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Valgar Reinhart (Guardian Heroes) (Read 6218 times)

Started by Tails Clock, July 01, 2009, 04:18:57 am
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Valgar Reinhart (Guardian Heroes)
#1  July 01, 2009, 04:18:57 am
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I've been making this char and putting all his progress up on a different site and didn't even think of posting here as I felt like I'd be cheating on my current forum. But I just saw like 3 guys from my forum post here on the first page and realsie how stupid I sounded when saying that out loud so here it is.

Obligatory screenshots:



Download Valgar V0.5

His theme song

He's still not finished as you should be able to tell from his version number, though certainly playable!
The only things he lacks is his 3rd air attack, D, D, B/C attacks, GH style blocking, GH style turning and then a bunch of several custom supers. He was not made to be perfectly accurate, but to be a good Mugen character. He only has one move that uses up power though so you and the AI may max out your power often.

Please criticise, but don't post useless crap like "He looks cool" or "I shall download him now" becuase these messages are just borderline spam. I need real comments!

I am trying to set up a Guardian Heroes Mugen Project. Before I do I'm trying to collect resources at http://mugenguild.com/forumx/index.php?topic=88937.msg770946#msg770946
I am more a sprite ripper than a character maker, but I can code well. I am always looking for projects to join. (I suck at solo projects)
I am a beta-tester and am well known for being very pedantic.
Re: Valgar Reinhart (Guardian Heroes)
#2  July 01, 2009, 02:32:30 pm
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- No need for so many red CLSNs on crouching C.
- No sound for run.
- Did he have double jump in GH ? Hell, it's been such a long time I can't remember how the game played. -_-
- Doing qcf+S makes the AI gain control ! o_O
- I understand infinite priority for weapon based attacks, but crouching B and jumping C have infinite priority while they are melee attacks.
- Too much spammage of the attacks IMO. GH was not Guilty Gear. :P
- Graviton Thunder can miss if performed close to the opponent.
- Graviton Thunder shouldn't have so many red CLSNs on the charged versions.
- Nice behaviour for the Graviton Thunder move. I can't say for sure if it's exactly as it's intended to be, but it acts like I used to use it : spamming the attack again and again, immobilizing the opponent. :D I don't recall it made the opponent fall so fast if there's a lag between two Graviton Thunders though. I recall I could wait a little bit before doing another one, giving the time for some charge.

Everything is nice and cool so far, even though you lack sounds, as stated in your readme.

And well, it's not nice to put Curze in your "No Thanks" : you're using souds from his chars, remember. And you could still release your sprites as open-source in case somebody wants to use them, or you could make your own chars out of them, since you say Curze's chars are resized and ugly (yeah, it's true).

And sorry for my bad memory : when you fight Valgar at the end of the game, him wearing his holy white armour, what attack does he gain compared to his old black armour form ? Graviton Thunder ?

Good continuation. :)
Re: Valgar Reinhart (Guardian Heroes)
#3  July 01, 2009, 09:32:15 pm
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First off, thank you for deciding to make GH characters.  There just aren't many of them out there, and being incredibly great game GH is, I can't figure out why ALL of the chararcters and stages haven't been made already multiple times.  This is a great step in the right direction.


Anyway, many great comments regarding Valgar are in the above post so I'll be short.  I also had the problem frequently with the AI gaining control... I beg you to remove this since it's extremely confusing and frustrating when this happens.  Obviously this isn't finished, as there are a lot of missing sounds, especially sounds for his voice for certain moves.  But all-around he's coming along quite well.


And I'm pretty sure Valgar does have a double-jump.
Re: Valgar Reinhart (Guardian Heroes)
#4  July 02, 2009, 01:59:23 am
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- No need for so many red CLSNs on crouching C. Wow, don't remember being that precise with my hitboxes. But so long as it doesn't slow anything down I think I'll leave it like that.
- No sound for run. I don't think there were run or  walk sounds in GH.
- Did he have double jump in GH ? Hell, it's been such a long time I can't remember how the game played. -_- All characters had double jump.
- Doing qcf+S makes the AI gain control ! o_O Oh yeah, I used that for AI testing. Didn't expect anyone to try that command. Should have removed it before release.
- I understand infinite priority for weapon based attacks, but crouching B and jumping C have infinite priority while they are melee attacks. ...Isn't infinite priority when there are no blue hitboxes? If it's not then I am sorry and feel horribly embarrassed for this noob mistake. I know very little about priority and will try to fix this.
- Too much spammage of the attacks IMO. GH was not Guilty Gear. :P Apart from his missing moves, he plays pretty much like he does in GH in my opinion. He kills me almost all the time in both games but in GH he often does it by using his "D, D, c" attack and throwing me when I block. He is a boss level character and I think I did his AI and attack speeds pretty well.
- Graviton Thunder can miss if performed close to the opponent. I've yet to see this happen in my tests. Though it is less efficient if done as close as possible as it'll only hit a few times.
- Graviton Thunder shouldn't have so many red CLSNs on the charged versions. I've heard that before, but I like jumping over them rather than blocking and hitting the corner of it when I tired that looked too wierd and wrong. Also, same reasons as for the down and C.
- Nice behaviour for the Graviton Thunder move. I can't say for sure if it's exactly as it's intended to be, but it acts like I used to use it : spamming the attack again and again, immobilizing the opponent. :D I don't recall it made the opponent fall so fast if there's a lag between two Graviton Thunders though. I recall I could wait a little bit before doing another one, giving the time for some charge. I wanted to make certain it was spammable as that's how I used to use it too. But I struggled with getting it's damage and cost balanced enough so it can't be spammed as many times as you're probably used to and deals less damage too. As for the small gap of time for launching another one, it's because in GH you could juggle an enemy as much as you want and ALL hits could hurt a downed enemy. I could try and add more time for when you use another one but it's be overkill if made it the same as the original.

