldn't hold your breath for too much more content.  Maybe 4 or 5 new characters at best, I'd wager.

That being said, if they're not porting this one to 3DS too they have no excuse not to bring Ice Climbers back.  I wouldn't mind seeing Charizard go back to being Pokemon Trainer either.  Also literally anything more from the Mother series.  There's no chance of another Mother character, but at least they could bring back Fourside or New Pork City.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on March 09, 2018, 01:58:56 am
I dunno about condensing Charizard back to Red and the others.  I felt splitting the character between three states just made it less fun to play overall.  It gets rid of Red, Squirtle and Ivysaur, sure, but there wasn't a whole lot to them to begin with.  I'd rather Charizard feel like a complete character, and maybe see about doing the same for the other two (Granted, that would fill the roster with even more Pokémon, but perhaps offset that by making them Blastoise and Venusaur instead?  Same general moveset concept, just larger.  Getting the original trio all in there would be a nice treat)

Ditto on more Mother though.  Paula would be fun with her frying pan and more devastating magic.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Uche_of_MFG on March 09, 2018, 03:15:11 am
I'm too hyped. I need to see MORE!!! MORE, DO YOU UNDERSTAND ME, NINTENDO?!!!
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: TrinitroRoy on March 09, 2018, 12:41:17 pm
I already predicted before that there wouldn't be a Smash for Switch...
...but MAN! I'm glad I was wrong!
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: 地獄の花 on March 09, 2018, 12:49:31 pm
when i saw the trailer i thought it was a parody and they were staring at some ku klux klan burning cross.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: TrinitroRoy on March 09, 2018, 12:59:57 pm
Also, friendly reminder: (https://res.cloudinary.com/teepublic/image/private/s--FofXtZha--/t_Preview/b_rgb:ffffff,c_limit,f_jpg,h_630,q_90,w_630/v1446247468/production/designs/309455_1.jpg)

Not to say that this is actually the case, but it's a funny theory nonetheless
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: R565 on March 09, 2018, 05:53:35 pm
People have been meme crazy with the thing the inkling girl saw.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: drewski90 on March 09, 2018, 06:03:06 pm
People have been meme crazy with the thing the inkling girl saw.

i saw that on twitter as well
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Person Man on March 09, 2018, 06:16:05 pm
Someone took a stab at trying to identify all the silhouetted characters:

(https://i.redd.it/666x9sx1dnk01.jpg)

Seems legit.  Only one that's not really clear enough to guess is the figure between Samus and Bowser.  That circle looking thing behind them could either be the Monado or the trails of Ike's headband.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Kirishima on March 09, 2018, 07:04:35 pm
A thought just came to me.

Let's assume this is Smash 5.  How would you all feel if this follows a format similar to that of Street Fighter V in terms of how future character seasons and contents are distributed?  Say that we start off with a small roster the size of Melee's cast sans Hidden characters and will have a lengthy lifespan along the way.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Speedpreacher on March 09, 2018, 07:15:07 pm
Now is this hypothetically taking the place of the traditional Smash unlockable content, or are we talking just extra seasons of chars, stages and possibly items

Because I firmly support expansion packs, but not if it means sacrificing the joy I get out of a new stage being unlocked
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Neo_Fire_Sonic on March 09, 2018, 07:30:05 pm
Someone took a stab at trying to identify all the silhouetted characters:

(https://i.redd.it/666x9sx1dnk01.jpg)

Seems legit.  Only one that's not really clear enough to guess is the figure between Samus and Bowser.  That circle looking thing behind them could either be the Monado or the trails of Ike's headband.

.... Or snakes headband
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Person Man on March 09, 2018, 07:47:51 pm
Snake's never coming back.  Konami still owns the rights to Metal Gear and they only make pachinko machines and bad decisions now.

A thought just came to me.

Let's assume this is Smash 5.  How would you all feel if this follows a format similar to that of Street Fighter V in terms of how future character seasons and contents are distributed?  Say that we start off with a small roster the size of Melee's cast sans Hidden characters and will have a lengthy lifespan along the way.

Selling a watered down version of a previously released game on a different console with plans to sell back the rest of the game piece by piece as DLC would be the worst decision Nintendo could possibly make.

Besides, Sakurai would never do it.  Back during Smash 4's development he straight-up refused to talk about even the possibility of DLC until the full main game was complete. 
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Koop on March 09, 2018, 09:29:28 pm
All of the Nintendo games with DLC are complete games with the DLC created after the main game's development.

Smash games don't have very long development times compared to other games. Smash 4 had a two year development time and 51 characters were in the game at launch.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: GTAguy on March 09, 2018, 09:56:32 pm
Oh boy... New console means a Smash Bros game is coming.
Still don't know if this is a new game or not, but i think it's just a port with even more updates.
If the Inklings are in, what other new characters get we to see in this game? I see that Spring Man from Arms is highly requested next to Rex from Xenoblade Chronicles 2. Aside from these chars, i see King K. Rool still keeping asking, but never got a chance to be playable or a assist trophy. If not, then Sakurai needs to tell why he won't include him in the game. (He must be allergic to crocodiles if you ask me)
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Jango on March 09, 2018, 10:00:17 pm
Because King K. Rool hasn't been relevant since... that one Donkey Kong game with the bongos, iirc.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: GTAguy on March 09, 2018, 10:13:40 pm
Because King K. Rool hasn't been relevant since... that one Donkey Kong game with the bongos, iirc.

Yeah, but that doesn't prove anything. He's being the most requested character since Brawl.
The tiki masks or those vikings Snomads, which aren't memorable villains than the Kremling'ss or the Koopa's in the Mario series.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Jango on March 09, 2018, 10:25:50 pm
Unless King K. Rool comes back in a big way in a big Nintendo title, he's got no chance at all. We were lucky he got a costume in the last Smash.

Like seriously, probably the only other character in the Donkey Kong franchise that has a chance of getting in Smash is Dixie Kong since she was in Tropical Freeze, but even THAT is a pretty big stretch.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: NamelessOnlinePlayer on March 09, 2018, 10:35:20 pm
A thought just came to me.

Let's assume this is Smash 5.  How would you all feel if this follows a format similar to that of Street Fighter V in terms of how future character seasons and contents are distributed?  Say that we start off with a small roster the size of Melee's cast sans Hidden characters and will have a lengthy lifespan along the way.

If most of the characters are free, fine by me; otherwise, no.
If this game will have paid-DLC characters, Sakurai and HAL should just stick to newcomers and guest characters like NRS did with Injustice 2.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on March 09, 2018, 11:31:09 pm
Unless King K. Rool comes back in a big way in a big Nintendo title, he's got no chance at all. We were lucky he got a costume in the last Smash.

Like seriously, probably the only other character in the Donkey Kong franchise that has a chance of getting in Smash is Dixie Kong since she was in Tropical Freeze, but even THAT is a pretty big stretch.
It's been a while since I've played a Donkey Kong game, but do any of the newer ones past DK64 have villains nearly as memorable or at least used in more than one game?  The only one I've heard of is this frozen kingdom Viking guy from Tropical Freeze.

I'd take a more liked character who's been out of the game for a while over a newer less impressive one, personally.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Person Man on March 09, 2018, 11:43:31 pm
It's been 19 years since K. Rool was the big bad in a main line DK game back in Donkey Kong 64, and 11 years since he was the villain in a spin-off (Jungle Climber).  Since then he's been relegated to cameos and oblique references at best.

Honestly I'd say Dixie Kong would have priority over him - if DK gets any more characters in the first place, that is.  She's been around nearly as long as he K. Rool has, and remained a lot more popular and relevant.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on March 09, 2018, 11:56:11 pm
Oh no, I agree, I should clarify.  I do see Dixie being a higher priority if DK gets another character into the roster.  I'm just saying from the villain's standpoint, has anyone really mattered or stood out in those 19-11 years since?  Because if no one really cares about them, and there's enough fan feedback asking for a DK villain to show...I don't see it really mattering how long ago it was since he last showed up, he's the one people are asking for and it would gather positive attention to them.

I mean, it is supposed to be an all-star showdown, not a showcase for what's up and coming or at least relatively new, after all.  Likely one of the contributing factors why so many people were not happy with Corrin last game, regardless of the new playstyle.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Person Man on March 10, 2018, 12:29:58 am
I think people were unhappy with Corrin because that pushed the Fire Emblem character count up to about 12 dozen while series like Star Fox and Metroid continued to get shafted.

And K. Rool is considered to be the de facto main antagonist of the Donkey Kong franchise by merit of being the most recurring.  The baddies in the DKCR games were just random one-time mooks, IIRC.  If the criteria was solely "we have to include a villain from Donkey Kong" then yes, K. Rool would be the best pick, but in the larger scheme of things I don't see any reason to include him now.  Considering the likelihood that this is just an enhanced port, I'd actually rather DK not get any new characters at all so that what few spots are open could go to other under-represented series.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Do not even ask on March 10, 2018, 02:51:46 am
sorry but if there's no New Funky Mode in this game then i'm afraid i'm gonna have to pass on it

also i think this thread is in the wrong subforum my dudes
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on March 10, 2018, 03:00:31 am
Old joke is old.

So, not that we have much to go off of, but anyone expecting them to retain the guest stars Smash 4 had?  Pac-Man was largely in thanks to the contribution from Bandai Namco, but I couldn't imagine them turning down the opportunity to show up again.  Same with Sega and Sonic. (And I'd hope Tails and Knuckles finally)  But I'm less certain with Capcom and more-so with Square specifically for Cloud.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: GTOAkira on March 10, 2018, 05:10:38 am
https://twitter.com/MissGandaKris/status/972294985834835968
(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DX5JITQVAAAmpW3.jpg)
Yoshi-Pit-DK-Peach-Ness-Marth-Mario-Link-Sheik-Pikachu-Samus-Kirby-Zelda-Bowser-Fox-CaptainFalcon-Wario
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: drewski90 on March 10, 2018, 05:33:12 am
it looks like zelda will have the same attire instead of the breath of the wild attire from the way she looks
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on March 10, 2018, 05:41:10 am
Zelda herself didn't actually do a whole heck of a lot related to combat in Breath of the Wild (Not that Ocarina of Time or Twilight Princess had her do what Smash does with her.  Closest being OoT, just that she stole Link's magic he earned) so as far as she's concerned it's probably easy enough for them to just give her a skin for BotW, or the other way around should BotW be her new default look.

Still wondering what they'll do for Ganondorf should BotW be her default as well though.  Should Twilight Princess Zelda remain the default, though, at least he then could do the same.  Though that would be rather awkward, unless BotW Link is indeed a separate character from regular Link.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: DarkWolf13 on March 10, 2018, 06:06:43 am
Just bring Wolf back and it's all good for me. That's all who I wish for to return. If not... I don't give a damn cuz the announcement of this had sold me completely I decided to get a Switch later in the year.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Moon Girard on March 10, 2018, 07:44:22 am
The original twitter that image came from said those are his guesses not the actual confirmed characters there hence Zelda's silhouette not really matching the actual silhouette in that spot. I also don't think there is anyway Link would go to the BoTW design while Zelda doesn't Shiek, Wolf and Roy shows Sakurai has no problem with making changes to designs to keep series characters looking consistent to each other.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Rai Tei on March 10, 2018, 02:44:22 pm
Snake's never coming back.  Konami still owns the rights to Metal Gear and they only make pachinko machines and bad decisions now.

Konami fired 1 very expensive dude to save the company, which includes reviving Bomberman with 2 new games, making Yugioh playable again, doing shit with Castlevania and Zone of the Enders. These are actually good decisions viewed from a business standpoint.
But unpopular opinion, I guess.

It's not farfetched to see Snake in Smash again, although Simon Belmont would have been the better choice.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Neo_Fire_Sonic on March 10, 2018, 03:30:32 pm
Snake's never coming back.  Konami still owns the rights to Metal Gear and they only make pachinko machines and bad decisions now.

Konami fired 1 very expensive dude to save the company, which includes reviving Bomberman with 2 new games, making Yugioh playable again, doing shit with Castlevania and Zone of the Enders. These are actually good decisions viewed from a business standpoint.
But unpopular opinion, I guess.

It's not farfetched to see Snake in Smash again, although Simon Belmont would have been the better choice.

HAHAHAHA try playing it now, also what about richter belmont  he'd be cool
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: ShinSamus on March 10, 2018, 04:38:46 pm
I'm really looking forward to this game.  :heart:

Honestly...I loved the last game so much, I don't mind at all if it is an upgraded WiiU+3DS version with new characters and modes added. It's by far the most balanced Smash game, and in my opinion the most fun entry in the series.

So long as it has a great online mode, I'll be happy.
(Also, maybe a stage creator similar to Mario Maker would be AMAZING)
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: 1Ultima on March 10, 2018, 07:17:37 pm
It would be interesting to see if Cloud does return. Especially since S.E seems to be pushing Noctis a lot recently. Although the 7 remake is being worked on.

it'll also be interesting to see how Ganondorf is in this game. Will they add inspiration from BOTW and Hyrule Warriors? Although anything's better then being a Falcon clone i guess.

