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Death Battle (And sprite fight animations) (Read 1852615 times)

Started by Long John Killer, April 09, 2015, 03:59:16 AM
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Re: Death Battle (And sprite fight animations)
#2581  May 18, 2021, 12:39:28 AM
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Oh, ok, you meant going in.  Then yeah, that I agree.  During the match it was fairly obvious by their calculations if nothing else Iron Fist wasn't going to destroy a planet like that meteor, if nothing else.  Going in I figured neither of them were going to be that fantastic considering my limited exposure to them.

I'm wondering what approach they'll take for next episode's animation?  Steven technically has sprites....but it's Save the Light which has his old series design though, and Unleash the Light has 3D models in that weird super deformed style on a 2.5D plane.  I don't think Star even have video games to pull from?  Or anything extensive fan made.  They could do the whole animation like Jack versus Afro, this would be the most likely episode to do it with considering the combatants.
Re: Death Battle (And sprite fight animations)
#2582  May 18, 2021, 07:40:10 PM
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Po vs. Ironfist was alright.

Can't wait for Steven or Star to just abandon their character like Aang in Aang vs. Edward.
Re: Death Battle (And sprite fight animations)
#2583  May 18, 2021, 10:15:22 PM
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I mean....Edward also isn't keen on killing.  Do realize the entire point of Aang versus Ed wasn't just the battle between the classical mythological elements versus the periodic table of elements, it was also built on the irony of neither could be in that situation Death Battle proposed based on their core moral values.  It's funny.  Or supposed to be, anyways.

That said, can't speak for Star but Steven's a murderer.  I mean, spoilers, but it's over a year old I think by now and the episode is pretty much bound to cover it for the stat feat related to the event.  Unless you mean just outright characterization abandonment throughout, which....I mean, has happened but they're kinda getting better at it?  I'm largely disconnected from Kung-Fu Panda but can say that last episode pretty much hit Po's character right on the nose.

I didn't think Aang versus Ed was terrible with their characterization, other than the obvious fact of them needing to end with a kill?  They were both playful in the episode and Aang was consistently apologetic while Ed was easy to send into a fury.
Re: Death Battle (And sprite fight animations)
#2584  May 19, 2021, 12:02:24 AM
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I really don't know how many more times this exact conversation has to happen here, but it is very explicitly stated in the rules of the series that moral limitations against killing are ignored for the sake of comparing skill and power levels.  It has been cornerstone of the entire series for a literal decade. I don't understand how people are still grousing about characterization when that's never once been the point of the show.

FFS the show is called Death Battle, not Well Mannered Moral Discussion About Whether These Two Characters Would Have A Reason To Be In Conflict With Each Other.
Re: Death Battle (And sprite fight animations)
#2585  May 19, 2021, 12:24:50 AM
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To be frank though, giving a reason, as well a reason as it is for this hypothetical, as to why something fundamental with the characters in question is being changed to the point where the character is now "wrong".....does not negate the fact that the character is now "wrong".  It'll always sit weird on characters that have to be bent so far off their alignment chart to the point that the perception of them in this scenario breaks to many a viewer.  You're not wrong, but it's always gonna be weird or even distasteful to some degree.  It's usually not a problem when they write a decent enough script, but then you will get those bigger pop culture icons and people's ingrained perception of them.

Its been however many years and Goku vs Superman deciding that Goku would be fine and happy killing off a city of people and Superman destroying the Earth still doesn't feel right outside all the arguments on who does what and why and whatever handwaving reasoning, fully aware why they do what they do.
Re: Death Battle (And sprite fight animations)
#2586  May 19, 2021, 01:00:33 AM
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I'd still argue that the onus is 100% on the viewer to adjust their expectations to match what the show explicitly states is going to happen.  When someone says up front what they're doing and why they're doing it that way for the purposes of the result they're looking for, and you still choose to go in knowing that, you don't get to come out at the end and say "I can't believe they would do that." 
Re: Death Battle (And sprite fight animations)
#2587  May 19, 2021, 01:12:13 AM
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"Bloodust" is a pretty universally recognized conceit to allow for two characters to fight who otherwise would avoid fighting, much less fighting at their full potential; there's really no way of doing these matchups in any other way.
Re: Death Battle (And sprite fight animations)
#2588  May 19, 2021, 01:22:13 AM
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And I'm not saying you guys are wrong in any way.  It's still will be forever jarring to an audience wide-reaching enough as Death Battle gets.  Things WILL tick those unique enough boxes that someone in the crowd will find wrong.  I myself didn't find anything wrong with Aang and Ed, but clearly they did.  I myself find Beerus and Galaxia pretty damn wrong and overall annoying the cast views Beerus as a living meme and nothing much beyond that, but I don't expect many others do as well.  But I suppose those don't fall into the "bloodlust" accountability, so....ok, Green Lantern versus Ben 10.  Beyond all the stat calcs everyone else argues with the episode, its never not gonna be weird Hal just wants to kill a kid nor Ben a police officer.  Yeah, you're supposed to just shrug and "deal with it", but it is nonetheless awkwardly handled.