Everything is nice and cool so far, even though you lack sounds, as stated in your readme. I can't rip the sounds as the English version lacks the options area to play all sounds seperately. I jsut gotta wait until I can steal them from Curze.

And well, it's not nice to put Curze in your "No Thanks" : you're using souds from his chars, remember. And you could still release your sprites as open-source in case somebody wants to use them, or you could make your own chars out of them, since you say Curze's chars are resized and ugly (yeah, it's true). I was mostly irritated at the time as we were ripping the same character and they beat me to it wasting all my effort. But Yeah they've also helped me a lot in this so I'll change that.

And sorry for my bad memory : when you fight Valgar at the end of the game, him wearing his holy white armour, what attack does he gain compared to his old black armour form ? Graviton Thunder ? Unfortunately, he is the exact same character with the same attacks. Only difference is his character level, and of course his palette.

Good continuation. :) Thanks for this large message. It's great to hear some good criticism as I've had nearly none.

I can't figure out why ALL of the chararcters and stages haven't been made already multiple times.
I think mostly it's because the game is so rare and expensive ($100) and most people cannot get the emulator to work. I'd have ripped the stages already and made at least one to go along with this char, but I have no clue how to when the stages floor has that cool 3D effect that I don't know the proper name for. Also thanks.

I am trying to set up a Guardian Heroes Mugen Project. Before I do I'm trying to collect resources at http://mugenguild.com/forumx/index.php?topic=88937.msg770946#msg770946
I am more a sprite ripper than a character maker, but I can code well. I am always looking for projects to join. (I suck at solo projects)
I am a beta-tester and am well known for being very pedantic.
Re: Valgar Reinhart (Guardian Heroes)
#5  July 02, 2009, 02:27:23 am
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Yeah, you bring up a valid point regarding why there isn't more GH material out there.  Although I've seen a number of sprite sheets out there.

I'd have ripped the stages already and made at least one to go along with this char, but I have no clue how to when the stages floor has that cool 3D effect that I don't know the proper name for. Also thanks.

Sounds likes you're referring to parallax.  If so and that's your only significant issue, parallax floors are simple once you understand the values (there are plenty of tutorials on this, or feel free to ask for help if need be).  Frankly I can't think of anything in Guardian Heroes stages that mugen isn't capable of... oddly yet there is no legit GH/mugen stage in existance to my knowledge.  I'd LOVE to see your's be the first!

Again, great work.
Last Edit: July 02, 2009, 02:30:43 am by Nate Nukem
Re: Valgar Reinhart (Guardian Heroes)
#6  July 02, 2009, 04:48:47 am
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parallax floors are simple once you understand the values (there are plenty of tutorials on this, or feel free to ask for help if need be).
Tutorials on ripping a parallax stage? Because that's what I meant. Doing a stage with parallax doesn't seem hard at all, it's purely the ripping part that's difficult.

Although I've seen a number of sprite sheets out there.
Impossible!! There are only 2 sheets anywhere on the internet not ripped by me!... Unless they're on some japanese site. If you do some across any PLEASE send them to me. Anything that saves me from ripping another character will really help my goal to make a full Guardian Heroes Mugen game.

I am trying to set up a Guardian Heroes Mugen Project. Before I do I'm trying to collect resources at http://mugenguild.com/forumx/index.php?topic=88937.msg770946#msg770946
I am more a sprite ripper than a character maker, but I can code well. I am always looking for projects to join. (I suck at solo projects)
I am a beta-tester and am well known for being very pedantic.
Re: Valgar Reinhart (Guardian Heroes)
#7  July 02, 2009, 05:16:11 am
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  • I've got ballllls of steeellll.
Ah yes, ripping a parallax floor is probably different... I've never done it.


As for the sheets, I can't remember where I saw a lot of them, but I have a sprite sheet for Godats if you want it.  I was planning on making them a mugen character but never got very far (Godats are my favorite GH character).  I'd love to see a more talented person than myself make an authentic, over-the-top Godats character with all the sweat, pushups, and multiple Godat assists running all over the screen.  For a matter in fact, if you can make that happen, I'd love for you to have it.


