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Hugo Released (Read 7233 times)

Started by Koop, February 12, 2025, 07:05:19 pm
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Koop

Hugo Released
#1  February 12, 2025, 07:05:19 pm
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Staubhold

Re: Hugo Released
#2  February 12, 2025, 08:03:24 pm
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What a pleasant surprise!!

Thank you KoopaKoot.

Some typos in the readme...

 - Roll is done with F or B X+A, not A+B
 - Slap is done with f+X, not f+A
 - Body Press(AIR) is done with d+Y, not d+A
 - Hip Press with f+A, not f+B
 

Smoker5

Re: Hugo Released
#3  February 12, 2025, 11:34:48 pm
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I like this hugo but why does it disappear if I leave it still and if I move it the char appears, how do I remove that error or does it not work in ikemen?

OrochiWeapon2000

Re: Hugo Released
#4  February 13, 2025, 01:29:37 am
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Smoker5 said, February 12, 2025, 11:34:48 pm

I like this hugo but why does it disappear if I leave it still and if I move it the char appears, how do I remove that error or does it not work in ikemen?

I tried Hugo out in IKEMEN as well, and to be specific, Hugo's standing (idle) animation doesn't display as it should (Clsns still show though). But, all other animations and Clsns seem to be present. A similar issue can be found in your Dan as well, though in Dan's case, none of his animations are shown correctly aside from his effects. When using Mugen 1.0/1.1, these issues don't seem to be present. Not sure why it happens at all, but it's very strange indeed...

Aside from that oddity, the character is pretty solid. Just a couple of things I noticed (the following tests were all done in MUGEN 1.1):

- "Ultra Throw" does no damage when it should (upon impact with the wall).
- One big issue Hugo seems to have is that when jumping, he tends to land back onto the ground before any of the stronger attack animations can even finish (jumping Y; jumping D+y; and jumping B), making his jump-in game almost non-existent. To be fair, this "issue" was also present in the source game, but after checking both the source version and your conversion almost side by side, it seems to be more of a problem in your conversion of Hugo.

Body Press Vs. KFM (MUGEN, Missed)


Body Press Vs. Ryo (SvC: Chaos, Hit)


As an example, Hugo's "Body Press" completely misses Kung Fu Man in MUGEN, while hitting Ryo (who is shorter) in the source game. Again, to be fair, it also misses characters in the source game like Kasumi and Choi entirely. But it does hit a number of others characters who are shorter than Kung Fu Man. I've even tested this on Arremer in SvC: Chaos, and it worked.

- "Gigas Cross Breaker" doesn't do much damage as a Lvl3 Super Move. Perhaps adding damage to the initial clothesline he performs during the attack would remedy that a bit?
Last Edit: February 13, 2025, 02:19:03 pm by OrochiWeapon2000

Vegaz_Parrelli

Re: Hugo Released
#5  February 17, 2025, 01:49:45 pm
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Cool Hugo.  But he'd better watch his step. He's surrounded by traps...  :8):

Do your best to become stronger. Become stronger, so you can do your best.

Saikoro said, June 27, 2012, 12:35:10 am
Mugen is a way for me to remain nostalgic with all of the dream matches I cooked up as a kid. It's also what I call a "Digital Action Figure Collection."
MaxBeta link=topic=155656.msg1876950#msg1876950 date=13867
Vegaz_Parrelli...also known as The Lord of the Rings.
[/quote said:

OrochiWeapon2000

Re: Hugo Released
#6  February 27, 2025, 02:54:35 am
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Additional notes:
- The issue with Hugo's standing idle animation not displaying properly seems to have been resolved in the latest nightly build of IKEMEN. Still a strange issue to have happened in the first place, but it appears to have been an issue with the engine and not the character itself. Same goes for Dan as well.

- You *should* normally be able to connect with a Monster Lariat after landing an Ultra Throw, but I've been unable to do so at all during my testing.

- When the opponent is tossed to the corner immediately following his kick throw, you *should* be able to connect with a Megaton Press immediately afterward (at least in SF3 anyway).

- Shouldn't the standing Knockdown Attack be special/super cancellable?

- When using F + LP as a cancel, should it not also be special/super cancellable outside of Max Mode? Or was it left as it currently is intentionally? Not really a big deal, but I thought I'd ask for the sake of clarity.

- In SvC, when Hugo lands a Giant Palm Bomber on an airborne opponent, it causes them to slide when they hit the ground. That's currently not the case in your version, though I'm unsure if that was intentional or not. :sweatdrop:

- Further testing of the "Ultra Throw" command grab shows that not only does impact with the wall do no damage when it should, but if the opponent isn't close enough to a wall to be bounced off it (as is the case in most stages with a zoom feature), landing on the floor does no damage either.

