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Sailor Mars release + Sailor Moon/Mercury update (13/05/24) (Read 4172 times)

Started by Million Miles, May 04, 2024, 10:30:47 pm
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Sailor Mars release + Sailor Moon/Mercury update (13/05/24)
New #1  May 04, 2024, 10:30:47 pm
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(13/05/24) Small fix for Sailor Moon

Mars arrives and ready to fight in high heels!
Moon and Mercury also received substantial updates including special intro compatibility so make sure to get them too.

Kudos to rgveda99 for hard work and dedication making lots of cool new sprites that allowed these characters to look as good as they do.


Spoiler: Screenshots (click to see content)

Sailor Mars: v1.1 download
Spoiler: v1.1 changes (click to see content)

Sailor Moon: v1.2b download
Spoiler: v1.2 changes (click to see content)

Sailor Mercury: v1.2b download
Spoiler: v1.2 changes (click to see content)
Last Edit: May 14, 2024, 12:20:28 am by Million Miles
Re: Sailor Mars release + Sailor Moon/Mercury update (04/05/24)
#2  May 05, 2024, 10:08:25 am
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Re: Sailor Mars release + Sailor Moon/Mercury update (04/05/24)
#3  May 05, 2024, 10:25:33 am
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I don't think was intentional
It most certainly not, moreover I thought I fixed this :furious:
Oh well, guess it's time to scratch my head again. Thanks for feedback!

EDIT: What is that stage with elevator and cat from one of your streams? First time seeing it and it looks nice.
Last Edit: May 05, 2024, 10:40:59 am by Million Miles
Re: Sailor Mars release + Sailor Moon/Mercury update (04/05/24)
#4  May 05, 2024, 10:56:48 am
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No problem.
The stage is Psylocke's from X-Men COTA.
Re: Sailor Mars release + Sailor Moon/Mercury update (04/05/24)
#5  May 05, 2024, 04:49:57 pm
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These chars are so good. From the sprite edits, to the move design and the unique effects. Great job again. :thumbsup:

I don't have much to point out so far, but:

- Hitting Mars should probably end Phobos & Deimos
- Fire Soul Bird might be a little too oppressive on block, between the tracking and the 90 chip damage
- Being unable to combo into Akuryo Taisan almost feels like a shame. The buff could last a little longer too since you still have to hit the enemy to take any advantage from it. Maybe it could also trigger on block? On the flipside, maybe it shouldn't have a hitbox since it's just a piece of paper that sticks to you
- You can set up (slow) unblockables with Running Fire and Fire Heel Drop. Maybe Running Fire would be more interesting being a safer move than a low?
- Can't seem to EX cancel Running Fire, despite the readme
- Fire Soul and Fire Heel Drop can only EX cancel into themselves. Intentional?
- Phobos & Deimos are not flagged as hyper attribute
- P2 can air recover out of Akuryo Taisan fire pillar, making it hard to capitalize on it (besides the initial damage)
You can help with Ikemen GO's development by trying out the latest development build and reporting any bugs on GitHub.
My Mugen and Ikemen content can also be found here.
Last Edit: May 05, 2024, 05:03:04 pm by PotS
Re: Sailor Mars release + Sailor Moon/Mercury update (04/05/24)
#6  May 05, 2024, 10:29:43 pm
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Haha, and there I thought "PotS is going to bash me for how powerful Akuryo Taisan is" and now you go with half of the post basically being "BUFF IT! BUFF IT!" :mlol:
Ok, here we go:
- Hitting Mars should probably end Phobos & Deimos
Interesting idea but it's a pretty heavy nerf for a move that lasts for 15 sec. Could you please elaborate why you think it needs this and also should I buff it somehow in exchange?
- Phobos & Deimos are not flagged as hyper attribute
You mean the HitDef attribute? It's intentional since hypers have some serious advantages (like going through Mercurys Shabon Barrier) and birdies doing it seemed OP. Not playing super KO effect if Phobos & Deimos KO an opponent is intentional too. Think of them as two mini-fighters doing normal attacks.
- Can't seem to EX cancel Running Fire, despite the readme
- Fire Soul and Fire Heel Drop can only EX cancel into themselves. Intentional?
Currently all specials can only be EX canceled into themselves, yes. Have you tried to EX cancel Running Fire into Snake Flare? It works when I test it in mugen/ikemen.
- You can set up (slow) unblockables with Running Fire and Fire Heel Drop. Maybe Running Fire would be more interesting being a safer move than a low?
You mean safer for an opponent? Like hitting high instead of low? Setting unblockables was one of its prime purposes since otherwise you don't have much reason to use it over Fire Soul. At least that's the impression I’m getting. Correct me if I'm wrong.
- Being unable to combo into Akuryo Taisan almost feels like a shame. The buff could last a little longer too since you still have to hit the enemy to take any advantage from it. Maybe it could also trigger on block? On the flipside, maybe it shouldn't have a hitbox since it's just a piece of paper that sticks to you
- P2 can air recover out of Akuryo Taisan fire pillar, making it hard to capitalize on it (besides the initial damage)
Being able to combo into an unblockable is pretty scary but I suppose the fact that you must hit an opponent again after that to capitalize on it sort of balances it. All in all I just was afraid that this move will be too cheap. This also applies to the fact that P2 can air recover from it. To be more precise Akuryo Taisan inherits recovery properties of the attack that set it off. Like if you hit an enemy with special they can recover but if you hit them with EX/Super they cannot. If you think its safe to make it unrecoverable at all times I can do it.