Another Xenoblade rep would be really cool. Question is from X or 2?
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Rai Tei on March 10, 2018, 09:20:34 pm
HAHAHAHA try playing it now, also what about richter belmont  he'd be cool

Been playing since hayday, haven't stopped since.
But this topic isn't about Yugioh or Konami, so let's not go that way :)

And yeah, Richter would probably be the better choice if you would choose a Castlevania character.

Ganondorf als a Falcon clone has always bothered me, such iconic character wasted as a asset swap.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Xhominid on March 10, 2018, 10:54:03 pm
It would be interesting to see if Cloud does return. Especially since S.E seems to be pushing Noctis a lot recently. Although the 7 remake is being worked on.

it'll also be interesting to see how Ganondorf is in this game. Will they add inspiration from BOTW and Hyrule Warriors? Although anything's better then being a Falcon clone i guess.

Another Xenoblade rep would be really cool. Question is from X or 2?

I can see it being Rex rather than anyone else due to him having the most obvious potential like Shulk.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on March 11, 2018, 04:40:09 am
Meh...

...Is Bomberman still a pipe dream or not? Yeah, Konami. But R WAS a Switch launcher... Doubting it though. Even then, best case scenario, they'll base him off that and even worse, not give him + explosions...
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: TrinitroRoy on March 13, 2018, 12:58:42 pm
Snake's never coming back.  Konami still owns the rights to Metal Gear and they only make pachinko machines and bad decisions now.
Super Bomberman R was a good decision, though.
Fight me.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: vgma2 on March 15, 2018, 05:18:27 am
If we get a Konami rep, I'd imagine we'd likely see Bomberman over Snake again.
That said, I woudn't mind seeing Snake again.  I actually liked his kit in Brawl.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on March 15, 2018, 06:06:53 am
I would imagine adding Snake would do nothing but help Konami's public image, which they desperately need.  They have the basic groundwork for the character already built thanks to Brawl, just update it, maybe throw some alternative skins like for MGSV and actual guns thanks to Bayonetta more or less throwing that "no guns" rule out the window.  Nothing that we know of that prevents them from having more than one rep, there's room for both Snake and Bomberman at this table.

Just like there's room for both Pac-Man and Klonoa.  Right, Bandai Namco?
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Cazaki on March 15, 2018, 06:35:47 am
Snake's never coming back.  Konami still owns the rights to Metal Gear and they only make pachinko machines and bad decisions now.

Konami fired 1 very expensive dude to save the company, which includes reviving Bomberman with 2 new games, making Yugioh playable again, doing shit with Castlevania and Zone of the Enders. These are actually good decisions viewed from a business standpoint.
But unpopular opinion, I guess.

It's not farfetched to see Snake in Smash again, although Simon Belmont would have been the better choice.

Kojima's known as the lifeblood of the company, with the cancelled/rushed games and the release of games like Metal Gear Survive along with the fact that the future of the company being flat out uncertain I don't know if I can agree with all of this being good decisions. Now if it needed to be done in order to save the company then I can see what you mean but I haven't read anywhere that that's indeed the case.

Pretty sure we won't see Snake again, and I'm pretty much okay with not having guest characters at this point because I didn't particularly enjoy them last time around. Except for Sonic he's a natural fit into the game IMO
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on March 15, 2018, 06:42:55 am
I dunno, so long as they pertain to really large video games, I'm personally fairly open to more crossovers.  It's mainly a Nintendo all-star game, but the more the merrier.  But then I'm the weird one who's perfectly fine with them having Banjo-Kazooie over so long as it includes Master Chief. (I mean come on, you'll have playable Haloid.  How is that not cool?  Even if it is regulated to being 343's Chief with that scummy looking redesign... (https://cdna.artstation.com/p/assets/images/images/001/578/484/large/kyle-hefley-chief-page-01.jpg?1448913192))

Though on the flip side, I'd rather they focus more on their first party characters that need to show before said guests.  Of all these possibilities from popular ports, I'd rather Waluigi as a joke character before Solaire or Dovahkiin or Crash Bandicoot as a serious contender.

Pertaining to the guest characters we already have though, it's been two games and I'd love for Sonic to be joined by Tails and Knuckles this time around.  If they're feeling generous Sonic can get Shadow and Silver skins, but just the main trio being in the game is good enough for me.  It was fine just being Sonic in Brawl, but I was genuinely surprised they skipped the opportunity for the other two in Smash 4, instead just dropping off some Mii costumes for them.  Surely it would have been time better spent than messing around with Lucina and Dark Pit?  Yeah, they required less effort, but the payoff would have been better
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Speedpreacher on March 15, 2018, 07:05:30 am
As long as Sonic is ostensibly a multi-platform character I don't want them to add anymore characters from his franchise but him as anything other than trophies and assists. If they want to add another Sega rep that's fine (and they have, although Bayo's pretty much a Nintendo character at this point), and there are plenty of avenues to take but I cannot in good conscience start wishlisting for Sonic characters to fill up roster spots.

No, not even him.

Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on March 15, 2018, 07:18:52 am
Typically that I could agree with, because it would get insane having everyone from a guest appearance from just one series show up.  It's like if now that we have Cloud that Tifa, Aerith, Yuffie and Sephiroth became mandatory.  But I feel this is a particularly special case.  Sonic has a unique relationship with Nintendo and Mario specifically, transitioning from rivalry to having crossover games multiple times now.  It would be one of the few times that it feels more out of place not getting special treatment than just having Sonic and calling it a day.

And don't hide it, we know you were thinking of how well Big the Cat would fit in Smash.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: nick. on March 15, 2018, 09:55:15 am
:( Travis when
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Kirishima on March 15, 2018, 12:06:55 pm
actual guns thanks to Bayonetta more or less throwing that "no guns" rule out the window. 
I don't think you get the difference between fantasy guns and actual real-life guns.  For starters, her guns don't even cause flinching.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on March 15, 2018, 12:37:31 pm
...That wasn't the point.  Guns were banned from Smash so long as they don't resemble actual guns, not for acting like real guns.  Everyone that had some variant of one had a very sci-fi fake looking gun, like Samus and Fox.  Bayonetta broke this rule.  It would not be out of the question for Snake to then get a pass as well, as far as I'm concerned.

I'm not concerned as to how it works mechanically in the game.  It can just add damage without flinching like Fox, it can be a projectile down smash, I don't care.  I was just noting how they can make it look less fake now.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on March 15, 2018, 12:42:13 pm
...Is there going to be a Forces stage instead of Windy Hill? And Cap Kingdom? An Arms stage at the very least would be neat that could replace Boxing Ring but doubt it...

Windy Hill was ugly garbage, but better than Brawl Green Hill and MKU was too much.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: NamelessOnlinePlayer on March 16, 2018, 11:26:21 pm
Found this on ResetERA (GAF's replacement) and thought it'd fun to speculate about it:
(http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/001/351/181/9dd.png)
Basically, Ridley might become a playable character this time around if what those mods at ERA are saying is true.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on March 17, 2018, 01:32:31 am
Presuming for a minute that there's any weight to that, if by some miracle Samus is updated to reflect her most recent attire like Link and possibly Mario if that is Cappy, would that make this Proteus Ridley (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KXHoEWLl7tA) or just plain old Ridley?  I'd imagine it would be more beneficial for it to be plain Ridley, but it's always weird when only select characters are up to date with changes.  Also then have to pick between which Ridley, which I would hope not be Other M's Ridley.  Besides Other M being the cesspool it is, that's also not...actually Ridley.  I mean, it is, but it's not, it's a cloned baby and it just looks different than normal and they just wanted to make him look more scary for the new game.

I actually think should he be in, and not Proteus, they would probably use a smaller updated version of Brawl's (https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/metroid/images/1/12/RidleySSBB.jpg) over the Other M version in Smash 4.  Just to help alleviate any confusion to more casual fans that would see screenshots of a big Ridley from Smash 4, and want to know how to play Giga Ridley in Smash 5.

...Barring his final smash isn't turning big, that is.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Person Man on March 17, 2018, 02:52:24 am
Ah, there we go.  It's not a true Smash game without a cavalcade of bullshit fake leaks.  So many uncles who work at Nintendo.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: drewski90 on March 17, 2018, 03:02:28 am
oh boy here we go

wouldn't it take too much space

how much space is ridley again?
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: DNZRX768 on March 18, 2018, 02:11:00 pm
Meh, with regards to the fake news and leaks roaming about, I'll wait until something pop up on official channels (like the Nintendo YouTube channel) before I get excited. It is always like this during the lead up to the official release with every Smash game, fake news everywhere.

Why does it always happen with the Smash series and not with other (fighting) video game series? No one give out fake news with SNK or Soul Calibur on this kind of scale?
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Rai Tei on March 18, 2018, 04:41:52 pm
Well, it happened to Capcom with MVC3, MVCI and SFV.
It's just that Smash has a broader audience, mostly because it's more of a casual party game.
Just to be honest, fighting games never had that much going on over here after the 90s fad.
I believe it's still a huge thing in Asia and America, not sure about the rest here in world.

Kojima's ........

But this topic isn't about Yugioh or Konami, so let's not go that way :)

I understand Konami being famous and of course a lot are still sad things happened between them and their beloved Kojima.
But please, if you have to, open a topic for it, tag me, and I'll gladly discuss it with you over there.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on March 20, 2018, 10:49:01 pm
https://twitter.com/FUNimation/status/973274075580821510

Funimation teasing Nintendo about possibly adding Goku to Smash.  What could possibly be taken out of control by this tweet?

...Do it, Nintendo.  Just do it.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on March 21, 2018, 03:20:47 am
Too bad Funimation missed the whole "they have to be from a video game" standard that isn't a little known fact.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: no1wammy on March 21, 2018, 03:55:28 am
I'm sorry guys, but I have to vent. Because I don't get it.

WHY DOES EVERYONE WANT GOKU FROM DRAGON BALL TO BE ON SUPER SMASH BROS.!?

What would be the significance of Goku? First anime/manga character to appear on Smash, is that it? What could Goku bring not just to Smash, but to the entire video game community? I'm trying to wrap my head around this, and I just can't figure it out. It seems that Nintendo has been searching specifically for video game characters who've made a lasting imprint on their platform and/or video game history:

Pac Man: First non-Pong, non-space shooter game, most iconic and successful, birth of booms for both Atari, individually and all of video games, globally
Sonic: Representative of Nintendo's former rival Sega
Solid Snake: Creator Hideo Kojima and Smash producer Masahiro Sakarai are personal friends, became first 3rd party character in Smash game
Megaman: Megaman 2 was best seller for Nintendo, also started out in Nintendo consoles
Ryu: Representative of the fighting game boom
Cloud: Representative of most successful of Final Fantasy games (VII), even though he was not in Nintendo (Playstation)
Bayonetta: Winner of Smash Bros. poll
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on March 21, 2018, 04:34:35 am
Well, Dragon Ball arguably has the most tie in video games of any property. Ever. Even with Star Wars in mind. That alone makes me want him more than those last two...

...But still not much. Also, it's been proven fairly recently that Mario is more iconic than Pac-Man. Still doesn't explain Dr. not being an just alt fully though. I'd even have to throw in that characters like Crash and Bomberman are more known/greater to gaming/further lasting than Bayo is globally. FE characters aren't known globally, Mother wasn't before Smash, Falcon wasn't known as anything other than a one-off compared to his car, Ice Climbers weren't but I don't even consider them characters/franchise/memorable at all personally...
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: vgma2 on March 21, 2018, 05:53:48 am
I'm sorry guys, but I have to vent. Because I don't get it.

WHY DOES EVERYONE WANT GOKU FROM DRAGON BALL TO BE ON SUPER SMASH BROS.!?
For the memes.  That's literally it.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Kirishima on March 21, 2018, 05:59:02 am
WHY DOES EVERYONE WANT GOKU FROM DRAGON BALL TO BE ON SUPER SMASH BROS.!?
It's a meme at this point.  Best follow tradition.

He makes more sense than Dark Pit.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: NamelessOnlinePlayer on March 21, 2018, 06:15:53 am
I'm sorry guys, but I have to vent. Because I don't get it.

WHY DOES EVERYONE WANT GOKU FROM DRAGON BALL TO BE ON SUPER SMASH BROS.!?

