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Capcom Heroines: Clash of Hearts - Brainstorming Thread (Read 81516 times)

Started by Steel Komodo, April 17, 2020, 02:58:46 pm
Re: Capcom Heroines: Clash of Hearts - Brainstorming Thread
#21  April 22, 2020, 10:48:30 pm
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Now see what you Morrigan fanboys have done.
Re: Capcom Heroines: Clash of Hearts - Brainstorming Thread
#22  April 22, 2020, 11:18:51 pm
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Now see what you Morrigan fanboys have done.

Hey, nobody was being a fanboy or anything. DW was giving very good reasons for Morrigan to be in the game and DauntlessMonk was offering legit ideas.  It’s kind of on me for not wanting to go for the obvious roster picks and wanting to subvert expectations.
Re: Capcom Heroines: Clash of Hearts - Brainstorming Thread
#23  April 23, 2020, 01:20:03 am
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If you're looking for roster ideas, then I have a few suggestions (some of these may subvert expectations):
  • R. Mika (Street Fighter Alpha 3)
  • Hinata Wakaba (Rival Schools: United by Fate)
  • Roll Caskett (Mega Man Legends)
  • Claire Redfield (Resident Evil 2)
  • Maki Genryusai (final Fight 2)
  • Lucia Morgan (Final Fight 3)
  • Poison (Final Fight)
  • Carol & Brenda (Captain Commando)
  • Mary Miyabi (Cyberbots: Full Metal Madness)
  • Lady (Devil May Cry)
  • Regina (Dino Crisis)
  • Female Monster Hunter (Moster Hunter)
  • Sakura Kasugano (Street Fighter Alpha 2)
  • Kaede (Onimusha: Warlords)
  • Ayane (Power Stone)
  • Rouge (Power Stone)
Last Edit: April 23, 2020, 04:04:07 am by Retro Respecter
Re: Capcom Heroines: Clash of Hearts - Brainstorming Thread
#24  April 23, 2020, 02:05:32 am
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    • Roll Caskett(Mega Man Legends)
    • Carol & Brenda (Captain Commando)
    • Mary Miyabi (Cyberbots: Full Metal Madness)
    • Lady (Devil May Cry)
    • Female Monster Hunter (Moster Hunter)
    • Kaede (Onimusha: Warlords)
    • Ayane (Power Stone)


    I think that some of these girls don't have spritesheets or I haven't found one and the only Rouge char for mugen (that I've seen) is currently private and for a fullgame

    Also adding some other suggestions:
    • Jill Valentine (Resident Evil)
    • Fiona Belli (Haunting Ground)
    • Trish (Devil May Cry)
    • Devilotte (Cyberbots)
    • Tabasa (Red Earth)
    • Mai Ling (Red Earth)
    • Tiffany Lords (Rival Schools)
    • Yurika Kirishima (Rival Schools)
    • Amaterasu (Okami)
    • Ton Pooh (Strider)
    Last Edit: April 23, 2020, 02:19:09 am by ZombieNeko
    Re: Capcom Heroines: Clash of Hearts - Brainstorming Thread
    #25  April 23, 2020, 03:17:27 am
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    Unbelievable you guys didn't even considered Pure The Mage and Michelle Heart :v

    Both definitely fits this idea.
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    Re: Capcom Heroines: Clash of Hearts - Brainstorming Thread
    #26  April 23, 2020, 06:54:16 pm
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    Believe it or not, I was considering Hinata for the shoto role. As for all those other suggestions, again, I'm going to be nitpicky here and say a lot of them don't have decent sprites or voicework up to par with what I'm after. There's a few I'm definitely considering, but after all this talk I don't want to settle on anything solid.

    So while I'm still being an indecisive bastard, lemme talk about the Hearts mechanic some more for a hot minute. For a refresher, this is the "Infinity Stone/Grooves"-style mechanic that gives extra abilities and powers to the player depending on which they pick. You can read about them more in this post here, but I'll update the OP as well to elaborate on this.

    So I currently have about three or four Hearts planned, but more could come along. Here's three of them right off the bat:

    #1. Strong Heart
    Based on Street Fighter Alpha and Street Fighter X Tekken. An aggressive style that encourages rushdown and brute force.
    • Basic Ability: Guard Break OR Parry OR KOF-stye knockback.
    • Change of Heart: Zero Counter.
    • Heart Surge: Rage Mode. The character gains enhanced damage for a brief time.

    #2. Focused Heart
    Based on Street Fighter 4. A more defensive style that rewards more cautious play.
    • Basic Ability: Focus Attack
    • Change of Heart: Advancing Guard OR Zero Counte
    • Heart Surge: Ultra Combo. Basically what it says on the tin.

