The Mugen Fighters Guild
M.U.G.E.N Central => M.U.G.E.N Discussion => Topic started by: DeathScythe on May 25, 2019, 07:44:54 pm
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I'm sorry if this topic has been created already.
This is something I've been thinking about for some time. What do you think?
Sometimes I feel like creating a char that I like, but then I look at how many of them already exist for MUGEN, and it makes me a little hesitating ...
Should creators just make whatever they want, no matter how many of the same content is already made, or they should not make the same chars over and over again?
My personal opinion is that creators should make what they want, no matter if your favorite character has been made by a thousand different creators. Most of the time you want to create something that will differ from the others, be it better sprites, more moves, different gameplay system, etc.
Also, people are not forced to download your character if they already have the same one, so ...
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That's how I feel when I decide to recode a existent version of certain chars into my VS Style Debuts template.
Sometimes you even want to give up because you can possibly fucks up a character which was already maded well and more accurately to source games by another coder. [Even if the intent of recoding it's more for a experimental changes and etcetera]
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If people started thinking of stuff like this, I doubt we would even have a community nowadays.
Don't think about it and do what you want.
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Pretty much what Darkflare said, there is nothing wrong with making characters that already exist since even commercial fighting games do this. In fact, the funnest idea in my opinion is taking an already existing character and refreshing their gameplay whether it is to convert them into a different game mechanic style to remixing their already pre-existing mechanic or even going full custom gameplay. With that brought up, old characters can always be renewed and help them remain relevant in the scene.
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besides, gameplay mechanics are so varied, that no character will play the same as another. for example, an mvc3 ryu is drastically different than an cvs ryu.
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You do you, its the best way to go about it. Even if its in the same style, I will still go over all the versions available to me and pick the one I like the most.
Just cause we have 2131231 cvs ryus does not mean you should not make a cvs Ryu.
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Considering that edits, alternative versions, and clones are a thing within MUGEN, I am of the opinion that creators should do whatever they want, regardless of if there is a previous character already.
I should know, considering that most of my MUGEN creations are edits and clones of existing characters and I don't get flak nowadays. Although there is a time where people look down on clones and edits, that was a long time ago and many of such complainers either left MUGEN or mellowed out. As a result, such complaints are seen as being a wierdo.
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I’d say keep making what you want shoot that’s how her got so many awesome versions of Ryu, Ken, Akuma. Some of my faves are Ogre, Reu’s Chars and the different Dans.
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On the other side of things - Are there even any 2D fighting game characters that HAVEN'T been made in Mugen? If there's a thread for this, please let me know, because I'd like to rip and / or make a character that hasn't been done before.
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There's a story it has to be told everytime someone asks about this or made a thread like this: like 10 years ago, Portuguese MUGEN creator Phantom of the Server (most known by his initials: POTS) was another common creator out there, until he announced he was going to work in his own version of CVS Ryu, an idea was totally rejected for good part of the community because there were plenty of Ryu on MUGEN, especially from CVS series.
Well, he continued with his WIP, until he released his version of Ryu, and quickly becomes THE definite Ryu you'd to use: the megamix of his moves from all his appearances until then (SFIII included), the edits of moves that aren't from CVS1-2 edited to fit the character, the color separation, the 4 modes to use (Normal, Evil, Master and the 3 mixed modes in one), and especially the sparks (FX hits, super sparks and screens) made him not just shut the mouth of all who think his version won't be remarkable, but gained various prizes in diverse websites and was the base for all his future characters... and creators who mimify this new style and take it as own.
tl;dr, thanks to that Ryu the "POTS-style" was born, and I witnessed all of that
So yeah, as many already said here, if you got an idea and you know it's good, then do it, no matter if was something made before. Who knows if you become the next POTS and your character becomes the model for years to come ;)
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Minor nitpick, but I am sure PotS is from Portugal, not Brazil. It's just very coincidental that both nations speak Portuguese and most of his imitators are from Brazil.
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Yeah, you're right, fixed in my previous post :P
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Great mssg on the history of stuff Bad Mr. Basara, thanks.
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On the other side of things - Are there even any 2D fighting game characters that HAVEN'T been made in Mugen? If there's a thread for this, please let me know, because I'd like to rip and / or make a character that hasn't been done before.
Generally those from terrible DOS games that only Melvana, Kelexo, and a few Japanese creators were interested in.
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Minor nitpick, but I am sure PotS is from Portugal, not Brazil. It's just very coincidental that both nations speak Portuguese and most of his imitators are from Brazil.
Finally someone understand that we don't speak spanish, lol
Now for the purpose of the thread, I see. I was afraid of making something that would be "just one more of the same char", but this encourages me. And I only want to make "the same char" again because I feel that the existing ones lacks something, I want to add more to the gameplay. :P
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On the other side of things - Are there even any 2D fighting game characters that HAVEN'T been made in Mugen? If there's a thread for this, please let me know, because I'd like to rip and / or make a character that hasn't been done before.
Generally those from terrible DOS games that only Melvana, Kelexo, and a few Japanese creators were interested in.
