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Touhou Fantasy, Xenomic's RPG Maker game! (Read 263678 times)

Started by Xenomic, December 20, 2012, 12:36:23 am
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Touhou Fantasy, Xenomic's RPG Maker game!
#1  December 20, 2012, 12:36:23 am
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For those who do not know this project, it is a game that I have been working on for the past 4 years almost solo (I've had some help here and there, and I appreciate the help from the many folks that has helped). Take heed that I've done no graphics or music myself, the sources vary. I am always looking for more help with this as well~

Concept Art:


Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty


Concept Sprites:

Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty


Videos:



There'd be too many vids to post, so I'll just post the playlist link here, and show the more recent Battle Animation Exhibition vids.



Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty


You can find the patches and beta link there, but just in case, here they are:

For the Game files: http://rpgmaker.net/games/3758/downloads/3561/

CommandRTP (Run RPG Maker games without installing the game or RTP package): http://rpgmaker.net/engines/rm2k3/utilities/5/


Feel free to leave feedback on the game and ideas/criticisms~


First review: http://rpgmaker.net/games/3758/reviews/1826/


Current version (1.121): http://www.mediafire.com/download/ka77ce9hkpo2lj5/Touhou_Fantasy_Version_1.121.rar

Please make sure to get this as well and unzip in the Facesets folder. There are some missing files that'll crash the game without them: http://www.mediafire.com/download/hyh85nd4z6elfl7/FaceSet.rar

Music: https://www.mediafire.com/folder/0nw7t9lzue4y8/Touhou_Fantasy_Music_Packs

*NOTE! If you only want the base music, get just the Vanilla Music packs and the Theme of Components found in the subfolder. If you want all the music, get everything. For all music files, place it in a folder named Music in the Touhou Fantasy directory.




Keep in mind that you'll need to run the CommandFTP first in order to play the RPG. If that doesn't work, let me know and I'll see if I can't fix things up. I'm hoping I have this going correctly ^^;; Enjoy, and I hope you all have fun with this! Looking forward to hearing from you guys ^^
Last Edit: December 19, 2014, 04:25:49 am by Xenomic
Re: Touhou Fantasy, Xenomic's RPG Maker game!
#2  December 20, 2012, 12:46:56 am
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Nice to see another person working on a Touhou RPG, fortunately yours seem to be quite different from what I'm making. Mine will be real-time, not turn based.
So, how complete is it now? Release Candidate complete (can reach the ending and everything is implemented but needs testing), or alpha/beta complete (some parts are still unfinished, features are missing, and/or ending cannot be reached)?
Re: Touhou Fantasy, Xenomic's RPG Maker game!
#3  December 20, 2012, 12:58:13 am
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It's still a beta (50% of the full story is done), and generally takes 10-20 hours just for it as it is (well, for me anyways. Dunno about everyone else). I meant for the game to be decently sized (I haven't implemented any sidequests at all. That's meant for beta8 alone).

There are 7 betas dedicated to just the storyline alone, and beta8, as already mentioned, is for all of the sidequest and post-game material. Do keep in mind that the beta1 areas (the first 5 dungeons of the game) aren't fixed up (aside from Misty Lake. That was last fixed up by my current mapper). So that leaves Scarlet Devil Mansion, Bamboo Forest, and Eientei to fix up (Bamboo Forest might not even NEED it that badly, but the other 2 do...).

Most of what I want right now is in the current beta. Although I don't have status sprites for everyone since my original status spriter left (after 6 months of disappearing THEN telling me he wasn't interested anymore) about 2-3 years ago. I'm thinking of going with status icons with DynRPG, but I'm not sure how that'll work out. Last I tried it, it didn't work very well...

So yeah, if you do play, PLEASE bear in mind that the filesize will run about 1 GB as of right now (the bulk is in the music alone), and that the starting areas are a little rough in terms of mapping (I'm not the best mapper in the world mind you. I'm better than when I first started, but still don't like mapping much. I'm a storyline guy, not a mapper/spriter/musician!).