Now regarding trigger on block - if fire pillar is blockable then your opponent can deliberately block your next special and make you lose most of its advantages which just feels unfair. And now if fire pillar is unblockable you basically have unblockable specials while ofuda is attached which feels pretty crazy.

Sorry I don't get the hitbox bit. Were you talking about fire pillar hitbox? Because attached ofuda doesn't have one I think.
EDIT: Oh, you meant it shouldn't hit an opponent when it's attached. This is a smart nerf and never actually crossed my mind.
Also you praising these characters means a lot. Thanks!
Last Edit: May 06, 2024, 07:16:17 am by Million Miles
Re: Sailor Mars release + Sailor Moon/Mercury update (04/05/24)
#7  May 06, 2024, 05:31:35 pm
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Interesting idea but it's a pretty heavy nerf for a move that lasts for 15 sec. Could you please elaborate why you think it needs this and also should I buff it somehow in exchange?
The opponent pretty much can't retaliate while it's active. Games usually make those moves last a shorter time or end when the player is hit.

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You mean the HitDef attribute? It's intentional since hypers have some serious advantages (like going through Mercurys Shabon Barrier) and birdies doing it seemed OP. Not playing super KO effect if Phobos & Deimos KO an opponent is intentional too. Think of them as two mini-fighters doing normal attacks.
It's not a big deal, but they *are* hypers though. I noticed because they build stun in Ikemen.

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Currently all specials can only be EX canceled into themselves, yes.
That seems a little too linear. Would be more fun if it were any EX. Harder to balance though.

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Have you tried to EX cancel Running Fire into Snake Flare? It works when I test it in mugen/ikemen.
I didn't and it does indeed. On that note, that EX is quite different from the base special.

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You mean safer for an opponent? Like hitting high instead of low? Setting unblockables was one of its prime purposes since otherwise you don't have much reason to use it over Fire Soul. At least that's the impression I’m getting. Correct me if I'm wrong.
Safer for Mars. Like the fireball has less reach and only hits along the ground, but Mars gets to act sooner than with Fire Soul. It's already a bit like this but the frame data doesn't seem fully realized in that regard.

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Being able to combo into an unblockable is pretty scary
I hadn't realized it was unblockable. That's probably a point in favor of making it not hit at all (just stick to P2).

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Now regarding trigger on block - if fire pillar is blockable then your opponent can deliberately block your next special and make you lose most of its advantages which just feels unfair. And now if fire pillar is unblockable you basically have unblockable specials while ofuda is attached which feels pretty crazy.
Definitely don't make it unblockable. What I pictured was more like the pillar causing more block stun and chip than the plain special move usually does, so you still get something for the paper buff even if you can't hit P2.

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Sorry I don't get the hitbox bit. Were you talking about fire pillar hitbox? Because attached ofuda doesn't have one I think.
EDIT: Oh, you meant it shouldn't hit an opponent when it's attached. This is a smart nerf and never actually crossed my mind.
Exactly. Also the charge input feels a little out of place.
You can help with Ikemen GO's development by trying out the latest development build and reporting any bugs on GitHub.
My Mugen and Ikemen content can also be found here.
Re: Sailor Mars release + Sailor Moon/Mercury update (04/05/24)
#8  May 06, 2024, 06:27:48 pm
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That seems a little too linear. Would be more fun if it were any EX. Harder to balance though.
I didn't and it does indeed. On that note, that EX is quite different from the base special.
Yeah at this point I design some EXs as "something you can combo your special into" rather than "same move but better". Snake Flare is essentially designed to hit opponents that jump over Running Fire. I'll stick to linear EX Cancels for now. Maybe will experiment with canceling anything into anything later but as you noticed it's real pain to balance.
Definitely don't make it unblockable. What I pictured was more like the pillar causing more block stun and chip than the plain special move usually does, so you still get something for the paper buff even if you can't hit P2.
Hmm I still feel like it's the game punishing you for actively using specials after you land Akuryo Taisan as it would waste some of its power on block. For zoner it feels very unnatural. I'd like to test it when I remove hitbox and than decide if I will implement on-guard trigger it or not.
Also the charge input feels a little out of place.
Haha, exactly. The main reason I used it is to make spamming it more clunky as I was afraid it will be too strong.

Thanks for nice tips. Will address them in the following update.
Re: Sailor Mars release + Sailor Moon/Mercury update (04/05/24)
#9  May 06, 2024, 07:51:26 pm
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Normal sized chars and especially your Sailor Moon chars can crouch under her regular fireball. Just checking if you accounted for that. It probably affects what you can/should do with Running Fire (if not addressing it directly).
You can help with Ikemen GO's development by trying out the latest development build and reporting any bugs on GitHub.
My Mugen and Ikemen content can also be found here.
Re: Sailor Mars release + Sailor Moon/Mercury update (10/05/24)
#10  May 10, 2024, 05:59:16 pm
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Characters updated!

Sailor Mars v1.1
-Akuryo Taisan reworked
-Akuryo Taisan command remapped to [D,DB,B, x/y]
-Running Fire/Snake Flare recovery time reduced
-Fire Soul Bird chip damage reduced
-Phobos & Deimos movement/attack speed increased; getting hit ends duration prematurely
-minor sprite updates

Sailor Moon v1.2b
-Twilight Flash edited to properly interact with Sailor Mars updated ofuda

Sailor Mercury v1.2b
-fixed AI behaviour during Shine Aqua Cutter
-fixed Aqua Mist refresh error
-minor sprite updates

The buff could last a little longer too since you still have to hit the enemy to take any advantage from it.
Since it now triggers on block increasing the duration will likely do more harm than good. You can however set its duration using config.txt in character folder.