The Mugen Fighters Guild - RYU

Just No Point

Re: RYU

#321 May 30, 2014, 11:17:01 pm

Updated his .air

All standing basic timings are now accurate. Near and far versions. Stance is accurate, and so is the walk forward and back animations. Had to reorder the sprites for his walk animations though because they were not in the right order.

@Lost_Avenger: It's not a big deal but did you know the walk cycle was not in the correct order? Index 3 should be the 1st step he takes in both forward and back.

Just No Point

Re: RYU

#322 May 31, 2014, 03:59:05 am

Random thought. 1 tick isn't a huge huge issue but it can still change the game in an instance. Once Ryu is finished do you think we should go back and make 2 other versions of most attacks? Like add a tick to a CLSN1 and remove a tick for CLSN1? Make it so that the moves have a 1 in 5 chance of going to one of these versions of the attacks?

This would make the timing of the moves slightly unreliable by 1 tick every so often. They would hit 1 tick longer (and the anim would last 1 tick longer) or it would hit 1 tick shorter and the move would be 1 tick shorter in total.

Lost_Avenger

Re: RYU

#323 May 31, 2014, 05:10:58 am

Busy, busy, busy

You mean meaty? Hitting at a later frame for a bigger advantage? Adding random hittimes would cause problems

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http://www.Trinitymugen.net/Hosted/CFJ2/
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thanks again Vans/Jesuszilla!

Just No Point

Re: RYU

#324 May 31, 2014, 11:37:32 am

I mean trying to duplicate the different amount of ticks an animation can have due to the frame skipping. Jab for instance. Most of the time it was 9 ticks. But every once in a while it would be 10 or 8. Because of the way we gain and lose ticks due to the speed setting.

The only way to be 100% accurate would be to make every tick it's own index but that's crazy talk. A better compromise is to just make 3 versions of each attack. A default 9 tick jab. And then a more rare possibility of getting a 10 tick or a 8 tick jab.

With that said I'd be happy to just go with whatever I count up the 1st time because IMO 1 tick isn't really worth the trouble of recounting frames and/or setting up something like this in the character.

But I wanted to run it by everyone else to be sure.

Alex Sinigaglia

Re: RYU

#325 May 31, 2014, 11:57:40 am

aka G.o.D.
Online

I deleted the running sprites that weren't used (the ones in group 101; those were there for nothing, I only left the first sprite of that group) and I added the finished frames of the SF3 Kick (I have to finish another one, but for now it will work).

∞

Lost_Avenger

Re: RYU

#326 June 01, 2014, 05:13:01 am

Busy, busy, busy

You can disable frameskip by putting it on the lowest setting iirc. I can't remember if it skips every 3rd or 4th tick. Just compare your times to waru's? As long as the start up is right, we can just tweak it to get the right frame advantage. No need to triple the size of your air files

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http://www.Trinitymugen.net/Hosted/CFJ2/
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thanks again Vans/Jesuszilla!

Just No Point

Re: RYU

#327 June 01, 2014, 11:20:43 am

Waru is pretty far from accurate. I only use your Ryu and POTS's.

One way or another the moves will not be 100% accurate to the CVS2 speed setting. Even if I got the ticks from the slowest setting and removed every fourth tick it still wouldn't be right. The tick removal isn't move specific it is something that's always happening to every detail on screen. Which is why sometimes a move may last 1 extra tick or lose a tick.

So to simplify things I'll just use the 1st values I count up. Technically it's not like we're making an accurate CVS2 game anyway and timings may change for this project while balancing things anyway. There really isn't a universal right way for this since the objective isn't to replicate CVS2

Lost_Avenger

Re: RYU

#328 June 01, 2014, 12:56:20 pm

Busy, busy, busy

Did I give you Ryu's guide pages for cvs2? I can't remember.

It doesn't need to be perfect, but close enough. 1 Tick can literally be the difference in a move linking. A lot of the buffs in Ultra are 1 tick start up changes that open up lots of new combo possibilities

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http://www.Trinitymugen.net/Hosted/CFJ2/
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thanks again Vans/Jesuszilla!

Just No Point

Re: RYU

#329 June 02, 2014, 02:13:26 am

I think you gave me that. It was in japanese though. And Ugh, 1 tick link combos. Another thing from SF4 I hate =p

CVS2 couldn't have that outside of the slowest speed though. If the moves can randomly lose or gain a tick due to the speed increase then timings would get messed up for 1 tick links. They could be in there but it'd be a lot easier to drop the combo due to the speed timings.