The game is meant to emulate the old SNES Final Fantasy gameplay (particularly goes somewhat like Final Fantasy II with skill system, albeit is handled differently), and is in no way meant to be an actual crossover like some people think, so don't expect things like chocobos, moogles, Cloud, or things like that! Some things ARE around though, such as equipment and spells (there's a lot of other references to other games too so...).
Re: Touhou Fantasy, Xenomic's RPG Maker game!
#4  December 20, 2012, 01:42:54 am
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In that case, I'll wait until at least the main storyline is 100% complete. Elecbyte made me realize how frustrated I get when progress slows down on something I have already started playing.

Quote
I'm a storyline guy, not a mapper/spriter/musician!
That's like me then, except I'm a gameplay/coding guy so I have a really nice and complicated stat system, plenty of skills, etc but I haven't even bothered looking for a sound engine yet because it's not that important.

Did you consider coding and using a map generating algorythm to make maps for you based on parameters you input? Or is that impossible in RPG maker?
Re: Touhou Fantasy, Xenomic's RPG Maker game!
#5  December 20, 2012, 01:58:31 am
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Don't think you can do that in RPG Maker. There's an auto-generate feature in it, but it's a bad idea to use it. Plus, probably wouldn't work for what I'd like to set up. I have a few dungeons that are meant to cater more towards specific characters than others, though you can still use whoever you want regardless (unless game forces you to use specific characters). For instance, in one of the upcoming beta5 dungeons, the main gimmick is No Items (Items isn't disabled, but you don't have any items to use throughout the entire dungeon, and monsters don't drop items at all that you CAN use), with its subgimmick being status tiles and traps. This means bringing along someone with healing/status curing abilities is a good idea (several characters can heal with skills, such as Cirno, Meiling, and Sanae, while the main status healers are those like Reisen and Nitori), and bringing along Nitori in general is a good idea, as her Stock command is just like FFX-2's Stash ability, although it costs MP to use items and you cannot use Ethers (which are Bs in this game) with said command. There will be a couple MP restoration points of course, I'm not THAT cruel...


So yeah, there's that at least. It'll seem like some characters are completely useless early on (Reisen and Nitori fall into this trope very easily. Reisen due to the dungeon you're forced to use her in having everything either immune or absorb Shadow, leaving her with no way to damage the enemies, and Nitori mostly due to her having the worst MP pool in the game and no access to the Item command itself), but in the long run they're far from useless. Just some are better to use than others is all!


For the record, there are a grand total of 28 playable characters (8 of them I believe are optional. The other 20 are main). There are roughly 22 other temporary characters meant to fill in the story segments and whatnot, bringing the total up to roughly 50 something playable characters. Yeah...


Game would be going faster if I weren't about the only one working on the project (I have a mapper that's working on the current dungeon, though he's been working on that thing for the past 3-4 months now...gonna send him to rework the beta1 maps later, but that's part of the reason of me not doing anything on the project itself aside from bug fixes and the like).
Re: Touhou Fantasy, Xenomic's RPG Maker game!
#6  December 20, 2012, 07:31:44 pm
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Have you tried to go to other Touhou forums for help? There's lot of fellows who may be willing to help you, at least a little. I mean, I know you post in Touhou Imageboard about this game, but trying forums may be good too. And you have proven that you've done the game, not just randomly talk.
Re: Touhou Fantasy, Xenomic's RPG Maker game!
#7  December 20, 2012, 08:46:22 pm
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awwww No thief or Assasin class?
Anyways,i tried goofing around once with RPG maker,but i didnt get it at all.
It was a trial version,so i cant do it again though....
Good luck on this,Xenomic
Re: Touhou Fantasy, Xenomic's RPG Maker game!
#8  December 20, 2012, 11:08:37 pm
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@Nanashi: Tried both DoujinStyle and Maidens of the Kaleidoscope, no such luck on either forum (and those are the two biggest ones I know right now). In a way, that's kinda why I wanted to post the game here on the MUGEN forums (though that was also part of the reason why I was hesitant to do so...).


@Erroratu: Well, in a way, Marisa is the Thief since she has the Steal command (and originally she would have the ability to unlock locked chests and doors that didn't require a switch or something, but overworld field abilities aren't all in yet. Haven't decided on how to handle most of them). No Assassin class though, though thinking on it Mokou could've easily been an Assassin, since she know assassin arts after all....hmmm...didn't think about that very well. >_>
Last Edit: December 21, 2012, 03:39:56 am by Xenomic
Re: Touhou Fantasy, Xenomic's RPG Maker game!
#9  December 21, 2012, 03:40:17 am
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I apologize ahead of time for the bad speaking and the whiffing in the mic. I don't know WHY it whiffs in the mic like that, but it does. Also, I don't know what happened to the volume in the second half. It kinda dropped out for some reason...


