M.U.G.E.N Central => M.U.G.E.N Discussion => Topic started by: Memo on August 24, 2016, 06:16:07 am
Title: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Memo on August 24, 2016, 06:16:07 am
Everytime pots style is mentioned in a topic I feel like peeps get in and start debating and arguing over shit. First thing that bothers people is just the words "pots style" I consider anything that shares the gameplay mechanics He put together in a char as "pots style" since it includes all the mechanics he has in HIS what's his name? Oh pots! Characters. Alot of you beg to differ and say oh that's not pots style, well why isn't it? I know he went the extra mile for accuracy and What not but lets be realistic we are not all as savy as him nor have all the resources he had or maybe dont know how to use Them. Come in and share you opinions about the gameplay style pots created get it off your chest and lets end these constant Arguments and shit, if your soft and your feelings get broke easy this isn't the topic for you just come on in And get that shit off your chest! Let us know what you like, what dont you like, why you feel like you do let all out!
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 無限の監視者 on August 24, 2016, 06:23:05 am
I'd rather use the PotS originals. Perhaps it would also be nice if they stop sticking the "PotS style" label on their "works".
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Memo on August 24, 2016, 06:25:17 am
I'd rather use the PotS originals. Perhaps it would also be nice if they stop sticking the "PotS style" label on their "works".
ok I understand where you coming from but why not use the lable "pots style"? What do you prefer it Be called If its a char thats a clone from his gameplay system?
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Kirishima on August 24, 2016, 06:25:36 am
Everytime I see the words "pots style" I keep thinking "gameplay that varies on the amount of substance inhaled by its creator".
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Memo on August 24, 2016, 06:28:00 am
Everytime I see the words "pots style" I keep thinking "gameplay that varies on the amount of substance inhaled by its creator".
Also can you explain a little more, are sone creators just fucking up certain mechanics from that style or is it the accuracy in chars not matching up to pots standard?
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 06:29:56 am
Let me be the first to say no way he is 100% accurate save that for someone like JZ. He literally just "did it first" that's all it is. End of topic. It's kinda like people just bandwagon whatever they "believe" to be some sort of legacy. I didn't even know of the guy nor do I generally care about him or anyone else for that matter. They just happened to learn about it before I did. Take cvs2 slap some High res on it and you got yourself a label. Dude didn't create cvs2 nor any of its mechanics which I swear they believe he did. It'll never end. Too much entitlement. It's no longer about what's fun as time as pasted we've seen that. You aren't limiting yourself by doing something you want to do just because someone else has something to say about it. Don't become like those that do it because they feel it's popular, to reiterate what I had said before regardless of whatever you wanna call it making a mugen character takes time & people forget all about that as well as the actual "fun" that should come along with it.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Memo on August 24, 2016, 06:34:17 am
Let me be the first to say no way he is 100% accurate save that for someone like JZ. He literally just "did it first" that's all it is. End of topic. It's kinda like people just bandwagon whatever they "believe" to be some sort of legacy. I didn't even know of the guy nor do I generally care about him or anyone else for that matter. They just happened to learn about it before I did. Take cvs2 slap some High res on it and you got yourself a label. Dude didn't create cvs2 nor any of its mechanics which I swear they believe he did. It'll never end. Too much entitlement. It's no longer about what's fun as time as pasted we've seen that. You aren't limiting yourself by doing something you want to do just because someone else has something to say about it. Don't become like those that do it because they feel it's popular, to reiterate what I had said before regardless of whatever you wanna call it making a mugen character takes time & people forget all about that as well as the actual "fun" that should come along with it.
you got a point, he didnt create any of those mechanics but he brought them in together sort of like a groove system or something that was unique to his chars at the time.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Duos.act on August 24, 2016, 06:35:01 am
This is the best comparison I can come up with.
Think of how every unsigned or indie artists puts their influences on their website or their social media page. That's basically what that term means. Calling your characters with a bunch of different CVS groove mechanics in one system the style of POTS is pretty much the same thing as saying that your somewhat experimental progressive rock band with psychadaelic themes is inspired by Pink Floyd. There's nothing really wrong with that, it just means that right now we're in the era of the early 90s where every band was trying to be Pixies.
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Of course the dark side of this analogy is that it implies that many of the people using the Pots label aren't very good at it and are just using it because it's an accepted formula and an easy ticket to getting attention, and that it fills an arbitrary quota. I don't think I have the right to say I agree with that opinion or not since I haven't played with or downloaded a giant majority of these characters.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Memo on August 24, 2016, 06:40:53 am
Think of how every unsigned or indie artists puts their influences on their website or their social media page. That's basically what that term means. Calling your characters with a bunch of different CVS groove mechanics in one system the style of POTS is pretty much the same thing as saying that your somewhat experimental progressive rock band with psychadaelic themes is inspired by Pink Floyd. There's nothing really wrong with that, it just means that right now we're in the era of the early 90s where every band was trying to be Pixies.
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Of course the dark side of this analogy is that it implies that many of the people using the Pots label aren't very good at it and are just using it because it's an accepted formula and an easy ticket to getting attention, and that it fills an arbitrary quota. I don't think I have the right to say I agree with that opinion or not since I haven't played with or downloaded a giant majority of these characters.
You have a very good point there too, shit I only released 1 char in that "groove system" lol and I felt at the time like I got alot of attention for it. Nothing wrong with it but I feel you on your opinion I sometimes get tired of something when its really popular sometimes its annoying. Especially when some members start requesting you make this char and that char in pots style, I only did it because I find his chars fun to play with and I wanted to try something new, kinda push myself see how good I can do it myself.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: XSZ on August 24, 2016, 06:52:26 am
oh crap pots is PotS lol! I like the bonus games, I think. But the character play style aren't like the "ultimate" style for mugen. Who wants to see every character play the same way as every other character...
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Memo on August 24, 2016, 06:58:07 am
oh crap pots is PotS lol! I like the bonus games, I think. But the character play style aren't like the "ultimate" style for mugen. Who wants to see every character play the same way as every other character...
Well if you want to have a balanced mugen, balanced as is all chars have the same mechanics then yes. Some people build a mugen to fight others and its not fair if my char is lacking a zero counter or a power charge like yours might have, shit my char maybe a mvc style one that wouldn't be a far fight would it? But then again theres those that like to mash different chars and gameplay systems together and have crazy fights that's the beauty of mugen your free to play how you want.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Trololo on August 24, 2016, 07:02:57 am
oh crap pots is PotS lol! I like the bonus games, I think. But the character play style aren't like the "ultimate" style for mugen. Who wants to see every character play the same way as every other character...
Good point. But having a character made in P.o.T.S. doesn't meant there is no other ways to create him anyway, right? The problem is that really- P.o.T.S. styled characters must have simular system. So, they MUST to play simular way. Like game adaptation characters.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Koopa901 on August 24, 2016, 07:04:25 am
Let call it....P-Groove for now on......
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 07:04:59 am
You mean "EX-Groove"? He didn't bring those together.. It was already a thing.. Also most people aside from those such as myself who are just huge fans of the series itself do it for the "balance" aka those who enjoy an experience similar to that of playing an actual fighter be that as it may.. Mugen. It's true there are a few who do it for attention and it clearly shows right? Than there are those regardless of your personal perception actually just are into the fighting mechanics. I already said man. There are those that do it for fun to actually play & use, those that are hype about their coding skills, and those that do it because they feel as though that's what people like.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Trololo on August 24, 2016, 07:05:44 am
oh crap pots is PotS lol! I like the bonus games, I think. But the character play style aren't like the "ultimate" style for mugen. Who wants to see every character play the same way as every other character...
