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Street Fighter - General Brainstorming topic - (Read 169980 times)

Started by FeLo_Llop, March 19, 2014, 12:13:32 am
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JustNoPoint

Re: Street Fighter
#101  March 27, 2014, 07:26:51 pm
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I figure I'll do most of the sff, air, CLSN creation, etc

I could even probably get that info from CVS2 if I wanted to do so thanks to XGargoyle's  tutorial Not sure if I'll be that anal about it though :P

varo_hades

Re: Street Fighter
#102  March 27, 2014, 10:55:44 pm
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Very promising project, I think the gameplay is a lot of work but well if you decide like that, I can help with my color separations(I did color separation of pots Ryu the pants and belt) and probably coding, If someone adapt the coding of my chars with your system(because I make chars like pots style).
For the plot I like that all games of street fighter the canon part, you consider alt. versions of chars like Sodom Final Fight and Sodom Street Fighter, or Chun-li Street Fighter Zero and Chun-li Street Fighter 2. And well I like to see Shin Bison in Capcom vs Snk graphic (only need to add the cape).
For the plot of Street Fighter games I recommend separate Street Fighter Zero 2 and Street Fighter Zero 3, Street Fighter Second Impact and Street Fighter Third Strike, Street Fighter 4 and Ultra Street Fighter 4, because is not the same story is the direct continue and well this is my proposed:

Street Fighter 1
-Ryu
-Ken(probably with appearance of Street Fighter Zero saga for the plot of course)
-Sagat(I think the color separation of DivineWolf is enough for hide the scar)

Street Fighter Zero 2
-Rose
-Dan
-Shin Akuma(Is not the final boss of all characters, but is one secret boss of all characters if you follow some requeriments)

Street Fighter Zero 3
-R. Mika
-Karin
-Shin Bison

Street Fighter 2
-Chun-li
-Guile
-Akuma(Normal not shin)

Street fighter 4
-C. Viper
-Zangief
-ShinGouken(Is a secret final boss very similar of Akuma of Street Fighter 2, and the difference of normal gouken is more powerfull and a little change of palette)

Ultra Street Fighter 4
-Juri
-Decapre
-Seth

Street Fighter 3 Second Impact
-Alex
-Ibuki
-Gill

Street Fighter 3 Third Strike
-Dudley
-Sean
-Q(Secret boss of all characters like Shin Akuma of Street Fighter Zero 2)

And you can consider one section of Final Fight
-Guy
-Poison
-Sodom(Because he was a boss in the Final Fight original)
And probably add more Final Fighters, even characters that not appeared like Haggar, Damnd, Abigail,etc.

And for the rest of Street Fighter 1 characters the sprites exist in cvs style Geki, Joe, Mike, Retsu and Lee only need complete the sprites.
Open to commisions or if you wanna give a donation I appreciate.
https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_s-xclick&hosted_button_id=MVVTGXPXYA9NN
My channel on youtube
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With the links of my chars
My site with my chars and my color separations:
https://varohades.wixsite.com/varohadesmugen
Subscribe to my Twitch and nice chars will come:
https://www.twitch.tv/varo_hadesgameplays

FeLo_Llop

Re: Street Fighter
#103  March 27, 2014, 11:06:33 pm
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- About RYU: we just need a list of what's missing in that sheet and translating it into pixels. Thinks as that dynamic recovery, that kick opener/ linker (to tatsumaki, as shown in Balthazar's link about the SF2M).

- Electro Shock: Don't stare at me like that but...YES, this definitively needs that animation. Everyone from SFZ and SF3 has it(even a bit different--yellow aura!). Also, my Rose and Viper have it as in SF3(without that BAM! FLAT YELLOW!!). Also, erased it from DJ and Karin(teasing teasing!). Anyway, it's up to you...if you prefer as in SFZ(with that yellow), then so be it. If as in SF3: I WILL LOVE YOU ALL FOREVER AND EVER.