I can think of some possible reasons:
1.- Ever since Brawl brought the concept of third party characters into reality, people just blew it out of the water and started to think the likes of Goku were possible.
2.- With many "rules" (they're mostly fan-made, only a few really have any sort of validity) being broken thanks to Sm4sh, some people think there's only a way to out-top the likes of Ryu ("no more than one 3rd party company rep") and Cloud ("character must be important to Nintendo") and that's bringing Goku in.
3.- Memes and shitposting that never succeeds at making me laugh.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Project.13 on March 21, 2018, 06:19:15 am
Personally, I'd much prefer Crash for Smash than Goku, but Smash fan-games that have Goku playable actually have me interested in how he would play. He's always been fun to me in the fan games he's been in and it gets me wondering and curious about how Nintendo would handle actually having Goku in it.

Edit: I'd also be pretty hype over seeing Sora from Kingdom Hearts in Smash.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on March 21, 2018, 06:47:10 am
More or less what other people have summarized, but it's pretty simple.  Smash has been a display of big important fictional figures fighting.  Until Brawl, it remained confined to Nintendo only.  Then Brawl started loosening the rules with Snake and Sonic, plus not-specifically characters from video games but related to them, thanks to R.O.B..  Then 4 gave even less restrictive guidelines than before, with multiple reps for Capcom, "no guns allowed" Bayonetta showing up and so on.

So basically, yeah, you're on the money.  First manga/anime character to show up in Smash.  Minus the small legion of anime swordfighters already dominating the game, anyways.  Dragon Ball's had an extensive history with Nintendo, and shouldn't need to be argued as to how popular the series and the character of Goku specifically is.

Would there be better choices that fit Smash specifically beforehand?  Sure.  Would Goku work, should they be so inclined?  I'd like to think so.  Granted, it would be as silly as if Sony's PlayStation All-Stars went and added Tony Hawk, but still.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: no1wammy on March 21, 2018, 06:55:59 am
Edit: I'd also be pretty hype over seeing Sora from Kingdom Hearts in Smash.

Sora is an interesting case. I feel the same way with him like I do Goku...

But there's a twist. Many Disney games have been on Nintendo, with the early titles being mostly produced by Capcom, a current Smash rep. Sora being first introduced in Kingdom Hearts technically makes him a Disney character, not a Final Fantasy character. Disney's significance to Nintendo may give Sora a leg up in a future appearance. Though I do worry about him appearing on Smash, for Sora could be a symbol of Smash jumping the shark.

So yeah, Sora could end up being a double-edged sword.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on March 21, 2018, 07:08:39 am
I'm confused.  How do you feel the same way about Sora being in as if Goku was in, while the twist is how bad it would be for Smash's consistency.  Did you want Goku in, then?

Sora would require more hoops to jump through thanks to the Disney ties, but it's not outside the realm of possibility as I see it.  There was already the first step taken of including Sora in Final Fantasy titles like World of Final Fantasy.  Disney can be negotiated with, and while FF mixing with Disney was the whole concept behind Kingdom Hearts, I'd venture it was more risqué of Disiney to have Sora go outside KH messing with uncensored Final Fantasy compared to if they want Sora in the more family friendly Smash.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: PBRTODD101 on March 21, 2018, 07:32:15 am
I'm sorry guys, but I have to vent. Because I don't get it.

WHY DOES EVERYONE WANT GOKU FROM DRAGON BALL TO BE ON SUPER SMASH BROS?
He is arguably THE most iconic manga/anime character worldwide. Doesn't matter if he's not from a video game, and from a gameplay perspective, his moveset and normals would be pretty insane (fuck me if I know how they would go about impleting his numerous transformations though).

I'd say that's reason enough.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: no1wammy on March 21, 2018, 07:35:23 am
I'm confused.  How do you feel the same way about Sora being in as if Goku was in, while the twist is how bad it would be for Smash's consistency.  Did you want Goku in, then?

I personally don't want Goku in. All it will do is provide a path to adding anime characters that have little or no connection to Nintendo or the video game industry. Same with Sora: because he's Disney, it might infuriate a few companies. Say for example Nickelodeon wants to get involved, because Nickelodeon and Disney are rivals. I honestly don't recall a single video game starring a Nickelodeon character that has made an important impact for Nintendo or the video game industry. Who in Nickelodeon would they put in Smash to rival Sora? During the Smash poll contest, I saw a few candidates that made me feel uncomfortable of where the game could be heading. One time, I saw somebody suggest Dreamworks Shrek as a guest - I said to myself, really?

This was what I meant with Sora being a double-edged sword.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on March 21, 2018, 10:50:10 am
Battle for Bikini Bottom. Still regarded as one of the best tie in games ever. If you mean more important then that, then there really is none.

...The biggest reason Sora would be bad/worse than Goku is because Nickeleodeon or "rival" characters might join? How would having SpongeBob vs. Ryu in a company made game be bad? It would attract an extremely wide array of players. Are you fearing it would become Punch Time Explosion 2? Shrek was just as much of a meme choice as Goku and we all know it. Sora is most likely a serious suggestion from most.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Rai Tei on March 21, 2018, 11:24:01 pm
. It seems that Nintendo has been searching specifically for video game characters who've made a lasting imprint on their platform and/or video game history:

Pac Man: First non-Pong, non-space shooter game, most iconic and successful, birth of booms for both Atari, individually and all of video games, globally
Solid Snake: Creator Hideo Kojima and Smash producer Masahiro Sakarai are personal friends, became first 3rd party character in Smash game


Pac-man was one of the first, if not fhe first of videogame mascot.
That's probably one of the main reasons.

Personally I thought Snake was a really weird inclusion, because he didn't really fit in like Sonic did.
You know, most of cast being colorful fantasy or cartoon orientated characters.

Snake would totally fit into another crossover mentioned here though, Playstation Allstars.
Then, for some reason he didn't, so we got Raiden instead?
SquareEnix also declined to include Cloud, because they didn't want him in a thirdparty game.
But then he's in Smash4. It's just a rant though.

And about Funimation tweeting Nintendo, do they even have any saying in this?
Wouldn't that be the role for Shueisha, Bandai Namco, Toei or Toriyama himself?
Don't they just have the dubbing and publishing rights for the anime in the US?

Anyways, I wouldn't mind them including Goku, some of my friends would go insane too.
But it really seem like an odd inclusion for a (Nintendo)  videogame icons game.
Than we're talking Disney.
If I am not mistaken, Nintendo had some history of publishing Disney characters that goes way back in the days from before they even did videogames. So their business should be even more relevant than some videogame companies.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Walruslui on March 21, 2018, 11:36:45 pm
dudes youre all yelling about a game that hasn't even revealed whether or not its even a port or not yet.

i don't think there is any point in discussing why or why not certain characters should be in or not because frankly at this point nintendo can do whatever the fuck they want with any franchise.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on March 22, 2018, 12:03:45 am
Even Mega Man and Sonic? And Street Fighter? I wouldn't mind if they took Pac-Man over though... Wishful dreaming...
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on March 22, 2018, 12:06:02 am
But that's what's fun about the wait.  Coming up with inane ideas and watching them burn.

Yes, no one should be skyrocketing their hopes for the unlikely.  But this little back and forth is just all in good fun.

Now add Goku so I can start petitioning for why they haven't added Usagi yet.  Then we can work on Darth Vader with his scorpion transformation.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on March 22, 2018, 12:31:56 am
Wait, who's Usagi. Actually... Which one?

I don't really see what's so inane about Bomberman compared to Goku, but that's just me. Yes, Konami. But...
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: drewski90 on March 22, 2018, 12:44:05 am
Wait, who's Usagi. Actually... Which one?

I don't really see what's so inane about Bomberman compared to Goku, but that's just me. Yes, Konami. But...

i think he means usagi from one piece?
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on March 22, 2018, 12:46:43 am
Sailor Moon.  Popular anime joke, only got Japanese releases with their games so it'd be like Marth and Roy, never mind it.  Dumb low-effort joke.

I was more referring to the clearly bizarre choices like Goku and the memes others brought up.  Bomberman is not impossible and would fit fine.  Likewise, don't expect anything drastic until we have more concrete news on the game.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: DNZRX768 on March 22, 2018, 01:25:47 pm
I agree with everyone that Goku for Smash is mostly a meme at this point. It has been so overdone at this point that I think we are beating a dead horse at this point.

I personally do not care for Goku regardless he gets in or not. He gets in? So what? I use Pikachu almost exclusively in the series (with the occasional Mii-brawler, Wii-Fit Trainer, and Charizard for the latest in the series). Goku will be just another punching bag for me to beat up, like what he is in my MUGEN program. He does not get in? No big loss for me at all.

I think that there are other characters far more obscure that deserves the spot more than Goku (and Cloud from FF7). How about some character from Namco-Bandai or even SNK. Those could use some attention and I actually might use a character from SNK.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on March 22, 2018, 01:44:02 pm
I gotta be real towards that. "Good, I guess." At least the middle portion... After Pac-Man last game, I don't think I could trust another Namco character. Like ever. SNK, though...? Even Konami or another Capcom character seem more likely.

We do realize Miku supposedly won the ballot in Japan, right? Things could have been much... Different. And more melodic, not even counting the Choir Boys rumor. Now that would be a mess.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: DNZRX768 on March 22, 2018, 03:04:10 pm
I guess my ultimate point is that opening the floodgates to characters not heavly related to Nintendo was a big mistake. Sure, I might have cheered to the fact that Snake and the rest of the third party characters are in (except for Cloud), but there is a line that shall not be crossed. Goku getting in will be dancing across the line and paving the way to even stupider things. If we took the time to include everyone that people want, then what's the difference between Smash and a very "trendy" MUGEN?

I threw in Namco-Bandai because they are cooperating on a good number of Nintendo games. I threw in SNK partially to illustrate how bad this inclusion fest can become if we use even the most bare of reasons to justify inclusion...
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on March 22, 2018, 03:30:23 pm
Well, Mugen would still have KFM. We know how much he's critical. And the aforementioned OCs. Nintendo could never replace or insert those, Nintendo's mortal like the rest of us.

Yeah, Cloud and Bayo were all Snake's fault. There's nothing to worry about, Goku won't get in. I can at least be sure of that in this bizarre period of gaming. That, and no indies either. Smash 4's reign of pure unadulterated nonsense is thankfully over.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Rai Tei on March 22, 2018, 06:24:48 pm
Well, if I am not mistaken, Bandai Namco developed Smash 4 in cooperation with Nintendo.
So a mascot from their IPs might have been part of the deal.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Cyborg Sun on March 22, 2018, 06:31:59 pm
Nintendo has just announced that they are holding a Smash Bros. Invitational at E3 this year. This may mean there will be a Smash trailer before E3, but only time will tell.
https://twitter.com/NintendoVS/status/976790642314522624
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: The Street Fighter on March 23, 2018, 04:31:14 am
Since pre-Brawl, I will still support my most wanted newcomer. King K. Rool. That's all I need for the new game.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: DNZRX768 on March 23, 2018, 01:13:21 pm
Nintendo has just announced that they are holding a Smash Bros. Invitational at E3 this year. This may mean there will be a Smash trailer before E3, but only time will tell.
https://twitter.com/NintendoVS/status/976790642314522624

Ooh, an invitational.

Too bad I can't attend. In fact, who can?
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Koop on March 23, 2018, 02:30:28 pm
People selected by Nintendo so it will be some fgc players and some youtube personalities.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on March 23, 2018, 02:36:54 pm
Great, now they'll NEVER shut up that Nintendo themselves talked to them... The YT ones at least.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Walruslui on March 23, 2018, 10:47:22 pm
"oh geez, the company who makes all my videogames i love wants me to attend their event!"

how is that a bad thing. if anything its a good move for Nintendo since theyre known to be kind of a dick to YT'ers
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Darkflare on March 24, 2018, 04:25:36 pm
Right, I'm a believer of "Goku will never be in Smash"

In fact, I believe in "If your origins aren't from a video game, your chances of being in Smash are absolute zero."
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Kirishima on March 24, 2018, 04:32:10 pm
People selected by Nintendo so it will be some fgc players and some youtube personalities.
Little did they know, Reggie's secretly getting massive prep time in case of facing the winner of the invitational.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: TrinitroRoy on March 24, 2018, 05:12:33 pm
*is sitting in the corner, hoping for Ice Climbers to return as well as Roy from FE not getting scrapped*
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on March 24, 2018, 05:19:06 pm
There is little reason for them not to reintroduce Ice Climbers nor remove Roy unless this turns out to be a new game of such extreme magnitude that they'd have to rework every character enough that they lacked the time to work on Smash 4's DLC.  Which while I'm in the camp it's a new game, I don't think it's going to be at the expense of previous characters.  Except the low effort clones like Dark Pit and Lucina, they can pretty much all go and get merged with their original characters as a skin.  I would like Dr. Mario to remain, though, keeping the original Mario moveset, while new Mario gets to mess around with Cappy and/or F.L.U.D.D., and Roy's got enough different going on for him that he should be fine.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Cyborg Sun on May 09, 2018, 05:33:44 pm
Super Smash Bros. Invitational 2018 players revealed. I barely know who a quarter of these people are (After all, I'm just casual trash), but I'm glad we'll see guys who actually know what they're doing for a first showing of the game.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: TrinitroRoy on May 14, 2018, 10:27:36 am
Also:

Namco Bandai is probably returning as Co-Developers again, meaning that playable Pac-Man would be easily a guarantee if this really turns out to be true.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: StevenB on May 14, 2018, 11:54:51 am
I hope that aside from Pac-Man they are also able to realise a Tekken character this time around (since Sega and Capcom had two reps as well; Sonic/Bayonetta and Mega Man/Ryu). I read in an interview that they considered Heihachi but couldn't get the complicated Tekken movesets to work in Smash so they dropped him. I'd be very interested to see if they could pull off Heihachi this time.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Darkflare on May 14, 2018, 04:00:01 pm
They could look over at his appearances in PSASBR and SFxT.