Good point. But having a character made in P.o.T.S. doesn't meant there is no other ways to create him anyway, right? The problem is that really- P.o.T.S. styled characters must have simular system. So, they MUST to play simular way. Like game adaptation characters.
I like to find chars in similar gameplay styles just because i like that balance. Pots style isn't all thats out there but its the majority so of your like me you probably like all chars in you mugen the in the same groove...ima start calling it pots groove for now on because that's all it is. Its not the s groove r the c groove from cvs2 its pots groove lol
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 07:17:07 am
How about this... What did "he" do that was not an already preexisting mechanic? What did he do besides mugenize it? If he even did that 100% solo. Pretty sure he had help from many others. If you guys really knew your stuff you'd know the amount of guess work that was thrown in there tsk tsk.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Duos.act on August 24, 2016, 07:18:45 am
You mean "EX-Groove"? He didn't bring those together.. It was already a thing.. Also most people aside from those such as myself who are just huge fans of the series itself do it for the "balance" aka those who enjoy an experience similar to that of playing an actual fighter be that as it may.. Mugen. It's true there are a few who do it for attention and it clearly shows right? Than there are those regardless of your personal perception actually just are into the fighting mechanics. I already said man. There are those that do it for fun to actually play & use, those that are hype about their coding skills, and those that do it because they feel as though that's what people like.
You will never be able to have true complete balance unless the code is 100% consistent between all characters and the same amount of care is taken for each one. Considering just how big the number of people making these characters is, this seems like a bit of a pipe dream.
How about this... What did "he" do that was not an already preexisting mechanic? What did he do besides mugenize it? If he even did that 100% solo. Pretty sure he had help from many others. If you guys really knew your stuff you'd know the amount of guess work that was thrown in there tsk tsk.
There is very little actual guess work in his characters. Everything he put into his work was something directly from an existing game in appearance, function and implimentation.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: beterhans on August 24, 2016, 07:21:51 am
For me a POTS style char means
1. No Modes but have all moves 2. Have moves across all generations. 3. fair game play
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Warden-San on August 24, 2016, 07:32:21 am
What's with this uniform and balance nonsense these people spew? Put all the POTS graphics characters together and you're not getting anything that's actually aesthetically uniform or uniform gameplay-wise. Even POTS' own characters aren't uniform. Like, compare his M. Bison to his Geese. Putting all the POTS graphics characters sure as shit ain't balanced either.
Why lie to yourself just embrace the chaos and see some weirdo's idea of Hibiki but with a viper beam gun and stuff take on Art of Fighting 1 faithful Todoh like we all used to do.
My actual stance on POTS graphics is I don't really care all that much. Few of them interest me because most of them are the same mediocre conversions of characters we've seen before but with glow in the dark fx.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 07:40:48 am
Do you play SF though? Or CVS? No right? Then that is an honest opinion of someone who isn't a big fan of the series. Who said anything about 100% balance you really didn't even read that before you jumped in. As I said. Because of renown this guy apparently created an entire fight system. You are right about one thing all that name is, is FX.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Warden-San on August 24, 2016, 07:44:20 am
Yep. I call it POTS graphics because ultimately the selling point for most is the fx.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Flowrellik on August 24, 2016, 07:47:01 am
In my book, POTs style should need a different name. I mean think about it: a combat system that utilizes 3 power bars, EX attacks, MAX Mode or Zero Combo, all round based on closeness to the original character with a majority of their attacks spanning across many games, + Rei uses that for CVSU and was proven to be pretty decent for tournament usage... I think I might have an idea for a name already. Why not call it CS-System? Btw, I know this might be a bit of a buzzkill on my end, but has anyone ever tried to make the Hi-res FX pop out more like say using a Trans=sub animation of the projectile/effect beneath the trans = add effect? I'm pretty sure that can help out with a majority of the whole "Stage too bright for FX" problem on a few stages.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Duos.act on August 24, 2016, 07:54:09 am
Do you play SF though? Or CVS? No right? Then that is an honest opinion of someone who isn't a big fan of the series. Who said anything about 100% balance you really didn't even read that before you jumped in. As I said. Because of renown this guy apparently created an entire fight system. You are right about one thing all that name is, is FX.
But he didn't create a single system. POTS characters have actually gone through various different systems because he was working things out between them and experimenting. The style people know of is the one used by Honda, Geese and Cammy. That and it's a bit difficult to say he created it since it's basically just a bunch of stuff from CVS2 thrown into one groove for better or worse.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 07:59:50 am
Let me tell you one thing.. There is absolutely no way in hell fire you have played more cvs2 than me LOL! It isn't even anything to be proud of. I have 9999999 time on memory card status.
All in all.. Don't mean to sound rube about anything. That name is like Micheal Jackson. I'll explain for those that don't know. He isn't the world's greatest dancer, but he is the King of Pop. That renown automatically beats anything out. Exodia. Lol
Also Duos you just said what I previously said above.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Jmorphman on August 24, 2016, 08:00:34 am
I'd rather use the PotS originals. Perhaps it would also be nice if they stop sticking the "PotS style" label on their "works".
Yes, this "makes" a "perfect" amount of "sense". Why even "bother" using that "label"?
It's not like it's a very reasonable way to group together a collection of characters with similar gameplay styles that all have derived from the creations of one person—oh wait that's literally exactly what it is. There's a reason everyone uses the term "PotS style". It may not be an absolutely perfect descriptor for this grouping of characters, but it doesn't need to be. There is a huge amount of variation among these characters, full of subcategories and alternate gameplay systems and weird one-offs and the like; it's pretty natural that any descriptor that links them all together is gonna be overly broad and vague.
But it works. There's no reason to try and give it a cutesy bullshit name when there's already an accepted one out there that everyone already uses.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Trololo on August 24, 2016, 08:01:29 am
So, techincaly, P.o.T.S. style is kind of EX-Groove... Well, I dunno, I don't see a reasot to rename it somehow. Even if he just compilated that style, it was compilated by HIM. But really, let's think about his other characters, which are really not that styled. Like Charlie. And Alpaca... NO FX OR SPARKS WILL SAVE CHARACTER IF HE IS SH*T. There is no need to find examples- look for Mazamerald's "P.o.T.S. styled" characters.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: XSZ on August 24, 2016, 08:02:54 am
Right. It's just another CVS EX groove with different options so it's not that original
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Warden-San on August 24, 2016, 08:05:08 am
Let me tell you one thing.. There is absolutely no way in hell fire you have played more cvs2 than me LOL! It isn't even anything to be proud of. I have 9999999 time on memory card status.
I bet I made more palette edits than you did even though most of them are joke palettes like "Soft Gay" Akuma and Vice with Nakoruru's Palette map
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Handmaiden of the Seascape on August 24, 2016, 08:18:21 am
My actual stance on POTS graphics is I don't really care all that much. Few of them interest me because most of them are the same mediocre conversions of characters we've seen before but with glow in the dark fx.
