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Goku Z2 by Balthazar & Cybaster (AI patch by 亞) (Read 151274 times)

Started by Cybaster, April 25, 2011, 04:35:13 pm
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Re: Goku Z2 by Balthazar & Cybaster
#61  April 26, 2011, 02:17:18 am
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Well, fuck it, here's the video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JD4yJm9IsGM

Feel free to put that link in the first post if you wish, so people know how broken your char is.

Also I was supposed to give this stupid feedback via PM but whatever:
Quote
As always all tested in Winmugen+.

- The dizzy state for the opponent when hit by a MAX Genkidama is in movetype=I instead of movetype=H, reseting the hitcounter in the process. This most likely also breaks the combo dampener. I guess this is why I can do 100% damage combos as shown on my video.

- I cant use any LV2 super or EX moves as standalone moves if their command use 2 punch buttons when Hope bar is on due to the Genkidama charge command having greater priority. Can only use those moves when cancelled into in such case.

- Can't connect an aerial attack into EX Slash Down Kick against a standing Goku, you get to the ground before the attack can hit him. Also should be atleast a bit more damaging, it's not really worthly to use it when you can do more damage by using aerial Mid Kick -> any Slash Down Kick, it's not like the EX version gives you anything like invulnerable frames or super armor. Also more hits = more dampening which is bad on this char so a damage buff would be nice.

- I got moved back during kamehameha, It was weird cornerpush behaviour. I was hitting an aerial opponent with 2 Ki Blasts, then cancelled into the super and Goke kept moving back during the superpause. Happened me twice (The other time after an aerial combo using Aerial Hurricane Kick).

- semi-infinite combos can be performed on a cornered opponent as shown in the last part of the video. Either give Standing Strong Kick more recovery time or less hitstun.

- Sometimes when you OTG someone after EX Left Snap Kick They actually get on their standing state yet the combo still is valid and the combo counter keeps rising. BTW your OTG system is REALLY weird >_>, it took me a while to figure it out why the enemy sometimes pops up and enables me to continue a combo and sometimes he just lays down, it depends of when you hit him (Best moment is after a bounce, just as they get at the apex of it).

- I just can't get over it, the inconsistence on the afterimages for the supers is just weird, same level of supers have totally different colors on their afterimages and to be honest, if I were you I would just remove them :P.

Why do you sound so pissed off? If there's a few things wrong with this character it's not the end of the world... You could've just given your feeback without sounding like this Goku has ruined your life.

and it's spelled "inconsistency"
Re: Goku Z2 by Balthazar & Cybaster
#62  April 26, 2011, 02:23:26 am
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Rednavi's intensity hinders his chances to lead a normal life. I think he has OCD, and perhaps an ego problem, he can't stand not getting the amount of attention he wants, and gets jealous when other people do. Don't mind him, move along :P

In his defense, the gameplay of Cybaster's characters is preeeetty loose, but I don't think it's as bad as to sound offended at that level :whistles:

Cap

Re: Goku Z2 by Balthazar & Cybaster
#63  April 26, 2011, 02:25:25 am
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Intensity.

He had four cans of it before posting that.
Re: Goku Z2 by Balthazar & Cybaster
#64  April 26, 2011, 02:31:46 am
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Also, the loop combo at the end of the vid isn't quite an infinite, the cornerpush was making goku further away, so he had to end it with the Chi blast. It's just that ... a very long loop :P
Re: Goku Z2 by Balthazar & Cybaster
#65  April 26, 2011, 02:36:21 am
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LOL I am pissed off but not at the char or thread, I'm just pissed off at the whole shitty week I had :D, funny how my emotions flow through my posts without noticing it XD! I'm not offended at all guys, I thought U all knew me better at this point :P

Also the Kick loop is an infinite because you can move forward before the next Light Kick, the punch one is indeed a very long loop, I did the ki blasts just for fun, to show that you can still do something after it (The combo could be a lot bigger aswell but you know that already). Both require strict timing anyway (But the timing for LK > MK > MP > SK is FAR more strict, it took me several tried to record combos involving that chain).
Re: Goku Z2 by Balthazar & Cybaster
#66  April 26, 2011, 02:49:10 am
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OMG this is really amazing, thanks for such a good character both Balthazar and Cybaster  :) may I post some feedback in a while
Chilling

Cap

Re: Goku Z2 by Balthazar & Cybaster
#67  April 26, 2011, 02:56:32 am
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Whew, I finally had an opportunity to put in some play time with Goku, and this motherfucker has some crazy ass chain opportunities. Reminds me of Strider in that regard.
Re: Goku Z2 by Balthazar & Cybaster
#68  April 26, 2011, 04:03:47 am
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Pure Awesomeness!!!! 8) :sugoi:
Re: Goku Z2 by Balthazar & Cybaster
#69  April 26, 2011, 04:05:14 am
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Good Job on this character

