The Mugen Fighters Guild - KOF XIII Saiki beta7f by Werewood & BoyBoyz (no more updates)

Baby Bonnie Hood

Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta3 (update 2011-07-04)

#61 July 08, 2011, 06:31:37 am

Cute Bounty Hunter

'94 Rugal could jump and crouch, right?

I have to say, it's sad how SNK has gotten so lazy with their bosses nowadays that they can't even jump anymore, much less crouch.

Check out my MvC3-style characters!

Werewood

Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta4 (update 2011-07-10)

#62 July 10, 2011, 10:47:24 am

Trying now to act normal

Version beta-4:

bug report and fix by Insanius:
>> The sparks need to use additive transparency,
AS256D128 added to super start-up FX, hit, & guard/block sparks anims

bug report and fix by Nameless353:
>> Hitsparks appear even when the enemy isn't hit.
Fixed by changing trigger1 = (enemy, stateno = [5000,5999]) && (timemod = 10, 0) to trigger1 = (enemy, stateno = [5000,5050]) && (timemod = 10, 0)
>> I dunno how, but the A.I. stays on the air floating sometimes.
Fixed by adding in P1 throw and P2 thrown states a posset and posfreeze State Controllers

bug report and fix by BoyBoyz:
>> 1. When the opponent gets stunned by the fireball, he/she can be moved outside of the black thing by just walking into the enemy. The stunned enemy is supposed to be stuck inside the black thingy.
Fixed by adding a playerpush value = 0 State Controller to P2 custom state
>> 2. the hard version of saiki's fireball doesn't do a 2-hit combo when saiki is right next to the enemy; only the hand hits but the fireball doesn't hit. Maybe the CLSN of the fireball can be adjusted a little.
Fixed by making the fireball red clsn box rearly wider
>> 3. After the counter move connects and the enemy is stunned, saiki will use his hand to knock the enemy away. When this happens, the black thingy should not remain on screen anymore.
Fixed
>> 4. The counter move only has a follow-up (where saiki knocks the enemy away with a CD attack) when saiki counters right next to the enemy. The followup should rather occur within the CD attack range.
Fixed by increasing p2dist x <= 50 to p2dist x <= 100
>> 5. There's no infinite fireballs : ( When the enemy gets stunned, saiki cannot throw another fireball to follow up immediately. The original saiki could do a straight fireball, an air fireball, then throw a rock at you for a 3-hit combo
Please download the kof13saiki_infinite_fireballs.cmd
>> 6. The walking forward time has been changed to 7, but the walking backwards is still 10.
Fixed by subtracting 3 from 10 for anim 21
>> 7. His legsweep (hard kick) is still wrong. Saiki first steps outwards (hence he moves forward a bit to give the sweep more range) then sweeps the enemy, then returns back to original position. He only moves forward DURING the move, but not after.
Ok, I posadd x = 5 at animelem = 2 and posadd x = -5 at animelem = 14, does it look alright now?
>> 8. Saiki's stone throw move (AI) sometimes has him throw the stone backwards (but the hit is still forwards)
This is a custom move for the A.I.!!!
>> 9. This is kind of minor, but after his counter move ends, saiki's head seems to bob up and down. No idea why. Maybe the sprite rips were out of place?
I don't know why since I ripped Saiki sprites from the Arcade PC dump............maybe wait for Insanius' proper rips......
>> 10. On one occasion while watching Saiki's AI, after winning he said two winquotes at the same time!
I used random trigger to generate 3 different winquotes. Now I use life to see whether improved or not.......

@Yoma Komatsu:
>> 's sad how SNK has gotten so lazy with their bosses nowadays that they can't even jump anymore, much less crouch.
Hope some 2D KOF spriters can add jump and crouch sprites to Saiki...........some days.........well............

@sedas:
>> Very nice, may I ask how you ripped the sprites from the game?
KOFXIII Arcade PC Dump.............................old traditional hard and stupid make movie take screenshot clean and crop way, a lot of disadvantages............... $:-\$

@rizki29:
>> cool character i will test it
Thanks! But:

Yo please don't COTM nominate my KOF XIII Saiki beta; he is far from completion. Thanks!
Admin please ignore my KOF XIII Saiki beta nominations

* Pleasing other people is nice, but when creating for Mugen, you're supposed to please yourself first. -- Cybaster

BoyBoyz

Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta4 (update 2011-07-10)

#63 July 11, 2011, 06:06:37 am

Woops sorry stupid me forgot to rename the cmd file the last time that's why the infinite fireball didn't work.
I must say sorry to keep pointing out errors and troubling you... this post is unreasonably long, demanding, and perfectionist, so you can ignore it if you like! I'm just a huge fan of saiki and hope to see him done well

Bugs:
1a. After stunning the enemy with his fireball, beta4saiki should not be able to walk through the enemy. Original Saiki could only walk against the enemy and the black thingy would be moved along with the being-moved opponent (you could test it out in the game to get a better idea of what I'm talking about).

1b. Major bug! Sometimes the enemy doesn't get stunned by Saiki's fireball even though the black thingy appears. This happens mostly (not confirmed) when the enemy is about to start a move or EX move or jump, and is quite close to saiki (not right next to him though). After testing in KOFXIII, the fireball lands first and the enemy gets 'hit' by it, hence all movement is stopped first, then the black smoke and black thingy appear and 'hold' the enemy in place. You could test it out to see what I mean.

1c. In beta4Saiki's hard version fireball, the first hit with his hand should 'chain' with the fireball. In other words, the enemy should not be able to block the fireball after getting hit by the hand.

2a. After being stunned by the fireball, if beta4saiki did a counter move right next to the stunned enemy, he would automatically follow-up with the punch as if the counter succeeded.