Most of people know my poision about the style, so, I won't repeat it again. But I share Arpa's opinion in that very few interest me, and only if they're well done (those who know me are aware that I use Karin and Asuna, pretty much the only characters that I use on that style.)
Do you play SF though? Or CVS? No right? Then that is an honest opinion of someone who isn't a big fan of the series. Who said anything about 100% balance you really didn't even read that before you jumped in. As I said. Because of renown this guy apparently created an entire fight system. You are right about one thing all that name is, is FX.
Know what EX Groove means, right? That's exactly what POTS did; an amalgam of the best assets of each groove from the console version of CVS2.
Let me tell you one thing.. There is absolutely no way in hell fire you have played more cvs2 than me LOL! It isn't even anything to be proud of. I have 9999999 time on memory card status.
Are you seriously bragging about that? :/
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Duos.act on August 24, 2016, 08:24:08 am
Let me tell you one thing.. There is absolutely no way in hell fire you have played more cvs2 than me LOL! It isn't even anything to be proud of. I have 9999999 time on memory card status.
All in all.. Don't mean to sound rube about anything. That name is like Micheal Jackson. I'll explain for those that don't know. He isn't the world's greatest dancer, but he is the King of Pop. That renown automatically beats anything out. Exodia. Lol
Also Duos you just said what I previously said above.
What's your CVS2 team.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: -Whiplash- on August 24, 2016, 08:26:19 am
Know what EX Groove means, right? That's exactly what POTS did; an amalgam of the best assets of each groove from the console version of CVS2.
Technically an EX-Groove could be any kind of gameplay style as long as it only used mechanics from CVS2. I could make an "EX-Groove" where the only mechanic is the long jump. I personally made a groove in CVS2 that was as close as I could get it to MVC. I also did that for SF3, which was hilarious and WAY, WAY more game breaking.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Trololo on August 24, 2016, 08:27:10 am
Sh*t, men! Nobody cares who played CVS2 more, it's just unneccesary. Cause it don't make you worse mugenmaker and P.o.T.S. style follower. If to be honest, I still have no ways to play CvS2 even first time... But I'm not worst at it! XD And yes, style is not original. Yes, everything we saw there can be seen in CvS2. But do this makes style somehow worse to play? No, this style is still clear fun and everyone knows that. In fact, I don't think, that if he has the same looks but worse system it could be that good. Once again, as example MMV's DW's style edit. I still didn't saw any REALLY HQ characters in this style. But that's mainly not only because of changes in style... But still. There is no need to rename this style, there is no need to change this style, there is no need to even discuss this style.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Gennos on August 24, 2016, 08:30:10 am
this thread's subject is the laziest way to start a discussion btw. how many times have we gone through this already?
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 08:32:23 am
You two really did not read that, or rather you misunderstood the context. I'm not about to explain it either.. Also so many of you are jumping in without reading what was already said. Don't quote me if you didn't read what I've said. You are only repeating it.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Duos.act on August 24, 2016, 08:34:27 am
All I asked what your team was.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 08:36:11 am
Not you that person that quoted me. And the other that replied to what I said, or what they thought I meant.
I can use anyone, but to fuh stuff up I play Hibiki, Kim, and Guile.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Duos.act on August 24, 2016, 08:36:54 am
What groove?
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 08:37:54 am
EX! I mean you could play me yourself. Any of you and see what the fuss is about haha
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Memo on August 24, 2016, 08:42:32 am
What do you guys mean by the FXs are what attract people? How did that work for mazemereld Miyamoto69/chucho? Fuck the fxs, hires does look nice but that shouldn't be what people look for. and damn rei...put that ps2 down go outside fool haha your hours of gamplay looking like cell phone numbers
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Duos.act on August 24, 2016, 08:50:40 am
Lol no thanks I'm not playing someone with EX groove, that shit ain't even legal because you can't keep it consistent. Thanks for the offer though.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Warden-San on August 24, 2016, 08:51:48 am
I wish I could invite you all to a CVS2 Pajama party. I get to be Hibiki I'm always hibiki because she's the best.
Their reputation kind of counters the appeal of the fx don't you think?
Like, I remember some really bad POTS graphics Amakusa some time ago with misaligned sprites, helper bugs, none of his original moves at all, and debug flood everywhere getting praised at first until I pointed that stuff out.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Jango on August 24, 2016, 08:52:45 am
EX! I mean you could play me yourself. Any of you and see what the fuss is about haha
lol bragging about being awesome in EX groove in CVS2 is like saying you are a master at rock-paper-scissors and you always throw out a gesture that's simultaneously paper and rock.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Warden-San on August 24, 2016, 08:57:14 am
hey maybe its a custom ex groove where it's P-Groove but even worse just to handicap himself you don't know...
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: ネオン７ on August 24, 2016, 09:01:35 am
Oh, God! Let's try not to get off-topic with that bull-crap. Please?
AHEM! Anyway, what do I have to say about this style that hasn't already (Possibly) been said? It's a combination of some of the best mechanics in any fighting game, one of the greatest things to happen to M.U.G.E.N (Other than Dragon Claw), and it works! It just works! Sure, not everyone is going to appreciate every play-style out there (Including P.O.T.S), but there's no need to be pissy, subjective, and a huge ass about it, neither. Sometimes, a simple "I don't like it" would suffice more. Anyway, I've said my piece.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Trololo on August 24, 2016, 09:04:35 am
/\ What I tried to say. And Maz was used here as counter-argument to "Effects ONLY makes this style popular, regard coding". And here we got recently chars with not good coding and very same P.o.T.S. hitsparks. Chars are good, huh?
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Handmaiden of the Seascape on August 24, 2016, 09:05:41 am
EX! I mean you could play me yourself. Any of you and see what the fuss is about haha
lol bragging about being awesome in EX groove in CVS2 is like saying you are a master at rock-paper-scissors and you always throw out a gesture that's simultaneously paper and rock.
That analogy reminds me of an obscene gesture used here for some reason, ::)
But in all seriousness, were you serious about that or that was just a piss poor joke, Rei? :|
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Duos.act on August 24, 2016, 09:06:36 am
Oh, God! Let's try not to get off-topic with that bull-crap. Please?
AHEM! Anyway, what do I have to say about this style that hasn't already (Possibly) been said? It's a combination of some of the best mechanics in any fighting game, one of the greatest things to happen to M.U.G.E.N (Other than Dragon Claw), and it works! It just works! Sure, not everyone is going to appreciate every play-style out there (Including P.O.T.S), but there's no need to be pissy, subjective, and a huge ass about it, neither. Sometimes, a simple "I don't like it" would suffice more. Anyway, I've said my piece.
Your piece is very dismissive and harmful to this thread, which calls for a discussion.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: -Whiplash- on August 24, 2016, 09:11:14 am
I bet I made more palette edits than you did even though most of them are joke palettes like "Soft Gay" Akuma and Vice with Nakoruru's Palette map
I want to see these. Only palettes I made were "Dante Rock", Ryu Ken and Ken Ryu and an all black "SHADOW AKUMA" for shin akuma. I got tired of the interface real fast.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Jesuszilla on August 24, 2016, 09:13:24 am
You don't know shit about competitive play or the game. Get out.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 09:13:39 am
Who is bragging though? You guys sure turn it from a friendly trash talk kinda thing to a king of games, but whatever. Besides are we not talking playing for fun? I could just infinite you with A groove? A did a play through on hardest with a scrub team using N. Doesn't matter which groove I play. In all serious though.. I'll play you with no groove son. How's that
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Jesuszilla on August 24, 2016, 09:14:25 am
You can't infinite by simply picking A-Groove you dipshit; that juggle timer runs out you know.