- Sagat: I know Armenti's work is awesome. VERY awesome. But that Sagat lacks something that Sagat IS: someone to be affraid off. Armentis' Sagat smiles. And directly coming from SvC, or SlenderMan on steroids. You can't compare to Chamat's and Chucho's work:
http://mugen.wikia.com/wiki/Sagat  <----Now, THAT'S impressive. Big, massive. Menacing. I'd say, just keep his size as it is in that SF3 conversion. He's a giant, after all(as Hugo). He doesn't needs a resizing into CvS values.
It just need a palete similar to CvS Values. I'll try it later or tomorrow morning. Showing it's a must.

- Effects: I'd say...for saving time, CvS. Or if someone can make some sexy and awesome FX from SFZ(I guess...someone converted them, but I'm not sure) would be cool too. I'm totally terrible at this.

- Now that we are speaking about effects...how many of you remember the BURN state from SF2(also the PSYCHO BURN)? I thought it can have a place here, maybe putting it above the gethit of the character while falling(with transparencies and sexy treatment). Or the same, but making a single custom sprite for the character. I mean, in SF2, everyone shared the same burn figure. Even Zangief, who's big as Hell and etc. Here it would need a resize for the fire figure. Did a try, it's around...30 seconds :P. Unfortunately, I'm terrible doing FX. Your choice.

- TAG/ Dramattic Battle: I'd say YEAH. FUCK YEAH. But maybe not in the begining. Why not implementing it in next stages?


I swear there was something cool here!!

JustNoPoint

Re: Street Fighter
#104  March 28, 2014, 04:19:14 am
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Alex Sinigaglia said, March 27, 2014, 05:11:36 pm
I would really like to join in this project, but with chat option what do you mean? I'm also not registered in Google +, but I'm very active here so there's that.
It's fine. It won't be a requirement. Just when we start working on certain things it might be easier to pull up a chat window. Consider yourself joined. I want this to be open to anyone that wishes to participate.

Balthazar said, March 27, 2014, 06:24:10 pm
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Yeah I agree. I would love dramatic battle type stuff but to start with we won't put much thought into team battle.
I like this move list!
Where is his f+MP overhead punch? ;_;

I think we should try to come up with at least 3 super moves. Since you select the super it shouldn't over complicate things too much. Denjin could work. The MAX version could be ERyu's from CVS2 where it charges faster.

A third/fourth one could also be Evil Ryu mode. Where you turn into Evil Ryu for a short time. Lose EX moves but gain the dive kick, horizontal air hurricane kick, teleport, Shakunetsu Hadouken, Messatsu Gou Shouryuu, and Shun Goku Satsu

More specific replies coming tomorrow. Help me keep this somewhat active over the weekends. I work Sat, Sun, and Mondays 12 hour shifts so I won't get to do a lot on those days.
Last Edit: March 28, 2014, 04:24:42 am by Just No Point

MS_Todd

Re: Street Fighter
#105  March 28, 2014, 05:43:25 am
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Uh, this is more like a personal opinion, but i think ryu shouldn't have a evil ryu transformation. What about a new kind of morphing, something far from the "evil" stuff?

Reason: In SFIV Gouken seals the evil intent from Ryu, so he can develope his own "final form" in terms of a inner's higher power. So, if we have a "evil" ansatsuken (akuma) and a "godish" ansatsuken (gouken), ryu could stand as a more neutral OR good (if you want to put Gouken in a "more neutral" char) ansatsuken warrior.

And also because i hate that evil crap. Is so childish and monotone. :)

I would want to help, but only if you need a writer or a beta tester. When is not on the cybaster stage creator tool, my mugen skills are zero to none XD

Greetings!

Balthazar

Re: Street Fighter
#106  March 28, 2014, 08:24:16 am
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I would not bother with transformations, period. There's really no need for them.
Especially if Akuma will join the roster later, Evil Ryu mode is just a flashy tack-on we don't need. It just overcomplicates things and as mentioned many times, we should really focus on ground work first, setting up the overall system we want to work with.

