Neocide said, August 29, 2016, 06:04:10 pmAnd it looked like Vegeta got caught off guard by the stabbing.Problem is it's always the same. And it wasn't so much caught off guard as he wasn't having any success anyway, Black got hit but he didn't give a shit. It's no better than vs Cell, and Vegeta is still the only one who doesn't know he's about to get whooped.Cybaster said, August 29, 2016, 06:23:58 pmWell, DBZ never made much sense with time travelling anyway, with the Cell/Cyborgs stuff, creating alternate timelines, etc.There was only the one thing about the timeline split until then, all the timelines were still a straight line, with just Trunks jumping from one to the other. Now we're having a Zamasu from a different timeline remember something that happened in the main timeline, and the grandfather paradox of Goku meeting Zamasu, causing him to go mad at humans, causing the creation of Black, causing Trunks to go back in time, causing Goku to want to meet Zamasu in the first place, implying that none of this would have happened if Goku hadn't met Zamasu - there's no starting point in this loop. This didn't happen before - even when Cell came back after killing Trunks, Trunks still ended in his own timeline killing his own Cell, there's a clear starting point and end point.This is all extremely basic concepts in time travelling shows BTW.
That's true(Vegeta never realizing he's over his head) but I think the gap between goku and vegeta is tiny, goku just seems like the smarter fighter than vegeta.
Byakko said, August 29, 2016, 06:30:17 pmThis is all extremely basic concepts in time travelling shows BTW.it could "just" be zamasu from the amin timeline traveling to trunks timeline for whatever reason and the nrmal level of brokeness would be kept; maybe the zamasu form this timeline is th eone who is using goku's body, since the dialgos hinted a lto as blacku being someone else in goku's body and thus mastering it.
Byakko said, August 29, 2016, 06:30:17 pmCybaster said, August 29, 2016, 06:23:58 pmWell, DBZ never made much sense with time travelling anyway, with the Cell/Cyborgs stuff, creating alternate timelines, etc.There was only the one thing about the timeline split until then, all the timelines were still a straight line, with just Trunks jumping from one to the other. Now we're having a Zamasu from a different timeline remember something that happened in the main timeline, and the grandfather paradox of Goku meeting Zamasu, causing him to go mad at humans, causing the creation of Black, causing Trunks to go back in time, causing Goku to want to meet Zamasu in the first place, implying that none of this would have happened if Goku hadn't met Zamasu - there's no starting point in this loop. This didn't happen before - even when Cell came back after killing Trunks, Trunks still ended in his own timeline killing his own Cell, there's a clear starting point and end point.This is all extremely basic concepts in time travelling shows BTW.These are excellent proofs as to why the writing is so deficient, and why I plan on never watching this, not even out of nostalgia. Toriyama just doesn't care.
walt said, August 30, 2016, 08:56:52 pmByakko said, August 29, 2016, 06:30:17 pmCybaster said, August 29, 2016, 06:23:58 pmWell, DBZ never made much sense with time travelling anyway, with the Cell/Cyborgs stuff, creating alternate timelines, etc.There was only the one thing about the timeline split until then, all the timelines were still a straight line, with just Trunks jumping from one to the other. Now we're having a Zamasu from a different timeline remember something that happened in the main timeline, and the grandfather paradox of Goku meeting Zamasu, causing him to go mad at humans, causing the creation of Black, causing Trunks to go back in time, causing Goku to want to meet Zamasu in the first place, implying that none of this would have happened if Goku hadn't met Zamasu - there's no starting point in this loop. This didn't happen before - even when Cell came back after killing Trunks, Trunks still ended in his own timeline killing his own Cell, there's a clear starting point and end point.This is all extremely basic concepts in time travelling shows BTW.These are excellent proofs as to why the writing is so deficient, and why I plan on never watching this, not even out of nostalgia. Toriyama just doesn't care.The whole thing will most likely end up with Super Saiyan God Goku fusing with Super Saiyan God Vegeta to become Super Saiyan God Gogeta/Vegito with them winning but obviously wouldn't last long. Then Goku does a Spirit Bomb but this time on a omniversal scale. It's not that bad really. So far it offers fresh new characters. Plus I've read Chris Claremont's not so spectacular and underwhelming rushed Exiles series.