2b. Quite lucky to chance upon a very rare and interesting thing: if Beta4Saiki's counter move succeeded but he was accidentally hit out of it, he could perform another counter move which would not do anything (or any other move for that matter), then after that the C+D would automatically still come out! Maybe the whole move should not be bound together or something, and maybe saiki should be made invulnerable once the counter connects.

2c. I only encountered this ONCE. After stunning the enemy with a fireball, I performed a counter move from about 1/4 screen distance away (while the enemy was still stunned). I executed some other move while the counter move was in motion (can't remember what I did exactly). Something happened... and saiki just stood there and kept doing the counter move (without me pressing anything) until the enemy stopped being stunned. I couldn't get the bug to appear again... maybe it's nothing?

3. Saiki's walk and grab/grab move: when the enemy is at very low health, the first three punches deal no damage.

Minor Improvements:
4. In addition to the infinite fireballs, after the opponent is stunned by a fireball, original Saiki could still do the counter move also. I've learnt from you to add the ';' in front of the numhelper thingy!

5. There's one more thing that makes the original saiki so powerful. He can cancel his punches or kicks into any of his special moves (fireball, grab, counter) even without the punches/kicks hitting the enemy! However, the order is only from punch/kick to special move, and it ends there. I wonder if this can be enabled in mugen?

6a. The voice during his super (when he kneels down) is the wrong one

6b. His voice for the QCF + Light Kick (when right next to enemy, hence performing a legsweep instead of rock throw) is the wrong one

To save you the time of testing it, the voice should be what he says when he starts up his super (yes, lazy SNK).

7. If the enemy is hit out of the black thingy before the full stun-time, the black thingy should fade away faster instead of remaining on screen for the full duration.

8. Not sure but did you give saiki a recovery stance? Like when he is about to fall and touch the ground he can recover by pressing A+B.

Last Edit: July 14, 2011, 05:06:30 am by BoyBoyz

Werewood

Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta5 (update 2011-07-14)

#64 July 14, 2011, 06:33:49 pm

Trying now to act normal

Version beta-5:

- increase poweradd for normal moves and special moves

1a. After stunning the enemy with his fireball, beta4saiki should not be able to walk through the enemy. Original Saiki could only walk against the enemy and the black thingy would be moved along with the being-moved opponent
>> added this feature by setting velset State Controller in the black thingy Helper statedef

1b. Major bug! Sometimes the enemy doesn't get stunned by Saiki's fireball even though the black thingy appears. This happens mostly (not confirmed) when the enemy is about to start a move or EX move or jump, and is quite close to saiki (not right next to him though).
>> used different methods to try to prevent this from happening, hopefully

1c. In beta4Saiki's hard version fireball, the first hit with his hand should 'chain' with the fireball. In other words, the enemy should not be able to block the fireball after getting hit by the hand.
>> increased the P2 pause time for the first hit

2a. After being stunned by the fireball, if beta4saiki did a counter move right next to the stunned enemy, he would automatically follow-up with the punch as if the counter succeeded.
>> fixed by using a new variable

2b. Quite lucky to chance upon a very rare and interesting thing: if Beta4Saiki's counter move succeeded but he was accidentally hit out of it, he could perform another counter move which would not do anything (or any other move for that matter), then after that the C+D would automatically still come out! Maybe the whole move should not be bound together or something, and maybe saiki should be made invulnerable once the counter connects.
>> now Saiki is invincible during D,DB,B,a/b special counter move

2c. I only encountered this ONCE. After stunning the enemy with a fireball, I performed a counter move from about 1/4 screen distance away (while the enemy was still stunned). I executed some other move while the counter move was in motion (can't remember what I did exactly). Something happened... and saiki just stood there and kept doing the counter move (without me pressing anything) until the enemy stopped being stunned. I couldn't get the bug to appear again... maybe it's nothing?
>> fixed by tweaking ChangeState State Controller triggers, hopefully

3. Saiki's walk and grab/grab move: when the enemy is at very low health, the first three punches deal no damage.
>> changed to triggerall = p2life >= 10 for the TargetLifeAdd State Controller

4. In addition to the infinite fireballs, after the opponent is stunned by a fireball, original Saiki could still do the counter move also. I've learnt from you to add the ';' in front of the numhelper thingy!
>> cool~

5. There's one more thing that makes the original saiki so powerful. He can cancel his punches or kicks into any of his special moves (fireball, grab, counter) even without the punches/kicks hitting the enemy! However, the order is only from punch/kick to special move, and it ends there. I wonder if this can be enabled in mugen?
>> done! changed from movecontact to time >= 3

7. If the enemy is hit out of the black thingy before the full stun-time, the black thingy should fade away faster instead of remaining on screen for the full duration.
>> done! added a ChangeAnim State Controller for the black thingy

8. Not sure but did you give saiki a recovery stance? Like when he is about to fall and touch the ground he can recover by pressing A+B.
>> done! please press ("z") or ("x" & "a") or ("x" & "y")

@BoyBoyz:
>> 6a. The voice during his super (when he kneels down) is the wrong one
>> 6b. His voice for the QCF + Light Kick (when right next to enemy, hence performing a legsweep instead of rock throw) is the wrong one To save you the time of testing it, the voice should be what he says when he starts up his super (yes, lazy SNK).
Please open kof13saiki.snd with MCM or FF and tell me which sound group & number I should change, because in fact I don't hear clearly from the source game, just guessing some voices...............
>> I must say sorry to keep pointing out errors and troubling you... this post is unreasonably long,
No don't say that! I love your very detailed feedbacks! You are helping me improve my Saiki beta! I really appreciate your feedbacks, especially in some cases you even teach me how to fix bugs! Keep them coming!