Denjin Hadouken as a 3rd Super should be fine. It adds the shock&stun feature which is interesting.
He never really needed the Shinkuu Tatsumaki super ever since that became his EX Tatsumaki.
Speaking of Tatsu's, Ryu should probably have this version
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
with Ken getting the classic Tatsu, just to differenciate things even more. Sean was going to add this Tatsu to his CvstW Ryu but I dont think that's happened yet. Not quite fond of the final axe kick though, the little spin at the end is kind of lame. But that can be reworked later, not a big deal right now.

Overhead Punch became his Guard Break attack, like it was in SF EX (though there the animation was quite different where he did a step forward and BAM). You didn't respond to my suggestion of pre-fight selectable EX specials, I think that will be a great addition.
Last Edit: March 28, 2014, 08:37:55 am by Balthazar

FeLo_Llop

Re: Street Fighter
#107  March 28, 2014, 11:35:26 am
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- Ryu/E. Ryu: Having Gouki, somehow "invalidates" E. Ryu, but there are people who likes this mode...:/(I'm not a fan). There's also a way to include this in:

- BACKGROUND STORY: SF's canon is a mess. Period. Ono(?) says that every SF happens in its own universe/dimension. OK...why if something(call it Pandora, Psycho Power, Ingrid's Power-the same-, whatever power) merges all the dimensions in one? Normal and evil/EX versions could be able to be in the place(sharing slot and whatnot). Ryu-E.Ryu, etc. I've got something in mind:

Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty

- Armentis Ryu:  I say that it's the best sprite sheet around. YES. But it's "a bit" colour messed. There are some sprites where the belt has ONE tone, other has THREE, other shares the darkest colour of hair...so, it got a lot more of work than I expected D: . I'll take a closer look as soon as finish Viper(missing: Ultra 2, Intro 1, Intro 2, kara throw. Also, speciffic stuff for this project, if so).
 
I swear there was something cool here!!

JustNoPoint

Re: Street Fighter
#108  March 28, 2014, 03:49:45 pm
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Balthazar said, March 28, 2014, 08:24:16 am
I would not bother with transformations, period. There's really no need for them.
Especially if Akuma will join the roster later, Evil Ryu mode is just a flashy tack-on we don't need. It just overcomplicates things and as mentioned many times, we should really focus on ground work first, setting up the overall system we want to work with.
Evil Ryu has been in SEVERAL games at this point though. It'd be odd for him not to show up in one form or another. I'd rather it be as a super art than not have him at all. That being said this super could be of much lower priority so we move on to something else and come back to add it later on.

Quote
Denjin Hadouken as a 3rd Super should be fine. It adds the shock&stun feature which is interesting.
He never really needed the Shinkuu Tatsumaki super ever since that became his EX Tatsumaki.
Speaking of Tatsu's, Ryu should probably have this version
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
with Ken getting the classic Tatsu, just to differenciate things even more. Sean was going to add this Tatsu to his CvstW Ryu but I dont think that's happened yet. Not quite fond of the final axe kick though, the little spin at the end is kind of lame. But that can be reworked later, not a big deal right now.
It's hard to get away from the classic. It feels like it may change how Ryu feels a lot. I've always thought it reminded me of Dan's gale kick too. I'm not saying "no" just that I'm feeling iffy on it =p

Quote
Overhead Punch became his Guard Break attack, like it was in SF EX (though there the animation was quite different where he did a step forward and BAM). You didn't respond to my suggestion of pre-fight selectable EX specials, I think that will be a great addition.
I really like the regular overhead though. I'll fight you for this one!!! Can we make his guard breaker the F+HP from SFA? The elbow dash?
As for the selectable EX attacks? I missed that for some reason. But TBH I like having all my super arts too :P And having to choose your EX is a bit of overkill IMO. Too many things to choose before a battle. (I'd like to choose colors before battle as well) Oh that reminds me. We'll have to make 2 versions won't we? You hate mugen 1.0 so some features will not work for winmugen like pal select before match. Darn it. Now I have to DL winmugen too! >:-(