That's the only one I have on my hard drive currently.  I can try to find where I saw the others, but it was years ago sorry.
Re: Valgar Reinhart (Guardian Heroes)
#8  July 02, 2009, 09:52:53 am
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Quote
Didn't expect anyone to try that command. Should have removed it before release.
I don't even know why I performed that command. ;D (and no, I didn't take a look at the CMD file)

Quote
Isn't infinite priority when there are no blue hitboxes? If it's not then I am sorry and feel horribly embarrassed for this noob mistake. I know very little about priority and will try to fix this.
Yeah, infinite priority is indeed when there are no blue hitboxes. Thus, on melee attacks (for basic attacks especially, it can be different for specials and supers), there should be a blue box overlapping the red one to some extent.
Refer to this for more info : http://kod.trinitymugen.net/K.O.D%27s_Basic_CLSN_Tutorial.html

Quote
I've yet to see this happen in my tests. Though it is less efficient if done as close as possible as it'll only hit a few times.
Tested on SPO Ryu by Rikard (my dummy character), and it misses at close distance.

Quote
I wanted to make certain it was spammable as that's how I used to use it too. But I struggled with getting it's damage and cost balanced enough so it can't be spammed as many times as you're probably used to and deals less damage too. As for the small gap of time for launching another one, it's because in GH you could juggle an enemy as much as you want and ALL hits could hurt a downed enemy. I could try and add more time for when you use another one but it's be overkill if made it the same as the original.
Yeah, I perfectly understand you didn't want to make it totally accurate, taking Curze's road can be pretty stupid :
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Maybe you could make the damage dampener act even more (if there is one), or make the attack do much less damage while being able to spam it longer (using the 3 powerbars would remove half of the life for example).

Concerning the discussion about stages, scroll down this page : http://randomselect.piiym.net/forum/index.php?topic=5016.0
Now you can contact mh777 and have a little conversation with him, I'm sure he'll be able to guide you into ripping parallax floors and coding them properly. ;)
Re: Valgar Reinhart (Guardian Heroes)
#9  July 05, 2009, 07:02:13 am
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  • If I offended you, you're an idiot.
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    • www.mugenevolution.co.uk/TailsClock/
For a matter in fact, if you can make that happen, I'd love for you to have it.
JESUS CHRIST YES YES YES YES YES YES YES SEND ME PLEASE. Thankyou. If you ever come across any that are not the Knight or Proto Silver then PLEASE send me anything and everything you can. I've been searching so much and have found so little. I want to make every single GH character.

Yeah, infinite priority is indeed when there are no blue hitboxes. Thus, on melee attacks (for basic attacks especially, it can be different for specials and supers), there should be a blue box overlapping the red one to some extent.
I thought I had done this right, though comparing mine to the ones in the tutorial I see I've left too big a gap between the red and blues. I will fix this.

Tested on SPO Ryu by Rikard (my dummy character), and it misses at close distance.
I just tested this on 20 characters and it never happened....until I realised that I was always cahrging it. So I tested the uncharged version and now I see the problem. I'll add some width to that move and slightly alter the clsn of the ball to stop that error from being possible anymore.

Maybe you could make the damage dampener act even more (if there is one), or make the attack do much less damage while being able to spam it longer (using the 3 powerbars would remove half of the life for example).
I don't have a dampener as all the ones I tried to implement just failed the second a 2nd one was used. but the move is stronger when charged. only problem is that the second you use a new one, the one you shot off loses all it's increased damage.
But to add more time to spam it I think I may just mess about with the velset or the recovery times.


Concerning the discussion about stages, scroll down this page : http://randomselect.piiym.net/forum/index.php?topic=5016.0
Now you can contact mh777 and have a little conversation with him, I'm sure he'll be able to guide you into ripping parallax floors and coding them properly. ;)
I really hope so, that would be awesome! Thankyou very much for all of this!

I am trying to set up a Guardian Heroes Mugen Project. Before I do I'm trying to collect resources at http://mugenguild.com/forumx/index.php?topic=88937.msg770946#msg770946
I am more a sprite ripper than a character maker, but I can code well. I am always looking for projects to join. (I suck at solo projects)
I am a beta-tester and am well known for being very pedantic.
Re: Valgar Reinhart (Guardian Heroes)
New #10  July 07, 2009, 07:59:09 pm
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  • I've got ballllls of steeellll.
Gladly!  Check your inbox.  ;)


For now, I just hope you let me (or us on this board) know as your great work on these GH characters continues.  If you finish Valgar and then do even SOME of the GH roster like you plan, you'll truly be my hero.  And of course, same goes if you take a stab at any of the stages.  Thanks so much again!
Last Edit: July 08, 2009, 10:27:32 am by Nate Nukem