The Mugen Fighters Guild - Looking into creating a MUGEN game, but there are some Issues I need solved

Nintega

Looking into creating a MUGEN game, but there are some Issues I need solved

#1 June 05, 2017, 06:47:15 am

As someone who's looking into game development (esports games mainly, but I'd be willing to also develop more "Casual" Games) as a career option (either through indie games or AAA studios), I'd like to start somewhere to get a bit more experience. While I have created some stuff in the fan game Super Mario Bros X (Basically MUGEN but for 2D Mario Platformers), It's been about 4 years since then & That isn't as advanced as MUGEN looks from what I've seen. However, there are Issues/Concerns I have that I need resolved before I can comfortably start with MUGEN (other than engine confusion, which I'll get into later, but isn't as Important as the other issues, plus it'd be the 1 thing I'd need to resolve in order to get anywhere in game development)

1. Concepts have become too free: Anyone who has saw Extra Credits should get an Idea on where this is going. He says concepts are cheap yeah? Well in my case, not only are they free, but they're crowded as f**k! Throughout my 4 years of creating game concepts & trying to build on the Ideas thinking I'd be able to actually execute it in someway, it has gotten the most chaotic & crowded in 2017 than in 2016, 2015, 2014, & Mid-Late 2013 combined! Game Ideas that I look to expand upon keep coming & going left & right non stop & It's to the point where I just want the concepts to stop coming yet they do more than the opposite! It's likely related to my recent interests in eSports that started with Competitive Smash & other Platform Fighters that slowly went into other genres through late 2016 & now has gotten me in thanks to Capcom Cup 2016 & Spring LoL esports this year. For Fangame Engines like SMBX & of course, MUGEN, there are so many applicable concepts that it actually creates a situation where I can't even decide on what the crap to actually go with! For MUGEN, I know I wanna use Capcom Characters, but that's where the ideas sort of stop. Now there are goals I'd like to make for the game such as making Roll Viable or even Top Tier, & getting a competitive scene going, but deciding exactly the game I'd want to work on that'd fit those goals is pretty tricky for me as of now.

2. Concerns with Production Capabilities: Specifically, what the engine can allow. Lots of MUGEN games just go outright ridiculous in terms of how the game is played. When I see a 4v4 all characters on point at the same time match, That gets a bit too insane, & at the cost of production quality, If it's even possible to do it like that. So far the only MUGEN game I can say has good production is Hyper Dragon Ball Z, & even then, the sprites are a bit shotty, & the roster is small, even compared to MvC1. A goal I have for whatever my MUGEN game would be is to make it look & feel like an official game. Megaman Fan Games, AM2R, & even SMBX showed me that Fan Games with great production are possible. But so far, almost no luck with MUGEN games. The Question is, is good, official production not possible, or are the devs of these games just lazy? Note, when I say production, I'm talking about things like fluidity, cleanliness, & even some original content (Characters, Stages, Music, etc, that aren't in the official games). Most MUGEN games I see are just either huge character compilations, team hell games (like 4v4 all on point games), or any combination of the 2. They're not necessary, & it doesn't give me a good outlook on what MUGEN games can be. Not to say I wouldn't do anything unique, but It'd be more in the realm of what official fighting games would do, rather than just going nuts with what the engine can allow. So far, the only good MUGEN game I've seen so far is Hyper Dragon Ball Z, which in terms of production & sanity, is acceptable. It looks enough like an official fighting game, & while it does have mechanics that players can deem fun, it doesn't go intergalactic levels of crazy. I might be sounding like a no fun, all comp kind of guy, but to give you a better Idea, UMvC3 is crazy, but not to the point where I'm like "Stop. Calm It". Wish I had a better way of describing that, but point is, I want my MUGEN game to feel like a Legit Fighting Game, no matter what it resembles (other than the broken fucking mess that is Marvel 2, or the unpredictable Street Fighter 5 Season 2).