God, you just made Elix look like Vans.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 09:18:35 am
Name calling? Okay. You must not play then? Just like this isn't possible either?
I didn't say any specific character did I? Nah you are just being a hoe for no reason.
JZ how about you play me then? Let's just settle it there?
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Duos.act on August 24, 2016, 09:20:18 am
Who is bragging though? You guys sure turn it from a friendly trash talk kinda thing to a king of games, but whatever. Besides are we not talking playing for fun? I could just infinite you with A groove? A did a play through on hardest with a scrub team using N. Doesn't matter which groove I play. In all serious though.. I'll play you with no groove son. How's that
I dunno dude. You were talking about how much experience you had and how much you knew the game so I just assumed. And the groove really doesn't matter to you? Cause that's a huge thing to consider when making your team. Some character/groove combinations don't work together at all. And some characters only work in certain grooves. I dunno, I guess I didn't get what you were trying to say.
Name calling? Okay. You must not play then? Just like this isn't possible either? [youtube]https://youtu.be/eLHYKTytp6U[/youtube] I didn't say any specific character did I? Nah you are just being a hoe for no reason.
That's C-Groove. I thought we were talking A-Groove. This infinite also isn't enough since Kim still isn't a very common sight.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 09:21:41 am
You are specifically talking tournament play. Who can't play a high tier character? I did just say play for fun.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Jesuszilla on August 24, 2016, 09:22:25 am
Are you really asking me this? I've probably put more hours into analyzing and disassembling this game than you have playing it. I probably couldn't paint the fence or do any fancy shit like that, but I sure as hell know better than to think EX-Groove is tournament legal. Are you really this stupid?
Also Kim is not high tier, not even in C-Groove (http://wiki.shoryuken.com/Capcom_vs_SNK_2#Tier_List). Stay free, homie.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 09:24:29 am
Read because you obviously can't. We aren't going to solve anything talking shit so let's just play.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Duos.act on August 24, 2016, 09:24:47 am
Well in CVS2 the high tier characters have a lot of difficult execution things that make them good. Sagat's roll cancel tiger shots, Sakura's A-Groove combos, etc. It's nowhere near as easy as you think.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Memo on August 24, 2016, 09:25:11 am
Damn, hope I didnt start no shit but then again I said this topics not for you if your feelings get hurt so I guess everything's cool
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Jesuszilla on August 24, 2016, 09:25:29 am
Play how? I don't have the XBL version, DC network is long gone, PCSX2 online play is even more laughable than picking EX-Groove and claiming it's legal...
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Warden-San on August 24, 2016, 09:27:11 am
With an All POTS-style Ikemen of course.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Memo on August 24, 2016, 09:27:27 am
If yall do play record that shit post it here, this is starting to sound like Manny vs Floyd part deuce
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Duos.act on August 24, 2016, 09:29:29 am
If yall do play record that shit post it here, this is starting to sound like Manny vs Floyd part deuce
So who's getting hugged then?
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 09:30:07 am
There are people who play to win. Strictly use whatever means necessary whatever characters to achieve this. There are also that use whomever they like to break that mold.
Aye get your context straight. I use emulator to play. Stop being meta police goodness.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Handmaiden of the Seascape on August 24, 2016, 09:30:49 am
Who is bragging though? You guys sure turn it from a friendly trash talk kinda thing to a king of games, but whatever. Besides are we not talking playing for fun? I could just infinite you with A groove? A did a play through on hardest with a scrub team using N. Doesn't matter which groove I play. In all serious though.. I'll play you with no groove son. How's that
There's a reason why trash talkers never go that far. You're just contradicting yourself.
Name calling? Okay. You must not play then? Just like this isn't possible either? [youtube]https://youtu.be/eLHYKTytp6U[/youtube] I didn't say any specific character did I? Nah you are just being a hoe for no reason.
JZ how about you play me then? Let's just settle it there?
And now you post a combo from a DIFFERENT groove. :|
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 09:32:02 am
Here you go again so far outta the loop. You can't hear me saying anything so how is it that you pull together a context for me as if you know me personally? Get the fuck outta my face. You don't even go here.
Also.. God.. That example is to show that there are many things possible even undocumented. Smh
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: ネオン７ on August 24, 2016, 09:33:34 am
Oh, God! Let's try not to get off-topic with that bull-crap. Please?
AHEM! Anyway, what do I have to say about this style that hasn't already (Possibly) been said? It's a combination of some of the best mechanics in any fighting game, one of the greatest things to happen to M.U.G.E.N (Other than Dragon Claw), and it works! It just works! Sure, not everyone is going to appreciate every play-style out there (Including P.O.T.S), but there's no need to be pissy, subjective, and a huge ass about it, neither. Sometimes, a simple "I don't like it" would suffice more. Anyway, I've said my piece.
Your piece is very dismissive and harmful to this thread, which calls for a discussion.
Except I never meant for it to be. It's not my fault that some people like to belly-ache over pointless things. I just wanted to share my thoughts, that's all. But I appreciate your concern.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Duos.act on August 24, 2016, 09:36:26 am
There are people who play to win. Strictly use whatever means necessary whatever characters to achieve this. There are also that use whomever they like to break that mold.
Aye get your context straight. I use emulator to play. Stop being meta police goodness.
I really don't understand. You're giving mixed signals. On one hand you're saying how much you know the game and how good you are but then you are saying you don't take it that seriously. Either is fine, but you can't have your cake and eat it you know?
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 09:38:30 am
Oh my goodness. For this example.. In MVC I know how to play Vergil, Magneto, and Doom. I can reset all day, but it's boring so I chose to play Ryu, Felcia, and Chun-Li just because. I don't limit myself to tiers. I play whom I like.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Warden-San on August 24, 2016, 09:43:07 am
I'm more concerned with how much time he has logged onto his console's memory card COMBINED with the time he spent playing it on an emulator. I fear he cannot be stopped with all that practice.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 09:46:03 am
SwapMagic not too hard to grasp. This has def changed to something else though. What started out as a joke/challenge turned into some other shit. If ever want to play let me know if not you guys can continue saying whatever.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: -Whiplash- on August 24, 2016, 09:49:20 am
Are you really asking me this? I've probably put more hours into analyzing and disassembling this game than you have playing it. I probably couldn't paint the fence or do any fancy shit like that, but I sure as hell know better than to think EX-Groove is tournament legal. Are you really this stupid?
Well, I don't think painting the fence is that fancy, really. It's only really hard to do from the back end of the screen, then again, my experience in doing it is limited to my friends and me dicking around in training mode, in a real match I can't even imagine, I screw up that shoryuken motion very easily.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: PeXXeR on August 24, 2016, 09:51:42 am
When I first got a POTS style char I was like SWEET SFEX2 style char, then I played a bit more with it, and its a nice mix of CVS2 and SFEX2, dude did a good job mixing them. People thinking POTS invented all those mechanics are young, or did no play the old school shit. Speaking of accuracy Kamekaze and Froz said pots has done a lot of guesswork, thats not the problem as long as the char playes fine its all right. Rei MJ is the best dancer :P
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Memo on August 24, 2016, 09:52:41 am
I'm more concerned with how much time he has logged onto his console's memory card COMBINED with the time he spent playing it on an emulator. I fear he cannot be stopped with all that practice.