This video is in response to all of the reviews and criticisms I've gotten. Granted, mostly the negative ones. I HAVE had GOOD criticisms and whatnot, don't get me wrong and I appreciate it, but some of these criticisms man...I don't know!


So yeah...hopefully ya'll can understand what I'm saying here, and what I'm trying to get at. Can't expect a one-man army to do EVERYTHING perfectly. It's called a BETA for a reason after all!


And why yes, that is exactly how I sound.
Re: Touhou Fantasy, Xenomic's RPG Maker game!
#10  December 21, 2012, 11:41:26 am
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It's normal that you get a lot of bad criticism at first, specially if it's your first game, as you literally have no idea if what you're doing will end up being good. Just ignore things like "This game sucks and you suck -1" comments and just grab the ones that tell you the flaws your game has, then improve it from there.

But seriously, a half an hour video discussing all those reviews is kinda... useless. And more if the quality sucks because of your microphone. Really, just ignore stupid comments, grab feedback and improve until you start getting to the point you want to be.
Re: Touhou Fantasy, Xenomic's RPG Maker game!
#11  December 21, 2012, 09:22:51 pm
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It was more of me trying to sort things out and set things straight really than discuss the reviews (a lot of comments I've gotten were like that too). It's not to say that I HAVEN'T had good criticisms within bad ones, just that a lot of these "reviews" and comments and whatnot are negative over things that honestly I don't think are THAT important at the current time. Yes, I know graphics are nice and all, but one can only do so much with them. As I said in the video itself, I am not a spriter, and I have no spriter, so I'm limited on what I can and cannot do on that front. *Shrugs* I kinda expect backlash on it or something from some people...but still felt like it was something I should do. I dunno.


I'm still going to continue doing what I've been doing in 2k3 and using what good feedback I've gotten to improve the game, no worries there. Still, doesn't stop the negative crap from being well...annoying to say the least.


(Though I wonder if it is because of my mic...the mic is close to my mouth, as it's part of the headset, and well, that's how my voice sounds naturally. That bit ISN'T because of the mic at all...).
Last Edit: December 28, 2012, 06:46:15 am by Xenomic
Re: Touhou Fantasy, Xenomic's RPG Maker game!
#12  December 28, 2012, 06:46:33 am
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So for those of you who've been keeping up with my game, or have played it themselves, they know that my crafting system is well...actually garbage. I'm in need of help with revamping this thing (which may result in cutting out a LOT of crafting items, redoing what enemies drop/steal/morph, what treasures give what, etc.), so there's going to be a LOT of coding on my end. I'm not exactly sure HOW I want to pull this off either...it's not like Final Fantasy IX's crafting system at all, and follows more of Genius of Sapphieros/Gensoumaroku's system (which is what I based it off of), though you can also say it somewhat follows Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles: Ring of Fates/Echoes of Time's crafting systems.


So yeah, if anyone is interested in helping on this, or has any ideas on how to fix this bad boy up so that things are USEFUL to craft (I HAVE the craftable items made already...just need to figure out how to MAKE them is the problem), do drop me a line. It'd require having to get the game, but ya wouldn't need the music at all, and would only require going to ???? on New Game to go to Debug Room for testing purposes. Hope some of ya'll out there are interested in helping!
Re: Touhou Fantasy, Xenomic's RPG Maker game!
#13  December 28, 2012, 11:10:10 am
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It's better if you describe all the problems the current crafting system has if you want non-players to help you.
Re: Touhou Fantasy, Xenomic's RPG Maker game!
#14  December 28, 2012, 12:17:55 pm
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I'm interested in discussing about a crafting system -- I'm mostly stuck at work and on a client floor so I'm not allowed to do anything game-ish. Even images are turned off via the browser for this reason. All I've done so far before making the post below is skim-read the review of the game.

FFIX had a crafting system? Or did you mean FFXI and it was a typo?