Although, how they would treat Just frames is another matter.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on May 14, 2018, 06:28:27 pm
It'll be a sad and incredibly desperate day when Nintendo has to look at Sony for anything other than Crash.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on May 14, 2018, 06:51:00 pm
Ignoring the clear buddy duo act of Spyro being along with Crash?

I don't really mind one way or another if Bandai Namco is working on the new game, seeing Smash was fine with or without them, but building rumors upon rumors, this just makes it harder to tell at this point if it's just revamping the last game or an entirely rebuilt game.  The former favors more previous characters getting ported over, the later suggests a better built game taking criticism in from the start.

I'm kinda leaning to wanting it to be a whole new thing, but I won't be upset if it's Smash 4.5 if it lets us keep Cloud.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Person Man on May 23, 2018, 03:02:58 am
Take this for what you will. (https://www.eventhubs.com/news/2018/may/21/rumor-new-leaks-claim-simon-belmont-ridley-and-ice-climbers-are-coming-super-smash-bros-nintendo-switch/)  Vergeben is reporting a new leak from a "verified source," which claims that Ridley and Simon Belmont will be newcomers for Smash 5, and also that Ice Climbers will be coming back.  He's also claiming that it's a full-fledged sequel and not just a WiiU port, and that everyone from Smash 4 is returning, including all 3rd party characters.

On the one hand, this is the same guy who accurately leaked TMNT for Injustice 2 and Groh for Soul Calibur 6, so it's not impossible that this is legit.  On the other hand he's also the same guy responsible for that bullshit MvCI leak that had Apollo Justice and Star-Lord and such, so he could also be full of shit this time too.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: RoySquadRocks on May 23, 2018, 03:07:10 am
Not sure if this is true or not, but I'll be glad if my main Pac-Man makes a return again.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: drewski90 on May 23, 2018, 03:15:43 am
Not sure if this is true or not, but I'll be glad when my main Pac-Man makes a return again.

and i'll be glad if greninja returns with an ash-greninja form this time
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on May 23, 2018, 03:46:53 am
I mean, I would play both of those characters, plus it just being an objective good to return Ice Climbers, so I'm down with it.  But I question the thought process to add Simon before re-adding Snake back in.  I mean, he could have just not added that fact that Snake is in as well, but it would seem a highlight to me.  And an outright replacement would be odd, given Snake himself is still more relevant than the Castlevania series, and Simon's not even the last big thing in the spotlight.

I also echo what I said last discussion about Ridley.
Presuming for a minute that there's any weight to that, if by some miracle Samus is updated to reflect her most recent attire like Link and possibly Mario if that is Cappy, would that make this Proteus Ridley (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KXHoEWLl7tA) or just plain old Ridley?  I'd imagine it would be more beneficial for it to be plain Ridley, but it's always weird when only select characters are up to date with changes.  Also then have to pick between which Ridley, which I would hope not be Other M's Ridley.  Besides Other M being the cesspool it is, that's also not...actually Ridley.  I mean, it is, but it's not, it's a cloned baby and it just looks different than normal and they just wanted to make him look more scary for the new game.

I actually think should he be in, and not Proteus, they would probably use a smaller updated version of Brawl's (https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/metroid/images/1/12/RidleySSBB.jpg) over the Other M version in Smash 4.  Just to help alleviate any confusion to more casual fans that would see screenshots of a big Ridley from Smash 4, and want to know how to play Giga Ridley in Smash 5.

...Barring his final smash isn't turning big, that is.
While there are a number of things many take issue with Other M, rightfully so, one of the things that irks me a lot is the character design changes on Samus and Ridley.  Smash 4 got away with using them as they were technecally still the last relevant source to cite for them, but with Samus Returns, I'd much rather something that wasn't a purple flesh mound with random jutting spikes and flappy beak-lips like something out of Lovecraft.  Or just base him on the original Metroid as much as you can, him being human-sized back then.  Would still look weird, but at least make some sense out of his height.

One other thing about this hypothetical.  If we're to expect all previous characters from 4 to return, for the love of god, give new movesets to Lucina and Dark Pit to really differentiate them.  Now that we've established that they're locked in the game, do something better with them?  Otherwise they simply are just character skins taking up space in the roster.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Person Man on May 23, 2018, 04:03:32 am
^ At a guess, I'd speculate Konami would want literally anyone other than Snake in the spotlight at this point, because anything Metal Gear related will just stir up all the backlash they got over Kojima's departure.

And don't be talking mess about my boy Dark Pit.  He's perfect just the way he is.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on May 23, 2018, 04:06:19 am
Ridley should be a red flag that the leak is not true. Sakurai already denied him, and Simon is somewhat of a doubt because his official creator left Konami.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Person Man on May 23, 2018, 04:12:07 am
FWIW, Sakurai has also gone on record saying that having Miis or an Animal Crossing character would never be feasible in Smash Bros either.  Dude's allowed to change his mind.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on May 23, 2018, 04:14:15 am
He did? Well, fuck then.

I mean, I can doubt his idea on Ridley changing... Wait, I thought he wasn't the leader of this Smash game?
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: NamelessOnlinePlayer on May 23, 2018, 04:45:27 am
On the one hand, this is the same guy who accurately leaked TMNT for Injustice 2 and Groh for Soul Calibur 6, so it's not impossible that this is legit.  On the other hand he's also the same guy responsible for that bullshit MvCI leak that had Apollo Justice and Star-Lord and such, so he could also be full of shit this time too.

In Vergeben's defense, Max corroborated that part as legit. Though he said in a recent video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V91IwEq7JTY) (look at minute 7:00) that Season 2 wasn't a thing anymore. Maybe it's a case of canned content.
And on the topic of Rids, I imagine he might be similar to the Brawl Legacy XP mod version of him with aerial grabs and long-range attacks.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Speedpreacher on May 23, 2018, 05:35:15 am
Simon is somewhat of a doubt because his official creator left Konami.

IGA didn't create Simon Belmont. Although even if he did there'd be no obstacle, as they clearly are not against using the character. (https://www.konami.com/games/castlevania/gos/)

Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on May 23, 2018, 05:43:18 am
Oh, right, I totally forgot that was a thing.  I was thinking the Netflix Castlevania anime was the last big project for the series, and that was focused on Trevor and Alucard rather than Simon.  Well, there goes my point, then.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Darkflare on May 23, 2018, 06:38:51 am
Going to call BS just for Ridley. Unless they're making a mode where you can play as the bosses, I absolutely cannot see Ridley as a feasible playable character without destroying his character, something Smash simply does not do.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: GTAguy on May 23, 2018, 11:48:08 am
I can understand for the Ice Climbers. But for Ridley and Simon, not so much.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Rai Tei on May 23, 2018, 03:08:08 pm
Going to call BS just for Ridley. Unless they're making a mode where you can play as the bosses, I absolutely cannot see Ridley as a feasible playable character without destroying his character, something Smash simply does not do.

Samus "High heels" Aran? xD
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on May 23, 2018, 11:53:01 pm
As someone who hates those stupid jet heels (But loves the concept if they just stuck to the actual jet boots she actually has) the Smash 4 version of Zero Suit Samus is hardly compromising her character.  Though I would still like some official canon recognition about her paralyzer apparently turning into a lightsaber/whip, since Smash is the only place that's a thing (And Haloid, now that I think of it, which...did that come first, before Brawl?  Did Smash steal a fan concept?) the character still very much looks like and acts like Samus, if more along the lines of Other M Samus.

Ridley is simply a complicated character to design for Smash without some form of backlash.  I mean, I wouldn't even be against him being as big as he canonically is, with slow attacks but helped by boasting superarmor, if Sakurai focuses more on the "it's just for fun" design of Smash moreso than competitive viability.  Just have tournaments ban him.  But people would be upset with that approach too, because many would want another regular use character rather than a "joke".  Which is totally understandable, but as has been said numerous times, when you shrink him you get a split as to how to make it still feel like a giant space dragon who eats people whole to heal and jostles Samus around in his claws yet still fit in with the rest of the crowd.

Speaking of eating people
(https://s3.amazonaws.com/AZComics/comic372.png)
I'm reminded that he kinda would be the darkest character in Smash, a straight-forward mass-murdering human-eating villain, and I've wondered if that might also sway Sakurai away from putting more effort into trying to make him fit?  It is still a happy fun time party fighting game they're advertising.  Granted, Bayonetta made it in but even censored she's still an odd one out in the roster.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on May 23, 2018, 11:56:47 pm
Fox never had a hexagon light shield until Sakurai couldn't think of anything else for Down-B, I mean.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Kirishima on May 24, 2018, 12:58:07 am
Ridley is gonna have a gigantic hitbox making him combo fodder to the likes of Fox, Meta-Knight, and Pikachu so it makes no difference if he gets in or not.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Person Man on May 24, 2018, 01:23:16 am

Ridley is simply a complicated character to design for Smash without some form of backlash.  I mean, I wouldn't even be against him being as big as he canonically is, with slow attacks but helped by boasting superarmor, if Sakurai focuses more on the "it's just for fun" design of Smash moreso than competitive viability.  Just have tournaments ban him.  But people would be upset with that approach too, because many would want another regular use character rather than a "joke".  Which is totally understandable, but as has been said numerous times, when you shrink him you get a split as to how to make it still feel like a giant space dragon who eats people whole to heal and jostles Samus around in his claws yet still fit in with the rest of the crowd.

If Smash was at all concerned about maintaining canon with the original series, we wouldn't have more than half of the characters we do now.  Capt. Falcon never leaves his race car, Ness can't use most of the PK attacks he has in Smash, Wii Fit Trainer/Villager/Mr. Game & Watch never even had anything that could be referred to as an attack.  Most of the movesets for most of the characters are entirely original for Smash.

I think Ridley could be made to work easily.  Make him 1/2 to 3/4 the size he was as a boss in Smash 4 (https://i.ytimg.com/vi/LDy6J58dXZY/maxresdefault.jpg) so he's still big, but not too much bigger than everyone else.  Make him a heavyweight powerhouse like Bowser, with strong aerials and a shitty ground game.  Bam.

Quote
I'm reminded that he kinda would be the darkest character in Smash, a straight-forward mass-murdering human-eating villain, and I've wondered if that might also sway Sakurai away from putting more effort into trying to make him fit?  It is still a happy fun time party fighting game they're advertising.

You wanna talk dark characters?  Lucas' backstory makes Ridley look like a kitten.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on May 24, 2018, 01:33:33 am
Now, I never played Mother 3 because I'm not that good at Japanese and I've never arsed to try the fan translation because there's always a new rumor about how it's coming out soon for the Wii/Wii U/Switch, but from my understanding...

Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Person Man on May 24, 2018, 02:17:04 am
Spoiler: Mother 3 spoilers (click to see content)

Canon stories don't matter all that much in Smash, but even if they did Ridley killing people wouldn't change much.  Ganondorf is implied to have killed loads of people.  All of the Fire Emblem characters explicitly kill people in their games too.  Fox and Falco have killed dozens of enemy pilots, Wolf probably even more.  Bayonetta's entire franchise is about murdering angels in order to fulfill a deal with Satan.  If Sakurai can work around all that, Ridley's fine.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Duos.act on May 24, 2018, 03:04:14 am
I just wanna pop in and say that Snake was in Brawl.  The entire Metal Gear series is based around themes of war, government surveilance, the devaluing of human life, military states, global conspiracies, nuclear weapons, torture, unethical government practices and various other degrees of global and sociopolitical conflict.  And that's all played completely straight when Kojima isn't breaking the fourth wall and making poop jokes at the expense of his characters.  Hell, Brawl came out right before (and explicitly promoted) arguably the darkest game in the series at the time, where Snake fights against brainwashed female soldiers in creepily sexual gimp suits (at least one of which is a rape victim) and drags himself through a microwave hallway that graphically burns his skin.  There's a lot you could use against Ridley, but I don't think him being a "dark" character is at all substantial.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Rai Tei on May 25, 2018, 12:32:29 pm
Kirby is way worse, swallows and eats anything in it's path and has no remorse for doing so.
Think of the Waddledees.....
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: DNZRX768 on May 25, 2018, 01:33:39 pm
Are people still talking about Ridley for Smash?