    #3. Swift Heart
    Based on King of Fighters and the Time Stone from Marvel vs. Capcom Infinite. Allows the player to keep moving and evade attacks.
    • Basic Ability: Dodge/Roll. Dodge can be followed up with a Counterattack.
    • Change of Heart: Evasive Dash. Dash behind the foe and put yourself on a frame advantage.
    • Heart Surge: SFA-style Custom Combo.

    All of this is subject to change, of course, and more will definitely be introduced. I'm already planning a "projectile-based" Heart used for zoning, one that grants Armor and another that summons a copy of the user for an assist. Lay on the feedback and I'll be sure to accomodate.
    Re: Capcom Heroines: Clash of Hearts - Brainstorming Thread
    #27  April 23, 2020, 07:40:09 pm
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    For Focused Heart, since you plan on "one that grants Armor". I might suggest an "Armor Mode" similar to what's in KOF 2000 where you have limited Super Armor.

    I'm not sure about Supers (In this case Ultra Combos) being limited to certain Modes/Grooves and that doesn't sound very defensive. The Ultra Combo thing could be a Universal mechanic outside of Hearts if that's up your street or having different requirements for each Heart.
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    Re: Capcom Heroines: Clash of Hearts - Brainstorming Thread
    #28  April 23, 2020, 09:01:13 pm
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    I think you could use the FIGHT.fx to add all stuff that will be used in the characters, it´s faster and easier to standardize all the girls at less time.
    i use this technique for my projects and it economizes me a lot of time.

    EVERYTHING IS ADDED IN FIGHT.FX

    SUPER PAUSE FX
    HYPER BG
    SOUNDS
    TRANSITIONS
    PORTRAITS

    this is a great hint to you and very simple to implement.



    Re: Capcom Heroines: Clash of Hearts - Brainstorming Thread
    #29  April 23, 2020, 11:52:44 pm
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    RagingRowen: That sounds interesting, definitely. Or maybe some kind of Aegis Reflector-style barrier that pushes foes away and reflects projectiles? There’s a lot we could toy around with here - we just need to find the right combo of things.

    Mazemerald: That’s definitely an idea, at least for the fullgame environment. The trouble there, though, is that I’d want to release at least a few of these characters to the public for use in their own MUGEN. Would it not be better in that case to code the stuff inside the characters to avoid compatibility issues? I’ve always coded stuff inside the characters anyway, since I’m more comfortable doing that. Is that going to be an issue?
    Re: Capcom Heroines: Clash of Hearts - Brainstorming Thread
    #30  April 24, 2020, 12:30:27 am
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    For Focused Heart, since you plan on "one that grants Armor". I might suggest an "Armor Mode" similar to what's in KOF 2000 where you have limited Super Armor.

    That one could be called a Heavy Heart.

    Speaking of fun names, you might want to seize the phrase Broken Heart. That could either be a mechanic of its own for counter attacks, or it could describe an effect from which a player cancels out or temporarily suspends the opponent's ability to use their heart powers for a short time.

    Re: Capcom Heroines: Clash of Hearts - Brainstorming Thread
    #31  April 24, 2020, 12:40:16 am
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    ...shit, that’s good. Although I’m already using the term Heartbreak to describe another gameplay thing, so that might cause confusion :P
    Re: Capcom Heroines: Clash of Hearts - Brainstorming Thread
    #32  April 25, 2020, 07:21:45 pm
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    Just a small post. No progress on making characters yet, but I do want to say at least two small things.

    - Ultra Combos are going to be dropped from the system. As much as I'd like to put them in as a universal mechanic, they were originally created as a counterpart to the "Rage Mode" system I envisioned for my Ryu. But with Heart Surges replacing Rage Mode in different ways, I don't see much of a reason to keep them around. I did have some good ideas for them, like Morrigan using her MvC1 Lvl 3 as an SGS-type move, Chun-Li's Sichisei Senkukyaku and Hinata using her Party-Up moves, but that was as far as I ever got with them.