- Just an idea, but speaking of the "Ultra Throw" when the opponent doesn't bounce off the wall; might it look better if the opponent slides on the ground rather than just hitting the ground?

- I feel like this style of Hugo with Blow Back/Critical Wire capabilities would probably be a terrifying thing. Not a bug report, but just something that crossed my mind during testing. :sweatdrop:

- When using Shootdown Back Breaker, Hugo is able to then juggle with a standing/crouching LP or LK, which can be cancelled into another Shootdown Back Breaker. Is Hugo being able to juggle after the Shootdown Back Breaker intentional? Not a complaint or anything, as it leads to some interesting combo routes. It was just never possible in any of the games Hugo was in (SF3 or SvC).

- Nice touch on allowing the last hit of Hammer Mountain to be cancelled into a Shootdown Back Breaker. I've always felt like that should've been a thing for Hugo in the source games.  :mthumbs:

I managed to find a couple of fun combos with Hugo, including a 19-Hit, 100% damage combo:

https://streamable.com/sl1saw
*Opponent in corner* - Giant Palm Bomber (Strong) > Giant Palm Bomber (Light) > Standing LP > Standing LP > Standing LP > Ultra Throw (Special Cancel) > Shooting Back Breaker (Light) > Standing/Crouching LP (juggle) > Megaton Press (Super Cancel)

https://streamable.com/xmiei5
*Opponent in corner* - (Max Activation) > Giant Palm Bomber (Strong) > Giant Palm Bomber (Light) > Standing LK > F+LP (cancel) > Giant Palm Bomber (Light, Special Cancel) > Standing LK > F+LP (cancel) > Giant Palm Bomber (Light, Special Cancel, Max Mode ends) > Standing LP > Hammer Mountain (Super Cancel) > Shootdown Back Breaker (Strong, cancelled from last hit of Hammer Mountain) > Gigas Cross Breaker
Last Edit: February 28, 2025, 04:39:30 am by OrochiWeapon2000

Koop

Re: Hugo Released
#7  March 01, 2025, 01:54:23 pm
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Thanks for the feedback. Let's sort those one by one.

- "Ultra Throw" does no damage when it should (upon impact with the wall). ;Throwing someone to the ropes shouldn't KO them~ Ah well that's fixed. Also if they don't hit the wall, they will slide on the ground.

- One big issue Hugo seems to have is that when jumping, he tends to land back onto the ground before any of the stronger attack animations can even finish (jumping Y; jumping D+y; and jumping B), making his jump-in game almost non-existent. To be fair, this "issue" was also present in the source game, but after checking both the source version and your conversion almost side by side, it seems to be more of a problem in your conversion of Hugo.
 I actually did give his air normals more active frames than source to make up for this. As for the body press, it had the wrong triggers. That has been fixed. The weak air normals is a good weakness for him to have.

- "Gigas Cross Breaker" doesn't do much damage as a Lvl3 Super Move. Perhaps adding damage to the initial clothesline he performs during the attack would remedy that a bit? The lower damage compared to the other Gigas Breaker is due to the fact that it can hit the opponent in the air and can combo easier.

- You *should* normally be able to connect with a Monster Lariat after landing an Ultra Throw, but I've been unable to do so at all during my testing. Fixed

- When the opponent is tossed to the corner immediately following his kick throw, you *should* be able to connect with a Megaton Press immediately afterward (at least in SF3 anyway). That sounds awesome! Added. Also you can combo into Gigas Cross Breaker too. :)

- When using F + LP as a cancel, should it not also be special/super cancellable outside of Max Mode? Or was it left as it currently is intentionally? Not really a big deal, but I thought I'd ask for the sake of clarity. That's intentional

- In SvC, when Hugo lands a Giant Palm Bomber on an airborne opponent, it causes them to slide when they hit the ground. That's currently not the case in your version, though I'm unsure if that was intentional or not. :sweatdrop:
 That's intentional too. Not having the slide knockdown lets you do some nice combos

- I feel like this style of Hugo with Blow Back/Critical Wire capabilities would probably be a terrifying thing. Not a bug report, but just something that crossed my mind during testing. :sweatdrop: That's too scary! I was thinking that too, but he already has Ultra Throw.

- When using Shootdown Back Breaker, Hugo is able to then juggle with a standing/crouching LP or LK, which can be cancelled into another Shootdown Back Breaker. Is Hugo being able to juggle after the Shootdown Back Breaker intentional? Not a complaint or anything, as it leads to some interesting combo routes. It was just never possible in any of the games Hugo was in (SF3 or SvC). That's not intentional. It sounds cool though...but let's not let him get too much off a backbreaker. Fixed (with sadness).


