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A few questions about what defines a compilation or fullgame (Read 3406 times)

Started by NecusX, February 20, 2021, 06:01:50 PM
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A few questions about what defines a compilation or fullgame
#1  February 20, 2021, 06:01:50 PM
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So recently I've been trying to do a edit overhaul to KOF chars, adding more mechanics to them to be consistent and balanced. Even though I'm adding some significant tweaks to the characters, would the roster still be considered a compilation even if I add and edit the core mechanics of the characters? Because the characters were still originally created by someone else. For instance, KOFE is considered a fullgame, although the creator basically entirely reworked and edit the core mechanics of the characters to his own, so basically in essence, if I'm tweaking and adding new mechanics to the KOF roster, what type of mugen would it be considered?
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Re: A few questions about what defines a compilation or fullgame
#2  February 20, 2021, 10:24:34 PM
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I think everyone might have a different idea, but at the most basic level I would say compilation = without major modification.

Now, what qualifies as a major modification I have no clue. A long time ago in the ancient past of 2007, an edit was not really considered your work, no matter what you did, and it would just be a compilation. I think people's views have changed and there are quite a few legitimate creators whose work consists of major edits, so perhaps they won't consider it a compilation.
Re: A few questions about what defines a compilation or fullgame
#3  February 20, 2021, 10:31:06 PM
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Personally for it to not be a compilattion all chars must have same mechanics,same effects,same button system(4 or 6 or different for anime fight)and should be edited a lot cause there are lot of authors who does chars on same gameplay style,and putting all that into a mugen with few stages shouldnt make it fullgame,so editing,how extended it has to be to be considered fullgame I have no idea
Re: A few questions about what defines a compilation or fullgame
#4  February 21, 2021, 12:30:49 AM
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Very much like what bannana said though I can define said terminology

Compilation:
A mugen roster with other people's characters, stages, screenpack, etc packaged up in a mugen "game" of sorts. Usually they have a theme to them that imply that said characters have some consistency with each other even if gameplay wise they can differ. Which even if they say that they are emulating the same style, said coding style of each of the authors can show in gameplay. Most of the time how mugen is set up is pretty surface level in terms of being a full game such as having characters show up right in the order in the select def, being assigned to the right stage, etc.

Fullgame:
A mugen roster with characters, stages, screenpack, etc that have been made in mind for the purposes of balance, consistency, gameplay, story, etc. Now a fullgame can have others peoples characters put into them but they tend to be heavily edited to where they at least in gameplay terms fit in with the rest of the roster to a tee, if not extending further with their gfx. Since spriting is a more arduous task sometimes than coding. Though in terms of making mugen into a game comparable to a commercial fighter like Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles X Justice League requires a ton workarounds if you want more out of it than just what mugen provides stock. Which is one of the reasons/use cases why Ikemen GO plus exists other than mugen online lol, though ikemen originally started out as that and this is before we had parsec.

The line can sometimes blur between something being a compilation or a fullgame but I think it comes down to consistency, intent, and opinion sometimes.
Last Edit: February 21, 2021, 12:38:52 AM by Amidweiz
Re: A few questions about what defines a compilation or fullgame
#5  February 21, 2021, 05:09:18 PM
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Very much like what bannana said though I can define said terminology

Compilation:
A mugen roster with other people's characters, stages, screenpack, etc packaged up in a mugen "game" of sorts. Usually they have a theme to them that imply that said characters have some consistency with each other even if gameplay wise they can differ. Which even if they say that they are emulating the same style, said coding style of each of the authors can show in gameplay. Most of the time how mugen is set up is pretty surface level in terms of being a full game such as having characters show up right in the order in the select def, being assigned to the right stage, etc.

Fullgame:
A mugen roster with characters, stages, screenpack, etc that have been made in mind for the purposes of balance, consistency, gameplay, story, etc. Now a fullgame can have others peoples characters put into them but they tend to be heavily edited to where they at least in gameplay terms fit in with the rest of the roster to a tee, if not extending further with their gfx. Since spriting is a more arduous task sometimes than coding. Though in terms of making mugen into a game comparable to a commercial fighter like Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles X Justice League requires a ton workarounds if you want more out of it than just what mugen provides stock. Which is one of the reasons/use cases why Ikemen GO plus exists other than mugen online lol, though ikemen originally started out as that and this is before we had parsec.

The line can sometimes blur between something being a compilation or a fullgame but I think it comes down to consistency, intent, and opinion sometimes.