Thats why Im betting a $100.00 on rei and I'm paying for the ppv, who's bringing the beer?
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 10:00:13 am
Aye I am trying to make some easy money lol You have to get in on it as well though & Duos PeXXer be going in as well.
I felt like today, I put enough "lol" and other gestures to make sure none took things out of context, but they still somehow fucked it up.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Jango on August 24, 2016, 10:10:25 am
Are you trying to do the "I was trolling" shtick?
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Memo on August 24, 2016, 10:11:33 am
Pots is like a box of chocolates...you never know what you gonna get.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Jango on August 24, 2016, 10:14:41 am
I know you're just shitposting but... that's actually correct, if the chocolates have shit filling in half of them.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 10:16:12 am
I was having fun/making fun and someone just had to come along and make things all annoying. Everyone was going along with the vibe then had to make it all serious & bitchy. As for the game you'll just have to play me & see all this talk ain't gonna solve anything.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Duos.act on August 24, 2016, 10:21:06 am
But you spent the whole thread talking yourself up about your knowledge of CVS2 and condescending to people. You implied that anyone who didn't share your enthusiasm had lesser experience in SF and CVS2 than you. You really can't stay stuff like that and then get mad when people question you. I wasn't even being rude or dispresectful at all, so I don't really know why you are acting this way.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 10:24:51 am
Quote what I said. That explains everything you just said. I didn't say you. You were going along with it?
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Darkflare on August 24, 2016, 10:25:49 am
So much backpedaling after getting called out.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 10:28:29 am
Not really its not that serious. It's the same users as always.
It goes on to say. It doesn't matter what I say, it's how you take it.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Jango on August 24, 2016, 10:30:27 am
Spoiler: He couldn't bet money in the first place, he was going to give you a gift certificate to Olive Garden if he lost.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: JustNoPoint on August 24, 2016, 10:32:36 am
What emulator do you use to play online?
On topic POTS style as a label just means people generally know some of the features that'll be packaged with the character. As with anything the actual outcome is only as good as the author. And that what's good can also be subjective.
That's why I don't care for constant complaints about POTS styled works every time the phrase is mentioned. There is no way to know if many of these authors would have tried a different theme had POTS style not been a thing. It makes several people happy to play and create and that's all it needs to do. Just like anything else that gets popular.
Insert meme pic of Kermit drinking wine while text says something negative about POTS style and its "none of my business"
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: PeXXeR on August 24, 2016, 10:34:54 am
Even the purple and blue orbs on the super cancles are from SFEX,
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Trololo on August 24, 2016, 10:35:11 am
Just like every other discussion thread, you should've seen this coming.
I saw it coming too, I dont know why arguments start wherever we talk about pots or his name is mentioned in something, I can't be the only one who notices. But either way, pots is gone. He left us some awesome characters And lets not fuck up his image by fighting whenever his name pops up. Yea theres some creators that need to step up there level who claim to code "pots style" that could definitely improve including myself and lets focus on that! Get your coding game up, study up on your characters and lets make some awesome shit worthy of being called pots style and fuck all the arguments this is supposed to be fun!
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 11:53:46 am
Why help create that vibe? You only help to build up that negativity.
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Once one person says something negative all shit goes flying. I for example even apologized if I sounded rude because I know how you guys are. Turn anything around, a joke about playing a game into bragging? Really? Condescending? Even the person who was a part of it got it? All the while other people jumping in talking shit for no apparent reason. Chain-effect, chain effect. Can't have an opinion without calling someone an idiot? That's cool? I mean I'm just saying after that how can you not expect someone to retaliate? Completely dictate someone's else's context. That's why I do hate some of these Internet personalities. Really go read everything from the beginning before you make these claims. Things turn sour because people can't just talk. "You don't agree with me? You fucking imbecile" Don't talk shit(serious shit) and there won't be shit too easy.
Exactly where did the fun go. Shit always has to get to the sessions. And it's always the same people.. The ones that hold that disdain for whatever reason smh
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Memo on August 24, 2016, 12:11:56 pm
Why help create that vibe? You only help to build up that negativity.
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Once one person says something negative all shit goes flying. I for example even apologized if I sounded rude because I know how you guys are. Turn anything around, a joke about playing a game into bragging? Really? Condescending? Even the person who was a part of it got it? All the while other people jumping in talking shit for no apparent reason. Chain-effect, chain effect. Can't have an opinion without calling someone an idiot? That's cool? I mean I'm just saying after that how can you not expect someone to retaliate? Completely dictate someone's else's context. That's why I do hate some of these Internet personalities. Really go read everything from the beginning before you make these claims. Things turn sour because people can't just talk. "You don't agree with me? You fucking imbecile" Don't talk shit(serious shit) and there won't be shit too easy.
Exactly where did the fun go. Shit always has to get to the sessions. And it's always the same people.. The ones that hold that disdain for whatever reason smh
Yea I knew when I started this topic exactly were it was going to go but that wasn't what I wanted, that's why I mentioned its not for people who's feelings get hurt over this topic. You need to chill dude dont take it so serious Fuck what others say just brush that shit off man its just a forum with a bunch of people you may never meet. And everybody's entitled to there opinions, I want yall to post them but not attack each other in the process too. If someone disagrees with you, ask why? Find out why and try to understand what others have to say too.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 12:28:26 pm
I wasn't talking about myself just in general. There were others in there as well that made some slick comments to other users for "no reason" but probably went unnoticed because people only read the last page. Its just idk why, but trust me you know how it is when someone try's to tell you how "you" feel. Same concept. No one here will likely ever agree who knows, but someone always has to push shit. There is always an instigator to take it there. As I'm sure they'll be still.. You have your views on it, as do I and others. We(general) may not agree on some aspects, but If you are having fun with what you do, that's all that matters.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Hephaistos31 on August 24, 2016, 12:32:59 pm
So this is the first post after Hollydays: POTS style is awesome.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 12:36:49 pm
Don't you mean Infinite style? Traitor..
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Jango on August 24, 2016, 12:38:34 pm
Why help create that vibe? You only help to build up that negativity.
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Once one person says something negative all shit goes flying. I for example even apologized if I sounded rude because I know how you guys are. Turn anything around, a joke about playing a game into bragging? Really? Condescending? Even the person who was a part of it got it? All the while other people jumping in talking shit for no apparent reason. Chain-effect, chain effect. Can't have an opinion without calling someone an idiot? That's cool? I mean I'm just saying after that how can you not expect someone to retaliate? Completely dictate someone's else's context. That's why I do hate some of these Internet personalities. Really go read everything from the beginning before you make these claims. Things turn sour because people can't just talk. "You don't agree with me? You fucking imbecile" Don't talk shit(serious shit) and there won't be shit too easy.
Exactly where did the fun go. Shit always has to get to the sessions. And it's always the same people.. The ones that hold that disdain for whatever reason smh
Actually apologizing for trying to start shit with people for no good reason would probably be better than this "holier than thou" crap you're pulling right now.