Didn't we all had this conversation years ago?
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: 1Ultima on May 25, 2018, 02:01:03 pm
We did.
And we'll continue to have this conversation every time a new Smash game is announced as people know that bringing up Ridley is easy hype money.

Surprised King K.Rool hasn't been brought up yet tbh.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: DNZRX768 on May 25, 2018, 02:04:05 pm
King K. Rool shows up time to time, but the meme is all about the Ridley.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Alex Sonico on May 25, 2018, 02:54:34 pm
May I remind you people of a fan game called Super smash bros Crusade? Ridley is in it.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Darkflare on May 25, 2018, 10:14:30 pm
Fan made Smash games tend to add whatever the eff they want with not much thought including anime characters if they really want to.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: The Street Fighter on May 25, 2018, 11:10:50 pm
Could be legit. Sakurai does like Ridley a lot, trying to be faithful to his incarnations in each installment.
He has had issues with him being playable in the past, but as with Villager, Mii's and Pac-Man, Sakurai could have taken his time to finally make Ridley fit. Remember how surprised Sakurai was when he was told that he was not only going to direct Smash 4, but for two consoles, which is stated was quite a surprise. Now, he knew more of the project himself, and might have used more time to figure out how to improve. Remember how single player was lackluster in Smash 4, and the disaster that was Smash Tour? All result in a rushed project, but trying to make it work.

Because of all of this, Smash for Switch will most likely be more focused work. So, Ridley being in the roster sounds quite legit to me. I'm sure that, "IF" Ridley will join the roster, then E3 is the BEST time to announce it, as Nintendo will win E3 by default, and the internet will blow up.

Belmont is not much of a stretch, really. Snake and the whole Konami vs Kojima makes sense that Belmont would make it. Remember that Sakurai stated that Castlevania and The Legend of Zelda II were the two games that changed his view of video games. So, if Sakurai likes Castlevania, why would Simon be much of a stretch?

Also, the only reason Ice Climbers didn't make the cut was because of hardware limitations. They are Smash characters, legacy, cult classic, and fans love them. Of course they are coming back, easy call.

So, do I believe this? I'm neutral. Do I think it's possible? Yes, very much so. Just a couple weeks left, and if Rids finally becomes part of the game, may King K. Rool & Waluigi also get their time to shine too. Just because, why not? Give me more reasons to actually purchase a Switch.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on May 25, 2018, 11:37:14 pm
Waluigi is nothing more than a meme choice, that's the thing. Even Goku has more solidity than him, due to his history and anime icon status. Waluigi doesn't have any oomph, any character, any real anything in any Mario game backing him like... Even Rosalina? Rosalina at least had a story. All Waluigi has is a random Mario Kart stage. If Sakurai were smart, he'd make a Waluigi Pinball stage to cash in on the meme.

Ice Climbers are a legacy in what? Smash? Certainly not their original and only game. Balloon Fight is the cult classic, and we already got a trash stage off of it.

Sakurai can like Castlevania as much as he wants, it means nothing if Konami won't reply or deny.

Cloud and Bayonetta wrecked the meta enough. Ridley would be the giant baby that would destroy the womb that is Smash, I guess.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Duos.act on May 25, 2018, 11:56:47 pm
I agree, it seems unnecessary to include characters that have no preexisting legacy of their own.  It's not Smash's job to make icons out of obscure characters.

Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on May 26, 2018, 12:26:24 am
Falcon got the anime. Where do you think the Falcon Punch came from? The same place Reflector did?

Surprised you didn't say Game and Watch. He's... A gray area though. Not really a true character before Melee, but not complete BS either...
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Darkflare on May 26, 2018, 12:34:19 am
Falcon got the anime. Where do you think the Falcon Punch came from? The same place Reflector did?
Actually yes.

The original Smash Bros came before the F-Zero anime.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Person Man on May 26, 2018, 12:49:01 am
Falcon got the anime. Where do you think the Falcon Punch came from? The same place Reflector did?

Super Smash Bros. original Japanese release date:  January 21, 1999.

F-Zero: GP Legend anime original premiere date:  October 7, 2003.

Swing and a miss.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Duos.act on May 26, 2018, 02:04:35 am
Where do you think the Falcon Punch came from?

Sakurai's ass.

Either way my point stands.  Smash Bros is not just there to give you your favorites, it's also there for Nintendo to promote less famous characters.  I used Falcon as an example because he was a literal nobody before Smash 64.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: The Street Fighter on May 26, 2018, 10:50:00 am
Soon you will all bow down to Doshin the Giant.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Rai Tei on May 26, 2018, 02:04:44 pm
Either way my point stands.  Smash Bros is not just there to give you your favorites, it's also there for Nintendo to promote less famous characters.  I used Falcon as an example because he was a literal nobody before Smash 64.

Fire Emblem became a massive hit in the west because of Smash, so yeah good point.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Duos.act on May 26, 2018, 06:47:25 pm
I would say F-Zero owes no small amount of its popularity to Captain Falcon's presence in Smash Bros.  Pretty much his entire persona came from the way he's portrayed in those games.  You could easily make the case that the story mode for GX and pretty much the entire anime would not be the way that they are if not for Smash turning him into a toku hero back when his only traits were being a bounty hunter that also races.  Kid Icarus is the same way, Pit had literally zero personality until Brawl brought him in as a goofball kid hero and then we got Uprising out of that.  Smash Bros pretty much gives these characters a chance to get a new lease on life.  And even so, like it or not, these guys are a part of Nintendo's history.  They may not be doing Mario or Pokemon sales numbers, but they're irreplacable nonetheless.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on May 26, 2018, 07:12:04 pm
F0X would have still done very well with or without Smash 64. Smash most likely helped shed more light on GX and the original, but X was considered yet another 64 classic.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Duos.act on May 26, 2018, 09:04:42 pm
X predates Smash 64 by a year.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Alex Sonico on May 27, 2018, 01:33:04 am
Where do you think the Falcon Punch came from?

Sakurai's ass.

Either way my point stands.  Smash Bros is not just there to give you your favorites, it's also there for Nintendo to promote less famous characters.  I used Falcon as an example because he was a literal nobody before Smash 64.

The same can be said for Ness. Earthbound wouldnt be a cult classic if he wasn’t included in 64 or Melee.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Speedpreacher on May 27, 2018, 01:49:41 am
That's not what cult classic means

If you want to argue there'd be no Mother 3 without it you'd probably be right
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Japanese Jesus on May 27, 2018, 04:36:23 pm
Waluigi is nothing more than a meme choice, that's the thing. Even Goku has more solidity than him, due to his history and anime icon status. Waluigi doesn't have any oomph, any character, any real anything in any Mario game backing him like... Even Rosalina? Rosalina at least had a story. All Waluigi has is a random Mario Kart stage. If Sakurai were smart, he'd make a Waluigi Pinball stage to cash in on the meme.

Ice Climbers are a legacy in what? Smash? Certainly not their original and only game. Balloon Fight is the cult classic, and we already got a trash stage off of it.

Sakurai can like Castlevania as much as he wants, it means nothing if Konami won't reply or deny.

Cloud and Bayonetta wrecked the meta enough. Ridley would be the giant baby that would destroy the womb that is Smash, I guess.

It's the fifth game in the series, dude. I think it's time to start adding obscure and minor characters such as Waluigi and whomever, because who else is there left?
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: TrinitroRoy on May 28, 2018, 10:49:54 am
Waluigi is nothing more than a meme choice, that's the thing. Even Goku has more solidity than him, due to his history and anime icon status. Waluigi doesn't have any oomph, any character, any real anything in any Mario game backing him like... Even Rosalina? Rosalina at least had a story. All Waluigi has is a random Mario Kart stage. If Sakurai were smart, he'd make a Waluigi Pinball stage to cash in on the meme.

Ice Climbers are a legacy in what? Smash? Certainly not their original and only game. Balloon Fight is the cult classic, and we already got a trash stage off of it.

Sakurai can like Castlevania as much as he wants, it means nothing if Konami won't reply or deny.

Cloud and Bayonetta wrecked the meta enough. Ridley would be the giant baby that would destroy the womb that is Smash, I guess.

It's the fifth game in the series, dude. I think it's time to start adding obscure and minor characters such as Waluigi and whomever, because who else is there left?

Pink Gold Peach
*runs*
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Rai Tei on May 28, 2018, 12:59:59 pm
Let's add another swordsman and have those already complaining, complain even more! :D
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Neo_Fire_Sonic on May 28, 2018, 06:36:46 pm
Let's add another swordsman and have those already complaining, complain even more! :D

no lets add another bayonetta character that no one wanted
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: vgma2 on May 28, 2018, 07:33:08 pm
At this point, the only thing that would disappoint me in terms of character additions is if the new characters don't revolve around a special mechanic or playstyle that makes them unique.  Smash 4 set the bar pretty high by having nearly every newcomer have one of those, with Mac's power meter, Rosa's Luma, Shulk's stances, etc.  The character itself could be anyone, and I'd be fine as long as they've got something really cool going for them in their gameplay.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Duos.act on May 28, 2018, 09:05:16 pm
Let's add another swordsman and have those already complaining, complain even more! :D

no lets add another bayonetta character that no one wanted

Right, that character that no one wanted that won a popularity contest spanning every video game character to ever appear on a Nintendo console. 
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on May 28, 2018, 09:33:49 pm
The one that was chosen out of 3 popularity contest winners because one was most likely a meme or joke, and the other was a singing robot schoolgirl.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: DNZRX768 on May 29, 2018, 01:34:00 pm
So, any actual news of the game, or are we just talking and waiting for more news?
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Kanbei on May 29, 2018, 02:17:47 pm
Come on guys E3 is just less then a week away.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: WumpaFruit96 on May 29, 2018, 04:25:14 pm
The one that was chosen out of 3 popularity contest winners because one was most likely a meme or joke, and the other was a singing robot schoolgirl.

Eh. I'd rather have Hatsune Miku over Bayonetta.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Duos.act on May 29, 2018, 09:47:44 pm
The one that was chosen out of 3 popularity contest winners because one was most likely a meme or joke, and the other was a singing robot schoolgirl.

That's not what happened?  She was within the top 3 most voted characters for the US and Japan, and was the number 1 most voted in Europe.  There's no way you can spin this that doesn't end with her winning the contest clean.  Take a statistics class or something.  Any way you slice it she came out on top above every single character included on a Nintendo system, including first party characters.  To say "nobody wanted her" is not just factually wrong, it's completely baseless.  Now if you say YOU didn't want her, that's a different story and you can't argue against that.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Neo_Fire_Sonic on May 29, 2018, 10:08:18 pm
The one that was chosen out of 3 popularity contest winners because one was most likely a meme or joke, and the other was a singing robot schoolgirl.

That's not what happened?  She was within the top 3 most voted characters for the US and Japan, and was the number 1 most voted in Europe.  There's no way you can spin this that doesn't end with her winning the contest clean.  Take a statistics class or something.  Any way you slice it she came out on top above every single character included on a Nintendo system, including first party characters.  To say "nobody wanted her" is not just factually wrong, it's completely baseless.  Now if you say YOU didn't want her, that's a different story and you can't argue against that.

top 5, in everywhere, not just us and japan and thanks to europe we all got someone no one wanted

and i too would rather have some meme or joke instead of bayonetta
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Speedpreacher on May 29, 2018, 10:41:02 pm
That is the most asinine thing I've ever heard

I don't give a shit about half the Pokemon they put in, that doesn't mean I'd rather them put some half-assed character because it's all about me and fuck everybody else

She was the highest ranking character in the poll that they could do so they put her in and that's the end of it

And she's pretty much a Nintendo character now because they're the only ones licensing her games so you might as well get used to her
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on May 29, 2018, 10:49:50 pm
I'm not upset at her in the slightest. I was just stating facts.

Now, Cloud on the other hand...
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: ShiroTori on May 29, 2018, 11:14:52 pm
Honestly, I'd rather Sakurai and Nintendo just call the shots for characters at this point. All this fan input is headache inducing.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on May 29, 2018, 11:21:09 pm
...Cloud what?  Certainly Cloud was wanted and popular, just considered impossible due to preconceived rules about third-party characters.  Not without some form of basis, mind you, but not so rigid that they couldn't be bent enough to allow one of the biggest RPG characters out there in.

Unless you mean you're completely against all characters that don't put Nintendo first, regardless of their status and popularity.  In which case....sorry?  Smash certainly is Nintendo focused, but when opportunity arises to bring other huge names into the fold, people are going to want it.  Like, imagine they want to represent the FPS genre (other than Samus, which Metroid Prime is a far cry from your typical FPS anyways) and the option for Master Chief or Gordon Freeman comes up?  That would be a huge draw.