FFIX's system, as far as I recalled: Collect different armor/weapons and fuse them together at a NPC to form a stronger item

FFXI's system, camp or spawn (spawns usually require camping for the item anyway) rare monsters with a 10% (or equally shit) drop rate and try to "HQ" the item, resulting in a slightly better one. If a normal quality item is crafted, sell it to make some sort of money back and try again

I don't think you're after FFXI's system. FFIX's system on the otherhand just requires you to hunt down the items to eventually build up to the item you want. Still, as you mention Final Fantasy, in general I will assume you're familiar with Final Fantasy 6-11 & 13 (I've never had the opportunity to play 12 so I can't factor that in)

---

First, I need you to determine what the objective you are trying to achieve with a crafting system. So in order to create some sort of balance, you say the craftable items are made already, but are they:

1. Worst than the items that can be obtained normally (players won't bother then; it's deemed unuseful)
2. Equal to the items that can be obtained normally (players might bother if there is not enough items to go around all the characters)
3. Top tier items better than any other that can be obtained normally (players may bother if it can last them a few levels ahead or at end game)

All 3 are subjective to current level to when they could be obtained versus other items. To make players optionally take up your crafting system, these items should have some sort of perk to it that's helpful to them at the time of obtaining it (i.e. before going into the 3rd area/dungeon of the game, you could collect 20 Magic Ores to craft Magic Sword which has an added effect of healing everyone for a small amount per turn, because the 3rd area/dungeon contains monster that uses abilities which affect all characters)

Are the recipes for the crafts:

1. Learnt naturally (maybe by level)
2. Obtained via NPC with some cost or free
3. Rare drops off monsters

Also, as this is an offline game, I am of course not going to take into account of the item's impact of the economy. Having said that, this also means crafting level is obsolete, it can be tied to the progress of your game/story or character rather than forcing the player to skill up like in MMORPGs.

Lastly, the items required to craft the craftables, are they:

1. Obtained out in the wild (i.e. the field, world map, a dangerous dungeon)
2. Off monsters
3. Off bosses and super-bosses
4. Brought off NPCs/Won from mini-games/Reward of a side quest
5. All of the above, mix and match

And bonus option:

1. Are the craftable items limited? (i.e. Golden Sun 1 & 2 allowed you to get a limited amount of materials off dungeons to be turned into powerful items for 2-3 of your characters out of 8 ) ; I see that you have 50~ characters
2. If unlimited, how are you going to place a limit on these items to stop abuse -- i.e. if the condition of these items is that they're better than the stuff you can obtain otherwise, you don't want players whoring them without some form of effort - FFXIII's system required you to spam hard fights with low drop rates or spend a ridiculous amount of gil for the ultimate weapons and armor

You don't want to force players to craft gear for all 50~ characters (although I suppose it's limited depending on time) but at the same time you want some of the gear to benefit across other characters; I assume the inventory is shared if there are multiple story branches (i.e. FFVI's 3-way split segment. If you play Sabin's path first you can buy some nice armor from the NPCs to be used in Locke's path)

3. Additionally, crafted items does not need to be necessarily equipped. You can say, implement un-equipable crafted items that can be equipped if further combined with something a powerful boss drops. System wise you got a lot to pick from. It can be as complex as this:

- Kill X rare monster for 10x X rare drop (time consuming)
- Craft unequipable item
- Kill X super boss monster for X drop (time consuming)
- Take unequipable item and X to NPC who will craft it to a super item for you (better quality of life)

--

Overall, you obviously want to tie effort to craft such items in terms of power. I guess one more point to consider is endgame:

1. Are the items required to finish story mode and beat the game? (Most RPGs say no)
2. Other than improving the character and the player's quality of life (quicker fights, etc) are the items actually mandatory? (FFVII was easy enough that the Ultimate Weapons were not necessary; however this was 10 years after and people raped the shit out of the game to have everything covered; if we rewind back to 1997 where we knew nothing, the Ultimate Weapons were actually really nice. Who didn't enjoy using Ultima Weapon to tear shit up? They were a nice damage boost and any average player would consider it necessary to beat Emerald/Ruby weapon)

I'm aware none of the Ultimate Weapons were crafted, but given the effort required to obtain some of them I lumped it in the same category.