May you elaborate on the " said coding style of each of the authors can show in gameplay." with some examples?
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Re: A few questions about what defines a compilation or fullgame
#6  February 21, 2021, 11:36:36 PM
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Very much like what bannana said though I can define said terminology

Compilation:
A mugen roster with other people's characters, stages, screenpack, etc packaged up in a mugen "game" of sorts. Usually they have a theme to them that imply that said characters have some consistency with each other even if gameplay wise they can differ. Which even if they say that they are emulating the same style, said coding style of each of the authors can show in gameplay. Most of the time how mugen is set up is pretty surface level in terms of being a full game such as having characters show up right in the order in the select def, being assigned to the right stage, etc.

Fullgame:
A mugen roster with characters, stages, screenpack, etc that have been made in mind for the purposes of balance, consistency, gameplay, story, etc. Now a fullgame can have others peoples characters put into them but they tend to be heavily edited to where they at least in gameplay terms fit in with the rest of the roster to a tee, if not extending further with their gfx. Since spriting is a more arduous task sometimes than coding. Though in terms of making mugen into a game comparable to a commercial fighter like Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles X Justice League requires a ton workarounds if you want more out of it than just what mugen provides stock. Which is one of the reasons/use cases why Ikemen GO plus exists other than mugen online lol, though ikemen originally started out as that and this is before we had parsec.

The line can sometimes blur between something being a compilation or a fullgame but I think it comes down to consistency, intent, and opinion sometimes.

May you elaborate on the " said coding style of each of the authors can show in gameplay." with some examples?

For example let's just say two people are trying to emulate MvC2 and for the most part they're pretty similar to each other, but one characters launcher is pretty much spot on with being able to connect air combos and the other either has too much or too little velocity on the superjump... if it even automatically does the superjump for you. A somewhat drastic comparison would be comparing Kongs MvC2 characters compared to redhot's edits with the ladder being much more accurate to MvC2. Little stuff like this can throw off the consistency of a fullgame that's for sure. I'm sure there's other examples out there other that just MvC2 characters in mugen.
Re: A few questions about what defines a compilation or fullgame
#7  February 22, 2021, 12:19:05 AM
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Here's an easy example of the same character, Rasetsumaru, in the same style, Samurai Shodown V SP, by two very different creators, Ali and Montana.
https://streamable.com/2006h8

The ways in which different creators study games, whether or not they guess or use raw data, as well as how they choose to code that data, changes the outcome.

Compound this distinction with 20 characters all by different authors and you'll definitely find some discrepancies.
Re: A few questions about what defines a compilation or fullgame
#8  February 25, 2021, 06:45:30 AM
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Sprite styling also becomes important. So same style portraits. If even one character has quotes they al should. They share hitsparks. They share hit sounds and any super activation fx/sounds. The system needs to be the same across the board.

The only thing that can be different is the characters and what moves they have. Normally the sprite style should be the same too. Like don't mix VS with kof with garou. But thats not totally set in stone. Just preferable.

Basic mechanics must match. Common fx and sounds must match. Systems must match. If any of those are left out I'd be leaning towards compilation still.


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Re: A few questions about what defines a compilation or fullgame
#9  February 25, 2021, 06:56:46 AM
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Tag Team Rev, the fangame I'm working on, basically has all of that but style consistency, since it's a crossover of all kinds of characters. But gameplay systems are the same, everything is pretty consistent, all characters have the same overall style and gameplay, and not just similar... it's basically a full-game equivalent to a typical compilation. Tons of characters in one space, but all made to play consistently.

For me I basically agree with Cyanide -- that much alone is REQUIRED for a full-game. Sprite style, IMO, is always hit or miss due to how varied so many art styles are. If you ask me, I'd say that's the least important requirement of sorts, if it can be called that. The important thing for me is if the sprites are of quality at all. So no generic MS paint doodles that look like eyesores.
Re: A few questions about what defines a compilation or fullgame
#10  February 25, 2021, 08:26:20 AM
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Basically how Cyanide stated it. Plus in my personally opinion, lots of work and love put into a full game with fully coded characters, custom sprites and custom effects (was going to put original voice actors for characters but that is a hit and miss for me.) That is what defines a FULL GAME! What doesn't define a full game but a compliation are the stupid "games" saying (FULL GAME NARUTO VS SOME OTHER POPULAR ANIME DOWNLOAD NOW!) That just screams compliation you can even see some videos sometimes where they use other peoples characters, stages and sometime music without even trying to make it a full game out of it.