3. Attracting a Competitive Playerbase: Another thing I haven't found any luck on seeing in MUGEN games. I haven't found a single MUGEN game's competitive scene as of yet. Maybe I just haven't looked hard enough, but considering that I'd love to keep my game balanced for a competitive scene to enjoy, There needs a competitive scene to balance around in the 1st place. Best I can ask is, what MUGEN game currently has the biggest & most successful competitive scene, & how big is it? I'm not expecting on the levels of like Smash 4 or Injustice 2, but at least something that'll have it's players wanting to improve at the game & discussing the balance of the game, how it can be played, & what they want to see in the future of the game's life.

I'll probably get into "engine confusion" in a reply to this, but for now, I just wanted to get the big 3 out of the way. Hopefully there are good answers to all 3 & I can start comfortably as a result. & Hey, if you'd like to join development for whatever I'd be working on, hit me up & we can work it out.

Memo

Re: Looking into creating a MUGEN game, but there are some Issues I need solved

#2 June 05, 2017, 06:58:52 am

Estoy siempre listo para un desafío.

Go on shoryuken.com and start a topic about competitive
Mugen games and see what those guys tell you.

Theres not alot of full created games, theres much more
User created content for people to just build they're own
Custom mugen roster.

And that 4vs4 crap, maybe 5 outta 10 people play like that
And I've yet to see it included in a full game.

HDBZ sprites look shotty? Can you sprite any better dude?
I think they look great compared to other custom made
Sprites, team Z2 are doing great and things like "presentation"
Not looking professional is part of mugens limitations,
Cant do much with the engine.

HDBZ rosters not even finished is work in progress

Ethan The Human

Re: Looking into creating a MUGEN game, but there are some Issues I need solved

#3 June 05, 2017, 08:31:42 am

"Get up, it's too early for you to be defeated!!"

If you want to make a really good, competitive, polished fighting game in any engine, it's gonna take a very, very long time for each character, so I wouldn't say it's lazy to have a small character roster. If you want to make a game that looks and feels like a classic CAPCOM game in the 90's, then Mugen was made for people just like you! I have no doubt that if you put enough time and dedication into learning Mugen, you'll get your straight-from-the-arcade fighting game you want. If you have the means to get art for custom characters, stages, music, etc. that FEEL like they come from a CAPCOM game, then you can code them to play like they do too, but I doubt you'll get too far on that end without commissioning someone or making the assets yourself.

Hyper DBZ (probably) has the biggest competitive scene, and their Discord has many discussions about balance and competitive play, but there are often tournamets for other MUGEN games on the Ikemen discord too!

Also maybe you just don't like the art style or something (I didn't either a long time ago) but HDBZ has some of the best sprites I've ever seen so I don't really agree with you on that end.

Also if you feel like Mugen is limited in some way, I could recommend waiting for that Unreal Fighter 2D template to come out, as that looks very promising!

Hardcore Palette and Color Separation enthusiast

Nintega

Re: Looking into creating a MUGEN game, but there are some Issues I need solved

#4 June 06, 2017, 07:28:50 am

Ethan The Human said, June 05, 2017, 08:31:42 am

If you want to make a really good, competitive, polished fighting game in any engine, it's gonna take a very, very long time for each character, so I wouldn't say it's lazy to have a small character roster. If you want to make a game that looks and feels like a classic CAPCOM game in the 90's, then Mugen was made for people just like you! I have no doubt that if you put enough time and dedication into learning Mugen, you'll get your straight-from-the-arcade fighting game you want. If you have the means to get art for custom characters, stages, music, etc. that FEEL like they come from a CAPCOM game, then you can code them to play like they do too, but I doubt you'll get too far on that end without commissioning someone or making the assets yourself.

Hyper DBZ (probably) has the biggest competitive scene, and their Discord has many discussions about balance and competitive play, but there are often tournamets for other MUGEN games on the Ikemen discord too!

Also maybe you just don't like the art style or something (I didn't either a long time ago) but HDBZ has some of the best sprites I've ever seen so I don't really agree with you on that end.

Also if you feel like Mugen is limited in some way, I could recommend waiting for that Unreal Fighter 2D template to come out, as that looks very promising!

About the Unreal 2D template, exactly what is it? I know about Unreal Engine, but what is the template gonna allow? & Does it allow for both sprites & 3D models, or just 1 of them?