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
yes i'm aware of the hypocrisy, MOM >:(
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: 2Dee4ever on August 24, 2016, 12:45:51 pm
You are reading too much into it. You usually do a better jump at averting stuff like this. Who started with the negative comments though? Exactly, but you justify it because you didn't agree with what "I" said? As I said someone always has to be trying to do something. Always way more looked into that what it really is. Like I said actually go & read. You are saying that then someone else is waiting to come in and support that claim solving nothing. Pointless even saying anything.. Conform it however you like bruh. Autocorrect!!! Oh well
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Hephaistos31 on August 24, 2016, 01:05:14 pm
Ah ah ah ah ah! :D You made my day, I'm laughing IRL! :) You are right, Rei!!!
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: PeXXeR on August 24, 2016, 01:14:27 pm
People should not go off like that and calling people names for no reason. Signs of a small mind I guess. Also some of you guys act high and mighty no one mentioned SFEX shows your fighter knowledge.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: oraora? on August 24, 2016, 01:21:09 pm
Everytime pots style is mentioned in a topic I feel like peeps get in and start debating and arguing over shit. First thing that bothers people is just the words "pots style" I consider anything that shares the gameplay mechanics He put together in a char as "pots style" since it includes all the mechanics he has in HIS what's his name? Oh pots! Characters. Alot of you beg to differ and say oh that's not pots style, well why isn't it? I know he went the extra mile for accuracy and What not but lets be realistic we are not all as savy as him nor have all the resources he had or maybe dont know how to use Them. Come in and share you opinions about the gameplay style pots created get it off your chest and lets end these constant Arguments and shit, if your soft and your feelings get broke easy this isn't the topic for you just come on in And get that shit off your chest! Let us know what you like, what dont you like, why you feel like you do let all out!
I find the level three super portrait is weird at time, I do not know how to explain this, but it feels odd to me whenever the character perform the level 3 super and suddenly a bright orange portrait shows up :P I actually prefer the level three super effect to be similar like the level 1 (blue) and level 2 (purple)'s super effect, much like Lost_Avenger's characters: http://trinitymugen.net/Hosted/CFJ2/. I would actually prefer all original Capcom vs. SNK's cast to have pots style as it brings a whole new level of the original Capcom vs. SNK and Capcom vs. SNK 2 as remastered version.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Memo on August 24, 2016, 01:48:48 pm
Everytime pots style is mentioned in a topic I feel like peeps get in and start debating and arguing over shit. First thing that bothers people is just the words "pots style" I consider anything that shares the gameplay mechanics He put together in a char as "pots style" since it includes all the mechanics he has in HIS what's his name? Oh pots! Characters. Alot of you beg to differ and say oh that's not pots style, well why isn't it? I know he went the extra mile for accuracy and What not but lets be realistic we are not all as savy as him nor have all the resources he had or maybe dont know how to use Them. Come in and share you opinions about the gameplay style pots created get it off your chest and lets end these constant Arguments and shit, if your soft and your feelings get broke easy this isn't the topic for you just come on in And get that shit off your chest! Let us know what you like, what dont you like, why you feel like you do let all out!
I find the level three super portrait is weird at time, I do not know how to explain this, but it feels odd to me whenever the character perform the level 3 super and suddenly a bright orange portrait shows up :P I actually prefer the level three super effect to be similar like the level 1 (blue) and level 2 (purple)'s super effect, much like Lost_Avenger's characters: http://trinitymugen.net/Hosted/CFJ2/. I would actually prefer all original Capcom vs. SNK's cast to have pots style as it brings a whole new level of the original Capcom vs. SNK and Capcom vs. SNK 2 as remastered version.
I feel the same way too, for my game I have the supers like that, I dont really like the big orange portraits, I'm keeping it simple like I like it like SFA and even yatagarasu where the background just dims a little bit.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: walt on August 24, 2016, 03:23:40 pm
I guess people feel attracted to "POTS Style" characters because it opens the door for NEW STUFF.
Let's face it, CVS has been so dead (2D in general) that the only way to season these old resources and make them feel fresh is adding stuff like new artworks in high resolutions, in a presentation that looks fresh.
It's not rocket science, I'll admit CVS style is the best sprites have looked, and also very accessible for people to jump in to make their own characters. It looks anime-ish, it doesn't use colors in a complicated way, proportions are standard for the most part... it's just easy to get behind, and it looks good.
It's popular because it's flexible, accessible and it can look fresh.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Niitris on August 24, 2016, 03:48:47 pm
CvS2 looks stylish, SFA sprites notwithstanding. It combines the strengths of Capcom's and SNK's signature look and mechanics. Pots was just the one who opened the floodgate to customize it. I honestly don't think it would've mattered his characters were great, as long as they weren't abhorrent garbage. Which they're not of course.
Everyone in a uniform system sounds cool. But CvS remix isn't my thing, I prefer the evil 3D sidesteppers and annie-may. Which includes Marvel.
...
Competitive CvS2: just pick C-Groove Sagat. Why go through painting the fence or sho-sho-ing with Sakura when you can just do the basic fireball-dp strategy with someone who's easymode? Not like you'll be playing an RCer or anything. You don't even need any other character if you're good enough at it, just don't pick S or P groove. Or play King. :(
No one mentioned EX because EX isn't CvS2 remix. Nor is it a sprite game. It also doesn't have Zangief being stupid as shit. And Chun's infinite. EX2+ was better but Excel (custom combo) was real strong. Questioning people's fighting game aptitude is an easy way to trigger a response.
you are a master at rock-paper-scissors and you always throw out a gesture that's simultaneously paper and rock.
That analogy reminds me of an obscene gesture used here for some reason, ::)
heh
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Cybaster on August 24, 2016, 04:30:45 pm
To go back into discussion, many people say "POTS style" when they see : - CVS2 sprites (or similar), - High-Res FX with HR portraits as used by POTS, - The gameplay mechanics included by POTS (parry, roll, power charge, EX moves, zero counter, etc.) - 6 button character with Capcom-like feeling.
The thing is that POTS went much further than this for his characters : he actually studied the different games where the character appeared, he included all of the moves the character ever performed into a single character (using various modes at times to do so), he extracted data (hittimes, hitpauses, damage, etc.) from the games, the combos from the games work, etc.
Most people don't realise this and just think that using one of his characters as template, they can get the same style. It's not the case if they don't study the games of origin first. If you're just guessing the way the moves should act, create new combos that never worked in any game, or put random values for damage, hitpauses, etc. there's no problem with that, but it's not POTS-style.
Vyn's and Infinite's characters share the same attributes listed at the beginning of the post, but they're in no way POTS-style, and wouldn't call it that.
Same goes for any other style, in fact. If you call a character CVS2 style but are just using the sprites, FX and movelist but are guessing all the rest, it's not CVS2 style. If you're mixing mechanics from KOF98UM, KOF2000 and KOF13 into a single character, you can't call it KOF94 style. KOF Remix style, or whatever, but not KOF94 style.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Bastard Mami on August 24, 2016, 05:12:30 pm
nor have all the resources he had or maybe dont know how to use Them.
y'all have now far more resources and tutorials.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: JustNoPoint on August 24, 2016, 05:32:09 pm
Still kinda hard to find it all though. But I'm slowly trying to help resolve this. I need to get to work on the mechanics portions of Mugen class again. But have been spending most of my free time trying to get a new character ready for the next HDBZ release deadline.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Bastard Mami on August 24, 2016, 05:34:13 pm
Most people don't realise this and just think that using one of his characters as template, they can get the same style. It's not the case if they don't study the games of origin first.