Oh before I forget. I had a thought. The guard break probably won't be very useful with the block meter. But if we make it shatter some of the guard meter as if it was a guard crush it might make it more useful. (In SFA when you crush a guard the bar reduces in length)

Byakko

Re: Street Fighter
#109  March 28, 2014, 03:59:43 pm
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Just No Point said, March 28, 2014, 03:49:45 pm
But if we make it shatter some of the guard meter as if it was a guard crush it might make it more useful. (In SFA when you crush a guard the bar reduces in length)
In SFZ, you have to hit a guarding opponent many times before getting to the guard crush state and reducing the guard meter. If the Guard Break does that in one attack, that guard gauge will be very short lived. It should probably put in guard crash state without reducing the guard gauge's overall size, but still decreasing its current amount by a fair share (as if hitting them several times without causing guard crush). It'd still be faster than hitting with regular attacks, but you'd still have to do it several times for each gauge reduction, and you(d still get the advantage of actually breaking the opponent's guard.
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JustNoPoint

Re: Street Fighter
#110  March 28, 2014, 04:02:34 pm
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Right. Instant shatter may be a bit too OP Thanks for the feedback!

Balthazar

Re: Street Fighter
#111  March 28, 2014, 04:02:50 pm
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Hah well yeah not a fan of Winmugen, but a community project like this is for the greater good, so I wouldn't be TOO upset if it's 1.0 only....maybe a little. I know 1.0 is a bit easier for most coders to work with. But yeah if anything, the 1.0-only features can be added at the very end (like pal selection since that doesn't influence gameplay at all).

As for the Guard Breaks, ALL of them were overhead animations, so I don't think Ryu's elbow dash (which is straight, to the midsection) will be suitable. But like I said, the Guard Break animation for Ryu is quite different from his regular f+MP animation, so he can probably have both.
Here is his Guard Break (though for this game it would need to be recorded for tracing when he performs it on the left side, p1 side, ofc):
Spoiler, click to toggle visibilty
Guard Break shattering a portion of the Guard Meter sounds fine to me too (like, it breaks a section of the guage off, making it shorter for the rest of the fight).

Retaining the classic Tatsu won't be a big deal for me either, either version is fine with me (I'm just trying to push as many SF EX features forward since I love that game :P)

To DKDC, the Guard Break attack costs 1 supermeter lv and it's very slow, I don't think it should be nerfed so much, since it'll be easy to knock the attack out of the animation. That said, in SF EX3, did did make it meterless. But I can't stress enough; SCREW SF EX3, that game was shit and I hate it with a mild passion. EX1/2 is where it's at.
Last Edit: March 28, 2014, 04:05:51 pm by Balthazar

rednavi -RETIRED

Re: Street Fighter
#112  March 28, 2014, 04:03:52 pm
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You don't really want to develop both a 1.0 and winmugen version of the game. Stick with one engine.
     Posted: March 28, 2014, 04:10:59 pm
I think you guys are getting the concept behind the guard crush attack wrong. Is not a "guard crush" attack really, it's just an unblockable strike that stuns the opponent for a short time. You don't really have to consider it while designing the guard meter behavior. You can just keep it like SFA3 AND keep the guard crush attack as it was in SFEX2 and nothing changes. You NEVER "block" the attack, it's unblockable. You're not getting guard crushed, you're just unable to block that particular strike.

JustNoPoint

Re: Street Fighter
#113  March 28, 2014, 04:11:54 pm
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Balthazar said, March 28, 2014, 04:02:50 pm
Hah well yeah not a fan of Winmugen, but a community project like this is for the greater good, so I wouldn't be TOO upset if it's 1.0 only....maybe a little. I know 1.0 is a bit easier for most coders to work with. But yeah if anything, the 1.0-only features can be added at the very end (like pal selection since that doesn't influence gameplay at all).