Yo please don't COTM nominate my KOF XIII Saiki beta; he is far from completion. Thanks!
Admin please ignore my KOF XIII Saiki beta nominations

* Pleasing other people is nice, but when creating for Mugen, you're supposed to please yourself first. -- Cybaster

Last Edit: July 14, 2011, 06:41:38 pm by Werewood

BoyBoyz

On the road to perfection

#65 July 14, 2011, 09:41:19 pm

Ok here goes... bear with me as I did VERY intensive testing this time round and will list everything at one go to prevent further trouble. The * represents the very important things to note. In case you read an earlier version of this document, the updated one contains 19 points and 2 observations and has just been modified at mugenguild time 06:55:09am

Bugs:

1a. In an AI battle, after saiki walked and grabbed magaki when he was at very low hp, the first punch killed him (this happens frequently but not all the time. Most often in AI watch mode) and he was left hanging in mid air for some time; the grey background also stayed there (it's not because I paused it lol, but he was actually floating there after screaming and after saiki let go of him). So far this move has 2 things to note: first, only the C+D final hit kills; and second, the three punches do normal damage even if the enemy is at veryyy low health.

1b. This bug happened where krizalid suddenly jumped out of Saiki's grab, and it was quite funny because saiki was punching the air.

*2a. This is important and very hard to explain, and is related to points 5b and 7b. Beta5saiki's straight fireball has this bug as can be seen in the picture. It catches the enemy mid-air and stuns them there also. To prevent this bug, we can refer to kofXIII's frames. First the fireball lands, then the fireball explodes and this explosion triggers a 'hit', causing the opponent to look like he/she was being hit (even when already stunned) and fall to the ground (if in the air) in an upright immobilized manner (therefore the stun position will be correct), then the stun activates. You could check it out if my words are hard to understand

*2b. The fireball stun SOMETIMES (most of the time it works) fails for huge opponents like Leopaldon, abyss third form, onslaught, apocalypse, or even for other characters. By fail I mean you can still move the enemy out of the stun thingy or they can still move. The black thingy needs to be 'tighter' xD. Here's a cute example: igniz was 'stunned' before he did that super, but he could still start doing it.

This happened when Igniz reflected Saiki's projectile, but the stun thingy still appeared. Rugal and athena have reflects too.

This happened when saiki countered rugal's QCFx2+kick grab super - the counter was successful but no stun thingy appeared at all; saiki just stood there while rugal whacked him without damage lol. Saiki's counter also failed to stun pikachu (maybe it's just character specific) when it connected. It needs a stronger bind to stop supers.

3. Also, with tall enemies like magaki/mukai/orochi/rugal (however it does work fine for some like juggernaut...) or super short enemies like pikachu or metool, the grabbing position is a bit wrong.. saiki looks like he's grabbing magaki's crotch! HAHA. Even if the character were to have his/her feet below ground level, it'd still look nicer than a crotch grab :3. Maybe there's a command that standardizes the grab to be at the top/head of the clsn box?

4. Only in AI watch mode does Saiki suddenly tend to lag a lot, and I realized this happens mostly when the screen fades to grey (during the grab move). Sometimes the screen remains grey for an extended period of time even after the grab, and sometimes the screen turns grey for no reason (see the pic below, Saiki is not doing anything but screen goes grey)! These only happen in AI mode.

Sounds:

5a. for the QCF+kick near enemy, the sound should be 36/57.
for the super, he says 36/57 only when he folds his arms. The super animation intro needs a slight pause (enough time for him to say the full sound) when he folds his arms.
for the super, after he kneels down he says EITHER 41/57 OR 42/57. He alternates between these two in the game. You could just choose one, they're almost the same lol.
Oh and beta5saiki's super should not have the bubbling sound 39/57. That sound belongs to the intro sequence for dark ash xD.

5b. Beta5saiki's counter move needs to be slowed down to accomodate 2 additional voices: if the counter doesn't connect, the disappointed voice (25/57) that beta5saiki currently has is correct; but if the counter connects, saiki should say in a flaunting voice 52/57 at the pause when the move is successfully countered (the pause is the ministun i mentioned in point 2 which immobilizes the enemies if they're in the air and causes them to fall to ground level), then when he does the final C+D hit that flings the enemy away, he'll say in a demeaning voice 26/57. Be careful though, because your counter works slightly differently in that it works even on fireballing/ranged opponents (and I LOVE this feature)! So this will be up to you how you want to add the sounds... maybe you can just add them for physical/close-range counters (for the C+D hit-voice).

5c. 5b was getting too long... so I created a 5c lol. If Saiki's counter didn't connect, the disappointed voice (25/57) is heard only when he withdraws his hand to his chest (before letting it down). Beta5saiki said 25/57 instantly when the move started.

5d. If we're going with 'infinite' fireballs, then the second follow-up fireball (both straight and air fireballs) should have the hit sound 22/57 too instead of a normal hit sound.

5e. A+B teleport has a sliding sound which is not in the soundlist, and there is another voice 30/57 in addition to the one it already has. It seems saiki has a lot of alternating voices

Improvements:

*6. The legsweep has been improved, but the range is still so short that it becomes not very useful. I measured it in kofxiii: saiki takes a step forward and then sweeps, making the total distance from where he was standing about 3 finger spaces, a.k.a a normal trip move from any character. (If you successfully increase the range, then the QCF+kick-when-near activation range should also be increased accordingly) It is important to note, as can be seen in the pictures, that saiki only moves 3 fingerspaces for the red clsn of his extended (the pic doesn't show his leg extended) leg to hit the enemy, but after that he gradually shifts back to original position as can be seen in picture 4 (not yet original position). Also, the legsweep time should be changed from 3 to 2, because it comes out VERY fast. Check it out in kofXIII

Here're the images in sequence for a better idea of how he moves from the starting position:

*7a. For Saiki's hard version fireball, his hand (not the fireball) sweeping outward can cancel boss priority projectiles. For example, in the original kof XIII when u played saiki vs. saiki, the computer would wait for you to launch your fireball, then when your fireball almost reached him, he'd start his own fireball such that his hand would cancel your fireball and his own fireball would hit you. That's why I was asking in another forum page if magaki's fireballs can be negated, with this hand-swiping motion xD. The hand-swipe can practically cancel ANY projectile in KOFXIII lol. Overpowered!