3. After getting these good crafted items, is there anything in the game that can utilise such items to give the player something to do for obtaining them? (Original FFVI had nothing that was challenging to the player after obtaining all the best weapons; Advance FFVI fixed it by providing an optional "challenge" dungeon)

If said items can be obtained again with some effort, then getting such items to power up one character would allow speedier progress to power up other characters (which will snowball up until all characters have X item)

---

Well I wonder if all that helped. If you meant by "crafting system" as in the gimmicks required to craft the item, rather than everything else around it, then I'm not sure how to help you there. Given the attention span of players nowadays, especially if playing a free fan-made game, they won't have much patience to stick around for anything more complex then "bring all these items together, push button", but you don't want to gate it in such a way that people just plain won't bother unless the game is exceptionally of high quality or good reputation (unfortunately, this dictates how long a player would be willing to stick around).

If you want complex crafting system, read the whole of http://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Category:Synergy and modify it to your likings.

Hopefully you did mean how to put such a system together in terms of crafting/obtainable items rather than the process itself :P
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Last Edit: December 28, 2012, 12:22:59 pm by ⒻⓊⒸⓀⓎⒺⒶⒽ
Re: Touhou Fantasy, Xenomic's RPG Maker game!
#15  December 28, 2012, 04:08:38 pm
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I can only give you one general advice and that is, avoid any sort of randomness in crafting. (GoS didn't have any so if you follow that, it's good.)
Otherwise players will keep reloading until they get the result they want and if it takes too many times for that they'll also get bored with doing that and end up disliking the game.
An example of this would be Dungeons of Dreadmor, where you could place an item onto an Anvil of Krong to gain a random bonus applied on your item, but it might get cursed instead and the Anvil can only be used once. It can also give 1 or 2 points of stats, and obviously, I kept trying until I got 2.
Pretty often I found myself wasting 30 minutes dropping the item onto the anvil and reload until I finally managed to get a positive stat on the item that wasn't useless (physical damage for your wizard is rather useless for example), and very often I still had to settle for something suboptimal, like +1 damage instead of 2, or +2 fire resistance (which is useful but nowhere near as much as +2 damage or armor)
I haven't added a crafting system to my game yet, but I plan to make it so that each item would require 1-2 specific materials, and about 3 materials where only the type is specific, and the additional bonuses applied will depend on what was used as additional materials. For example, a High Quality Wood+High Quality Crystal+3 Essences would result in a High Quality Staff, and depending on the type of essences, it will gain extra stats, like when 3 blue essences are used, it gains +3 INT, 2 blue and a green gives it +2 INT and +1 VIT, etc, each type of essence increasing one specific stat by a set amount.
This bonus amount will then be scaled by the item level, and the level of item being made will depend on the character's level who makes it, and their crafting skill.
I doubt you can make anything that advanced in RPG maker, unfortunately.
Re: Touhou Fantasy, Xenomic's RPG Maker game!
#16  December 28, 2012, 07:54:52 pm
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@Nanashi: Yeah, I'm not very good at explaining anything. Well, the issue here is that there's like 100 crafting items (well, that shouldn't be TOO big of an issue really, seeing as RoF and EoT had just as many. Although GoS and Maroku did not, and I can't say if FFIX had that many or not, but IX did things differently than those 4 games). The easiest way to get them right now (aside from the beta shop for them) is to either win them from enemies, steal them from enemies, or find them in chests. Note, you can only ever win one item from one enemy, so if you win a Sealing Rod from a Fairy, that's all you'll ever see it drop if it drops it. Steals I can be more flexible with as I have to hardcode that but I digress.

The main issue is that craftable items tend to take way too many of specific items to make, for something that isn't spectacular. An example is the HP +10% accessory, which requires 4 HP Stones. HP Stones are items that give a character +30 Max HP (I think?) when used, and they're not easy to come by at that. Finding 4 in the entire game as it is isn't going to happen either...and some items don't appear until much later that are needed (hence why I put that beta shop in just for crafting items. Not sure if it'll stay or not though). That's just one example though, many craftable items require high amounts of items (20-30 is about the norm for some of them), mostly of common items such as elemental gems, but even then those drop at like a 20-30% rate if you find the right enemy.

So that's how it is.


=============================================================

@ⒻⓊⒸⓀⓎⒺⒶⒽ: I'm pretty well versed in the FF universe (FFI-XII, bar FFXI, FFXII: RW, FFCC: RoF, FFCC: EoT, FFMQ, FFT series) so yeah, I was referring to FFIX's. The issue with IX's that I had was it required 2 specific items, and I didn't want to go that route (I still do have some equipment needed in order to make other stuff, but GoS/Maroku both did that anyways).