Yeah we could try to do that. I just wanted to be sure you could play and enjoy the game you seem to be investing so much into =p If you're okay with 1.0 only that would really make things simpler because I have no idea what all is 1.0 exclusive besides the pal thing and ai. Man it'll make it so much easier to make an AI too!
     Posted: March 28, 2014, 04:13:54 pm
-Red- said, March 28, 2014, 04:03:52 pm
I think you guys are getting the concept behind the guard crush attack wrong. Is not a "guard crush" attack really, it's just an unblockable strike that stuns the opponent for a short time. You don't really have to consider it while designing the guard meter behavior. You can just keep it like SFA3 AND keep the guard crush attack as it was in SFEX2 and nothing changes. You NEVER "block" the attack, it's unblockable. You're not getting guard crushed, you're just unable to block that particular strike.
I know. But since it's so slow and costs meter and is easy to be knocked out of I figured it could be adapted a bit differently and buffed using the guard crush system.

rednavi -RETIRED

Re: Street Fighter
#114  March 28, 2014, 04:18:48 pm
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There are many small differences. Even down to how hitpauses work like (It's glitched in winmugen), and it's the superior engine, it's damn stable. I don't want to go back to the winmugen days where you would get random crashes all the time, and had to use .ogg files to avoid music skipping or had to use .adx files to have looping music. It's a nightmare everywhere.

Is not just a matter of "hey let's add pal selection at the end" to adapt them from one engine to another. You have to keep tons of things in mind for that. It's pretty much impossible if you want to have a big community project with many coders.

Balthazar

Re: Street Fighter
#115  March 28, 2014, 04:22:59 pm
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1.0 it is then ;)
My beef with 1.0 is for purely aesthetic reasons, I am not denying it's programming-superiority.

rednavi -RETIRED

Re: Street Fighter
#116  March 28, 2014, 06:08:38 pm
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I thought you had a problem with how the sound works like :P

FeLo_Llop

Re: Street Fighter
#117  March 28, 2014, 08:14:58 pm
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That's very interesting...a move that can break a guard :3

Now...I DLed Armentis' sheet of Ryu and opened it with Photoshop just for...watching the belt problem he told me about.

Belt...problem? Belt, hair, gloves, skin, dogi...it was a colour mess. There was nearly 60 colours. After messing with the mess, I've downgraded them to 26(transparency included). But, why do I say "mess"? Because the darkest hair tone shares colour with the darkest of the glove. Some bandana shares colours from the gloves too. Some eyes and teeth shared colours with dogi, so...

DON'T WORRY! It's now a quickie thing to fix :D!! I'll try to have that sheet fixed by this weekend or Wednesday as much.

Haave a nice day!
I swear there was something cool here!!

Balthazar

Re: Street Fighter
#118  March 28, 2014, 08:30:40 pm
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-Red- said, March 28, 2014, 06:08:38 pm
I thought you had a problem with how the sound works like :P
That too, but I guess you could file that under aestethics?

FeLo, I would advice you to play some SF EX on emulation...but sadly those 3D games don't ever really work that well on emulation (neither on Mame or PSX emus).
Sad to hear his Ryu sheet is so messy, color-wise. I still think we should just begin with CvS Ryu sprites, perhaps later swap the animations out with Armentis' Ryu sprites once those are fixed (+ missing animations filled in).

FeLo_Llop

Re: Street Fighter
#119  March 28, 2014, 08:38:41 pm
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I have SFEX2 in MAME :P. Also I agree with you about the way it word D: !!

About Ryu's sprites: I think I can have them by this weekend OR as much, Wednesday. I just have to organize myself with it.... And also, I have to find your "completations"(I mean, that kick opener into tatsumaki from the movie, that guard breaker kick, etc). Found a way that can make spriting easier than ever :D!

Once done that...who could CS him? I would try, but  I'm currently messed with Viper and also have to CS her(found some colour mistakes that I did D: )
I swear there was something cool here!!

Balthazar

Re: Street Fighter
#120  March 28, 2014, 08:43:52 pm
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There is THIS, that kick is pretty much exactly what he needs (though it can be improved a little perhaps).

Just that first kick, altered a little to come from his roll. Kinda dumb how the creator of this animation made the Tatsu spin the other direction :P
Kinda nullafies the use of that start-up kick, if you ask me!
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