7b. Saiki's fireball needs to have higher priority. Even True Geese's double reppuken is cancelling and going past it xD

7c. Related to point 2: when saiki's air fireball missed and landed on the ground, the explosion could hit the enemy and cause the stun to activate! This led me to think that it's actually the explosion that triggers the black-thingy-stun, not the fireball? That's why if u notice in kofXIII, the stun doesn't activate as fast as your saiki's stun. I think there are two frames to the fireball stun (perhaps this is why the counter-move had a pause also): first it lands and the explosion 'hits' the enemy (doesn't really count as a hit, but the enemy will look as if he/she has been hit), then the stun comes in for a second hit (but it isn't counted as a 2-hit combo). However, your betasaiki's stun is cool also! Up to you!

7d. Beta5saiki's straight fireball handswipe's red clsn stops at 16/54 ticks, but i've observed in the original that it ends at around 29/54 ticks (as long as the black flame was still there around his body), meaning that the enemy can still be hit at 29/54.

7e. Also, the stone throw had light and hard versions of it (I've no idea how to activate them in KOFXIII though... maybe lightly tap the a button or press it hard?) where the light version will come out slower and just hit the enemy, but the hard version will be much faster and knock them off their feet!

*8. Saiki's counter move could be spammed VERY fast - he could do another counter move (if the first one missed) right after his hand reached his chest (did not need to wait for the hand to return to his side).

9. What's left: super needs the correct sprites, sprite refurnishing to stop the bobbing head in counter move and breathing.

Observations (can ignore):

1. Saiki's super can hit between 33-44 times. No idea what to make of this, but it does reveal certain mechanics about the super. I remember seeing sprites of the second super on mugenimperiolatino, but the project has been removed lol.

2. Consider adding AI solutions for opponents like Onslaught, Abyss, Apocalypse, Leopaldon (Guilty Gear Isuka) etc who cannot be grabbed (Maybe telling him to use the walk-and-grab move less often. Is there even such an AI configuration? lol).

That's all for now!! It's one thing that I can give you such detailed reports, but it's also another on your part that you're able to understand and correct your awesome betasaiki to the very word. Very impressive!

If there are no bugs after these adjustments, your saiki should almost be perfect already! Rock on~

Last Edit: July 17, 2011, 02:44:57 pm by BoyBoyz

Werewood

Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta6 (update 2011-08-06)

#66 August 06, 2011, 03:58:41 pm

Trying now to act normal

Version beta-6:

- alternate AIR (kof13saiki_alt.air) deleted no more in need for a boss like Saiki

>> so far this walk&grab move has 2 things to note: first, only the C+D final hit kills; and second, the three punches do normal damage even if the enemy is at veryyy low health.
= Fixed by adding to kill = 0 to the three punches' TargetLifeAdd to ensure these won't kill P2

>> This bug happened where krizalid suddenly jumped out of Saiki's grab, and it was quite funny because saiki was punching the air.
= Not quite a fix but adding a trigger2 = p2movetype != H to make Saiki change to his stance state once P2 for some reason jumps out of his grab. Please note that Saiki's grab uses a very intrinsic throw HitDef and TargetBind which seems to be permanently binding P2 during the state.

>> Also, with tall enemies like magaki/mukai/orochi/rugal (however it does work fine for some like juggernaut...) or super short enemies like pikachu or metool, the grabbing position is a bit wrong.. saiki looks like he's grabbing magaki's crotch!
= Fixed by using an absolute TargetBind P2 y positioning instead of using P2's size.head.pos.y constant

>> Beta5saiki's straight fireball handswipe's red clsn stops at 16/54 ticks, but i've observed in the original that it ends at around 29/54 ticks (as long as the black flame was still there around his body), meaning that the enemy can still be hit at 29/54.
= Fixed by BoyBoyz

>> For Saiki's hard version fireball, his hand (not the fireball) sweeping outward can cancel boss priority projectiles.
>> Saiki's fireball needs to have higher priority. Even True Geese's double reppuken is cancelling and going past it
= Increased the hand sweeping fireball from projpriority = 1 to projpriority = 100; it should be able to cancel most other fireballs such as Magaki's pink fireballs and even his fog-like helper-based fireballs!
= Changed the main fireball (the oval-shaped dark stone) from Projectile to Helper and added an extra projectile along with the helper to try to cancel out P2's fireball
= The helper and its projectile now has pausetime = 0,0 which means they no more stun P2 in mid air

>> hard version fireball and counter move need a stronger dark bind..........
= Now Saiki's hard fireball and counter move use Helper instead of Projectile to stun bind P2, hopefully making it bind stronger.........

>> This happened when Igniz reflected Saiki's projectile, but the stun thingy still appeared. Rugal and athena have reflects too.
= Now Saiki's hard fireball is using Helper, so Igniz/Rugal/Athena shall have hard time reflecting it........

>> the stone throw had light and hard versions of it (I've no idea how to activate them in KOFXIII though)
= I added one more version of the move yet it comes out by 50% chance!

>> Saiki's counter move could be spammed VERY fast - he could do another counter move (if the first one missed) right after his hand reached his chest (did not need to wait for the hand to return to his side).
= I added a CtrlSet value = 1 to allow you to gain control of Saiki when his hand reached his chest (animelem = 26)

>> Consider adding AI solutions for opponents like Onslaught, Abyss, Apocalypse, Leopaldon (Guilty Gear Isuka) etc who cannot be grabbed
= Now using the p2name trigger, A.I. will use stone throw move instead of walk&grab move against A.I. Onslaught, Abyss, Apocalypse, Leopaldon, and my Infant Mutant Naughty Baby!!!