    - After much deliberation, heres' a very tentative roster. Characters I know are at least possible are marked in bold, non-bolded characters are mad pipe dreams.
    • Chun-Li (Street Fighter)
    • Maki or Poison (Final Fight)
    • Morrigan or Felicia (Darkstalkers)
    • Tiffany or Hinata (Rival Schools)
    • Jill Valentine (Resident Evil)
    • Saki (Quiz Nanairo Dreams)
    • Roll or Tron Bonne (Mega Man Legends)
    • Rouge or Ayane (Power Stone)
    • Amaterasu (Okami)
    • Tessa or Mai Ling (Red Earth)
    • June, Claire or Luca (Star Gladiator/Plasma Sword)
    • Devilotte (Cyberbots)
    • Monster Hunter (Monster Hunter, based on MvCI)
    • Fiona (Haunting Ground)
    • Seth (Street Fighter V, possible final boss)
    • Mai Shiranui (Fatal Fury, guest character)

    As you can see, the roster kind of exploded on me. I wanted to keep it to around 10-12, and it ended up being nearly twice that amount! I do imagine that some of these characters are going to get cut to keep things managable and avoid some overlap - I'm still hesitant about quite a few of these, especially the more obscure ones like Devilotte, Fiona and the Red Earth/Power Stone/Star Gladiator characters.  I also envisioned a joke sub-boss called Miss XYZ, who is Dan in female garb as a parody of Miss X from SNK Gals Fighters, or perhaps a female version of Ryu.

    As for the "Queen of Hearts" character? That's undecided. She's one of the three ideas I've had for a final boss, alongside Seth and a mysterious dark force I'm tentatively calling Nevermore. But considering she's mostly there just to facilitate the plot, she might just appear in the endings.

    - Been mulling over main system stuff while I was at it and here's a very basic list of what I have.
    • The basic normal chain is L > M > H > H. The second H functions as a SFxTK-styled launcher. Unlike SFxTK, however, you are not locked into the chain - you can cancel out of it with either a command normal, special or super. In addition, command normals and specials that use H take priority over the launcher. You can also use the launcher with DF + H aka TvC.
    • You can only use Ground and Wall Bounces. Not every character will have them, and you can only perform one Wall Bounce, Launcher and Ground Bounce per combo.
    • Combo progression: Normal > Command > Special > Super.
    • Air attacks cannot be used in chain combos.
    • No air blocking, or at least very limited air blocking.
    • Forward dash instead of a run.
    • Ground recovery only. Also includes KoF/MvC-style recovery rolls, or perhaps a SFxTK-style wakeup roll option.
    • I'm thinking of adding a Roman Cancel-esque mechanic, either as a universal one or specificl to a particular Heart. But I'm worried that with the current system I have, it might be too much.
    • Just Defend or Parry. A successful one grants a little extra meter.

    And that's... really all I have to say. Sorry that I'm not producing actual content for you all, and I can understand if you want to write this off as yet another mad pipe dream of mine. But I do want to stick with this one and not throw in the towel, especially since I've done that many times before and consider it a bad habit of mine.
    Last Edit: April 25, 2020, 07:32:47 pm by Steel Komodo
    Re: Capcom Heroines: Clash of Hearts - Brainstorming Thread
    #33  April 25, 2020, 07:38:26 pm
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    I'd suggest a Second Guest character like a SFEX/Fighting (EX) Layer character, like Blair Dame which has decent sprites.
    Having only 1 guest character doesn't sound very satisfactory and Mai is a very common nominee for a non-Capcom char.
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    Re: Capcom Heroines: Clash of Hearts - Brainstorming Thread
    #34  April 25, 2020, 09:38:09 pm
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    Having only 1 guest character doesn't sound very satisfactory and Mai is a very common nominee for a non-Capcom char.

    I gotta disagree with you there, I'm all for just one guest character. A lot of crossover fullgames get muddied up with guest characters that take focus away from the main idea. It also comes across a little unprofessional. One character is fine, and Mai is a solid, if not a little common choice.
    Re: Capcom Heroines: Clash of Hearts - Brainstorming Thread
    #35  April 26, 2020, 12:38:33 am
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    Yeah, I only wanted the one guest character. I know people like them, but I didn’t want to take the focus away from the Capcom characters. Also, Mai made the most sense to put in. I did consider others like the female Terry or Skullomania from SNK Gals Fighters, but again that’s down to sprite availability.

    Also, keep in mind that I’m very likely to cut this roster down quite a bit. Primarily for the sake of my own sanity, but also based on stuff like personal preference, gameplay styles, representation etc. I’m willing to hear suggestions on that as well, but I know everyone has their favourite character and won’t want to see them go, so that’s going to take a lot of discussion.

    That said, I’m probably fixed on a Power Stone character getting in. Those guys have had no official love from Capcom at all :(
    Re: Capcom Heroines: Clash of Hearts - Brainstorming Thread
    #36  April 26, 2020, 01:02:48 am
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    Female Terry only really worked in SNK Heroines alongside Miss X and the Female Skullomania is a bit overboard and specific in the Guest department and it would make more sense to add a gal from "EX" alongside the genderswap but then again that might be one too many guests. Decisions mate, decisions.

