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entertainment news that don't deserve their own thread (Read 1342916 times)

Started by Titiln, June 18, 2011, 03:16:32 am
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SNT

Re: entertainment news that don't deserve their own thread
#821  October 20, 2013, 12:24:27 am
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Why stop there?  Let's make them ALL racial minorities!  We'll be SUPER diverse then!

And another thing.  If racism is such a big issue in America, how the hell did the concept of a black man that sets himself on fire make it past development?  Yes, it's a ridiculous comparison, but I'll be damned if I haven't seen people say much stupider things than this in the course of taking offense at something.
Last Edit: October 20, 2013, 12:29:21 am by SNT

Jmorphman

Re: entertainment news that don't deserve their own thread
#822  October 20, 2013, 06:45:26 am
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SNT said, October 20, 2013, 12:24:27 am
Why stop there?  Let's make them ALL racial minorities!  We'll be SUPER diverse then!
Why not? What exactly is the harm there? I mean, maybe the Thing would be better off staying the same, since he's Jewish and all, to keep as a tribute to Jack Kirby, but who the fuck cares if Reed is Asian and the Storms are black, or whatever?

SNT said, October 20, 2013, 12:24:27 am
And another thing.  If racism is such a big issue in America, how the hell did the concept of a black man that sets himself on fire make it past development? Yes, it's a ridiculous comparison, but I'll be damned if I haven't seen people say much stupider things than this in the course of taking offense at something.
that's just dumb

Roman55

Re: entertainment news that don't deserve their own thread
#823  October 20, 2013, 07:03:49 am
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The only trouble I have with race lifts is that a few of them are just blatant PR stunts to drum up attention.

As long as the guy is alright and the film is good, no complaints on my end.

Unfortunately, it's being produced by Fox so I don't count on it (the film being good that is).
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Jmorphman

Re: entertainment news that don't deserve their own thread
#824  October 20, 2013, 07:14:36 am
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Mark Millar is also a creative consultant, so... yeah. It's gonna be terrible.

But Michael B. Jordan will probably be great! I mean, he was in The Wire, AND Friday Night Lights!!!

SNT

Re: entertainment news that don't deserve their own thread
#825  October 20, 2013, 10:14:13 am
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Jmorphman said, October 20, 2013, 06:45:26 am
Why not? What exactly is the harm there?
What exactly is the benefit there?  It's change without a discernible tangible benefit.  If what race the main characters are doesn't matter like you say, then no, diversity for the sake of diversity is not a tangible benefit.  All it does is fuck with established lore and alienate a chunk of the target audience.

What next, an Aussie Dr Doo- oh wait.

rednavi -RETIRED

Re: entertainment news that don't deserve their own thread
#826  October 20, 2013, 10:23:32 am
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This is really stupid

Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty

Mgbenz

Re: entertainment news that don't deserve their own thread
#827  October 20, 2013, 04:56:09 pm
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Last Edit: October 20, 2013, 04:59:28 pm by Mgbenz

Roman55

Re: entertainment news that don't deserve their own thread
#828  October 20, 2013, 05:02:15 pm
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Re: entertainment news that don't deserve their own thread
#829  October 20, 2013, 05:32:23 pm
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You know, I think there's another POV in this situation, what if the current actor was the best suited to play as Johnny Storm? Maybe they picked him because he was the best in the casting and not because he was black.

SNT has a point, change for the sake of change is kinda dumb but I never really cared about anybody's color skin anyway, and let's be honest, black Nick Fury is the most badass version of any Nick Fury ever :P

Speedpreacher

Re: entertainment news that don't deserve their own thread
#830  October 20, 2013, 05:39:48 pm
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Making Johnny black and Sue white is stupid because you have to come up with unnecessary backstory.

They should make them ALL black. Michael B. Jordan, Kerry Washington, Terry Crews and Denzel. Who wouldn't see THAT movie?
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Person Man

Re: entertainment news that don't deserve their own thread
#831  October 20, 2013, 05:41:40 pm
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Going out of your way to change a character's race purely for the sake of being able to say you have diversity is dumb.   It doesn't do any service to the character, or really make any meaningful change in any way.  All it does is come off as the studio executives wanting to be able to pat themselves on the back and tell everybody how progressive they are.  It's almost patronizing, in a way.

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Re: entertainment news that don't deserve their own thread
#832  October 20, 2013, 05:46:47 pm
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yeah but were they actually looking for a black actor for the sake of change or was he just the most suited for the character?

Speedpreacher

Re: entertainment news that don't deserve their own thread
#833  October 20, 2013, 05:51:37 pm
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-Red- said, October 20, 2013, 05:46:47 pm
yeah but were they actually looking for a black actor for the sake of change or was he just the most suited for the character?