@BoyBoyz:
>> 4. Only in AI watch mode does Saiki suddenly tend to lag a lot, and I realized this happens mostly when the screen fades to grey (during the grab move). Sometimes the screen remains grey for an extended period of time even after the grab, and sometimes the screen turns grey for no reason (see the pic below, Saiki is not doing anything but screen goes grey)! These only happen in AI mode.
= About the "lag in AI mode" that is not a buggy lag! That is intentional - a slow-mo-jo super move for the A.I. only! During the slow-mo-jo super move, Saiki's walks faster and grab P2 faster and his fireballs travel faster too! That is why you see the screen turns grey when Saiki is performing this custom super move

>> 9. What's left: super needs the correct sprites, sprite refurnishing to stop the bobbing head in counter move and breathing.
= Sorry I can do nothing to the sprites! Please wait for Insanius' proper rips in this October!

>> 1. Saiki's super can hit between 33-44 times. No idea what to make of this, but it does reveal certain mechanics about the super.
= I checked with the KOFXIII PC arcade dump and found Saiki's super does exactly 34 hits, which is the number shown in MUGEN too..............

BoyBoyz! Thank you for helping me fix the sounds, sweep kick, counter move invincibility, and CD (yb/c in MUGEN) hit activation range!!! I already added you in my readme credit list in beta6!
Please continue to give me more feedback!

Yo please don't COTM nominate my KOF XIII Saiki beta; he is far from completion. Thanks!
Admin please ignore my KOF XIII Saiki beta nominations

* Pleasing other people is nice, but when creating for Mugen, you're supposed to please yourself first. -- Cybaster

BoyBoyz

Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta6 (update 2011-08-06)

#67 August 06, 2011, 06:38:39 pm

1. the counter move ctrlset shdn't be so fast, animelem 30 or 31 is just nice.

2. Also the Projectile state for the fireball (statedef 1000) handswipe (with the stateno 1302) doesn't do anything, so it could be replaced with an extra helper I mailed you in order for it to cancel boss-level projectiles.

3. What's left: fireball needs a helper that's similar to the stone throw helper. The stone could cancel magaki's floating sphere (the white transparent one)!

Awesome! perfection!

Last Edit: August 06, 2011, 08:25:44 pm by BoyBoyz

Werewood

Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta6 (update 2011-08-06)

#68 August 06, 2011, 07:34:33 pm

Trying now to act normal

BoyBoyz said, August 06, 2011, 06:38:39 pm

1. the counter move ctrlset shdn't be so fast, animelem 30 or 31 is just nice.

2. Also the Projectile state for the fireball (statedef 1000) handswipe (with the stateno 1302) doesn't do anything, so it could be replaced with an extra helper I mailed you in order for it to cancel boss-level projectiles.

3. The sweep kick needs to come out faster. The timing (I think) should be 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, 4, 3, 3, 3 etc. The starting of the sweep is very fast, but saiki slows down when returning to original position.

4. What's left: fireball needs a helper that's similar to the stone throw helper. The stone could cancel magaki's floating sphere (the white transparent one)!

Awesome! perfection!

BoyBoyz said, August 06, 2011, 05:52:07 pm

btw magaki's pink fireballs look like they can be cancelled but they're actually just teleporting around : (

I tried using your stone throw states to create a helper for the black fireball, but I couldn't get the helper to follow properly

For #2 and #4:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5KnefzSgHIg

I have tested it here....................please look at my video

For #1 and #3, I will do it later....................

For all people including you BoyBoyz, please re-download beta6 thanks!

Yo please don't COTM nominate my KOF XIII Saiki beta; he is far from completion. Thanks!
Admin please ignore my KOF XIII Saiki beta nominations

* Pleasing other people is nice, but when creating for Mugen, you're supposed to please yourself first. -- Cybaster

Last Edit: August 06, 2011, 07:59:21 pm by Werewood

JFCT555

Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta6 (update 2011-08-06)

#69 August 06, 2011, 08:58:18 pm

99% Offline, So?

Well, I have read your "stuff you will never make even if..."

Werewood said, June 15, 2011, 09:06:16 pm

What kind of MUGEN stuff you will never make even if.....[size=4pt]- M$ Bill Gates hires you to head the new MUGEN department,
- Apple hires you to add this and that MUGEN stuff to iPad,
- Your girlfriend's request if not granted then be ready for a split up,
- Your MUGEN authoring skills suddently level up so high that you can just whatever you like,
- Your boss' son requests you to do one for him then he will ask his dad to promote you to advance,
- McDonald and KFC ask you to make a better Donald and Colonel then they will let you eat their food for free for your entire life,
- Werewood buys you your favorite hotdog and beer?

For me:
1. Hentai MUGEN stuff -- why some H'ers can't go for real p0rn? I just hate to love H stuff... [/size]
2. KOF chars. -- I clearly understand the terrible, tragic, life-threathening consequence of not being able to make an accurate KOF char.
[size=4pt]3. Palettes -- just because I suck at making ACTs. I don't have a pair of keen colours-sensitive eyes

To put it simple, what kind of MUGEN stuff goes against your principle??? [/size]

And, as you see, you have swallow your own words... And nothing makes the exception if you can't even control some simple helper problems like your saiki's one.

Nice try, nice char, and perfectly named as beta, don't give up and... you will improve your programming.

Werewood

Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta6 (update 2011-08-06)

#70 August 06, 2011, 09:25:19 pm

Trying now to act normal

@JFCT555:
You are a KOF mugenization expert of course you will feel my first (and last) KOF mugenized char. Saiki plays like a baby level.
I did Saiki all because he is a boss. If he weren't a boss I wouldn't have risked my life to try to mugenize him.

But!
I take every feedback very seriously and am very willing to improve and fix if I have the ability to. This way I can learn stuff. So please as a KOF mugenization expert JFCT555 please give me some useful feedbacks so that I can polish my beta Saiki further yo!