Or the Mega Man Battle Royale for that matter, scrolling through their list of episodes again now.  A few of those characters have actual positive history with one-another, so willfully ignoring it is a bit strange.
Re: Death Battle (And sprite fight animations)
#2589  May 21, 2021, 11:41:25 AM
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You're overanalyzing something that has already been explained.
The show intends to solve the question of who would win between A and B when they're both not limited to restrictions including morality. While they try to keep in character as best they can, ultimately when they have the characters go for the kill there's so much they can keep "in character". This particularly affects more the characters that avoid killing because they're definitely killing now. I mean, I would say that more than half the matches wouldn't end in a death if they kept that morality in.
Re: Death Battle (And sprite fight animations)
#2590  May 24, 2021, 08:17:00 PM
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Max Galactica

Re: Death Battle (And sprite fight animations)
#2591  May 24, 2021, 09:00:30 PM
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Okay, that's weird.  They went into potential math before even introducing the character?  And.....math that doesn't make sense to the context at hand?  Huh?

They're looking for a durability feat of the shield vs the corruption song.  Except it wasn't a blast or laser or something to guard against, it was.....a song.  Just a vocalized melody that comes up a few times in the series.  They just needed to be covered from it.  I GUESS you can measure how loud a sound wave would need to be to cover the entire Earth....?

But even on top of that, it still wasn't a blast of physically damaging effect, it was more like a audibly-administered techno-virus that changed everyone who heard it psychologically.  This analysis already doesn't make sense.
Re: Death Battle (And sprite fight animations)
#2592  May 24, 2021, 11:03:30 PM
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Energy is energy.  It’s visibly producing light, so it’s still it’s still a source of power even it’s not creating physical  force.  All the light, heat, and radiation being emitted has to come from somewhere and account for something.
Re: Death Battle (And sprite fight animations)
#2593  May 24, 2021, 11:17:21 PM
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Well, it didn't affect the physical Earth at all, seeing its literal whole point was to corrupt the files of the gems, so this is effectively finding how much energy it would take for a flashlight to cover the Earth and at what distance.  And the source being Yellow, Blue and White Diamond's actual gems, which....we know already every Gem species has a self-generating unlimited source of energy, they'll last forever.  And it's hard to give the Corruption Song a huge energy output as a high-tier feet when the series has a whole species of Lapis Lazuli.  Whose whole point of existing is terraforming and destroying planets as need fit for the Empire.

Actually, bugging me more than that upon review is just throwing in the light-speed reactions from the Peridot laser defenses.  I get the feeling already they're going to handwave the whole species lore from Sugar that Gems can't go beyond light-speed without A) Outside help and B) Damaging their form's stability and general design.

I mean I can assume WHY they'd give it.  Steven's crossbreed status probably relieves him of that limitation because his body is flesh, not hardlight.  And then you still have Lapis from Ocean Gem just outright contradicting the supposed limitation.  So whatever.  Still bugs me.
Last Edit: May 24, 2021, 11:27:22 PM by Long John Killer
Re: Death Battle (And sprite fight animations)
#2594  May 24, 2021, 11:26:03 PM
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I mean they literally said energy and not force in the video when calculating the output of that ability, and never once claimed that they were equating that to physical output.

I'm... really unclear as to which nit you're trying to pick here?  Is your argument that what the Diamonds did didn't actually exist or didn't happen and shouldn't be counted or something?  Because from a physics standpoint everything they said here checks out.
Re: Death Battle (And sprite fight animations)
#2595  May 24, 2021, 11:32:56 PM
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I'm saying it's a weird stat to include at all to begin with.  The event they're giving attention to, they're measuring the wrong thing of importance.  It's like remarking how great Noah's Ark was at steering; irrelevant to what mattered.  If they were going for big-end feats then comparing Blue Diamond taking on Lapis would be a good start.  This here is just odd, placing it at the beginning of the character evaluation before the character in question even shows, and for something not that big a deal.  More impressive would have been if they somehow related the area of affect to the potency of the computer virus and the shield's counter-virus being that big.