I love the combo mechanics you used

kinda makes me want to create a DBZ character  ;P
... Pulse Lifebars Re-Make :twisted:  60%
Re: Goku Z2 by Balthazar & Cybaster
#70  April 26, 2011, 08:48:47 am
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Noticed something when I was doing his big kamehameha wave. the center beam didn't show when I held it for about 4 seconds after its pause time. Check it out

Sorry I didn't get a shot of it
Re: Goku Z2 by Balthazar & Cybaster
#71  April 26, 2011, 09:22:28 am
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Lol haha i knew it took a reed navy to find some crazy stuff. Genki Dama x2 is a single combo? Goddamn :P
While this stuff is great obviously we'll need to fix some of that in the next update :P

Thanks for your intese testing, i don't feel you're that angry, just very to the point XD!
Re: Goku Z2 by Balthazar & Cybaster
#72  April 26, 2011, 09:34:21 am
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Also:

Forgot to say that he won't open in FF either? Not sure whats up with that?
Re: Goku Z2 by Balthazar & Cybaster
#73  April 26, 2011, 11:17:31 am
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Hey, lots of stuff while I was sleeping. ;P

Wow!!!! THis wag as great as I spected... I even replaced my old gokuHR with this one... I like it a LOT!...

I was wondering... maybe with the alredy done sprites you have, you can code (whenever possible) a teleport move... nothing too cheap since it can get some recovery time and ctrl time... more or less like strider hiryu... by the other hand, he nedds an antiaerial move (not badly needed, but useful).
No need to replace it. They're so different they each deserve their own spot in your roster. Infact, I have Choujin's Goku, Warusaki3's SSJ3 Goku, Toskomics Goku and Goku Z2 in my Mugen roster. :P

About the teleport move, we thought about it, but even though it's DBZ, we didn't want to give too many options with such moves.
Maybe another char will get it, but not Goku. Consider Bicycle/Meteor Kick as his teleport moves. :P

- I don't understand (might just be my comprehension :S).
When I use the basic version of Chou Kamehameha in a combo, it connects fine, but if I use the MAX version (40 hits), the opponent gets out of the hitstun state from the previous combo, and so the Kamehameha doesn't chain.

The opponent might even attack you, while you're charging the MAX Chou Kamehameha.
OH ! Well, that's kind of the point actually. It can be used in its MIN version in combos normally, and deal moderate damage. It can be charged to make it more powerful, but at the risk of getting hit out of it, a bit like Denjin Hadouken if you think about it.
EDIT : Dope explained it better anyway. :yes:

Well, fuck it, here's the video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JD4yJm9IsGM
Nice combos here. :)
About the last Chou Kmh when the opponent is dizzy, I'd need to check if it's possible to charge it up to MAX, since the dizzy state can be shortened by smashing the buttons.
About the infinite : :gonk: !!! That's what I get for changing the timings of the basics when Balthazar sends me new updated animations with completely different sprites that require different timings... :(

As always all tested in Winmugen+.

1- The dizzy state for the opponent when hit by a MAX Genkidama is in movetype=I instead of movetype=H, reseting the hitcounter in the process. This most likely also breaks the combo dampener. I guess this is why I can do 100% damage combos as shown on my video.

2- I cant use any LV2 super or EX moves as standalone moves if their command use 2 punch buttons when Hope bar is on due to the Genkidama charge command having greater priority. Can only use those moves when cancelled into in such case.

3- Can't connect an aerial attack into EX Slash Down Kick against a standing Goku, you get to the ground before the attack can hit him. Also should be atleast a bit more damaging, it's not really worthly to use it when you can do more damage by using aerial Mid Kick -> any Slash Down Kick, it's not like the EX version gives you anything like invulnerable frames or super armor. Also more hits = more dampening which is bad on this char so a damage buff would be nice.

4- I got moved back during kamehameha, It was weird cornerpush behaviour. I was hitting an aerial opponent with 2 Ki Blasts, then cancelled into the super and Goke kept moving back during the superpause. Happened me twice (The other time after an aerial combo using Aerial Hurricane Kick).

5- semi-infinite combos can be performed on a cornered opponent as shown in the last part of the video. Either give Standing Strong Kick more recovery time or less hitstun.

6- Sometimes when you OTG someone after EX Left Snap Kick They actually get on their standing state yet the combo still is valid and the combo counter keeps rising. BTW your OTG system is REALLY weird >_>, it took me a while to figure it out why the enemy sometimes pops up and enables me to continue a combo and sometimes he just lays down, it depends of when you hit him (Best moment is after a bounce, just as they get at the apex of it).