I am obsessed with bosses if you follow my releases!

And, my beta Saiki is just a bait; to prompt the revealing of the coming proper sprite rip, and more KOF mugenization expert can't wait to convert their Saiki to beat the crap of mine, how cool~

@BoyBoyz:
Good find as always! Stay tuned for my next update yo!

* Pleasing other people is nice, but when creating for Mugen, you're supposed to please yourself first. -- Cybaster

BoyBoyz

Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta6 (update 2011-08-06)

#71 August 06, 2011, 10:48:02 pm

Yea werewood is trying his best already! Will have to make do with beta5 for now... beta6 has lots of bugs

Finalized bugs (please read again in case I updated something):

1. First bug is that the explosion and explosion sound when the black thingy appears comes out two or three times only for the forward fireball AND counter move (for the counter move, when it successfully counters magaki's white fireball you can hear 3 explosion sounds, after which the invisible helpers will be left on screen: refer to bug 4). Air fireball not really affected... either that or I can't hear the difference xD

2. MAJOR bug: The stun fails very frequently (beta5 was 95% strong; it just failed for some overpowered edited characters). In order to see this bug, just keep chaining the 2-hit fireball up close, and suddenly the 2 or 3 sounds for the dark binding will become 1 only, and this is when the enemy will not be 'stunned' (I'm guessing the helper missed at close range or something). The enemy also won't be stunned when you do a 3-hit combo like this: Standing hard punch/light punch/light kick (it works for the hard kick though!) followed by closeup fireball (total 3 hit combo). Sometimes the black thingy doesn't even appear: standing at a slight distance away from the enemy (important to find the exact distance) causes the fireball to not stun at all (no black thingy). It still stuns from far though. Only occurs for forward fireball.

3. MAJOR BUG! ONLY when right at the corner of the screen, the black thingy can be PUSHED OFF SCREEN by just walking against it (this was in beta5 too but I failed to spot it

)!!! The enemy remains stunned there but u can push the black thingy away. There is an important thing to note. The stun seems to have two phases in this new beta, because the enemy's body freezes from one position to another. Only in the first freeze position can the black thingy be pushed out of screen. If you wait a little longer till the second freeze frame, then the black thingy can't be pushed. All moves that concern this dark web (down and forward fireballs, counter) have the same problem - the web can be pushed out of screen.

4. MAJOR bug: sometimes the invisible helper (from the fireball AND counter) seems to stay on screen even after the stun. After everything seems normal, magaki's fireballs still disappear for no reason, or he gets countered and stunned by the invisible counter-move helper. Also, when magaki jumps about, he can get hit by those invisible helpers stuck on the screen even when saiki isn't doing anything. Also present in ver beta5.

5. saiki's counter move now no longer follows up with the C+D move if it connects up close O_O.

6. big bug: after enemy gets stunned by ONLY the forward fireball, and you do the grab (both grabs have problems) move on them, the positioning of the enemy during the grab gets messed up (test it to see what i mean; it looks like saiki is grabbing their feet). There are 2 conditions to activate this bug: First, only the forward fireball must be used; second, the forward fireball must hit from a semi-long distance (and sometimes semi distance has no stun...) and the grab performed after. The 2-hit combo up close or full screen-length fireball stun doesn't seem to have this positioning problem for the grab, no idea why... or maybe it does but the bug didn't appear? Only the .csn will tell!

Minor Improvements :

1. one thing I realised is: the 2 hit combo for the fireball up close is special in that the handswipe has a knockback effect, not a stun. I went to observe this in KOFXIII, and the enemy appears to be hit upward/backward, then he gets caught by the fireball and is stunned back to the ground. It all appears very fluid in the game, but your saiki has a slight pause at the handswipe hit... wonder if that can be corrected. Do make sure that the knock back cancels all movement still, else enemies can block the fireball after the handswipe. If it can't be corrected then the current animation is still great!

2. the forward fireball's clsn AT THE FRONT (behind is ok because it might miss when upclose) needs to be smaller lol, else it looks like the fireball explodes without touching the enemy.

3. I tweaked the sweepkick's (statedef 240) range to x=30, followed by -10, -10, -10, and accordingly tweaked QCF+a's reach (Statedef 1610). I changed the .cmd file's 1610 activation range to x<>85 too. The range is now almost exactly like the original.

5. It appears for Saiki's counter move, removing the clsn from the .air file is not a good idea. Your other character Hattori was able to run through him while he did his counter, and some moves just appear to go through him and not get countered sometimes... I think the nothitby is better still, but could that be adjusted to end earlier?

Suggestions:
1. Perhaps you could add a break-free-from-throw move for saiki (either by pressing A+B, C+D, or forward/back + button when about to be thrown, like the usual fighting games). I'm not sure what the animation is for this though... maybe it's the C+D animation? Or perhaps to make saiki even more overpowered... CAN'T BE THROWN? LOL

2. perhaps in the future you could add a function that enables us to play AS the AI saiki (like press and hold start + any button or something)

Actually beta5's dark web was pretty good already; it just failed for very few characters, and you can't expect to bind every mugen character out there as they're all different xD.

don't give up! keep trying! I'm a huge fan of bosses too!

Last Edit: August 15, 2011, 07:58:00 am by BoyBoyz

KRIZALID-2

Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta6 (update 2011-08-06)

#72 August 08, 2011, 07:00:50 pm

THE King Of Fighters

WOW finaly
it my take you long time to make it huh ?
we thank you for this work
all the best

Werewood

Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta7 (update 2011-09-05)

#73 September 05, 2011, 12:50:29 pm

Trying now to act normal

Version beta-7:

Now BoyBoyz is one of the author of this beta Saiki!