Stuff like that will be tweaked during balance fixing anyway. We can have better control of what moves would have a 1 tick link and what would not. I do hope that doesn't become a hefty part of the mechanics like it is in SF4 because I am not a good robot!

Lost_Avenger

Re: RYU

#330 June 02, 2014, 05:16:07 am

Busy, busy, busy

My AI is though

Can't you just plink in SF4 or was that just X Tekken? I prefer link heavy gameplay since it requires more skill and practice. You can still just do normal combos(jump in - close normal xx special), but you can do more by putting the time in

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http://www.Trinitymugen.net/Hosted/CFJ2/
-
thanks again Vans/Jesuszilla!

Just No Point

Re: RYU

#331 June 02, 2014, 05:35:27 am

If I was still a teenager I might have agreed with you on 1 tick link combos. Over the years I've gotten less time to actually play and prefer something a little bit more accessible. I don't mind strict timing links. But 1 tick links are a bit ridiculous IMO. Makes me feel like I'm trying to play guitar hero and the feeling I get from accomplishing them doesn't make up for the frustration and lack of intuitive fun.

Once you get that strict it feels more like a chore.

And yes, I am well aware of your Kyosuke's robot timing combo potential! >:-(

In SF4 you can plink everything but the light attacks in the chains. It gives you a 2 tick window instead of 1.

Lost_Avenger

Re: RYU

#332 June 02, 2014, 07:12:54 am

Busy, busy, busy

The option for 1 tick libks should still be there imo. Its not like we can play this online. I kept some of Ryu's sf4 links for CFJ2(solar plex links for instance). It gives you more options and makes it so that people don't feel similar and stale. Then again,there are a lot of similar links in AE. cl medium - medium or c.mp - c.mp. etc

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http://www.Trinitymugen.net/Hosted/CFJ2/
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thanks again Vans/Jesuszilla!

Just No Point

Re: RYU

#333 June 02, 2014, 11:14:11 am

Oh, they will. The very nature of us using static tick measurements where every move lasts the exact same amount of ticks each time you do it lends itself to make it near impossible not to have them. Had we decided to go the random 1 extra/1less tick route it would have greatly reduced the 1 tick link potential.

I do have to disagree that their removal would make characters feel similar and stale though because I don't think that they feel that way at all in SFA, SF3, CVS2, and other games with the frame skip settings that would prevent robot combos. But that is mute here because we will have them to a degree.

Last Edit: June 02, 2014, 11:32:29 am by Just No Point

Alex Sinigaglia

Re: RYU

#334 June 02, 2014, 11:16:15 am

aka G.o.D.
Online

Before I forget, just to make sure, have you read my post?

∞

Just No Point

Re: RYU

#335 June 02, 2014, 11:30:50 am

About updating the sff/air? Yes sir. I've been working and just have not been able to work on Ryu yet. Will commence again Tuesday. Don't worry, I'll be sure to use the updated dropbox Ryu =p

Lost_Avenger

Re: RYU

#336 June 02, 2014, 02:04:37 pm

Busy, busy, busy

Cvs2 waS very link heavy lol. I'm off tomorrow night so what is the current goal for Ryu?

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http://www.Trinitymugen.net/Hosted/CFJ2/
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thanks again Vans/Jesuszilla!

Just No Point

Re: RYU

#337 June 02, 2014, 03:19:09 pm

There are links and there are 1 tick links!!!!!!!!!11

My current project is counting ticks and fixing the timings in all the moves.

I'll be off tomorrow too. I'll get a hold of you on Skype and we can coordinate an action.

Jmorphman

Re: RYU

#338 June 02, 2014, 08:05:14 pm

Q.E.D.
Online

Yeah, 1 tick links suck! >:[

They just add another barrier to entry and they are just a matter of the execution being needlessly difficult, which I think fighting games should avoid.

Just No Point

Re: RYU

#339 June 02, 2014, 11:07:16 pm

@Lost_Avenger: What mechanics could we start implementing while I'm busy getting the timings fixed? The corner push? The combo dampener?
Anything?

Just No Point

Re: RYU

#340 June 03, 2014, 02:33:54 am

With some of this stuff I may actually want to post in a help board but I'll try here. It's worked so far.

I'm working on getting an accurate jump. Exactly what all controls jump mechanics?

velocity jump, movement yaccel

Is there anything else I can fidget with? Basically I can get him to jump the correct height and stay in the air the right amount of ticks. But his take off is a bit too fast. What all tweaks the ascent, hang time, descent?

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