Hugo has been updated with the fixes. Link is still the same. :)

Staubhold

Re: Hugo Released
#8  March 01, 2025, 08:15:48 pm
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Some very quick feedback...

 - no CLSN1 on air d+y, air y, air b and standing b (Dropkick)?
There are CLSN1, but... Can't hit standing KFM with any of those.
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty

 - Have you changed the position of p2 in the Moonsault Press? p2 looks much further away in the fall animation. Is it just me? Looks strange.
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty

Gigas Breaker p2 position
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty

All tested in MUGEN 1.0
Last Edit: March 01, 2025, 11:19:47 pm by Staubhold

OrochiWeapon2000

Re: Hugo Released
New #9  March 02, 2025, 08:17:07 am
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Just took Hugo back to the lab followed by some arcade runs, and I can definitely see and feel the improvements. Great job! ;D I found a couple more notes in addition to what Staubold reported:

- When the opponent hits the ground after a far "Ultra Throw", they still take no damage when hitting the ground. It might also give the slide a little more "umph" if the opponent moved a little further back during the slide. As it is now, it kinda looks like they slide almost in place since they don't move much. :sweatdrop:

- A few times during my arcade runs, I would use his Standing B (far) to try and get some distance, only to get thrown out of the attack entirely with ground normal/special/super throws, even though Hugo was already in the air at the time I was grabbed. Getting hit during a Standing B (far) also brought me immediately back into a standing hit state, which leads me to believe that his Standing B's statetype is "S" throughout the attack. His Crouching Y also has a similar problem. Oddly enough, this issue was also present in his Crouching Y in SvC. However, in SF3, once Hugo is in the air during these attacks and gets hit, it definitely sends him into an aerial hit state.

- I noticed that Jumping B and the Jumping Knockdown Attack (or Jumping Z) share the same animation. Just an idea, but perhaps a suitable alternative animation to use may be the animation at the end of the "Meat Squasher" special? Given Hugo's massive size, it would likely make Hugo's jumping Knockdown Attack one of the strongest jumping Knockdown Attacks in ANY KoF-styled character. But I think that given all his other animations, that one in particular just seems like it would fit pretty well. He'd be like a jumping wall! :eaugh:

- I definitely noticed the absence of that ability to juggle after the Shooting Back Breaker was removed. It was my bread and butter for a while, and pretty fun while it lasted, lol! But for the sake of being thorough in my reporting, I still felt I had to include it. :sweatdrop: There does seem to be a sort of middle-ground though: When Shooting Back Breaker connects as a counter, the juggle is still possible. I think that's actually a fair way to allow for some amount of craziness. ;D

- When used in isolation, and not as a follow-up to "Ultra Throw" or any other combo, connecting with a Shooting Back Breaker does a pretty hefty bit of damage. This is VERY apparent when using the aforementioned Shooting Back Breaker "Counter" juggle, as the damage is a whopping 593! :mwhoa: Considering that's just a 3-hit combo that ends in a Level 1 super, it *might* need some looking into. :sweatdrop:

- "Meat Squasher" looks off once Hugo begins running while holding the opponent. It seems like the position of the opponent doesn't stay locked in place and instead moves toward Hugo as he's in motion, even going completely through Hugo by the end of the attack. This is even more noticeable when performing the move anywhere outside of the corner (with Hugo facing away from the corner).


- I can think of only one set of solutions for the "issues" regarding his jumping strong attacks (specifically his Jumping B and Jumping D+y), but they would probably lead to Hugo being harder to play overall, as well as deviating a bit too much (I think) from the way he plays in the sources. The idea would be that for the Jumping B, it would probably "look" better if he went into the recovery state seen at the end of his Standing B (far) animation when he hit the ground; and for the Jumping D+y, to have him go into the same animation he would when hitting the ground at the end of a Moonsault Press/Megaton Press. However, as I mentioned before, I'm pretty sure that would just make an already slow-moving character feel "clunky" as well. This is just a long-winded way to say that what you've got now feels like the best it can be when compared to the original sources. :mthumbs:

- While I do agree that throwing an opponent into ropes probably shouldn't K.O. them, in both SvC and SF3, they *did* still receive some damage. In this case, it was more of a "it was like that in the sources" kinda thing than a personal opinion, lol. Tizoc in Garou:MotW also inflicts damage when he tosses the enemy to the ropes in a similar-styled attack (HCF+LK).

As he is now, Hugo is still an excellent and well-made character, as are all your other works. :thumbsup: I'll continue to report any of my other findings here.
Last Edit: March 03, 2025, 11:55:01 pm by OrochiWeapon2000
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