- readjusted speeds of all projectiles/helpers to 7.5 from 8.
- readjusted downward fireball explod and helper to appear at a later animelem
- adjusted downward fireball's 2nd stun phase to come later at 23 (more like original),
- changed dark binding (1099)'s projanim etc to 10001 instead of 1302.
- added another helper with the same definitions as 1007
- Fixed a bug where the stone would randomly disappear by removing the trigger1 = NumHelper(1601) = 0 in the non-AI helper.
- added the random stone throw in and increased walk and grab speed to +0.5 from +0.4.
- new knockback for fireball handswipe (ground velocity to -6, -4). Readjusted handswipe's clsn and priority, and reduced hit range to animelem 21.
- Adjusted handswipe such that you can only do 2 handswipe combos up close (exceptions like juggernaut etc with huge clsn boxes), before having to move forward to try again due to the pushback and pausetimes (12,12).
- adjusted C+D's ground velocity (-5.5, -4) to push enemy further like in original, and animtype = Hard
- new fireball (for both forward and downward) stun animation with 2 stun phases; fireball now travels faster forwards. New fireball also eats all fireballs including magaki's white orb. No duplicate sounds. Always stuns.
- fixed walk and grab positioning, fixed grab bug, movespeed (adjusted to +0.4), and clsn reach
- added nothitby to counter move, adjusted activation range for C+D, adjusted ctrlset animelem to 33, fixed some bugs, added damage to counter succession but kill=0
- added nothitby to qcb+ x/y (reversal move) to balance out the 'nerf' in counter move (personal preference)
- added nothitbys to fireball p1 starting sequence (to get rid of a bug where if saiki got hit before fireball landed, fireball would disappear or dark web wouldn't appear)
- fixed counter helper staying on screen by adjusting destroyself to animelem = 21. With that, also readjusted all the destroyself and nothitby to 21
- fixed dark web (statedef 1099) being pushed off screen by changing move physics to S
- Made A+B roll time faster (more like original)
- legsweep (strongkick adjusted to reach 30), qcf+a adjusted accordingly
- Fixed inability to block second stun phase (darkweb appearing) by adding a trigger = MoveGuarded to changeanim for statedef 1001. BUT this results in the bug below.
- Since I used beta5 model, the random stone throw thing is gone. Instead, I adjusted the stonethrow to hit enemy into the air, but fall=0 so they'll land on their feet.
- Tweaked jump height (jump.neu = -11.2) and speed (yaccel = 0.55), and adjusted landing/turning speed in .air
- Adjusted fireball's clsn to prevent misses in the air and no darkwebs.
- fixed certain fall/air.fall/forcenofall stuffs for handswipe (statedef 999/1302)
- Adjusted the numhit of some moves to 0, so the combo counter would display accurately
- fixed guardspark bug by adding removeexplod with removetime=20 to both fireballs (1001 and 1002 helpers)
- reworked forward fireball, so that when it hits enemy in the air, state 1888 (freeze) does not happen first; instead, enemy falls to ground, then the second stun activates the freeze. This is exactly like in original. The downward fireball needs more work still though.
- reworked fireballs' groundtype (High then Low vice versa) and ground velocity to make it look more like original.
- removed fireball's juggletime so the combo counter would count infinitely
- Reworked fireball pausetime and groundvelocity so that if handswipe hits, enemy will be stuck in air; but hitting with another fireball allows them to land due to air.velocity = 2 and forenofall = 1
- reworked darkweb (1099)'s air.fall to 1, fall to 0, forcenofall to 0, so that when hit into air by the handswipe, enemy will fall to floor after stun ends, while if just stunned by the fireball, enemy will land on feet after stun ends (does not work for some characters with too small or weird clsn boxes like KOFXII iori)
- Fixed dark web so that when you go behind the stunned enemy and stun him with 2-hitcombo up close, his stunned back will face you still. However, if you make him land with a 1-hit fireball, he will face you.
- Fixed a bug where if enemy was web-binded in the air, another fireball would cause stun to miss
- Reworked standing strong punch to Medium animtype and C+D to hard instead of diagup. Fixed more velocities (ground and air) of handswipe and C+D
- implemented 1302 (counter's helper) for all fireball helpers, so they won't miss (in the air especially) or look awkward (with another fireball coming out)
- Created trigger = command = "Qcf_y" for forward fireball to fade. Until a better solution is found, this will do

- Reworked 3 sounds (makeshift commands):
1. (1300,1) when Saiki's countermove connects into C+D (movetype = H, AnimTime = 0 && p2dist x <= 74)
2. (1300,0) when saiki's counter fails to hit anything (p2movetype = A && movecontact = 0, animelem = 24)
3. When Saiki's counter connects successfully (p2movetype = H, animtime = -40). This isn't the correct command. When enemy is stunned, just doing another counter move makes saiki say this voice again, which isn't right.

And here I officially give a challenge to any MUGEN Pros -- do a better versions of all my current and future MUGEN stuff -- but don't use my materials. I don't need you to like the mugenization choices I make; I just want you to have the guts to accept my challenge. This is the only way to make me stop releasing half-assed MUGEN stuff and the only way to make me shut up. 8)

P.S. Oh I think I should post my official MUGEN Pros challenge in other fourms...............let me think think which ones.......

Hey I am not trying to argue; I really want someone can make better versions of my MUGEN stuff because I alone don't have the skill and time to do so.

And, I don't get upset at all by my solid MLM spirit, I am just getting angry because some human beings here are 200% wrong about me.

And, yes, I need to defend newbies, especially myself. The more they attack, then more I defend myself. 8)

I don't need credits; I don't need praises; I don't need unhealthy feedbacks; I don't need hit counts; I don't need attentions; I don't need dramas; I don't need shit; I only want to have all characters & stages perfectly done by gods that I want to make and leech.