No need to get so purist :P
One thing MUGEN has never had is consistence. POTS Style offers flashy consistent visuals, easy for people to get behind.
You're not describing how to make a POTS styled character, you basically described who POTS was and what he did to get his inspiration. People can get their own inspiration from their own places.
The only thing we can all agree on is "make the best possible incarnation of the character, add more stuff (preferably canon) to make it more complete", which is basically using MUGEN's flexibility to make cool shit.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Jango on August 24, 2016, 06:15:26 pm
You are reading too much into it. You usually do a better jump at averting stuff like this. Who started with the negative comments though? Exactly, but you justify it because you didn't agree with what "I" said? As I said someone always has to be trying to do something. Always way more looked into that what it really is. Like I said actually go & read. You are saying that then someone else is waiting to come in and support that claim solving nothing. Pointless even saying anything.. Conform it however you like bruh. Autocorrect!!! Oh well
I just reread all your posts and YOU'RE the one trying to tell everyone how awesome you are at CvS2 and trying to challenge people to money matches via emulator. Stop acting like the victim here and take responsibility for your posts.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: JustNoPoint on August 24, 2016, 06:28:06 pm
I figure his logic is that he is a good judge of cvs2 related creations due to how much time he has spent playing the game.
However lots of playing and being good doesn't necessarily mean one knows how to break down the mechanics properly and understand how they change the game in large and small ways.
Alternatively knowing how to break down the game and mechanics doesn't necessarily mean one is a good player or spent much time.
So yeah, mentioning it once are twice can get the point across without having to try and prove anything.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: DW on August 24, 2016, 07:20:41 pm
I main Rock, Ken, and Sagat in CvS2. C or N groove works fine for any of them, though I usually go with N. K Groove is that Sagat secret weapon. :ninja: Ken can be swapped out depending on how I'm feeling, with either Ryu or Akuma. Though Akuma's low health is a problem. I would like to use Geese, but I can't for the life of me, EVER pull out R.Storm when I want to... So, I leave him alone in a serious competition. Others I like to use are Kim, Joe, Athena, Mai, Ryo, Todo, Raiden, Kyosuke, Iori, Kyo, Chun-Li(kinda)... TBH, I'm not too fond of Chun-Li in that game. She feels very nerfed and plain, with only like two specials.
I didn't realize King was so low tier... :( Never saw a tier list prior to this thread honestly. Sagat is like top tier in every game he's in though lol. That's not much of a surprise. I guess if you can work some A groove magic, Sakura might be pro, but I don't like her. I like her in the EX series though. A and P grooves are the grooves I stay away from. S Groove I may use every once in awhile, along with K. C and N are really the way to go for me though. N groove best groove bruh. Come at me bro. 8)
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: XGargoyle on August 24, 2016, 07:45:42 pm
POTS style nowadays is the only way that mediocre, bad and horrible characters could get the attention and a high number of downloads/likes/+1
A character named "Yet another boring character" will get less attention than the same character named "Yet another boring character POTS style"
End of story.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Warden-San on August 24, 2016, 07:47:11 pm
Anyone should stay away from P Groove unless you're dead-set on showing off.
Hibiki and Haohmaru in K Groove is how I CVS2. Cum 2 my house and bring the link up cable
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Jesuszilla on August 24, 2016, 08:17:21 pm
I figure his logic is that he is a good judge of cvs2 related creations due to how much time he has spent playing the game.
However lots of playing and being good doesn't necessarily mean one knows how to break down the mechanics properly and understand how they change the game in large and small ways.
Alternatively knowing how to break down the game and mechanics doesn't necessarily mean one is a good player or spent much time.
Exactly. The SRK wiki lists one of Sagat's CvS2 hitboxes as being "invulnerable" on the leg, yet when you actually look at the boxes, there's almost NO invulnerability on said box!
Likewise, I'm honestly not that great at CvS2. I lost at UFO a lot when it still had the machine. I can't paint the fence, I can't shoshosho without accidentally triggering the super, I don't even really have a set team because I hardly get any practice. However, I have a lot of in-depth knowledge, including how dizzy is implemented. I traced assembly instructions for god's sake. I never claimed to be good at the game, but I know a lot more about competitive play because I've actually watched tournaments and am very familiar with the mechanics.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Jmorphman on August 24, 2016, 08:51:29 pm
Most people don't realise this and just think that using one of his characters as template, they can get the same style. It's not the case if they don't study the games of origin first.
No need to get so purist :P
One thing MUGEN has never had is consistence. POTS Style offers flashy consistent visuals, easy for people to get behind.
You're not describing how to make a POTS styled character, you basically described who POTS was and what he did to get his inspiration. People can get their own inspiration from their own places.
Yeah, it sucks. I'm still thinking about how to approach all that; probably not gonna be using the CvS hitboxes unchanged, at the very least (a shame, since that's only recently been made possible).
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Duos.act on August 24, 2016, 09:06:47 pm
It's not just hitboxes you're working against. A lot of SNK characters got hurt in the transition to CVS2 for a lot of other reasons.
Competitive CvS2: just pick C-Groove Sagat. Why go through painting the fence or sho-sho-ing with Sakura when you can just do the basic fireball-dp strategy with someone who's easymode? Not like you'll be playing an RCer or anything. You don't even need any other character if you're good enough at it, just don't pick S or P groove. Or play King. :(
You need to be able to roll cancel to play C-Sagat at optimal level.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: R565 on August 24, 2016, 09:13:01 pm
I figure his logic is that he is a good judge of cvs2 related creations due to how much time he has spent playing the game.
However lots of playing and being good doesn't necessarily mean one knows how to break down the mechanics properly and understand how they change the game in large and small ways.
Alternatively knowing how to break down the game and mechanics doesn't necessarily mean one is a good player or spent much time.
Exactly. The SRK wiki lists one of Sagat's CvS2 hitboxes as being "invulnerable" on the leg, yet when you actually look at the boxes, there's almost NO invulnerability on said box!
Likewise, I'm honestly not that great at CvS2. I lost at UFO a lot when it still had the machine. I can't paint the fence, I can't shoshosho without accidentally triggering the super, I don't even really have a set team because I hardly get any practice. However, I have a lot of in-depth knowledge, including how dizzy is implemented. I traced assembly instructions for god's sake. I never claimed to be good at the game, but I know a lot more about competitive play because I've actually watched tournaments and am very familiar with the mechanics.
I agree with this as well, you don't have to be a top player to make MUGEN characters, you just have to learn how that specific character originally works in the game. Their playstyle, the core mechanics, heck even the little nuances that make them tick, figure that out and you'll be able to see how to apply it to MUGEN. I love fighting games as well but i'm a longshot from beating a top player, I just play them for fun, just like with all of my hobbies.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Jmorphman on August 24, 2016, 09:18:54 pm
It's not just hitboxes you're working against. A lot of SNK characters got hurt in the transition to CVS2 for a lot of other reasons.