7- I just can't get over it, the inconsistence on the afterimages for the supers is just weird, same level of supers have totally different colors on their afterimages and to be honest, if I were you I would just remove them :P.
[/quote]
1- Will fix. It made sense in POTS' Ryu I guess, but not here.
2- Fixed in the release already.
3- Good point about the damage. Will do.
4- Yeah, Hero already gave feedback about this. I didn't try too much, but even a PosFreeze didn't work here. It's in my TODO list, when I figure out the problem.
5- Yep, will give more recovery time, as said.
6- The OTG system is really weird because ... not so much thought went into it. ;P I'll eventually have to rework it.
7- I like afterimages. But I'll let Balthazar have his word here. :) I can modify the colours though.

LOL I am pissed off but not at the char or thread, I'm just pissed off at the whole shitty week I had :D, funny how my emotions flow through my posts without noticing it XD! I'm not offended at all guys, I thought U all knew me better at this point :P

Also the Kick loop is an infinite because you can move forward before the next Light Kick, the punch one is indeed a very long loop, I did the ki blasts just for fun, to show that you can still do something after it (The combo could be a lot bigger aswell but you know that already). Both require strict timing anyway (But the timing for LK > MK > MP > SK is FAR more strict, it took me several tried to record combos involving that chain).
Yeah, I knew you weren't "pissed off". And I'm used to your feedback by now anyway. Actually, that's what I'm looking for. ::)

Noticed something when I was doing his big kamehameha wave. the center beam didn't show when I held it for about 4 seconds after its pause time. Check it out
Using Winmugen or 1.0 ?

Forgot to say that he won't open in FF either? Not sure whats up with that?
Huh ? And how do you think I coded him ? ;P Well, I'm using FF Update 3 and FF3 beta (private), and he opens fine.

Thanks everybody for the interest and the motivation. :)
Will try to fix all this in New-Zealand, while updating his sprites as Balthazar sends me new ones ... when I get the time.





Re: Goku Z2 by Balthazar & Cybaster
#74  April 26, 2011, 11:22:08 am
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For his genkidama not to be abused, just make him unable to activate another genkidama mode after hitting the opponent for the duration of the dizzy period.

I would also remove his OTG crouching punch.
Re: Goku Z2 by Balthazar & Cybaster
#75  April 26, 2011, 12:53:47 pm
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Re: Goku Z2 by Balthazar & Cybaster
#76  April 26, 2011, 01:04:36 pm
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Fuck, I just realized I forgot to answer OrochiWeapon2000 :

1- When hitting the opponent from behind, Left Snap Kick knocks them toward Goku instead of away from him.

Personal Gripes/Complaints/Comments:
=============================
2- I've noticed that Light attacks (all of them) don't stun the opponent long enough to connect with Strong attacks or specials/supers, limiting their usefulness because...

3- ... medium attacks (all of them) don't stun the opponent long enough to connect with most specials/supers (like the Dragon Punch or Hurricane Kick). This prevents them from being utilized for "poking" and 2-in-1's that would increase Goku's overall combat potential.

4- Light and Medium attacks seem to knock opponent back a bit far, making it fairly difficult to link a proper straight combo (X > Y > Z or A > B > C) without having the opponent in the corner first. And even then, depending on the size of the opponent, it can still be a bit difficult.

5- And that's about it for now. :) I love the Kaiyoken attack. Have you considered using that DBZ "fierce attack hit" sound for the final hit? It's kinda hard to describe, but it's usually heard in the anime whenever one of the fighters knocks their opponent through the air and it's usually proceeded by a "jet" like sound effect by the person being knocked away.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7Rj8RQbV9o&feature=related

The sound I'm referring to is heard at 1:02 in the video above.
1- Will fix.
2,3- I get your point. Even though the system is very loose, I wouldn't want all the basic to chain into all other speicals. However, Light > Strong is a possibility yeah.
4- Will tweak.
5- Will check the video, and try to see if I have this sound somewhere. :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O668kFgMQ58
Demonstration of an infinite combo. Air chain + Dive Kick is always dangerous  :S
Nice catch. Hmm, fixing this one without breaking the other possible combos will not be easy, bt that's definitely something to fix.
Does it also work on smaller characters, or only the very tall ones ?

Re: Goku Z2 by Balthazar & Cybaster
#77  April 26, 2011, 01:06:19 pm
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Only tall opponents. Air Light Punch can't hit normal-sized opponents.
Re: Goku Z2 by Balthazar & Cybaster
#78  April 26, 2011, 01:38:36 pm
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To add on the note that the Left Snap Kick from behind knocks p2 towards you; this is also the case with the Blur Kick follow-up after Hurricane Kick :)
Re: Goku Z2 by Balthazar & Cybaster
#79  April 26, 2011, 01:58:36 pm
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Re: Goku Z2 by Balthazar & Cybaster
#80  April 26, 2011, 02:12:48 pm
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:gonk: Fuck tall characters. :bigcry: