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Feedback to Warnings/Decisions (Read 876294 times)

Started by Iced, February 24, 2012, 09:43:26 pm
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Speedpreacher

Re: Feedback to Warnings/Decisions
#3561  March 03, 2016, 07:30:01 pm
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Christ Jesus I cannot believe it's current year and I still have to spend at least 1 week every month with the same goddamn Chucho discussion mucking up Random Posts
Nevermind, there's nothing I can do
Bet your life there's something killing you
It's a shame we have to die, my dear
No one's getting out of here alive
This time
What a way to go, but have no fear
No one's getting out of here alive
This time
It's a shame we have to disappear
No one's getting out of here alive
This time, this time, this time

Jesuszilla

Re: Feedback to Warnings/Decisions
#3562  March 03, 2016, 07:33:34 pm
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BerryBox said, March 03, 2016, 07:25:37 pm
Umezono said, March 03, 2016, 06:43:37 pm
i didnt even troll your precious lil buddy mc2. i posted on quote in qotd and made fun of it

and that made him ragequit?
Are you here to discuss the problems at hand or are you just going to keep making off-topic, unnecessary quips to try to look cool?


And I love how my suggestions for how staff need to change the way to go about things (not the thread-locking, jesus) are being ignored because that's a bigger problem, and part of why we're here having to discuss simple solutions such as banning repeat offenders in the first place. I'm not saying to hand out bans left and right, nor am I saying it should be done all the time, but come on.

You want to know what else wouldn't happen in any other community? Shit thread katamari (especially in a board that constantly complains about shitposts), users who do nothing but make sarcastic/satirical/snarky quips and never post in the most relevant sections of the community (no, All That's Left is not MUGEN-related), barking at users constantly until they are driven out when their behavior is not satisfactory rather than kicking them out when you're fed up. The latter, you even make a public affair out of so every user can take a shot at them, and the people doing this are granted immunity simply because you don't like them. It's a goddamn witch burning.

Users constantly act up and you wonder why they're acting up because you never stop to think that there's a problem with your approach or philosophy.
Last Edit: March 03, 2016, 08:05:15 pm by Jesuszilla

JustNoPoint

Re: Feedback to Warnings/Decisions
#3563  March 03, 2016, 09:51:17 pm
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I can't really discuss anything because I'm stuck at work for the next few days working 12 hour shifts! :p

Anyway just to put a nail in a part of the coffin I want to break the discussion into simpler chunks at some point.
Locking his threads is not on the table. So that part of the discussion can be done with. Like it or hate it.

I'll try to focus on more later.

Jango

Re: Feedback to Warnings/Decisions
#3564  March 03, 2016, 10:42:07 pm
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Y'all niggas need to kick back, relax, smoke a joint (if it's legal in your jurisdiction) (or not, I don't care). This shouldn't be that big of a deal.

On a sidenote, JZ, that analogy you made eaier about dogs shitting in the house? That could apply to the users that enter the threads and just unleash a torrent of vitirol. If you know those users are going to be abrasive and rude, give 'em a time-out. I mean seriously, the whole locking the threads bit, if we were to further use that analogy, would be like replacing the carpet with a red hot BBQ grill for a floor. The dog's not going to shit in the room any more, but the people that legitimately want to casually say "nice we got a CVS Elsa" won't be able to drop by either, leaving chuchoryu with no feedback at all, positive or not, regardless if he's paying attention.

If you want a more extreme example, pretend that chuchoryu is that video Youtube LP'er Markiplier did of him putting on makeup with one hand while simultaneously playing a video game with the other. The "nice char +1" posts are the equivalent of all the 12-year-olds that found it funny that a grown-ass man was putting on makeup. The vid also generated a lot of angry comments saying that he's being transphobic and even some threatening to physically beat him up (incidentally I know of at least one member on this board that did so, but that's irrelevant). Those are the angry comments in chucho's threads.

If you're getting mad at something, get away from it. That's all there is to it. If you can't control yourself, you deserve someone giving you a slap on the wrist.

Jesuszilla

Re: Feedback to Warnings/Decisions
#3565  March 03, 2016, 10:49:21 pm
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crazyhand420 said, March 03, 2016, 10:42:07 pm
On a sidenote, JZ, that analogy you made eaier about dogs shitting in the house? That could apply to the users that enter the threads and just unleash a torrent of vitirol. If you know those users are going to be abrasive and rude, give 'em a time-out.
That's precisely what I was referring to.

crazyhand420 said, March 03, 2016, 10:42:07 pm
I mean seriously, the whole locking the threads bit, if we were to further use that analogy, would be like replacing the carpet with a red hot BBQ grill for a floor. The dog's not going to shit in the room any more, but the people that legitimately want to casually say "nice we got a CVS Elsa" won't be able to drop by either, leaving chuchoryu with no feedback at all, positive or not, regardless if he's paying attention.
Exactly, it's an extreme solution, but I thought I'd throw it out there anyway because if they just keep deleting posts "in the cycle," they're almost doing the same thing.

crazyhand420 said, March 03, 2016, 10:42:07 pm
If you're getting mad at something, get away from it. That's all there is to it. If you can't control yourself, you deserve someone giving you a slap on the wrist.
And that's something we all agree on. But these users have had enough wrist-slaps, hence the "NO" part in the analogy. You can't just keep saying "NO" and expect it to change at some point.

Snakebyte

Re: Feedback to Warnings/Decisions
#3566  March 03, 2016, 10:55:59 pm
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Jesuszilla said, March 03, 2016, 10:49:21 pm
crazyhand420 said, March 03, 2016, 10:42:07 pm
I mean seriously, the whole locking the threads bit, if we were to further use that analogy, would be like replacing the carpet with a red hot BBQ grill for a floor. The dog's not going to shit in the room any more, but the people that legitimately want to casually say "nice we got a CVS Elsa" won't be able to drop by either, leaving chuchoryu with no feedback at all, positive or not, regardless if he's paying attention.
Exactly, it's an extreme solution, but I thought I'd throw it out there anyway because if they just keep deleting posts "in the cycle," they're almost doing the same thing.

This was my entire point in posting to begin with: They can drop by at MMV, and most people know that, so that isn't really an issue.

Jango

Re: Feedback to Warnings/Decisions
#3567  March 03, 2016, 10:59:27 pm
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Again, it's the individual poster's fault, not chucho's. If they're going to keep coming back even after getting multiple bannings, then THEY'RE the ones with the problem, not chuchoryu. He and the rest of the community shouldn't be punished because a few "holier-than-thou" assholes (on both sides) can't keep their mouths shut.

Jesuszilla

Re: Feedback to Warnings/Decisions
#3568  March 03, 2016, 11:01:48 pm
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That was just one half of the argument. The other, dealing with the users, is that more severe punishments (such as bans) are not being handed out to them, and it's become apparent that they should be.

Jango

Re: Feedback to Warnings/Decisions
#3569  March 03, 2016, 11:05:10 pm
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There's already a decent "ramp-up" banning thing going on tho. Every subsequent ban's duration lasts longer, so under "normal" circumstances, those people should get the hint by now. If they can't, they have problems that are beyond the scope of a forum dedicated to a hobby.

EDIT: And of course if those people aren't getting noticed, nothing wrong with hitting the "report" button

Cyanide

Re: Feedback to Warnings/Decisions
#3570  March 04, 2016, 01:16:21 am
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But the problem is that they HAVE been noticed and the response has been to continue stripping out the offending posts.

The staff have some options
1: Repeating their current actions in the hopes that people will magically change
2: Banning the users
3: Locking the threads
4: deleting the threads
5: banning the user who made the thread causing all the problems in the first place.

1 obviously doesn't work, they're trying it now and it's failing
2 this could easily be done, they are being disruptive and insulting, simply need to keep track of who is breaking the rules
3 is really easy and could be tested before being implemented but is apparently off the table
4 this is unlikely but would totally work
5 this isn't actually a solution but is at the other extreme from simply "dealing with it"


In M.U.G.E.N there is no magic button

They say a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but it's not one half so bad as a lot of ignorance.

Niitris

Re: Feedback to Warnings/Decisions
#3571  March 04, 2016, 02:39:24 am
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I alluded to it earlier that maybe it just needs to be enforced harder.

The most recent bump of Chuchoryu's thread is a example. It starts with a post that contributes nothing, never mind not being funny either. And instead of firmly stopping the derail before it went any further, it was allowed to fester and generated 10-15 more responses, almost none of which was talking about the characters. That's how release threads turn to shit.

Even much earlier in the thread, with Gennos post. Yeah he was rightfully told to cool it, but apparently no one got the message to stay on topic, which allowed "the cycle" to continue.

Basically, I think releases need to be treated more seriously. I mean, someone pours hours of work (good or not) into making a artistic work. And they come to find that most of the discussion in the comments section is (at best) semi-unrelated nonsense? Kinda disrespectful.

Thing is, from everything I gather, people do a good job on this for the most part. The average release thread is orderly and everything is fine. Of course there's gonna be the few threads (like Chuchoryu's) where people feel compelled to speak of other matters (him as a creator being the usual) that deviate from the topic, which is the characters themselves.

Diverging from the topic has more leniency in more general discussions, like on "the other side" of the forum. Or mugen discussion. But for release threads, the focus should remain strictly on the character, or stage, or whatever. No disrespect, but I don't think a good enough job is done on that matter.

JustNoPoint

Re: Feedback to Warnings/Decisions
#3572  March 04, 2016, 03:21:28 am
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Alright then. Several things have been brought up. I want to go back through the thread and read everything again to cover points that have been brought up but I don't have the time to do that tonight.

So for now we can focus on the Releases issue.
Here's what I want to do. I say want. This isn't final. This is up for discussion. Talk about pros and cons, alternatives, etc.

If you blatantly insult an author in a release thread you're banned. The only exceptions might be if you are new. And then it still depends on the severity of your blatant insults.

This next part may only apply to Chochoryu threads but could be used in other threads if needed.

If the "cycle" I spoke about starts up it'll be deleted. A warning will be given and the next person that restarts the cycle will get banned. Thread will be cleared of offtopic again and we carry on.

To note: This would mean that the posts JZ and Jennos made would have been an instant ban. Yes Gennos, saying someone is like an insult is the same as insulting them.

Up till now I'd preferred to use my own sometimes flawed internal checks. JZ, your post was well worthy of ban even in the old system but I still carry some of the old values in me a bit. You hadn't been in trouble for over 10 months from checking and you had been being very helpful and releasing works. I have a bad habit of giving people that are actively helping and developing a bit more wiggle room.

So, how does this system sound?

Jesuszilla

Re: Feedback to Warnings/Decisions
#3573  March 04, 2016, 03:25:11 am
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I only made said post in order to force this discussion anyway, so sounds alright to me.

Unconventional, but it certainly worked.

ShinZankuro

Re: Feedback to Warnings/Decisions
#3574  March 04, 2016, 03:26:22 am
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If this ends definitely the shitstorm on every Chucho's release, that's fine.
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Niitris

Re: Feedback to Warnings/Decisions
#3575  March 04, 2016, 03:27:10 am
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Sounds good

JustNoPoint

Re: Feedback to Warnings/Decisions
#3576  March 04, 2016, 03:28:57 am
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I should note. If a mod sees the crap starting and can't deal with it at the time it would be a good idea to lock the thread and report the post.

I'm mostly saying this to establish my own method of handling these issues if I'm at work. I only get 2 20 minute breaks and 1 30 minute lunch!!!

hatter

Re: Feedback to Warnings/Decisions
#3577  March 04, 2016, 03:30:17 am
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Sounds like a plan, boss.
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Sinnesloschen

Re: Feedback to Warnings/Decisions
#3578  March 04, 2016, 03:31:39 am
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It'll work.
Alpaca-San said, December 27, 2014, 08:50:31 am
Is finding MUGEN to be more enjoyable to play when you're not wearing clothes an underrated opinion?

Berry

Re: Feedback to Warnings/Decisions
#3579  March 04, 2016, 03:32:16 am
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It seems reasonable enough

Titiln

Re: Feedback to Warnings/Decisions
#3580  March 04, 2016, 03:37:26 am
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i don't think it's worth an instant ban, that's way too harsh. i'd say it's worth one warning and the next one is a ban. it would put the user on a warning level that is right next to a ban. it should be assumed that posters are humans that understand words and warnings. if they don't they get banned.

any other alternatives (locking the thread, banning chuchoryu, putting a huge "This Guy Doesn't Take Feedback" sign in his posts) would just single him out and are worse than the current situation. most people realized that he doesn't really address most of the feedback he gets so they don't bother. the current "system" works, offtopic posts in release threads are usually deleted or moved and the guilty parties are warned, but it's not being enforced, otherwise his latest release thread would have a lot less posts. gennos' posts comparing him with a shitty fanfic writer is still there.

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