walt said, August 30, 2016, 08:56:52 pmByakko said, August 29, 2016, 06:30:17 pmCybaster said, August 29, 2016, 06:23:58 pmWell, DBZ never made much sense with time travelling anyway, with the Cell/Cyborgs stuff, creating alternate timelines, etc.There was only the one thing about the timeline split until then, all the timelines were still a straight line, with just Trunks jumping from one to the other. Now we're having a Zamasu from a different timeline remember something that happened in the main timeline, and the grandfather paradox of Goku meeting Zamasu, causing him to go mad at humans, causing the creation of Black, causing Trunks to go back in time, causing Goku to want to meet Zamasu in the first place, implying that none of this would have happened if Goku hadn't met Zamasu - there's no starting point in this loop. This didn't happen before - even when Cell came back after killing Trunks, Trunks still ended in his own timeline killing his own Cell, there's a clear starting point and end point.This is all extremely basic concepts in time travelling shows BTW.These are excellent proofs as to why the writing is so deficient, and why I plan on never watching this, not even out of nostalgia. Toriyama just doesn't care.You're being over dramatic and cynical. The show isn't the best but it's not terrible. If you're a fan of dragonball then it's worth watching. Toriyama hasn't been a good writer since Cell saga so none of this is surprising. You just gotta take it week by week.
Do I really gotta? I think I may have given up halfway through Buu.Just watched the movies out of nostalgia, and those were mediocre at best.
I loved Saint Seiya when I was a kid and I bought the SS game Namco Bandai released last year and had a blast with it. It was pretty much me partially reviving my childhood due to NB hiring the LatAm voice actors for the game.Even with all of that in mind I tried to watch Soul of Gold this year and dropped it pretty much after episode 5. I couldn't bear with how boring the series truly was. [E] was spot on with SS, it's just about people aiming their fists at each other with pretty lights coming out, there isn't that much in terms of people outplaying each other with smart tactics because as "unique" as each one's skill set was, everything still pretty much boils down to who can take the most attacks or a third party coming out of nowhere to save the day.Dragon Ball has the same issue due to all the characters having pretty much the same skill setup. They all fly, they all shoot ki blasts and have a technique that's their equivalent to the Kame-Hame-Ha. They tried to make things interesting with the last tournament but it was pretty underwhelming overall, which Hit being the one who changed things the most due to pretty much being a JoJo character, a series where people actually have specific weaknesses and limits for their own skills and outplaying the enemy with smart tactics and deception is the norm.I still enjoy DBS (Although I skipped both movie arcs) and I actually like the clusterfuck they're doing with time travelling because they're at least getting out of the comfort zone but I totally understand when people drop the series after having watched DBZ so long ago. It's basically the same thing I did with SS.
The main draw of Super is the huge widening of the world. We got a definite difference between regular ki and god ki, people able to reach it, a god of destruction tied to the kaiohshins, multiple universes, a king of all universes, multiple timelines that suddenly become very relevant (thereby making Future Trunks, an old fan favorite, relevant) - that's several levels of world building stacked up all at once. edit - oh, and even more importantly, they all actually matter. They're the core of the story, they're not an excuse for Cell to set up a tournament, the tournament is the setup to the things that matter.The one bad thing here is that there's so much new stuff that we're told we'll see soon, and it takes so long to get there. Hell, the multiple universe thing got interrupted by the king of all universes, the king got interrupted by an alternate timeline, the alternate timeline got interrupted by the god of another universe, and we have no idea where we're at right now. With so much material and leads, we can be pretty sure that this will go on for a long time - even only to resolve everything that has been hinted at so far, and even everything else that will have come out of that. It's like having hints at Saiyans, Cell, Kaiohshin, and the fusion, all the way back during Roshi training little Goku and Krillin.... And supposedly, power level ladder is supposed to take a step back, in favor of different natures of powers (god ki, time stop...), but that's not working all that great so far.tl;dr watch it or don't right now, but be sure to give it a look in a couple years or five.
A generous backer(s) said, August 31, 2016, 06:50:25 pmEven with all of that in mind I tried to watch Soul of Gold this year and dropped it pretty much after episode 5. I couldn't bear with how boring the series truly was.Did you watch Omega? Because Soul of Gold was overly hyped and disappointing, but at least it was short.Omega on the other hand...
dunno, I think dropping SoG after episode 5 was a good call, because if the reason was because it was boring, it got even more boring in the second half once the gold saints stopped being drunk and the series fell into generic bullshit (my favorite part of SoG was how at least one gold saint per episode would be drunk ).
☺Saint said, August 31, 2016, 05:27:03 pm the original evil GokuBlack Goku would probably beat him in a fight thoTurles is like an Evil Goku from an alter dimension. About Goku Black. I will laugh if Goku Black is only a doll or illusion.
Wow, I wasn't even close. Great episode.Spoiler, click to toggle visibiltyGood animation kinda helps.