* Pleasing other people is nice, but when creating for Mugen, you're supposed to please yourself first. -- Cybaster

Last Edit: September 05, 2011, 01:43:29 pm by Werewood

Baby Bonnie Hood

Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta7 by Werewood & BoyBoyz (update 2011-09-05)

#74 September 06, 2011, 04:42:20 am

Cute Bounty Hunter

Werewood said, September 05, 2011, 12:50:29 pm

And here I officially give a challenge to any MUGEN Pros -- do a better versions of all my current and future MUGEN stuff -- but don't use my materials. I don't need you to like the mugenization choices I make; I just want you to have the guts to accept my challenge. This is the only way to make me stop releasing half-assed MUGEN stuff and the only way to make me shut up. 8)

I wonder if anyone will actually bother. People complain about Warner's stuff, but no one ever does anything about it.

Check out my MvC3-style characters!

BoyBoyz

Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta7 by Werewood & BoyBoyz (update 2011-09-07)

#75 September 07, 2011, 09:15:52 am

Saiki beta7c by Werewood and me is here! (For those who downloaded the earliest release of 7C, you don't really need to waste your time with this small patch. Wait for beta8 or something)

*1. completely reworked counter move to 90% true to source (still missing a few original sprites). Fixed a bug regarding the C+D failing to hit after counter connected. Also reworked it such that if saiki managed to get hit, he would stun the enemy but not do the C+D if it's out of range.

*2. Fixed all darkweb changeanims to disappear on hit!

*3. Balanced counter move to only cancel projectiles but not stun enemy from far. Super counter's command changed, and damage increased, else it isn't a super.

*4. Sounds for counter move are totally accurate, with 3 implemented phases so all 3 sounds can be heard properly.

*5. Fixed air fireball not exploding when it touched ground.

6. adjusted air fireball's initial black cloud to 'on top = 1', so that the fireball will appear to come out from INSIDE the cloud, like the original. Air fireball balanced now, won't home in that fast. It can mostly be used as a followup after forward fireball hits.

7. Reworked air fireball's animation by using time = 35 for helper to appear, and adding the EXplod 1077 INSIDE the helper, so when the black cloud appears the fireball will appear regardless of saiki being hit or not. The helper's position is -205, so if you super jump you might see something weird... but this is tailored for all non-super jump maps to look aesthetically truest to source. Not for too tall characters.

8. adjusted air/forward fireball/handswipe speeds to as close to source as possible (now spammed faster and more fluently, but damage lowered)

9. Fixed some bugs with helpers disappearing wrongly. Increase jump.neu (height) to -12.5

10. Tweaked AI to use less air fireballs, use less slow motion, and use the new super counter move. Very strong AI.

---- 2 more minor fixes:
11. Fixed forward fireball's helper's clsn at the rear to be within the original fireball, so the enemy won't get 'caught' by the helper and not get stunned. (hopefully fixed. This bug occurs very rarely only)

12. Removed an AI command that told Saiki to use super jump move when enemy is/has lying/fallen on the ground, causing it to miss.

what needs to be done for 99% Saiki:

1. Need to reduce damage done per combo stack using attackmul etc.
2. The only solution for the loose dark web (statedef 1099) I found so far is by making his jump height higher -.- (temporary fix only, need a better one!)
3. There's a bug with igniz's QCB+light punch projectile, in that saiki's super counter cannot reverse it. No idea why.
4. full KOFXIII saiki sprites. (the black flame for his counter should be separately ripped from his body too)

Things not true to source (but feels better this way):
1. Stationary grab is a reversal in this version
2. Both stationary grab and walk and grab can catch air enemies in this version.
3. Super counter might not be true to source because I don't know how to perform the move in the original, but at least it's LOOKING the same now.

Please report any bugs!
http://www.mediafire.com/?qxaljic3bq4jyt5

or

http://page.freett.com/werewood/mugen.html when Werewood uploads it.

Last Edit: September 07, 2011, 03:10:37 pm by BoyBoyz

rizki29

Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta7 by Werewood & BoyBoyz (update 2011-09-05)

#76 September 07, 2011, 01:13:23 pm

Come mighty warrior face me

i have make it mvc 3 sorry not tell you but i make some bugs lost in it

BoyBoyz

Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta7 by Werewood & BoyBoyz (update 2011-09-05)

#77 September 07, 2011, 01:29:07 pm

wow cool! could you share? What bugs are there? I've tested like crazy and currently there're only about 4 known bugs; I'm real keen to find more!!

Werewood and me just want to make the best character possible. We've worked very hard in trying to root out any possible bugs, and have also narrowed down even the smallest of details from KOFXIII, so if you can help in anyway that'd be great!

Last Edit: September 07, 2011, 03:13:53 pm by BoyBoyz

rizki29

Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta7 by Werewood & BoyBoyz (update 2011-09-05)

#78 September 07, 2011, 01:53:24 pm

Come mighty warrior face me

yeah i can but maybe two days again cause there still one more i must do in this character

BoyBoyz

Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta7 by Werewood & BoyBoyz (update 2011-09-05)

#79 September 07, 2011, 02:13:54 pm

Awesomeeee. Are there sprite updates? : DD

rizki29

Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta7 by Werewood & BoyBoyz (update 2011-09-05)

#80 September 07, 2011, 02:18:39 pm

Come mighty warrior face me

yeah
-new hitspark
-new supermove
-new "mvc 3 setting"
-new bugs because mvc 3 setting =="

Links to this post

KOF XIII Saiki beta7f by Werewood & BoyBoyz (no more updates) (Read 407453 times)

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On the road to perfection

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Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta7 by Werewood & BoyBoyz (update 2011-09-05)

Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta7 by Werewood & BoyBoyz (update 2011-09-05)

Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta7 by Werewood & BoyBoyz (update 2011-09-05)

Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta7 by Werewood & BoyBoyz (update 2011-09-05)

Re: KOF XIII Saiki beta7 by Werewood & BoyBoyz (update 2011-09-05)