Every craftable thing is there from the get-go once you get Nitori (who has the Call Craft Shop ability and is the only way to get to it), so players can get whatever assuming they have the proper materials. For the most part, you can just craft things that would otherwise cost a lot to buy (for instance, one Large P item costs 1000 yen, but you can instead craft 1 by using 10 P items, which are easy to win from fights). Equipment generally is stuff that you can buy in shops, but you can try to get equipment available later in the game early on assuming you have the right materials. In addition, character-specific armor and weapons generally are exceptionally good (for instance, Sakuya's level 2 specific weapon lets her use the Haste spell, which nobody can use normally, and Momiji's Soul Calibur weapon (yes, she can use Soul Calibur) is her 4th tier (strongest) craftable weapon that grants bonuses to her while equipped, such as Life Up which is a stronger version of Regen.

Of course, there's at least 1 or 2 weapons stronger than the strongest craftable weapons that cannot be crafted, and a couple armor that's really nice to have around that aren't character specific.


1) Crafting items generally are not limited. There's almost always a way to get some, though some are going to be much, MUCH more difficult to obtain (character specific level 5 materials, Adamantite, Orichalcum, just to name a few). They are, as stated before, generally obtained through mix and match basically. The sidequests aren't in yet, but that'll be for when I get the entire main story done...someday.

2) While there ARE 50 some characters, only about 25 of them are those you can change equipment for (the other half are just temporary characters). In fact, for someone like Cirno who naturally HAS no weapon at all and can only use specific craftable weapons, it's better for those characters anyways (and for Cirno, it would benefit her a lot since she has a naturally 100% critical hit rate).  Inventory is shared yes (I'd be crazy trying to not make it shared x_x;;)

3) I know Valkyrie Profile did something like that with an item that prevent Freeze on the entire party now that I think about it. The problem is I don't know how to go about doing that at all, or what for. Some things I can't tinker with at all (drop rates and EXP/Yen drops cannot be changed outside of flat out changing it on enemies; critical hit rate can't be changed; evasion cannot be changed; etc.), so I'm limited on what I CAN and CAN'T do...and changing status resistances is EXTREMELY annoying (why oh why didn't 2k3 just use ONE % for these things instead of 5 levels...ugh). Though the idea of fighting X superboss for X item kinda happens later with an optional character (assuming you don't actually kill said optional character), and is repeatable as well since it's the only way to increase her skill levels. Boss gets harder each round at that.

4) None of the items are required to finish the game, but the later items are generally relatively nice to have. Right now, physical attacks are garbage mostly because of how 2k3 treats damage formula:

Damage = 1/2 Attack - 1/4 Defense

Yeah...garbage formula indeed. So a character with 100 ATK attacking something with 100 DEF will generally do 25 damage each time they attack. It's terrible...

5) They're only really mandatory for late game optional bosses since some make life easier (I COULD have some equipment negate specific battle events, such as FFXII's Ultima's gimmick of switching out HP Drain > MP Drain > Slow speed > whatever gimmick. Yes, that gimmick is around in here...oh, and yes Ultima is around somewhere too....maybe).

6) There are going to be 4 post-game dungeons that will require some of the better gear to get through (they're pretty massive too. A couple at the very least are going to be 100 floors, and they all have their own gimmicks at that). Luckily, with the way the system is handled, everyone's best stuff is specific to them. Sure, you can get the best craftable GENERIC weapon and armor for everyone, but their specific stuff is generally better than that (with some exceptions in armor).


Most of the issue was fixing the system. The system pretty much is already implemented and all, but it's a matter of how many items is needed for what material and whatnot. That, and if the amount of crafting items needs to be reduced.

=============================================================

@Seravy: There isn't any randomness in crafting at all. It's just "Bring these items here, if you have enough then craft X item". Also, it's possible to make something like that in RPG Maker. Just would take a while to do.
Re: Touhou Fantasy, Xenomic's RPG Maker game!
#17  December 31, 2012, 12:27:08 pm
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That's cool so you seem to have most of it thought out.

