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Stealth based character in a fighting game? (Read 4342 times)

Started by SecondDeath777, January 04, 2020, 12:06:23 am
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SecondDeath777

Stealth based character in a fighting game?
#1  January 04, 2020, 12:06:23 am
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So, to keep it short, what ideas would you have for a character in MUGEN, or really any fighting game, whose mechanical focus is stealth and deception? It's an unorthodox concept for the fighting genre, but I'm feeling innovative. What sort of moves would you give a sneaky bastard?

Nep Heart

Re: Stealth based character in a fighting game?
#2  January 04, 2020, 12:16:48 am
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 The first thing that comes into mind is invisibility, something that has been done as early, if not earlier than Reptile from Mortal Kombat. It's the simplest sense of what you're asking for, but for more complex stealth gimmicks, probably characters with illusory powers used to create deceptive mix-ups that are far harder to read than conventional mix-ups such as Reisen Udongein Inaba in Hisoutensoku and Hibiki Kohaku from BlazBlue; both can use illusions to attack from unlikely positions, reposition without the opponent even realizing it and just throw off reactions with tricky visuals/sounds in general.

SecondDeath777

Re: Stealth based character in a fighting game?
#3  January 04, 2020, 12:34:50 am
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Not a bad start. I think my favorite examples are Segalow's Dead Ringer, and FG-MSasuke's Genjutsu. One surreptitiously spends a bar of meter to make it so you're fighting an illusory copy, until you hit him, at which point he appears behind you. The latter makes it so the next ten seconds won't actually occur, reverting the damage you took in the time after you activated it, but keeping your foe's damage, in a sorta Matrix-y "your mind makes it real" way. It empties your meter when it's over, and is only a once-per-round deal. Those definitely make me FEEL sneaky, as a player. Invisibility is a clear consideration, but you often have a hard time keeping track of yourself as much as your opponent does, and it can occasionally just cause your opponent to get some free hits, since you're trying to be calculated in your offensive, while they just start throwing shit around. I do like the idea of illusory mix-ups and jukes though. I'll have to put some study into those characters. Also, I'll need to figure out how to trick the AI without making it TOO unable to cope. Lastly(I'm sorry for being a wordy little shit), one idea I had for invisibility is to maybe make it so they're invisible and invincible, but they can only attack from the front, behind, or above with predetermined attacks, and there'll be a brief visual cue as to where and when. But maybe you could also produce the cue without attacking, helping you fake someone, and keeping them guessing.

Nep Heart

Re: Stealth based character in a fighting game?
#4  January 04, 2020, 12:40:09 am
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 Sadly, it's extremely hard to make that kind of thing work on AIs correctly simply because, unlike human players, they're just reading math that the engine is generating independent of any sort tangible perception.

SecondDeath777

Re: Stealth based character in a fighting game?
#5  January 04, 2020, 12:42:51 am
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Indeed. Segalow's actually does that kinda cleverly by feeding that program false data on hit registry and positioning. It would take some precision, but I think altering the computer's perception would be a fun challenge, if a bit ambitious.

Darkflare

Re: Stealth based character in a fighting game?
#6  January 04, 2020, 07:49:04 am
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The first thing you need to keep in mind is that no matter how stealthy the character may be, they're locked into a fight. For the most part, one would be stealthy to avoid fights altogether and try to evade and escape should they find themselves in one. Obviously, in a fighting game, avoiding a fight is impossible and there is no way to disengage.
Having a move that can create illusions is one way, as an opponent that reacts to sudden images/animations will be susceptible to it. At the same time, you also must have a way to tell what is actually going on.
As an example here's Murakumo's standing C

Crouching C

Back C


At a glance, you can tell exactly what Murakumo is actually doing, but in the heat of the moment, it's possible for the opponent to be briefly confused as he tries to note which Murakumo is the real one.

Alternatively, you can make the character trap based, setting up traps to limit the opponent's options while forcing openings to attack. This style could emphasize how the character is meant to avoid fighting an opponent directly.

SecondDeath777

Re: Stealth based character in a fighting game?
#7  January 14, 2020, 04:47:28 pm
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Ooh, traps. I like that idea. Kinda like Snake's C4 in Smash. I appreciate your input, it's expanded my horizons a bit.
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