    I did/do have a CvS Heroines in mind by the way.

    Going back to the Ultra Combo thing, if you had the ideas I might suggest simply making Level 3/MAX Supers instead without relying on a specific Heart.
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    Re: Capcom Heroines: Clash of Hearts - Brainstorming Thread
    #37  April 26, 2020, 01:40:40 am
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    Yeah, I only wanted the one guest character. I know people like them, but I didn’t want to take the focus away from the Capcom characters. Also, Mai made the most sense to put in. I did consider others like the female Terry or Skullomania from SNK Gals Fighters, but again that’s down to sprite availability.

    You know, this is probably going to sound like a crazy/dumb idea, but if you want to put in Terry, Skullomania, Iori/Miss X, etc, you could just use the male sprites, but change their SND so they use the female voices from SNK Heroines. At least until decent sprite sheets for the female versions become available.
    Re: Capcom Heroines: Clash of Hearts - Brainstorming Thread
    #38  April 27, 2020, 07:11:45 pm
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    As funny as that is, I'd probably want to play it straight. So I don't think that'll be happening :P

    @RagingRowen: Oh? Do tell.

    Re: Capcom Heroines: Clash of Hearts - Brainstorming Thread
    #39  April 29, 2020, 02:04:59 am
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    So it’s 1am and also probably a bad idea to voice these thoughts out loud. But I’ve just realised I’m not happy with how this is turning out.

    When I first envisioned this project, the intention was to create something between a dumb, casual party fighter and an actual fighting game. Something fun and accessible with a bit of RNG, but doesn’t turn off those who like real fighting games. And the roster was going to be small and manageable, by my standards at least, and not have to rely on me commissioning new stuff because I live on peanuts and don’t control my own finances. It was meant to be within the scope of my abilities, basically.

    But now it’s not what I had in mind anymore. I changed it too much, because I was afraid people wouldn’t accept the original concept. And now it’s mutated into Yet Another Capcom Versus Fighter(tm) with a blatant ripoff of the Infinity Stone mechanic, a bigger roster than I wanted and demanding new sprites that I’ll never afford. And that’s made me really lose motivation to do anything for this, which is exactly as I said would happen in the very first post. I know my own brain too well for me to be surprised anymore.

    I know that was the whole point of the thread to begin with, to take ideas and make this into a better project. And I’m not disrespecting or disparaging anyone that did give feedback - I appreciate all of it, trust me. But maybe that was a mistake. Maybe I should have stuck to my guns and not done a brainstorming thread to begin with. Or maybe I should have considered a different idea entirely? I could go on, but that’s beyond the point now.

    The question, what do I do to rectify this? How do I bring this idea back around into something I want to do and can do, with how little I know of MUGEN and fighting game theory in general? How do I bring this closer to the original idea of “fun casual fighter” that I feel’s gotten lost somewhere in translation? If anyone has any ideas on how to do that, or if you think I’m being an overdramatic moron, just say. I don’t want to have to drop yet another concept like an unwanted baby, but I’m struggling to think of ways I can make this thing come to life, or even if I want to anymore.
    Re: Capcom Heroines: Clash of Hearts - Brainstorming Thread
    #40  April 29, 2020, 02:22:18 am
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    The question, what do I do to rectify this? How do I bring this idea back around into something I want to do and can do, with how little I know of MUGEN and fighting game theory in general? How do I bring this closer to the original idea of “fun casual fighter” that I feel’s gotten lost somewhere in translation? If anyone has any ideas on how to do that, or if you think I’m being an overdramatic moron, just say.

    Easy: go back to THE root. You want this game to be something funny yet "professional". Then, from my humble point of view, first step is deciding the number of buttons. Or decide WHAT to do with them. Sometimes, less is more. U want to keep the 6 button thing and that's cool. Unless it's Tekken, I can not understand a vs game with 4 buttons :/. Here, if I may, leave a suggestion:

    A: LP
    B: MP
    ->B: HP

    Z: LK
    X: MK
    ->X: MK

    This leaves D and C as "do what you want" with the buttons: I'd suggest one of this for CHARGE and the other for...dunno. Maybe a SPECIAL ACTION like dodge, run, teleport, etc. Or even activating the gem thing you spoke about.

    Next is: keep the roster as simple as you wish. For example, make ONE charcater and use this as the BASE for your game(kinda like KFM). And from her, determine the stuff for the others(more comboability, more speed, stronger, etc). This is the most I can say, given my small understanding of the codes and else.

    Good luck!
    I swear there was something cool here!!