Or if youa re lucky, a random arcade game that suddenly got supported by mame ; I odn't if it still happnes but I used to check a few mame pages in the late 2ks because it would ahppen randomly (that and cps3 emulation being new got me into "moding" mame).
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Dunno about others but when selecting a character to make next, i kinda preffer something already done a few times, that way people dont expect accuracy at all, hell people will encourage original content in characters and original crazy content is what i love about mugen.
This of course coming from the dude who makes many versions of the same character himself lol.
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Didn't Jesuszilla make 3 Felicias with 3 different systems? I think it was a nice experience for him (he clearly likes the character) and a nice experience for the community (two of them won the cotm award iirc)
I'm up to make what I want. Besides, maybe there's an existing version out there of the character I'm making, but I might disagree completely with the decisions that the author took during development.
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On the other side of things - Are there even any 2D fighting game characters that HAVEN'T been made in Mugen? If there's a thread for this, please let me know, because I'd like to rip and / or make a character that hasn't been done before.
Generally those from terrible DOS games that only Melvana, Kelexo, and a few Japanese creators were interested in.
Oh loads. The fighting game genre is really big. There are plenty that aren't converted or just stopped. I don't think the full cast of daraku tenshi has been done. Rise of the robots. Xenophage. Game ive forgotten the name of but buckus made something from it. Multiple other fighters that exist but ripping is hard and nobody has bothered.
Edit: game i forgot was martial masters. Sprites are rather good but I'm pretty sure there are only a couple of them in mugen.
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On the other side of things - Are there even any 2D fighting game characters that HAVEN'T been made in Mugen? If there's a thread for this, please let me know, because I'd like to rip and / or make a character that hasn't been done before.
Generally those from terrible DOS games that only Melvana, Kelexo, and a few Japanese creators were interested in.
Oh loads. The fighting game genre is really big. There are plenty that aren't converted or just stopped. I don't think the full cast of daraku tenshi has been done. Rise of the robots. Xenophage. Game ive forgotten the name of but buckus made something from it. Multiple other fighters that exist but ripping is hard and nobody has bothered.
Edit: game i forgot was martial masters. Sprites are rather good but I'm pretty sure there are only a couple of them in mugen.
I actually think the entire cast of Martial Masters has been made
http://mugenfreeforall.com/topic/23782-martial-masters/
Edit: Only Monkey Boy is left
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Yeah. I went looking after as well. However i bet a couple can be done better.
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Also, there's a lot of obscure fighting games (or even some relatively famous) that only have 1 version for MUGEN, and sometimes, not even a one finished (Fuuma from AODK was made by Yoshi-OK and it's pretty unfinished, for example). So yeah, the field is wery wide to pick up a character and make it :P
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Daraku Tenshi, really? XGargoyle basically gave us access to all the assets anyone needed down to hit boxes, but I guess he's the only one who cares enough.
I figure a lot of characters haven't been made for two reasons: no one who has decent conversion ability likes the game enough to dissect it or the game is such trash that it's not worth it, even for the sake of conversion.
I mean, has anyone done the Mario from Dong Dong Never Die? (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvUUia5kaF0)
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Daraku Tenshi, really? XGargoyle basically gave us access to all the assets anyone needed down to hit boxes, but I guess he's the only one who cares enough.
I figure a lot of characters haven't been made for two reasons: no one who has decent conversion ability likes the game enough to dissect it or the game is such trash that it's not worth it, even for the sake of conversion.
I mean, has anyone done the Mario from Dong Dong Never Die? (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RvUUia5kaF0)
Someone was working on it, but it never came to light apparently
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Making exitsing characters seems pointless, but at the same time, you make your own version and perhaps it's better than the previous character. Not every character has to be the same way as the original gameplay.
In conclusion, it keeps Mugen alive at least.
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I personally feel like making characters that have already been made is very much worthwhile. There are dozens upon dozens of characters whom, while they have been made, could be done much better, thanks to things like TFGAF, and there is also the ability to put characters in different styles or otherwise put one's own spin upon them. They are also a good way for creators in general to get started with character creation, as there will not be as much pressure as with something original or something without a conversion. Even then, there are still thousands of games with no worthwhile conversions, if any at all, and could potentially be explored, as seen with creators such as MelvannaInChains. I'm completely fine with converting existing characters.
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It depends.
If you are planning to make a source accurate version of it when a good one already exist, it would be a little bit pointless.
But if you plan to add your own twist to it (Even if small) then there is not problem in making it.
Because what you are making is unique in your own way.
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please dont kill me guys...but if i see someone made a good character i just think of something else. IMO, mugen really thrives when there is variety. i get that KOF, SF, SS, MK, etc are super popular...but theres a special kind of joy when its someone totally new...and it also makes the overall MUGEN roster grow. its not so much of a fantasy if there is 2000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 ryus. but at the end of the day, do u. :)
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At the end of the day MUGEN is most fun when you make whatever YOU want.
I’d get no joy out of this shindig if I was told “There’s already enough Dans so you can’t make your own.” Make whatever you want and it’ll attract the people who want what you made. :)
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Should a painter renounce to paint a certain landscape because someone else already made a painting of it?