Saisyu Released!

[Umezono]

@[user id=26079]Vans[/user]:  Your life's work seems to be based entirely on disassembling Neo Geo games, so you should do it.  I personally have no interest in consoles that were only successful in countries that didn't matter. 

You were already being an ignorant asshole, then you had to blow it completely with the xenophobia.

[Jmorphman]

I'm not being a dick, I'm just stating the obvious.  Most of the people who made MUGEN stuff have almost no programming background, and I say most, I mean EVERYONE who has contributed, be it PotS or those people who tack on MKvSF hitsparks and screw up the combo system of Mortal Kombat characters.  It's kinda like the whole theory on how the N64 was developed; since it would be tricky to use, that would require serious effort from the developers, thus minimizing the amount of trash.  Unfortunately for Nintendo, the N64 has neither quality or quantity. 

In short, if this guy was a programming genius, he would been able to do a better job than what he did here.

@[user id=26079]Vans[/user]:  Your life's work seems to be based entirely on disassembling Neo Geo games, so you should do it.  I personally have no interest in consoles that were only successful in countries that didn't matter. 

How about you calm down on the ad hominems, hmm?

[TTTTTsd]

Hell, I'd rather fulfill my dream of making my very own Neo Geo game if that was the case.

I like how he said this and then went "NAH I'M NOT INTERESTED IN FAILED CONSOLES LIKE THE NEOGEO." What the hell

[Aldo]

He isn´t making any sense... and then he replies in an asshole-ish way saying "countries that don´t matter". Bad, bad.

[vicmugen]

Most of the people who made MUGEN stuff have almost no programming background

Probably true for many creators, but not all . I know some who actually have such programming knowlegde, some of them wander around here to.

Sorry to say ,  but you are mistaken.

[Cybaster]

It's really sad that Scal, Winane, Bea, Byakko, Insanius, me and many others have good knowledge of C++/C#/Java or whatever, puts the whole theory in the grave.

I personally have no interest in consoles that were only successful in countries that didn't matter. 

Proud American is proud of his country. Heil Bush !!! God bless Prism !!!

[Umezono]

yo cmon cybaster, you are just taking the bait and stooping to his level.

[Cybaster]

Nah, I'm just making sure this topic gets splitted quickly so we can resume discussing about Saisyu instead of this troll.

[Jmorphman]

Well generally we want to try to avoid splitting things, so we ask all our users to behave and stay on topic.

but I'm sure I'll be splitting this sooner or later

[Vans]

@[user id=26079]Vans[/user]:  Your life's work seems to be based entirely on disassembling Neo Geo games, so you should do it.  I personally have no interest in consoles that were only successful in countries that didn't matter. 

I'm sorry but you have genuinely pissed me off because I find this incredibly offensive.

You don't know anything about me or my life's work. The only people with the right to judge my MUGEN work are those who have spent the time to understand what it's like or why I do the things I do.

My goal with this hobby was pushing MUGEN's limits as far as I could, to prove it could be used to produce content that rivals that of original games. If that requires research then so be it.

So please kindly fuck off and keep your racism to yourself.

[21stFighter]

Saisyu could use some improvement with the bugs listed, but I think for this guy's first time making a character play this way, he didn't do too bad.

Everyone can't get it right off the bat the first time around, or even the 2nd or 3rd....

If you have the knowledge to help, then why not help the guy out, list the bugs and encourage.... All the other unnecessary comments aren't going to help make the character play any better...

Some creators have released numerous characters in the past and when they did, they didn't play like accurate source. It took time and effort for them to finally find out what works and what doesn't to get their characters playing how they should play.

Different people have different techniques as to achieving this. Some go the route of getting source game play data, some improve over time with release after release....We all learn differently.....

Keep in mind that, at one point some of us were new to mugen and we didn't always have the knowledge as some of the pros do now. Heck I've been doing stuff since '07 and I'm still learning.

Not knocking anyone that doesn't code mugen characters at all, but I give most people (not all) some kind of credit for at least taking the time to try and make something for mugen, because there are still a lot of people who don't know how to make anything for mugen, nor do they care to. It doesn't mean that just because they make something automatically I say +1, but keep in mind that what they made may be not so great now, but months or years down the road they can become one of the best creators we have in mugen. And there are people at mugen guild right now that are prime examples of this.

Well said, R@CE!

[Laharl]

personally I don't care about the effort if the result is bad :/. You could work day in and day out and still get a shitty result, your effort means nothing. if the result is good then it matters. as for this char hes not bad im not familiar with saisyu all that well so idk how he SHOULD play but hes a keeper imo.

[Aldo]

Sorry to say but besides that being completely off-topic that logic is terrible. How do you know that effort are worthy or worthless in the first try??  it is the learning process that matters, getting feedback and learning from your mistakes in order to turn something bad into something good. Sorry, but you brain farted there

[Niitris]

I'm glad we're kinda back on topic. So here's what I've found (some of it's probably been repeated).

• Liedown time is entirely too long (8-12 is good in most cases).
• Command for FwdDash is too strict and comes out as Run more often than it should.
• BackDash isn't right (doesn't move far back enough).
• The first hit of 100 Shiki can be blocked in the air... this isn't supposed to happen (since he hasn't left the ground yet).
• HitBox for F+HP is too far forward (he can hit from a longer range than he should).
• No Canceling from a Dodge Attack... when a Dodge Attack (that doesn't knock down) hits in KoF/CvS, you can cancel into a special move.
• For Geshiki: Goutsui, it's an overhead. Since it's a 6-button character (inspired from CvS2), the command should be F+MP (doesn't have to be but it would honor the 6-button scheme of Capcom)
• Geshiki: Goutsui can be blocked in the air... not supposed to happen.
• Contact box for 108 Shiki (projectile) is too high... it shouldn't be able to collide with Sagat's Tiger Shot.

... im not familiar with saisyu all that well so idk how he SHOULD play...

Not to make light of your opinion, but those who are more familiar would naturally have a better idea of what's "right or wrong"

Not being able to destroy projectiles with his QCB+P special move is a disappointment, incorrect (based on common KoF & CvS conventions), and is indicative of either being lazy with code (something I fell into a lot), not doing enough research, or both. Same for the fact that he can't cancel a Dodge Attack into a special move (something that should be able to be done).

I'm sure these were just simple oversights... those can happen to anyone (that's why learning things is fun).

A good or bad creation is subjective, and depends on the standards of of the tester. I don't think is god-awful (for intermediate MUGEN coding standards)... at least it obeys most standard 2D fighting nuances (which is more than I can say for most of the stuff that's out there), but it does need refinement. If this was a final release, it would be quite underwhelming imo (fortunately it's not I presume).

[Laharl]

Sorry to say but besides that being completely off-topic that logic is terrible. How do you know that effort are worthy or worthless in the first try??  it is the learning process that matters, getting feedback and learning from your mistakes in order to turn something bad into something good. Sorry, but you brain farted there

its not off topic at all, also theres no brain fart that is how I feel. I agree feedback is important but the fact is ppl say "well they put effort in" why does that matter if the result is bad? (not applying here) just saying.