Oh my god, could you imagine Gordon Freeman using the gravity gun for far-ranged grabs, though?  That would be awesome/terribly broken.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Person Man on May 29, 2018, 11:34:26 pm

top 5, in everywhere, not just us and japan and thanks to europe we all got someone no one wanted


What combination of drugs do you have to be on to interpret "This character won a popularity contest spanning 3 entire continents" as "nobody in the world wanted this character".
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on May 29, 2018, 11:42:21 pm
I mean that I personally do not like Cloud at all. That was all I meant.

They already have Mario and Yoshi to represent the FPS genre, I mean... Who else would they choose? Doomguy or B.J. Blastowitz?
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Orochi Gill on May 29, 2018, 11:44:58 pm
What the fuck?

Mario and Yoshi were in one shooter and it was an obscure Super Scope rail shooter on the SNES (Yoshi's Safari)

I think it's time to stop
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on May 30, 2018, 12:00:14 am
Also yes, they would choose DoomGuy.  The series has got history with Nintendo, and still has an exclusive what with Doom 64.  Heavily censored compared to the likes of Doom 4, obviously, like Bayonetta went through, but you can still get away with things like the Plasma Gun or BFG9000.  Not sure how you'd go about fitting in the signature Super Shotgun because you're not losing that, but hypothetically DoomGuy can be made to fit in.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Duos.act on May 30, 2018, 04:41:54 am
The one that was chosen out of 3 popularity contest winners because one was most likely a meme or joke, and the other was a singing robot schoolgirl.

That's not what happened?  She was within the top 3 most voted characters for the US and Japan, and was the number 1 most voted in Europe.  There's no way you can spin this that doesn't end with her winning the contest clean.  Take a statistics class or something.  Any way you slice it she came out on top above every single character included on a Nintendo system, including first party characters.  To say "nobody wanted her" is not just factually wrong, it's completely baseless.  Now if you say YOU didn't want her, that's a different story and you can't argue against that.

top 5, in everywhere, not just us and japan and thanks to europe we all got someone no one wanted

and i too would rather have some meme or joke instead of bayonetta

Have you considered auditioning for the circus?  Because those are the most impressive mental gymnastics I've seen in a while. 

Honestly, I'd rather Sakurai and Nintendo just call the shots for characters at this point. All this fan input is headache inducing.

Of course I believe everyone is entitled to feel however they do about any character's presence or exclusion.  I only take issue when I see complete ignorance used to justify either.  These games aren't being sold to a sole individual, so to disregard the tastes of thousands because one person disagrees is more than a little questionable. 
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: TrinitroRoy on June 03, 2018, 01:13:06 pm
Remember how Nintendo added a what the fuck NES character to Melee with Ice Climbers?
And then a what the fuck NES character to Brawl with ROB?
And then a what the fuck NES character to Smash 4 with Duck Hunt?
I want the what the fuck NES character of Smash Bros for Switch to be Mike Jones from StarTropics, and I just couldn't care less how unlikely his addition would be.
I know he wont be in Smash Bros for Switch, but that still wont stop me from dreaming, damn it!
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on June 03, 2018, 08:15:03 pm
What about Star Man from Pro Wrestling? Would be interesting to have a grappler. And then they could reboot that and have the game reach a whole new audience.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: The Street Fighter on June 03, 2018, 08:31:02 pm
Most likely it will be Takamaru, but ...

I'd like it to be either Balloon Fighter with a gameplay focused around air-game. Or, Lip from Panel De Pon, being a summoner of those blocks.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: TrinitroRoy on June 04, 2018, 01:12:08 pm
I'd like it to be either Balloon Fighter with a gameplay focused around air-game. Or, Lip from Panel De Pon, being a summoner of those blocks.
Can I marry you, please?
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: DNZRX768 on June 08, 2018, 03:27:53 am
E3 can't come quickly enough. Hopefully, the reveal trailer will shed some light on a few things.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Rai Tei on June 10, 2018, 01:59:17 pm
Most likely it will be Takamaru, but ...

I can see a lot of people swearing about too many swords xD
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: no1wammy on June 10, 2018, 06:52:44 pm
Don't know the validity of the post, so take it with a grain of salt. Even if it was posted to Twitter on May 30.

https://twitter.com/TannerLPer/status/1001940499429814273

Listed companies based on copyright: Nintendo, Pokemon/Creatures/Game Freak, Intelligent Systems, Sega, Capcom, Bandai Namco, Square Enix, Konami

Speculate.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Seadragon77 on June 10, 2018, 07:10:44 pm
Don't know the validity of the post, so take it with a grain of salt. Even if it was posted to Twitter on May 30.

https://twitter.com/TannerLPer/status/1001940499429814273

Listed companies based on copyright: Nintendo, Pokemon/Creatures/Game Freak, Intelligent Systems, Sega, Capcom, Bandai Namco, Square Enix, Konami

Speculate.

Sounds like an upgrade of Smash 4 with Simon Belmont/Bomberman/Solid Snake (Take your pick) thrown in... oh god, does that mean the joke characters that are the Animal Crossing Villager and the Wii Fit Trainer are still there and there is also an overabundance of Fire Emblem crap???
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: EndlessDream on June 10, 2018, 07:22:56 pm
I have a gut feeling that Rex from Xenoblade 2, and characters from ARMS will be included.

If Rex is in there, I hope he's not a blatant clone of Shulk.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on June 10, 2018, 07:39:49 pm
Looks like Simon wasn't a lie then.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: WumpaFruit96 on June 10, 2018, 08:17:40 pm
Don't know the validity of the post, so take it with a grain of salt. Even if it was posted to Twitter on May 30.

https://twitter.com/TannerLPer/status/1001940499429814273

Listed companies based on copyright: Nintendo, Pokemon/Creatures/Game Freak, Intelligent Systems, Sega, Capcom, Bandai Namco, Square Enix, Konami

Speculate.

Sounds like an upgrade of Smash 4 with Simon Belmont/Bomberman/Solid Snake (Take your pick) thrown in... oh god, does that mean the joke characters that are the Animal Crossing Villager and the Wii Fit Trainer are still there and there is also an overabundance of Fire Emblem crap???

What are you talking about?
They still haven't announced more yet. Calm down.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Person Man on June 10, 2018, 08:44:56 pm
Don't know the validity of the post, so take it with a grain of salt. Even if it was posted to Twitter on May 30.

https://twitter.com/TannerLPer/status/1001940499429814273

Listed companies based on copyright: Nintendo, Pokemon/Creatures/Game Freak, Intelligent Systems, Sega, Capcom, Bandai Namco, Square Enix, Konami

Speculate.

That was confirmed fake a while ago.  Some video that popped up on 4chan that was literally just the ending of the Smash 5 trailer and the guy added that screen to it.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: vgma2 on June 11, 2018, 12:49:19 am
oh god, does that mean the joke characters that are the Animal Crossing Villager and the Wii Fit Trainer are still there and there is also an overabundance of Fire Emblem crap???
Please.  The only joke character in the game is Jigglypuff because Sakurai has been determined to make her stay low tier after Melee.

Honestly, there's no way they'd drop Villager and WFT.  They have defined playstyles and they are the only representative of their franchises.  The only times we lost returning characters were because of: Clones, Copyright, or System Limitations. (Mewtwo is an exception with time constraints)

I could potentially see someone from Fire Emblem being dropped, if not only to introduce a new character from the franchise.  If any new FE character gets in, I'd imagine it would be Lyn, seeing as how she's been an assist trophy for the past two games and is the most popular female FE character.  Either that or a new character from the upcoming/recent game.  I could see Roy, Lucy or Corrin potentially being dropped, but Corrin has a unique kit, and Roy & Lucy hold the title for 2nd most popular male/female character.  Knowing this, I bet Sakurai would be hesitant to let either of them go.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Seadragon77 on June 11, 2018, 05:02:00 am
Please.  The only joke character in the game is Jigglypuff because Sakurai has been determined to make her stay low tier after Melee.

No. You do not talk shit about Jigglypuff. You can only talk shit about the Villager, Wii Fit Trainer and the Fire Emblem characters. No one else.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: TrinitroRoy on June 11, 2018, 10:29:06 am
Please.  The only joke character in the game is Jigglypuff because Sakurai has been determined to make her stay low tier after Melee.

No. You do not talk shit about Jigglypuff. You can only talk shit about the Villager, Wii Fit Trainer and the Fire Emblem characters. No one else.
But...ROY!
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Walruslui on June 11, 2018, 10:29:28 am
...thats an extremely safe trademark list so uh, no, this isn't really worth speculating that much over, since it looks fake as hell, because the only "new" trademark in there would be konami and i already know how everyone is gonna say it's for snake or something
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: TrinitroRoy on June 11, 2018, 11:40:16 am
Actually, it's for Snake AND Simon Belmont.
Because that one DasVergeben leak? That might end up being real after all:
https://www.reddit.com/r/smashbros/comments/8q4h48/dasvergeben_leak_might_be_correct_afterall/
Quote
The same source that told him about ridley, snake, simon and ice climbers being in smash also said there would be 2 Castlevania games coming out. Including a compilation game for the Switch.
Quote
The same source told him that Just Cause 4 and a new jump game that would be a mix of popular japanese shows. Both of these just got confirmed during the Microsoft conference.
And as we may know, Just Cause 4 ended up being real, same with that new Jump game (which ended up being Jump Force).

EDIT: Forgot to mention
https://imgur.com/a/2CGhFCF
The DasVergeben leak also includes Star Fox Grand Prix, Dragonball Xenoverse 3 and...VIEWTIFUL JOE 3?! AND IT'S A COLLAB BETWEEN CAPCOM AND PLATINUM GAMES?!
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Walruslui on June 11, 2018, 11:54:08 am
they literally just announced that XV2 is still getting DLC and isnt finished. I doubt that XV3 is a thing now, same with Star Fox Grand Prix.

You guys rely on "leaks" too much that aren't even leaks for this type of stuff. If you're going to post about leaks, post with something with substance atleast instead of just a couple dudes going "oh i heard this and this is gonna be a thing from my uncle dad at nintenbox"
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: DNZRX768 on June 12, 2018, 06:27:05 pm
Super Smash Ultimate, a new game on Switch with all of the characters back!

It is a dream match come true!
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Japanese Jesus on June 12, 2018, 06:43:05 pm
Ridley looks amazing.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: WumpaFruit96 on June 12, 2018, 06:44:50 pm
RIDLEY IS HERE!!!
RIDLEY IS HERE!!!
SNAKE IS BACK!!!
WOLF IS BACK!!!
SOME VETERANS FROM MELEE ARE BACK!!!
NINTENDO WON AGAIN!!!
THANK YOU NINTENDO!!!
THANK YOU MR.SAKURAI!!!
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: DNZRX768 on June 12, 2018, 06:46:03 pm
RIDLEY IS HERE!!!
RIDLEY IS HERE!!!
NINTENDO WON AGAIN!!!
THANK YOU NINTENDO!!!
THANK YOU MR.SAKURAI!!!

Good, now can people stop asking about Ridley?
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Jesuszilla on June 12, 2018, 06:47:51 pm
I can’t believe it. The crazy bastard did it...
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: DarkWolf13 on June 12, 2018, 06:49:46 pm
OMFG..!! That means I'll play as Wolf again!! YES!! We also got Daisy and Ridley in the lineup
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: WumpaFruit96 on June 12, 2018, 06:56:34 pm
I can’t believe it. The crazy bastard did it...

Let's not forget Daisy!
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: DNZRX768 on June 12, 2018, 07:07:29 pm
Now how many characters will be in the game? More than my MUGEN roster?
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: DarkWolf13 on June 12, 2018, 07:09:02 pm
It's guaranteed it has beaten MvC2's roster of 56. There's over 60 fighters and around close to 70.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: DNZRX768 on June 12, 2018, 07:10:40 pm
My word, that's a lot! Is that the biggest we have seen in a fighting game other than MUGEN?
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Solarflared on June 12, 2018, 07:17:16 pm
In regards to narrowing down Darkwolf's post...About 65, or 68 if we count the "echo fighters".
...wonder why only Dark Pit, Lucina and Daisy count as "echo fighters", though. I mean, there's a whole slew of moveset clones that got introduced in Melee.

But hey.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: R565 on June 12, 2018, 07:18:48 pm
In regards to narrowing down Darkwolf's post...About 65, or 68 if we count the "echo fighters".
...wonder why only Dark Pit, Lucina and Daisy count as "echo fighters", though. I mean, there's a whole slew of moveset clones that got introduced in Melee.

But hey.

Sakurai might have made the former clones get new moves.... Like Gannondorf using his sword more in his moveset.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Lucky Dearly on June 12, 2018, 07:20:38 pm
December 7th can't get here fast enough!
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: no1wammy on June 12, 2018, 07:22:43 pm
https://www.smashbros.com/en_GB/

The website is up. Basically Nintendo's version of Marvel vs. Capcom 2.