But then you're going in Ultron/Sigma territory, which doesn't matter much in the long run.  So that's all, it's a weird stat to give importance to.
Re: Death Battle (And sprite fight animations)
#2596  May 24, 2021, 11:43:41 PM
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I'm sure it's not the only thing they'll be tallying for Steven in the full rundown.

Also, when you consider that he'll be facing off against a pure magic user, it does make a certain type of sense that they'd want to look at his ability to defend against non-physical, energy-based abilities.
Re: Death Battle (And sprite fight animations)
#2597  May 25, 2021, 12:10:05 AM
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Granting they still consider Gem's as "magical".  They were called such at the beginning of the series, but as we found as it progressed, the series takes Arthur C. Clarke's third law rather seriously and all magic is just technology humanity has yet to understand.  Likely the Gems as well, considering we never found out who their precursors were, they just were built one day to be the most advanced civilization in the universe by....supposedly the last most advanced.  Was kinda hoping Future was gonna get into that but is what it is, show got cut short for Garnet's wedding.  C'est la vie

Anyways, here's Star's preview.

Seems like a weird show.  I see why the debaters are conflicted on where to put her.  The preview alone already has both destroying a dimension and her top-tier spell is akin to a simple minigun.  With all due respect to Heavy Weapons Guy fans, there's a bit of a difference between the two.


Death Battle team put out a little preview GIF.  Huh, I'd think throwing in the Watermelon Stevens is a bit unfair, regardless of who they have win.  They're not summons at his beck and call, he accidentally created a new sentient race on Earth that resemble him.  But it does bring up a good point however.  If Star wins, they kinda have to lean on that dimension/universal feat.  Because anything lower that just kills Steven and/or breaks his gem isn't going to count as enough technically, he'd just jump into the next convenient body in the universe.  Like in the Lars body swap episode.  Curious how they'll get around that one if Star doesn't just destroy the whole universe.
Last Edit: May 30, 2021, 03:04:30 AM by Long John Killer
Re: Death Battle (And sprite fight animations)
#2598  May 31, 2021, 01:55:15 PM
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Maybe the Watermelon Stevens are just the impetus for the fight?  Like, Star thinks they're some kind of magical monster and tries to destroy them, and Steven jumps in to stop her.

Also, that dimensional feat may not actually count as much as people think it will.  Like Rock Lee and the Eighth Gate, a character theoretically having access to an ability doesn't count if they've never actually demonstrated that they can, in fact, use it.  From a cursory bit of research, having never watched the show myself, it seems like all of the universe-ending spells (no pun intended) are either only described in theory or used by other characters with no clear indication that Star has the ability to do the same.
Re: Death Battle (And sprite fight animations)
#2599  May 31, 2021, 02:51:35 PM
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Maybe, but that'd be painting Star out of the gate as the "villain" of the match.

...Not that that changes much, they've had plenty of episodes that just feel wrong narratively just to get the fight rolling.  Mikasa and RWBY girl was a recent one.  Was kind of hard to root for the protocol breaking rebel endangering lives for the selfish want to read a book in the animation.  Actually.....same applies to the other RWBY girl as well with Yang.  Waltz into 7th Heaven, kill the bouncers, demand information, kill when you don't get anything.  And people wonder why it's not a favorable episode.

Just not as fun when they hit one or both of the members with the Idiot Ball square in the face.  But I guess plot demands it to fit into the scenarios they create.


Anyways, here's the full thing.

Just....ugh.  No, guys.  No.
Last Edit: May 31, 2021, 07:24:27 PM by Long John Killer
Re: Death Battle (And sprite fight animations)
#2600  May 31, 2021, 07:30:00 PM
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The music for the fight was awesome.. To me, this was a fight where I had no clue how it would go since I've never seen either show before.. so what knowledge for both came from watching this.

If anything, Star was the 'aggressor' here since she dropped the sand tower on Steven. Still, it wasn't too bad.. I would of loved to see Steven's Pink Monster form appear, but since he has little control over it, it would have done more harm then good.

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