I'm also surprised but I also respect your "going big" thought for a single-player RPG, i.e. the 50 chars & 100 floor dungeons, etc. I had a quick browse through your video and I can see how you're able to generate so much in so little time.

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The main issue is that craftable items tend to take way too many of specific items to make, for something that isn't spectacular. An example is the HP +10% accessory, which requires 4 HP Stones. HP Stones are items that give a character +30 Max HP (I think?) when used, and they're not easy to come by at that. Finding 4 in the entire game as it is isn't going to happen either...and some items don't appear until much later that are needed (hence why I put that beta shop in just for crafting items. Not sure if it'll stay or not though). That's just one example though, many craftable items require high amounts of items (20-30 is about the norm for some of them), mostly of common items such as elemental gems, but even then those drop at like a 20-30% rate if you find the right enemy.

So that's how it is.

If that's the issue, why not simply make more items available? Increase drop rate, availability, etc. Or lower the material requirements.

I don't know how to put it but it feels like you're thinking along the lines of MMORPGs "crafting" where 90% or more of the output is useless (biggest example would be World of Warcraft). I'm not sure why you would want to do that in the game.

Also, the example you provided, the HP+10% accessory, when can it be obtained? Basically I am doubting this, if it's no where near endgame:

1. There is an item you can craft, but no access to the materials until near the end of the game; you say finding 4 isn't simple
2. If the player uses even one of the HP Stones, they effectively cannot craft it
3. Would the item even be useful at that stage of the game?

I can't understand what you are trying to achieve here. When it comes to getting items from a crafting specific point of view only, I feel for now (until I can understand the game and the items that can be crafted better) the items are completely undesirable. You may have a system in place in terms of items, but for most part it doesn't seem to help much (so far).

As we're both familiar with FFIX, that's the best example to shoot for. Each synthesis item is more or less useful at that point in the game (when you gain access to the NPC) if you got the items to make it. i.e. Butterfly Sword was a significant damage boost for the time you can get it, and the materials for it were the base dagger Zidane starts off with, and a Mage Masher, found by stealing, a chest in the early dungeon or the shop.

The feeling you're looking for here is this. At many point during my FFIX playthrough (during 2000, internet less helpful back then), I would reach a new area, and check out the synthesis shops. As I played the game casually, I did not grind or farm as much in the given areas. I see the items, and I have a desire for them, because I know they are good due to the stats or whatever, but I don't know where to obtain or farm for the synthesis items.

I know you're limited by RM2k3's limited system and coming up with creative items can be difficult. But still, you should aim to create items players would find powerful and be somewhat easily obtainable (depending on progress within the game and the item's power), not time consuming to the point of a Korean MMO Grind. You only have the authority to force players to grind the item if you know players are captivated by your game. At the moment, given the following facts:

1. A gamer's (or heck, a person's) attention span is extremely low nowadays
2. It's a free fan-made game; people are less likely to go all the way unless it's something amazing
3. To my knowledge, the game is not relatively well known, or hyped up over either, unless you have the hype of a commercial game
4. There is little to nothing to show for the items obtained (commerical games at least had achievements; even stupid games on the iOS have similar)

I don't think players would be interested in such a crafting system (by your initial description of the issue at the top).
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Re: Touhou Fantasy, Xenomic's RPG Maker game!
#18  December 31, 2012, 07:13:39 pm
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Drop rates are generally dependent on the level of the crafting material too (elemental gems are 15% drop rate usually, while level 1 character items are generally 50-60%). It just all depends on the level; level 5 or extremely rare items that WOULD be drop rate would be as low as 5% probably. All I'm going to do really is cut down how many items are used for materials (like again, 4 HP Stones would instead become 1 HP Stone) and so on and so forth. I also try to keep SOME *cannot think of the right word* way to identify where to get items from enemies. For instance, when fighting a Fairy, odds are you'll get an item for Cirno (Fairy Wing, Fairy Dust), fight a frog and you'll usually get items for Suwako or sometimes Cirno (Frozen Frog, Holy Tadpole Eggs, etc). The other issue, and one that I need to rethink probably, is that some of the crafting materials that you can get are also equippable items (Youkai Sword "Inu" is an universal sword that anyone can use. Has low attack, but a 10% chance of Instant Death. Hunter's Knife is Sakuya's level 3 (?) item, but gives +50 Speed when equipped (nothing else at all).