So, about that final boss. Still Master Hand?
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: DarkWolf13 on June 12, 2018, 07:25:15 pm
My word, that's a lot! Is that the biggest we have seen in a fighting game other than MUGEN?

I believe this is the largest fighting game roster in history now. MvC2 had it going for years and now it's Smash's turn, not including DLC either.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: drewski90 on June 12, 2018, 07:59:43 pm
really digging greninja's new artwork, it's better than the previous one
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Sookoll on June 12, 2018, 08:13:32 pm
Finally he's here.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Person Man on June 12, 2018, 08:26:10 pm
Holy crap.  All of the cut characters coming back?  I wasn’t expecting that at all. I wonder how exactly they’re going to differentiate Young Link from Toon Link now.

Much as I love the additions to Ness and Lucas’ final smashes, I can’t help but also be dissappointed knowing that it means none of those Mother characters are going to be playable.  At least there’s still hope for Flint.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Knuckles8864 on June 12, 2018, 08:35:58 pm
Just when you think you've collected all the Smash amiibo, they're throwing in everyone they got. Welp, that's the joy of being a Nintendo fan. :)
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Bastard Mami on June 12, 2018, 09:07:18 pm
My word, that's a lot! Is that the biggest we have seen in a fighting game other than MUGEN?

as long as we ignore the dragon ball "fighting games"
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Jesuszilla on June 12, 2018, 10:02:46 pm
Holy crap.  All of the cut characters coming back?  I wasn’t expecting that at all. I wonder how exactly they’re going to differentiate Young Link from Toon Link now.

Probably taller hitboxes, less horrible range, and maybe Young Link’s spin will be N64’s or something.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Person Man on June 12, 2018, 11:11:02 pm
^ That makes sense.  The character vid from the site shows he's got his fire arrows too, which I totally forgot that he had.

There's actually a lot of new stuff in those videos they didn't show off in the presentation.   There's an assist trophy for Krystal, and a New Donk City stage with Pauline's band playing in the background.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: PineappleProducer on June 12, 2018, 11:29:16 pm
No King K Rool. 0/10


Seriously though, this looks absolutely amazing. All I've ever wanted was to have all the characters in one game, and now it's finally here! 
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on June 12, 2018, 11:40:51 pm
Wait, if we have New Donk and New Pork, that means we can literally have A Tale of Two Cities.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on June 12, 2018, 11:42:09 pm
So I'm just going to say this nitpick now so as to move on to the rest of the good stuff as I mull over all the information overload.  The fact they stuck with Other M Samus and that annoying jet boot thing for Zero Suit still very much so irritates me.  They had the opportunity to update her as they did most others, and did not.  Which they really probably should have all the more, what with that final announcement.

And dear god, Ridley, I thought you would look like your 2D versions, but not the decaying husk version from Fusion.  Jesus Christ, he's a monster compared to the entire rest of the roster.  It's fantastic.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Uche_of_MFG on June 13, 2018, 12:28:38 am
You are forgetting the most important news out there: Daisy is playable!!!!! :D
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on June 13, 2018, 12:30:55 am
What about the updated facial expressions? I think that's even more important.

Or how everyone's Final Smashes now are literally super tryhard Mugen Level 3 hyper attacks, complete with hyper portraits?
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on June 13, 2018, 12:47:49 am
Ok, a few thoughts.  So Sakurai stated that there will be little to look forward to in newcomers, because that work has already been put to reviving previous entry characters.  That's fine, but now we need some in-depth look as to what makes their return worthwhile beyond nostalgia.  Because Pichu's cute, but a joke character before.  Is that still the case, or is it a more dangerous Lucario now, does more damage the higher its own is while also always hurting itself?  And Young Link, does he incorporate the masks in some format?  I would imagine the by far fan favorite Fierce Deity Link would be his Final Smash move.  But in general, I want to know what makes these characters worth the effort beyond "they're back".  Explain what changes Dark Pit got.  Even more-so, what's going on with Ganondorf now.

With Pichu restored, I kinda want a Raichu to be a Pokémon DLC character.  Yeah, it's not nearly the highest requested choice, and expands the Pokémon roster even further, but it feels odd not to complete the evolutionary line now.  And you could have Alolan Raichu as an alt.  But I have no expectations of that coming to fruition.  And the assist trophy section is like a shot to the heart, watching Waluigi, Bomberman and Midna go by.  So close to a full inclusion, then left just as a gimmick.  Likely none of them will end up full characters down the line this title.

Also, since they said everyone will be back, I wonder if that includes Alph.  He wasn't shown off today.  But then, granted, he was just an Olimar skin.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Uche_of_MFG on June 13, 2018, 01:08:49 am
For once, I would love to see the looks of the black sheep of the Super Smash Community's faces when they see Super Smash Bros. Ultimate.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Person Man on June 13, 2018, 01:13:23 am
Also, since they said everyone will be back, I wonder if that includes Alph.  He wasn't shown off today.  But then, granted, he was just an Olimar skin.

Alph and the Koopa Kids are still there, just as alternate skins like before.  You can see them in the character highlight videos.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on June 13, 2018, 01:14:53 am
Ah.  I only saw the main presentation so far, will have to catch those later tonight, then.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Jesuszilla on June 13, 2018, 01:31:29 am
Simon Belmont is rumored to be the last new addition. I am extremely looking forward to that.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: ShiroTori on June 13, 2018, 02:16:07 am
The Captain N trio will finally be complete!
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Person Man on June 13, 2018, 02:29:58 am
Heh, just noticed this:

(https://www.smashbros.com/assets_v2/img/fighter/bowser/ss_4.jpg)

Peach's neutral B had its animation totally redone so now Toad is jumping in front of Peach on his own instead of her just using him as a human shield.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on June 13, 2018, 02:56:55 am
Oh, that is...an unusual color palette choice for Bowser, now that I focus on it.  He looks so, I dunno...dry.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Kirishima on June 13, 2018, 03:23:39 am
Apparently all Pokemon hazards from past games are returning.  There was a case where Scizor appeared from a Pokeball.  Saffron City retains its n64 graphics, heh.  Really digging the all-in-one route.

Pikachu has a new N-Air.  It's a multi hit move probably to set itself apart from Pichu.  Ganondorf has several new Smash attacks using his sword.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on June 13, 2018, 03:37:06 am
Ok, so just to rewind, I had to go see that Ridley trailer again.


And oh my god, Ridley legitimately just straight-up murders Mega Man and Mario.  I said he was gonna be a dark addition, but I didn't think Nintendo themselves would have a pre-rendered trailer of him snapping Mario's neck.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: vgma2 on June 13, 2018, 03:42:55 am
Various things I saw:

I love the changes with the UI and effects.  From the VS splash screens and blast zone indicator to the hyper move backgrounds and cut-ins like other fighting games.  The "final strike" effect even looks like a hyper combo finish effect.

Also apparently grab teching is in the game. (Like in regular fighting games)
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: PineappleProducer on June 13, 2018, 03:58:10 am
  • Wario has Shoulder Bash back.

I can die a happy man now.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on June 13, 2018, 04:05:54 am
Oh god, 3D Land is returning in that Toad picture. It literally took them 4 games to change Ganonnondorf, too.

About time they added Shoulder Charge as a dash attack as well. Always hated that weak flop.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Person Man on June 13, 2018, 04:28:32 am
Knuckles and Arcade Bunny from Nintendo Badge Arcade are both confirmed assist trophies.  Knuckles just poses in Sonic's video so IDK what he does, but it looks like Arcade Bunny calls down a giant claw machine to grab fighters and pull them up and out of the stage.

There's also a screenshot of Snake next to a Ramblin' Evil Mushroom from Earthbound, but it's not clear if it's an assist trophy or an item.  Maybe an enemy from some kinda Smash Run mode.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on June 13, 2018, 05:01:08 am
(https://www.smashbros.com/assets_v2/img/fighter/daisy/ss_3.jpg)
I see Smash this year is in the running to try to upstage Street Fighter IV's slo-mo goofy faces.

(https://www.smashbros.com/assets_v2/img/fighter/zero_suit_samus/ss_5.jpg)
I also see they did the same joke again.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: drewski90 on June 13, 2018, 05:12:22 am
speaking of street fighter, have you noticed that before the fight begins someone picks a stage then someone picks a character

it reminded me of street fighter V in a way
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: vgma2 on June 13, 2018, 05:22:48 am
Yup, they said they did it so that you could choose your character accordingly based on the stage that was chosen.
It's what they do at tournaments too, so that's pretty neat.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Kirishima on June 13, 2018, 05:28:17 am


Vega/Claw theme cover as part of a new music addon.  I never expected his music to be included.


Snake has a new logo being an exclamation point instead of the Foxhound logo.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: DNZRX768 on June 13, 2018, 06:24:43 am
(https://www.smashbros.com/assets_v2/img/fighter/zero_suit_samus/ss_5.jpg)
I also see they did the same joke again.

Was Snake always an ass-man?

Never seem to notice that, or maybe he's just a pervert.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Rai Tei on June 13, 2018, 02:57:22 pm
Heh, just noticed this:

Peach's neutral B had its animation totally redone so now Toad is jumping in front of Peach on his own instead of her just using him as a human shield.

She used to take him out from underneath her dress xD
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Sookoll on June 13, 2018, 04:05:07 pm
Was Snake always an ass-man?

Never seem to notice that, or maybe he's just a pervert.
That's how he recognized Meryl.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: GTAguy on June 13, 2018, 05:39:04 pm
That Direct was awesome. Holy shit!

All the fighters returning. Do you think we get a 70 chars in this game? Apparently the leak seems to be true and Simon could the simi-final char and soon another one.

Btw did you notice that Marth has a English voice and it sounds like Sora from Kingdom Hearts?
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: drewski90 on June 13, 2018, 09:25:08 pm
That Direct was awesome. Holy shit!

All the fighters returning. Do you think we get a 70 chars in this game? Apparently the leak seems to be true and Simon could the simi-final char and soon another one.

Btw did you notice that Marth has a English voice and it sounds like Sora from Kingdom Hearts?

it's about time marth gets an english voice. I don't think roy will have an english voice as well
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: GTAguy on June 13, 2018, 11:32:44 pm
That Direct was awesome. Holy shit!

All the fighters returning. Do you think we get a 70 chars in this game? Apparently the leak seems to be true and Simon could the simi-final char and soon another one.

Btw did you notice that Marth has a English voice and it sounds like Sora from Kingdom Hearts?

it's about time marth gets an english voice. I don't think roy will have an english voice as well

Speaking of English voice, what about Cloud Strife? Steve Burton is still active and is still the role of Cloud. How come didn't he have a English voice in the first place?
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Person Man on June 13, 2018, 11:34:30 pm
So everyone was blown away by the announcement of all the characters yesterday, but the stages ended up getting overlooked.  Going through all the videos, screenshots, and the official website, more than 80 stages have been confirmed to be in the game so far, which is nuts.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gsBjEXlqGXY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQ81QsJqLA4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gF-yNJJOUWU

At this point it'd be easier to list the stages from past games that aren't being recreated for Ultimate.  As a Mother fan, I'm super excited about Fourside and New Pork City coming back, plus that gorgeous Magicant stage getting the HD upgrade it deserves.

:EDIT: So for shits and giggles I actually did make a list of all the past stages that haven't been shown off in some way for Ultimate yet.  Discounting the various iterations of Battlefield and Final Destination, there are about 120 or so stages between every Smash game until now.  Of those, there are only 35 that have yet to show up in this one.

Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty

Goddamn.  Sakurai putting in the work.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: drewski90 on June 13, 2018, 11:51:38 pm
omg first the largest fighter roster, now the largest stage roster
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: MR. IBZS II on June 14, 2018, 04:37:34 am
Mushroomy Kingdom is shown too. Dang shame most of those are annoying as hell to play on.

Still have a way to go to beat out Smash Infinite's stage roster though.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Darkflare on June 14, 2018, 04:53:42 am
Btw did you notice that Marth has a English voice and it sounds like Sora from Kingdom Hearts?

Yuri Lowenthal has been voicing Marth in English for a while now. Honestly, he could have had it by Smash 4 due to the Shadow Dragon remake having english Marth already

it's about time marth gets an english voice. I don't think roy will have an english voice as well

Roy has an english voice in Heroes, so he could have one in Smash 5 as well.

Still have a way to go to beat out Smash Infinite's stage roster though.

Comparing to a silly fan game.

kek.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: DarkWolf13 on June 14, 2018, 12:13:02 pm
Mushroomy Kingdom is shown too.

That's my favorite stage in the 3DS version of Sm4sh. Easy and fast kills with high launch set. I hope it's usable for 8 player smash.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: TrinitroRoy on June 14, 2018, 12:24:38 pm
BTW, something I noticed: Knuckles is an assist trophy now, yet Shadow is...oddly absent...
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: drewski90 on June 14, 2018, 01:42:31 pm
i just realized something:

while they're showing us gameplay for super smash bros ultimate

i can hear xander mobus being the announcer again in the new smash bros game
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: vgma2 on June 14, 2018, 07:45:16 pm
While they did introduce the term Echo Fighters, I don't expect them to go too crazy with it.
I'm don't think there'll be any Echos of 3rd parties, or to make a dark version of a character. (To avoid the Dark Pit-esque backlash again.)