When you've got an actor/director relationship it's hard to tell. It's like asking whether Johnny Depp was the Mad Hatter or Willy Wonka or Tonto because he was the best man for the job or not (the latter would be no, I think).
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Roman55

Re: entertainment news that don't deserve their own thread
#834  October 20, 2013, 05:59:41 pm
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Speedpreacher said, October 20, 2013, 05:39:48 pm
Making Johnny black and Sue white is stupid because you have to come up with unnecessary backstory.
Probably some annoying adoption thing. "Oh you guys, we're not related but we're all family" bullshit.

We all have that co-worker who has no friends other than his mom and keeps dropping that line.
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Byakko

Re: entertainment news that don't deserve their own thread
#835  October 20, 2013, 06:06:25 pm
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Miles Morales. That one was a good way to use a big name and inject some "diversity", because it's actually a NEW character, and they constantly compare him with the previous version - WITHOUT being obnoxious about it, and without feeling like "just another ripoff / clone". Of course the moment he appeared it felt a bit like "creating Black heroes for the sake of diversity" (and that was only because it was done to such a big name, Spiderman) but in this case it disappeared as soon as the character had a couple of pages to his name.
Taking an existing character and changing him will obviously feel forced. Why not just create a new character ? That's how you do it if you want nobody to care that he's Black.
tl;dr the problem isn't that he's Black, the problem is that it's a change. Don't start calling people racist for no reason.
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Re: entertainment news that don't deserve their own thread
#836  October 20, 2013, 07:19:13 pm
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Roman55 said, October 20, 2013, 05:59:41 pm
Speedpreacher said, October 20, 2013, 05:39:48 pm
Making Johnny black and Sue white is stupid because you have to come up with unnecessary backstory.
Probably some annoying adoption thing. "Oh you guys, we're not related but we're all family" bullshit.

We all have that co-worker who has no friends other than his mom and keeps dropping that line.

Err... you all are aware that a couple composed of a white skinned person and a dark skinned person can produce white or dark skinned children, correct?
I have examples of such in my own family.
Genetics is a wonderful thing, and thus Susan and Johnny can still be siblings without any kind of unnecessary backstory.
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Jexsam

Re: entertainment news that don't deserve their own thread
#837  October 20, 2013, 07:47:12 pm
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Arbitrarily changing a character's race is stupid by virtue of being arbitrary.  There's nothing wrong with it in most cases from a storytelling point of view, but there was nothing broken about the character before that a race lift would fix.  Best case, it adds nothing; worst case, it adds an excuse for writers to wax poetic about racial inequality.  That said, the only real drawback is the alienation of long-time fans.  While I understand and to an extent agree with the idea that sticking to the established is better, a race change is so low-impact a change that getting upset about it is almost as stupid as the change in the first place.

I said all that to basically say "meh".

Speedpreacher

Re: entertainment news that don't deserve their own thread
#838  October 20, 2013, 08:18:41 pm
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Bea said, October 20, 2013, 07:19:13 pm
Roman55 said, October 20, 2013, 05:59:41 pm
Speedpreacher said, October 20, 2013, 05:39:48 pm
Making Johnny black and Sue white is stupid because you have to come up with unnecessary backstory.
Probably some annoying adoption thing. "Oh you guys, we're not related but we're all family" bullshit.

We all have that co-worker who has no friends other than his mom and keeps dropping that line.

Err... you all are aware that a couple composed of a white skinned person and a dark skinned person can produce white or dark skinned children, correct?
I have examples of such in my own family.
Genetics is a wonderful thing, and thus Susan and Johnny can still be siblings without any kind of unnecessary backstory.

I'm well aware of it. So now you have to show that Johnny and Sue have mixed parentage and you probably have to waste a throwaway line or two explaining genetics to people who AREN'T aware of such things (your average moviegoer, for one). Or you take the easy route and make one of them adopted. Okay, which one? THIS is what I mean about unnecessary backstory. You make them both black, you don't have this problem.

And I was totally serious earlier. You make them ALL black. You get to say right from the start you're making the FF black, so the discussion is over and done with. Terry Crews gets to be the Thing like he wants. You get a prominent black leading man who otherwise would have to choose between Blade, T'Challa, Luke Cage, [insert B or C tier character that nobody's heard of and/or cares about]. You get a prominent black leading lady who's got even less choice when it comes to superheroes because Halle Berry has a stranglehold on Storm. You get Tyler Perry involved somehow (not as Reed, please) to bring the illusion of family friendliness and sell it to people who otherwise wouldn't care all that much. You make money.
Nevermind, there's nothing I can do
Bet your life there's something killing you
It's a shame we have to die, my dear
No one's getting out of here alive
This time
What a way to go, but have no fear
No one's getting out of here alive
This time
It's a shame we have to disappear
No one's getting out of here alive
This time, this time, this time

Roman55

Re: entertainment news that don't deserve their own thread
#839  October 20, 2013, 08:23:18 pm
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I made the adoption crack to highlight the silliness of the scenario myself, but Speedpreacher nailed it.
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Re: entertainment news that don't deserve their own thread
#840  October 20, 2013, 08:28:27 pm
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Maybe in the universe the movie happens, people can be born with random skin colors. It's mahvel baby!
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