I'm trying to avoid having the crafting system be useless, but I'm also trying to balance it so that the player can't just simply break the game wide open by being able to get some of the best stuff early on (not that they COULD because level 4-5 items don't show up like at all in the current beta, but you get the point). Just balancing it out is the main issue here.


As for those points:

1) That's one of the bigger issues right now (that, and some of the lower leveled items you can't even find right now in the current beta as is, which is another issue, hence why I made that beta crafting materials shop where you can buy level 1-3 character items and a lot of the generic items).
2) Trying to avoid this problem too, since everything CAN be gotten in some form or another in unlimited quantity. Just HOW to do so is the issue.
3) I honestly can't say HOW useful some things would be early on (HP +10% might not be, but that accessory is required to make the HP +20% accessory, and so on and so forth). Though some things would be (Rabite's Foot for example, since that gives a whopping +50 speed).


In addition, crafting materials CAN sometimes be used as battle items (Poison Mushroom casts Bio on all enemies I believe for instance). I am trying to avoid grinding (the game is bad about that because of how terrible 2k3's EXP system is...that, and the game demands a lot of money for everything else. Luckily, crafting is free sans the items), and as stated, everything in the crafting shop is available from the start of the game (i.e. you can potentially get beta4 equipment during the start of beta2 when you first get access to the shop, including stuff that you cannot get anywhere else (at one point I was going to have a HP Stroll, MP Stroll, and HP/MP Stroll accessory, which could only be gotten through there, and the Rabite's Foot previously mentioned can only be gotten through there. Speed is one of the most important stats in 2k3 so...).
Re: Touhou Fantasy, Xenomic's RPG Maker game!
#19  January 03, 2013, 01:48:10 am
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I am *gasp* actually working on the game! This is what's going down:

*Fixed beta5 bug that crashed the game in Pandaemonium
*Fixed speed bug from beta2 ending (after defeating Tiamat and then getting Komachi)
*Will be fixing up some dialogue to touch up on it.

*Currently working on fixing up the crafting shop. Crafting materials are still the same prices, but those will probably change eventually. However, I am not certain if the crafting material shop (shop for buying materials) should stay or go. Originally, the system was based around winning or stealing from enemies, finding materials from chests or characters, or being rewards from sidequests. They were NEVER meant to be bought, so having that shop there kinda is influencing how the system is working. It'll need some more testing, but if I must, I'll have to do MORE changes later, either to how many materials each piece of equipment needs or the drop/steal rates of how often they're dropped (which I'm trying to avoid due to well...that's more work than changing the materials needed). If anyone would like to help on this, please let me know. I can use all the help I can get...

Heck, even deciding on whether or not to keep the shop or not would help. I already have the original crafting shop data uploaded, so if you want to try and help, here's what they USED to be:

http://www.mediafire.com/?8ue07tht17z11xp


There won't be an update patch until AFTER I get the crafting system fixed up, so keep that in mind, ya'll! Still waiting on mapper as well before I can work on beta5 story stuff...

Unless you guys want to wait until I get the new crafting shop done and/or an item list (i.e. where to find all of the items in the current beta) done first?
Re: Touhou Fantasy, Xenomic's RPG Maker game!
#20  January 03, 2013, 06:30:18 am
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http://www.mediafire.com/?n29jjcfdh8dda56


So I did a bit more remodeling than I thought. Here's what got changed:

*All accessories, except for Iron Duke, have had material costs dropped. In addition, some accessories have had some materials completely removed (for example, the HP/MP +20% and HP/MP +40% accessories both do not require a Dark Matter anymore)
*All shields have had their materials required dropped.
*Some items have had their material costs dropped.
*Several character specific weapons and armors, generally the first/second tier pieces, have had their materials dropped and/or coding fixed.
*Some items were added in the crafting materials shop, others moved to the appropriate levels.

Not EVERYTHING was fixed up/changed yet. In addition, I do not know if the crafting shop will still stick around or not, so there's that to keep in mind. Odds are, I won't keep it around (crafting materials were meant to double over as a way to get more money quickly too after all, as well as being some kind of battle item if need be). So if anything needs changed/fixed, do let me know. Also still need to know whether to keep the shop or not (which most are probably going to say yes for keeping, but...).