Since we'll be having tons of unlockable characters again, I wonder what they'll do in terms of single player modes.
I at least hope Classic mode will be as good as it was in Melee.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Jesuszilla on June 14, 2018, 08:44:54 pm
I hope Isabelle becomes a Villager Echo Fighter; I hear she’s no longer an assist so it seems possible.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: PlasmoidThunder on June 14, 2018, 08:56:57 pm
I'm not sure how people are deciding whether an Assist is in or not when all they've got to go by is an E3 build which definitely doesn't have everything in it; heck, that Meta Ridley costume featured in Ridley's reveal trailer isn't even in there, nor are the alt colours of Wireframe Mac.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Person Man on June 14, 2018, 09:09:13 pm
I hope Isabelle becomes a Villager Echo Fighter; I hear she’s no longer an assist so it seems possible.

While I would absolutely love that, I also don’t know if I could ever bring myself to hit Isabelle.

Since they made echo fighters a Thing, I have to imagine there are at least one or two more.  Funky Kong and Octoling are the most obvious ones that come to mind.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: TrinitroRoy on June 15, 2018, 12:47:08 am
While they did introduce the term Echo Fighters, I don't expect them to go too crazy with it.
I'm don't think there'll be any Echos of 3rd parties, or to make a dark version of a character. (To avoid the Dark Pit-esque backlash again.)
I'm not sure how people are deciding whether an Assist is in or not when all they've got to go by is an E3 build which definitely doesn't have everything in it; heck, that Meta Ridley costume featured in Ridley's reveal trailer isn't even in there, nor are the alt colours of Wireframe Mac.
Yeah, but at the same time, a 3rd party franchise having TWO assist trophies is equally weird.
So...does that just mean that Shadow is completely cut?
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: PineappleProducer on June 15, 2018, 01:59:11 am
Since we'll be having tons of unlockable characters again, I wonder what they'll do in terms of single player modes.
I at least hope Classic mode will be as good as it was in Melee.

Heck, I'd even be content with a 3DS style classic mode. For other single player modes, I'd like the target test to return, event matches that aren't garbage, and an story mode ala Subspace Emissary (though I'm not holding my breath).   

I'm curious, though - they said the existing Figure Player data on our amiibo would be compatible with SSBU, right? What does that mean for custom moves?

Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: Long John Killer on June 15, 2018, 03:42:53 am
I'm more curious how it'll carry anything over and still be useful when the characters are all reworked with new gameplay mechanics behind the scenes, if they don't simply have altered moves altogether.  Being a level 50 Link amiibo won't help when it tries to use bombs and gets confused why they need to be remote detonated now.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: DarkWolf13 on June 16, 2018, 05:51:58 pm
I think this thread should be renamed Super Smash Bros. Ultimate
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros Ultimate
Post by: Japanese Jesus on June 17, 2018, 02:49:33 am
Why is Vega's music in the game? Is his stage in?
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros Ultimate
Post by: Jesuszilla on June 17, 2018, 03:26:36 am
Nah, most likely Yoko Shimomura decided to compose it because she really was proud of her work on that track.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros Ultimate
Post by: StevenB on June 17, 2018, 09:40:33 am
Why is Vega's music in the game? Is his stage in?

Ryu's stage only had like 3 tracks in Smash 4. They're probably adding more tracks to Suzaku Castle and Midgar to make them consistent with the other stages.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros Ultimate
Post by: PlasmoidThunder on June 17, 2018, 10:50:22 am
More music on Midgar would be wonderful, but that's up to Square. Maybe some Bravely Default music?
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros Ultimate
Post by: Mgbenz on June 17, 2018, 11:21:11 am
Just popping in to say Snake lost his iconic ass and Capt. Falcon and Ganon lost their glorious bulges. Otherwise an awesome game.

Ok bye.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros Ultimate
Post by: GTAguy on June 17, 2018, 01:45:32 pm
I'm fine with more music. But when do we get custom music? I can put my music and anything I want. If some PS4 games can, why not Smash Bros?
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros for Switch
Post by: DNZRX768 on June 17, 2018, 05:05:53 pm
Was Snake always an ass-man?

Never seem to notice that, or maybe he's just a pervert.
That's how he recognized Meryl.

Heh, the more you know...

Still, I wonder why women didn't slap him for that?

I'm fine with more music. But when do we get custom music? I can put my music and anything I want. If some PS4 games can, why not Smash Bros?

Because then you have to figure out a way to put the music into the system and the only way I saw that the Switch can gain files from a computer is with an SD card.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros Ultimate
Post by: The Street Fighter on June 17, 2018, 05:32:37 pm
Alright, say you only had 5 more newcomers. Who would "You" want to see?

Mine;
- King K. Rool. (DK)
- Dixie Kong. (DK)
- Lip. (Panel De Pon)
- Black Shadow. (F-Zero)
- Isaac or Geno. (Golden Sun/Super Mario RPG)
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros Ultimate
Post by: vgma2 on June 17, 2018, 09:37:29 pm
I'm fine with more music. But when do we get custom music? I can put my music and anything I want. If some PS4 games can, why not Smash Bros?
We're not getting custom music anytime soon because:
1. To stop hacking.  There's a reason they've been trying to stop us from loading our own files for the Switch.

2. To give people a reason to buy stage DLC that has their favourite song in it.

You'll just have to wait until the modding scene manages to get their hands on Smash 5.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros Ultimate
Post by: Long John Killer on June 17, 2018, 10:39:15 pm
There's only one newcomer I'm now looking forward to, and Nintendo themselves let the news slip.

(http://i.imgur.com/2ZIEXsW.jpg)
It's Mr. Saturn's time to get promoted from an item to a playable character.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros Ultimate
Post by: NamelessOnlinePlayer on June 18, 2018, 03:18:28 am
I'm looking forward to all the new music this game will offer. Vega and Wood Man remixes make me want more.
Also, Vergeben (the guy that claims Simon will come) says there's at least six newcomers coming to the game (https://www.reddit.com/r/Kappa/comments/8k0li1/here_are_some_big_smash_leaks_for_those_that_care/e0pemqo/):
said:
I heard that at minimum, there are at least a half dozen characters still to be revealed. But I don't know who any of them outside of Simon are yet.
Seems reasonable to me. 8 new characters in base game fits with the statement of "don't expect a lot of newcomers."
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros Ultimate
Post by: DarkWolf13 on June 18, 2018, 04:01:44 am
I hope to some more soundtracks in there and hopefully include the main themes from the other 4 titles. I'm surprised Vega has a remixed theme for Smash. I wonder if they have one for Bison as well. We got Ken's though despite it's exclusive to Smash Wii U.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros Ultimate
Post by: drewski90 on June 18, 2018, 04:12:20 am
so i guess for each month there'll be one newcomer
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros Ultimate
Post by: Person Man on June 18, 2018, 04:13:23 am
I'm surprised Vega has a remixed theme for Smash. I wonder if they have one for Bison as well. We got Ken's though despite it's exclusive to Smash Wii U.

It's probably because now that Suzaku Castle isn't DLC anymore they can't get away with just a DLC-level amount of music for it.  Or the additional Street Fighter content means that Ken is Ryu's Echo Fighter.

Ooh, that makes me realize that the Great Bay stage means we're gonna get a ton of new arranged Majora's Mask music.  Please give me Stone Tower Temple and Bremen March.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros Ultimate
Post by: Lucky Dearly on June 18, 2018, 04:22:34 am
Alright, say you only had 5 more newcomers. Who would "You" want to see?

Mine;
- King K. Rool. (DK)
- Dixie Kong. (DK)
- Lip. (Panel De Pon)
- Black Shadow. (F-Zero)
- Isaac or Geno. (Golden Sun/Super Mario RPG)

Hmm mine would be:

Miles "Tails" Prower (Sonic)
Wreck-It Ralph
Crash Bandicoot
Spyro the Dragon
Agumon (Digimon)
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros Ultimate
Post by: Long John Killer on June 18, 2018, 05:04:56 am
Not that I expect Namco's first choice as a rep to be Digimon, though it would admittingly be kinda cool to see, wouldn't WarGreymon make more sense?  About human sized, like Charizard, more diverse movepool, established rivalry, has something that would work as a Final Smash, is a dragon and dragons make money. (An undeniable truth)

I wouldn't be against Ken showing up either, Ken's awesome and his stage/theme is all the more so, though if anyone else in Street Fighter deserves to show it sure as hell should be Chun-Li.  I just want to see how diverse the echo fighters get from their established bases.  Especially with Ken, seeing how he's evolved into his own being over time and isn't "just" Ryu in red anymore.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros Ultimate
Post by: Person Man on June 18, 2018, 05:15:13 am
I wouldn't expect too much variety from echo fighters.  If we're going off of the basis of Lucina, Dark Pit, and Daisy, they're going to have to be A) Physically similar enough that they can just hang the new model on top of the original characters' rig and animations, and B) Would believably use the exact same moves as the base character.    Villager => Isabelle is the most drastic departure I can see happening, but they'll probably be closer to Olimar => Louie or Bayonetta => Jeanne.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros Ultimate
Post by: Long John Killer on June 18, 2018, 05:35:36 am
My expectations aren't that high for them to be too different, I just hope there's something more to them than being glorified character skins with their own slots.  All I really ask for is they change the B moves.  Keep the A moves, that's fine and probably preferable for most of them, but as is they're still too similar for my tastes.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros Ultimate
Post by: no1wammy on June 18, 2018, 06:29:41 am
If anyone else in Street Fighter deserves to show it sure as hell should be Chun-Li.

Chun-Li could become a candidate due to being the first fighting female character in fighting video game history. But then Capcom will hold the bizarre distinction of being 2nd in number of fighting candidates represented by a 3rd party, though somebody will correct me on that statement largely because of the Nintendo IP ID discrepancy. This basically means companies like Creatures/Game Freak (who run the Pokemon franchise) are technically a part of Nintendo, therefore not considered 3rd party. Still, it's weird.

I have a hunch Waluigi's getting in, his fan support is pouring and increasing in volume.

Agree with the crowd on Simon Belmont. Could his Final Smash be the Greatest Five Dual Crush from Portrait Of Ruin?

By the way, GameFAQs had this up in the polls today: https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/poll/7115-if-you-could-convince-nintendo-to-just-put-one-more
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros Ultimate
Post by: DarkWolf13 on June 18, 2018, 06:48:11 am
I just read some info regarding the assist trophies and noticed that Midna and Ghirahim are among those that can be defeated as well as Lyn. So far only 9 have been confirmed to be totally invulnerable and more than one assist trophy can be summoned now. Guess I'll be doing Smash battles with Assist Trophies, X-Bombs and Smart Bombs.

Not hopeful for Waluigi though cuz the number of fighters we're getting is satisfying enough. If he's doomed as an Assist only so be it, he'll forever be doomed.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros Ultimate
Post by: PlasmoidThunder on June 18, 2018, 09:33:09 am
Is it wrong that I think Bomberman being an Assist Trophy was the best way to implement him? He lays bombs and runs away, which works perfectly for this sort of thing.
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros Ultimate
Post by: TrinitroRoy on June 18, 2018, 10:17:13 am
I wouldn't expect too much variety from echo fighters.  If we're going off of the basis of Lucina, Dark Pit, and Daisy, they're going to have to be A) Physically similar enough that they can just hang the new model on top of the original characters' rig and animations, and B) Would believably use the exact same moves as the base character.    Villager => Isabelle is the most drastic departure I can see happening, but they'll probably be closer to Olimar => Louie or Bayonetta => Jeanne.
So...would you think that Dark Samus and Shadow being Echo Fighters in Smash Bros Ultimate would be plausible (when ignoring certain unwritten "rules", of course and only focus on the two points you mentioned).
Because technically speaking, Shadow was just a Sonic clone in Sonic Adventure 2, and so far, Shadow is completely absent from the game (Knuckles seems to be replacing Shadow as the Assist Trophy character), and not only seems the Dark Samus Assist Trophy to be absent, but also Samus' Dark Samus palette (it got replaced with a brand new palette).
Title: Re: Super Smash Bros Ultimate
Post by: Person Man on June 18, 2018, 12:46:05 pm
Conceivably, yeah.  I don't think either of them would be a good idea considering people's reactions to Dark Pit last time, but yes they would be totally plausible echo fighters.

Tails could also work as an echo fighter of Sonic, I think.  They're built more or less the same and all of Sonic's moves are from the Genesis games, where Tails can do everything that he can.