I'm well aware; I think I've done a decent enough job restoring some of the SNK character's luster with the various characters I've done, but King still needs a bit more work than what I usually do.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Duos.act on August 24, 2016, 09:20:25 pm
I figure his logic is that he is a good judge of cvs2 related creations due to how much time he has spent playing the game.
However lots of playing and being good doesn't necessarily mean one knows how to break down the mechanics properly and understand how they change the game in large and small ways.
Alternatively knowing how to break down the game and mechanics doesn't necessarily mean one is a good player or spent much time.
Exactly. The SRK wiki lists one of Sagat's CvS2 hitboxes as being "invulnerable" on the leg, yet when you actually look at the boxes, there's almost NO invulnerability on said box!
Likewise, I'm honestly not that great at CvS2. I lost at UFO a lot when it still had the machine. I can't paint the fence, I can't shoshosho without accidentally triggering the super, I don't even really have a set team because I hardly get any practice. However, I have a lot of in-depth knowledge, including how dizzy is implemented. I traced assembly instructions for god's sake. I never claimed to be good at the game, but I know a lot more about competitive play because I've actually watched tournaments and am very familiar with the mechanics.
I agree with this as well, you don't have to be a top player to make MUGEN characters, you just have to learn how that specific character originally works in the game. Their playstyle, the core mechanics, heck even the little nuances that make them tick, figure that out and you'll be able to see how to apply it to MUGEN. I love fighting games as well but i'm a longshot from beating a top player, I just play them for fun, just like with all of my hobbies.
Knowing the character and game is not the same as being a top player. Knowledge is not the same as skill, but skill is not necessary to make the game. Knowledge however is.
It's not just hitboxes you're working against. A lot of SNK characters got hurt in the transition to CVS2 for a lot of other reasons.
I'm well aware; I think I've done a decent enough job restoring some of the SNK character's luster with the various characters I've done, but King still needs a bit more work than what I usually do.
Well good luck, you've got your work cut out for you this time. I'm curious to see how you achieve this.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Amidweiz on August 24, 2016, 09:30:09 pm
POTS style nowadays is the only way that mediocre, bad and horrible characters could get the attention and a high number of downloads/likes/+1
A character named "Yet another boring character" will get less attention than the same character named "Yet another boring character POTS style"
End of story.
I mean pretty much this, But to be honest you don't really see a flood of P.O.T.S style characters unlike 2 or 3 years ago when Infinite and R@ce were pumping out their stuff. Even though I'm not a particular fan of P.O.T.S myself, I can see it's appeal.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Niitris on August 24, 2016, 09:31:59 pm
Competitive CvS2: just pick C-Groove Sagat. Why go through painting the fence or sho-sho-ing with Sakura when you can just do the basic fireball-dp strategy with someone who's easymode? Not like you'll be playing an RCer or anything. You don't even need any other character if you're good enough at it, just don't pick S or P groove. Or play King. :(
You need to be able to roll cancel to play C-Sagat at optimal level.
No disagreeing there. Noticed I worded that part poorly, I meant playing against an RCer. :P
What I mean is, it's not quite as necessary to RC with Sagat to be competent, compared to Bison and select others CCs which is easily their most dangerous asset. His normals are beast, and he does good damage on his own to go along with Tiger Shots and dp. K-Groove Sagat is almost as viable because the already good Tiger Cannon is locked to level 3.
Title: And if I ever make either of them, you bet your ass that will be in there
Post by: Jesuszilla on August 25, 2016, 05:21:38 am
I like to pick Joe and Todo and roll cancel into their taunts.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Duos.act on August 25, 2016, 08:52:43 am
Competitive CvS2: just pick C-Groove Sagat. Why go through painting the fence or sho-sho-ing with Sakura when you can just do the basic fireball-dp strategy with someone who's easymode? Not like you'll be playing an RCer or anything. You don't even need any other character if you're good enough at it, just don't pick S or P groove. Or play King. :(
You need to be able to roll cancel to play C-Sagat at optimal level.
No disagreeing there. Noticed I worded that part poorly, I meant playing against an RCer. :P
What I mean is, it's not quite as necessary to RC with Sagat to be competent, compared to Bison and select others CCs which is easily their most dangerous asset. His normals are beast, and he does good damage on his own to go along with Tiger Shots and dp. K-Groove Sagat is almost as viable because the already good Tiger Cannon is locked to level 3.
Nah you're right. Playing Sagat without roll cancel still leaves you with Crouch Fierce and the extremely solid character that comes with it.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Sir Lord Alpyne on August 27, 2016, 04:20:14 pm
i happen to dig P-Groove, it's tha 1 i mainly use, helps you to not be so dependent on meter, & pays off in a big way 1ce you do use meter [if you connect, of course]. my only gripe with it really is that you can't use EX moves with it, since you should be allow'd to considerin' tha source it's based on. i use that, K-Groove, & occasionally C or S. i've never been much of a "main" user/abuser in fightin' game, since i tend to like havin' more than just 1 or 2 options when in regards to char usage to smack some1 around with, lol. i select a handful that i truly dig, & try to be as deadly with them as possible, without usin' cheap tactics or exploits [kara throws, RCs, infinites, etc], since that's not a true showin' of actual skill IMO [even tho some are harder to pull off than others, cheap is still cheap at tha end of tha day].
example: i fought some random cheap dickhead online a few years back on Supercade in a game of SamSho IV, & he used an infinite exploit with Genjuro in tha 1st round, where he grab'd & threw me with my back towards him, then just repeated dash + B [mid slash] til i was dead, then quit tha game. i ask'd him why'd he quit, & his ACTUAL response was, "becuz you don't know how to play, u're beneath me", as if it took some grandiose level of skill to be that cheap & cheesy. shit like this has always made me sad when it comes to fighters [as far back as crouching/jumping jab/short-->throw on SF II], & with cheap tactics now becomin' more of a main thing, it makes me wonder when did folks start becoming more worried about winning at all costs versus winning from actual skill showcasin'. anyhoo.....
i myself dig tha dynamic of a good number of kreations that P.O.T.S. style has been tha influence for [that's how tha best Sagat evah came to be after all! luv yah D-Dubbyah ^_^], & i personally see nothin' wrong with that. havin' a diverse amount of chars that share a similar system in 1's roster is a not a bad thing if tha work is solid [i prefer max mode over cc tho, just puttin' that out there XD], & shouldn't really be frown'd upon as much as it seems to be at times. kreator preference is another matter of course, but overall when some1's body of kreation(s)/work inspires other to kreate also, & maybe even put their own spin to it, whether it comes out good/great, or not-so-good/great, that's still some1's time & effort they put into bringin' somethin' to tha table so-to-speak, & it's somethin' that should be praised &/or encouraged, not knock'd on in a harsh manner.
Title: Re: lets have a discussion about P.o.t.S. Style
Post by: Warden-San on August 27, 2016, 08:43:57 pm
The only things I were able to decipher from that eyesore of a written passage is that advanced techniques like kara throws are apparently cheap and do not showcase skill.
Also that you apparently didn't know that you could rage explosion out of the infinite and avoid actually somehow getting guard break'd again (If not avoid playing something as broken as Samurai Shodown 4 on supercade)